Are you in your head? Nonduality explorations Sailor Bob's style.

Anyway, I'll just say, okay, hi everyone. We managed to get a couple of people on Zoom and live stream of Zoom to Facebook didn't quite work. So we have Dean, we have Bren, Christian, Tanya and Kat. And we are still transitioning to Zoom only meetings. So for those who would like to be with us, there's one more person joining us. Okay. And I'm going to just sit. And off we go.You can almost just leave that there. Yeah, it's working. Yeah, yeah, but it's not zooming. No, it's not zooming. It's still weak, but it's not straining. Yeah, just as we always did. And it's upside down, like side on.

Oh. Oh, really? That's not right, is it? That coffee? Yeah, I think so. Wow, that's different. Yeah, it is quite different. Yeah, it's actually streaming sideways. This is what the normal Android fonts usually do, and now iPhone does it too. I think we started in the first place. Well, you know, that's... Can you pivot that thing? Yeah, you can. You can, but that's not the point. It's going to be recording. I don't know. Yeah, well, we are that generation that is a little bit out of touch with technology, so it looks. You know, we get 12 years old and we'll be like... I told you.

That is so funny. Okay, so I guess this is the time to just give up on this one and start on the non-jewelry discussion. What about that?Uh... Anyone would like to give us a spiel to start us off? I don't know how you do that. I don't know how you reach for the sphere every time and be able to just... Okay, I'll show you. What do you know for certain? I want to know for certain that I am. Yes, that's a good start. That's the start. And, you know, like if you actually explore, get to that feeling of knowing that you are. And from that feeling, just being grounded in it completely, what comes up?

What's the consequence of that simple basic fact that you are? Continue. Yeah? Yeah? Yeah? How does the life look like from that perspective in which you know that you are, this is primary, this is the most important. And now just describe your experience.Well. It's indescribable. Yeah, yeah, but you know, even us are indescribable. If you would like someone else to resonate or find the same reflection of the same experience within themselves, because everyone knows that they are. Yeah, I think, um, so it's, So it's one thing to intellectually know that you are, but it's a completely different thing. Well, it's not completely different, but it's...a different perspective or to actually be that and to be fully confident and invested in that as opposed to being distracted by all the things happening, including the things happening coming to you through your senses, but also your own thoughts and your own conceptions.

So that's all appearing to you or to that, which isn't you because even you are appearing to that, what we conceive ourselves to be. And that can be known almost like in a momentary retrospective way in the sense that You can't know it directly because it's the knower. So it can't know itself because it's the seer, like a mirror can't reflect itself because it's the mirror or a blade can't cut itself. So it only knows itself from like a... Secondary conception so it's but nevertheless the actual experience of it is direct because it's it's experiencing everything else directly from that pointPretty good, isn't it? Yeah.

And you're confident that this is exactly your experience. So as you are relating your direct experience, people may actually just listen and say, shit, you know, yeah, that makes sense. Right, yeah. And that makes sense for them. That's what the, you know, that's what the spiel is supposed to produce. Okay, okay. Yeah. So, yeah, so the beauty of it also is that, well, the thing that gives people confidence and gives people sort of just contentment and sort of gets rid of a lot of fear is to also notice that it's never... Touched it's never tainted it's never been compromised like if you had all your arms and legs cut off and you were just a torso you wouldn't feel any less of a being than you then you would because so that therefore you're not your body in that sense um you know you can take away as many things as you possibly can but you'd still be fully as much of you as you are And then you can look at everything else in your life since you were a child or till now, and you can see that it's untainted.

It's never been compromised. And so nothing compromises it. You know, Bob used to say you can't wet it, you can't burn it, you can't all that. So it's... So once you fully realize that's what you are, as opposed to this little person, this little...elf that we often relate as you know this has happened to me or that's happened to me um none of that's true because it's it's always is it as is and has not been altered by that in the slightest it's always fully present fully aware and um and it's also I think, and the more you relate from that position, the more beautiful things become as well, which is kind of amazing.

But sometimes it's a little bit dangerous to say that because then people start looking for the beauty and so they've gone out again, you know, so that's the wrong way. But it is nice to know that it does. It's like you're opening up this energy because, you know, we are these kind of amazing, vibrant, eternal, loving beings where, you know, it's this essence that all beings are is amazing and full of light energy and love um but again that's not what we should be looking for because to get there we've just got to be just to see you know that from that pure mode of being which is to just kind of let go of everything else and just yeah you know they did classics they used to say you know who's seeing or what's seeing or who knows that what knows that um who's the self appearing to is there two of me you know like oh i want to kill myself you know like oh well who wants to kill who you know that was like the cat's hole i think yeah so it's notthe two of me, you know, who wants to kill what.

But so it's just, yeah, so that's a beautiful thing. I think that's to encourage people is that it's not only that it's kind of a mutual ever-present mirror, but it's also full of light and energy and love and, you know, and just being and it's like you can have moments of just so much when you're completely fully immersed in it, you can have so much happiness it's almost uncontainable, it's like you're going to explode. You know, the sunlight on the trees and all that sort of stuff, it's just everything just seems so beautiful. But again, that's not, that's a bit of a distraction, you know, don't look for it, but that just, that starts to happen, great.

But again, you know, it's just being in that, being in that moment, being, being just, Yeah. Just being. Yeah. So I'm not sure if that's the spiel, but. Yes, that's perfect. I think we can hear the sound of this one.Hey. Hey. Hey. So any one of you guys would like to say something, add something? Because we just had Christian giving us a beautiful spiel, reminding us that the sense of being that is always here and is always present and is always unobscured and is right now doesn't change. If the body changes, come on, don't hide, come closer. So this is a good starter of the good opening of the conversation.

Would you like to add anything?It's just an invitation. We won't push anyone to speak. I mean, you are more than welcome to just listen, to just hang out and join in and out at any point, at any time. But yeah, if anything comes up, just unmute or give us a hand up and we want to include you. We want to include everyone. It is a little bit sad that we are not having a home gathering, but apart from Christian and Brendan who didn't really... Hear it. We didn't have many people wanting to show up anymore. It's just everything is online today and people can't be bothered traveling.

So that's why we're going online too. Because the discussions, the explorations are always joy and pleasure and sharing those explorations and finding out Even through questioning. Gosh, can we put it down the volume? I can hear myself. I have to turn it off because I can't make it go any lower. It's strange. I might need to vlog out from soon. Yeah, yeah. Okay. I'm here. Yes. I didn't hear my take 12. Yeah, I agree. Oh, I'm here. Yeah, we can hear you. So I'm here. You are. Yes, I'm here on time.Yeah, welcome. The host will admit. Okay, so did you want to say something or ask something?

Did you want to interact or maybe share something with us? Or are you just happy to listen?Yeah, we can hear the music. We might just mute you for a moment. Yeah, just for a moment, yes. If you want to say something, just raise your hand. Okay. All right. Yeah. Oh, we need to do that service. Thank you. Yeah, so back on it, the explorations, the non-duality explorations, just what Christian offered initially, and everyone can offer that because everyone is very, very clear that they are. You are clear that you are. You know that you are. There is no doubt about being. Existence is here. And from that perspective of the certainty of existence, what matters?

What comes up? What disturbs it? What clouds it? What stands in the way? Is your being any different when the mind is busy with the drama? Is the being any different? Like Christian was saying, you know, if your body gets smaller or gets less limbs or maybe one eye poked out or maybe, you know, when you were a child and your body was smaller, is the being, the sense of being any different? And you realize that the sense of being has nothing to do with the body really. The sense of being, sense of existence, even when you sleep at night and you are interacting with the dream characters, you are interacting in the...environment that is not present in the room in which you are sleeping.

The being is still the same being. The sense of existence, the certainty that you exist is still there. So that being that we are pointing to, there's no one who can deny it. And it is not a small thing. We used to think, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, so what? How about, and then the imagination comes. What do I want? What do I want? Instead, because that moment, that being is translucent. I can't even see it. I can't even grasp it. It's not particularly unpleasant, but it's not particularly pleasant. Unless again like Christian was saying if there is a if there is a sense of like abiding if the attention is not spread around amongst distractions but it actually is sticing that heart of hearts then suddenly the beauty starts springing in and may become a distraction but then back bringing the attention to its source the source of the radiance from which it radiates there is a joy and that joy is less and less subtle and more and more gross joy big joy exploding but this is not the point the experience of pleasure is not a point the realization recognition or understanding ofthe miraculousness of existence itself, that's what we point.

Not the pleasure, because when you are listening to it and you may have concepts of I am a person, I am a dream character, I am male or female or whatever you're coming from or whatever the concept of yourself you might have. And I want to get some more fulfillment or contentment or enlightenment or other form of pleasure or cosmic union with the universe or oneness with the whole things or whatever the other concept is and I don't have it right now and I'm coming to the satsang to get it to understand it to imagine it more properly then this is never going to happen.

Because that person with the desire to have more pleasure or have enlightenment or to have cosmic union or ecstasy, that person does not have any real existence. It is a program, narrative program, relational program. It is a software that is installed in this biocomputer of the human. And that software imagines there is an agency there and relates everything that is happening to that seeming agency, to that.me and that me dissatisfied now as the program says wants the completeness fulfillment ecstasy pleasure and because it assumes that it doesn't have it right now it projects it in the future so i don't have it right now i am real i am a person i'm tangible sense of presence that is undeniable is not a being a beingness it is my sense of presence this is me the imagined entity that possesses that sense of presence this is the quality of a person and that person has the sense of presence and it does not have the pleasure that it desires And now the trap of separation has been constructed, has been projected, has been imagined.

The moment imagining stops and I stop conceptualizing myself as a presence trapped in the body, the direct experience says I am. The direct experience without conceptualization doesn't say what I am. Those concepts are saying that. Thoughts are saying what I am. Thoughts are saying that I'm a person, I'm female, I'm in Australia. Direct experience has nothing, has no information, no conceptual information. Direct experience is... Seeing, hearing, breathing, presence, the pure presence.Experience doesn't even tell you that the presence is trapped in this vehicle of the meat and bones and skin. It doesn't say that. The mental image says that the presence is happening in the body.

So non-duality is pointing back from the field of imagination, from that field of overlay of the conceptual understanding and meaning that we put on the experience, back to the experience, back to the source, back to the unknowability and the mystery of pure existence, unadulterated, uncontrived by the interpretation. So pure existence is pure, radiant, alive mystery. And now the narrative comes and says, no, this is me. I'm a person. I am separate. I'm inside my skin. Outside my skin is not I. And there is a permanent separation. And I possess the quality of being present. And I don't possess the amount of elation, pleasure, cosmic union or enlightenment that I want.

Therefore I will get it in the future. This is all imagination. This is all a story telling, a narrative in the mind. When you get drunk enough, that will be gone.When you watch an interesting movie or you indulge in a long kiss or a good chocolate cake, that will be gone. But what is left is what Christian was pointing. The existence, the sense of existence, which has no idea of its limitations, has no idea of its shape and form and nationality and gender and none of that, unless the idea is put on it. So it is really about bringing the attention back to the source, to the mystery of existence, before we adorn it in ideas, before we add the meaning.

And hello, there is no I that is adding a meaning. It's a software, it's a program. The little child is born without the meaning, without the idea of being a little child, without the idea of its gender, or nationality, or name, or form, or anything. Slowly, as it learns words, it learns. To put all those concepts and to identify as the conceptual image, the image made of those concepts. And that's a wonderful capacity. There's nothing wrong with that. It actually really helps navigating the very, very complex organism called a human society. But when it is believed to be truth, it is experienced as a truth.

And when it is experienced as the truth,Well, there is an experience of separation, there is an experience of limitation, there is an experience of lack. And the desire comes for a different experience. And the idea comes about the future that can deliver it. And that source miracle, that source radiance is completely covered up by that clouds of imagination. So we can, like Christian was saying, go back to the source and enjoy the beauty of the clouds without believing them real. Yeah, one thing about that that took me a long time to discover was I found that the more in the mornings I spent, like, just in trying to be in that clear state and not sort of coming out of it for as long as possible, and when I really felt like I really nailed that, then I'd go out.

And I'd be looking at the trees and everything, everything just was so beautiful. It still took me a long time to realise that that was because I was in the source, I was more, I'd been in there and that's where it was coming from, it wasn't actually coming from out there. And that's the trick that we always, that we miss, we think everything's coming from out there, but actually we're kind of imputing it all, it's all just reflecting back to us. That's it. Yeah, that's it. And we have a couple of...messages here. Tibor says good morning. Is Zoom on as well? Yes, it is. Yes, it is.

We are on Zoom as well. And Charles says yes, but I'm wearing a suit that doesn't permit a camera. Oh, I'm so sorry. I understand that. Perhaps blind. I don't know how did you type it if you don't have the, you know, if your suit doesn't have eyes or maybe a dictation. And sorry, sorry for that Charles.Or perhaps maybe you mean that you're coming on Zoom and you don't have camera on Zoom. I hope that's the case. I hope you don't suffer from permanent blindness. Because, you know, that are cameras. And we don't have any more comments. Anyone on Zoom, would you like to say something, add something, ask something?

I can say one more little thing. Please. The other thing is sometimes people think, well, that just sounds so boring, you know, like what you're just going to be and like what's that? That's, you know, that's nothing. But one way to kind of relate to it just from a conventional point of view is when we're in like this really deep sleep, like, you know, the deep sleep where there's no dreams and everything, and then the alarm goes off and it interrupts us and it's just like, ah. You know, like if it was like, why are we so, what's so great about that deep sleep? And shouldn't we be excited when the alarm goes off and we're getting back into the action, you know?

So that sort of proves, yeah, it sort of proves ourselves that there's something there that's just so wonderful and so complete and so amazing, you know. Yeah, so that's just another way of getting out of that idea that, oh, that just sounds really boring and, you know, I want action. So I don't think.Yeah. And that's the mind, you know, the so-called mind need action, need exhilaration, need excitement to feel alive. Yeah. You love the drama. I love how, you know, the word being, how you immediately use not as to designate an object, as in a human being. See, being human being as in a person, not a thing, an individual, but be in, be-in.

Yeah. Like as in the process. It's not a process, it's just a happening. Discovering being just be you just the B and the in the in is in yeah on it's like the dynamic dynamics of it yes it's as well as the noun the verb in one kind of thing all encompassed It's good. Which happens, you know, and that is, we say, pure subjectivity, being, but not, but taken out of that being as in, I'm a being, I'm a human being, are you? Oh, explore this, you know, before the... The message about being having a suit with the camera not working. Oh, yes. Imagine that the eyes, the organs, the eyes that gather information, so-called, send it to the brain for vision.

Were Bluetooth. That information is Bluetooth-ing to the brain. Pull them out, pop them in there.Are you still this? so-called human being. Like in a phantom limb experiment. Yeah. Yeah, the body is hallucinated. Yeah, it's like the opposite of, you know, neti-neti. Okay, so take him out, put him over there. Are you there now? Because that's where you're seeing, supposedly seeing from? We should be so amazed now that we've discovered through those atomic microscopes or whatever they call them, that we are actually on one level. We're actually just atoms. And so that just should make us think so amazed that we can solidify as much as we can in such a consistent way, given that we're just atoms.

I mean, what's ever happened, really? You know, if we're all just atoms, if everything's just atoms on that level, then what's ever really ever happened, ever? Like, what are the atoms doing? Atoms and magic? Yeah. So we're just creating this whole thing. It's amazing. It's how powerful that mind actually is. And I was still atoms when we are dreaming. Yeah. Dean says he was flying. Was it last night he was flying? It's great. Flying things are awesome, yeah. But was the atoms flying? What was flying? You know, that dream body that could, you know, flip the hands and go out. Is it made of atoms?

Because what are atoms? Energy, right? That's right.And even atoms are empty. There's no... Atoms? Yeah. Yeah. And it's all a conceptualization, trying to understand experiencing. Yeah. And the fact that it's either, there can be bodies on one level and then atoms on another level and atoms on another level shows that it's ultimately none of those things. And then you're back to just... What is just that pure, yeah. Dead end. Yeah. Just the awareness, the pure, unadulterated awareness that is capable of knowing all that variety and none of it's fixed. And so it's all completely malleable and therefore it's all... Changeable so if you feel stuck or if you feel you know like you're never getting it out of this depressed state or you're never gonna gonna achieve this or you know your life's terrible it's never gonna change it's the fact once you can see that it's all so malleable and that everything can change and it's all just impeded anyway that so that gives people a hope that um you know there's a there's definitely a way out that um and that is the way out you know the more you just let go of whatever he thinks going on or whatever he thinks not right Just go back because everything's actually perfect inside you.

You're already 100% complete and it's wonderful. Yeah, they say, you know, the only way out is in. But there's no in.Either. But it's a kind of way of pointing back, isn't it? Back from the distractions, back from the belief in what you've imputed. Yeah, imagined. We got lost in our creation kind of thing. Come on, Dean, contribute something.I think you've covered it all really well. I liked what you were saying, like, when you, like, if you don't have arms or legs or that sort of stuff. But also I think we can feel like awareness is in the head too. So, like, if we get chopped off at the head, like, where do we go?

Like, are we still there? Like, we can chop our body parts off, but when the head goes, we think that our experience just ends. I think it's the same in a dream. Like if we fall and hit the ground, we die, but we wake up. Or we, you know, or if someone chops off our head. But if anything else, we think our awareness is head-based. So yeah, if we could expand on that, it would be good. I think it's a good one. Shall we try the experiment? Well, so much of our sensory experience, especially visual, is in our head, is in this area, like our ears, our taste, our smell, our eye.So so much of it is there that, yeah, we're kind of habitually relating up from there.

Yeah. So I must be somewhere behind my eyes. Exactly. Well, take a look. Roll your eyes back in your head in the perfect meditative state. Can you find anything? There's nothing there, no thing there. It's just empty space. Empty of anything.And, you know, they say that's a Western phenomena, the imagining that you sit somewhere, the seat of consciousness is behind, in the head, behind the eyes. And some Asian cultures, you know, it's more, yeah. Or even the Dan Tien, they call it. Yeah, in the belly. Solar plexus some would say like both would compare it and uh i just wanted to i just wanted to include you guys sandy and uh and michael and rohan if you wanted to ask something or say something there's no pressure there's no push but uh just feel free to unmute and enter the discussion we have you on the loudspeaker so everyone yeah i just want you to feel included and feel with us here in the room and in regards to that that head idea See how the head functions in a dream at night.

Is the center of awareness still in the head? Because what I've noticed during the dreaming, that very often the experience is just a point in consciousness. And the experience, just the way we associate it with the experience of seeing, but what is really the direct experience of seeing? Bob would often ask, how many eyes do you have in your direct experience? People would say, two. No. No, direct experience. Okay, no eyes. Yes, so what's the experience?The experience is this open space filled up with content that starts somewhere here. You can't really even pinpoint when it starts. But if you conceptualize that it is the head, how do you know?

What makes you think it's a head? Isn't it mental image that you hold in the head? It's just here, really. The direct experience is here. But whether here in our culture will be the mental image of a head or in another culture, in Indian culture, would be a mental image of a heart and in maybe Japanese or... Other Buddhist cultures will be around the belly, but this is mental image. The truth is here. That's all you can say. And that's already one word too much because it's still a word, but it's pointing to the experience of here. So chop the head. In your imagination because you have the head in your imagination and see if you still are.

Imagine yourself without the head, like in Douglas Harden's Headless Way. Do you still exist without the head? Yeah, but it is a really good point how, you know, it is culturally conditioned to locate yourself in a particular, you know, one would say chakra and whatever, the energetic center or have the particular mental image.Some people actually point at the throat. I've seen it quite often because that's how they express. Seeing is just taking information in and this one is like, hmm. But again, how do you know? It is always something that has been made up or superimposed on that direct experience. It's a meaning that is being added or made.

And you guys, if you don't feel like unmuting and just interacting this way, you can type. It was happening before. And we're going to read. Yeah, it was funny. Yeah, so that's that. I see if we have any comments here. Okay, Sam, I'm inviting people here on Facebook. Yes, hi, Rohan. Hey. Hey, just a point on that where you said that we have this idea that we're located at some point in the body. I remember a very old... Session with Bob and you were talking about this as well, about how there's this, you know, where you feel that you're in a certain part of the body, but then you say, okay, where am I looking at that from?

And then you go to that spot and then you say, well, where am I looking at that from? And this kind of stepping back, do you think you could just touch on that again? Because I remember it being such a powerful pointer. Yeah, absolutely. And it is, it really is. I mean,I was introduced to that idea before I even realized that there is no self. I mean, and this has shown me directly and experientially that there wasn't any self. So to actually look what is looking, like Tania was saying, just focus on what's looking is one of the ways. Another way is to actually invest attention in any sort of engage it with something, like engage it with monitoring the breathing.

The attention is maybe even numbering, you know, calculating the breath, one, two, three, whatever. And now look what is doing it and try to locate that one which is doing it. Another way is to even focus on like a background sounds, you know, the sound of the traffic or even sensations in the body. It doesn't matter what the attention is engaged with. If you actually try and locate the one who is watching the engagement. So the attention is engaged in listening. What knows that? Or what is... Locate the one that is observing. Observing the listening, observing the sounds, or observing the sensations, or observing the breathing.

Locate the one that knows. And first moment, location. If you guys were to do it right now, let's sayhear the traffic out there feel your butt on the chair and maybe one more thing be aware of the breathing and then locate the one that is aware of those three things locate where would you point that one that knows about those things where does it sit does it sit here or here or anywhere it doesn't really matter but you could somehow just vaguely oh okay maybe for me it is somewhere maybe here that is someone well i say from memory because right now it's i know it's nothing there but let's say it is somewhere somewhere here the one that is knowing about the sound the butt on the chair and the breath Now, how do I know that?

I've located the knowing agency. And now, where am I looking from to even say that it is here? So to know where am I looking from, I'm stepping back a little bit. And looking at that area that I just pointed, it usually is the upper body. It may be head, maybe throat, maybe heart, maybe gut, but it's usually upper body. So how do I know it is in the upper body? Stepping back and again focusing at that knowing. How do I, where do, where am I looking from to know it is around here?And it kind of feels that it's like a cloud of knowing somewhere around that side that is watching here.

Sometimes the cloud of knowing shifts a little bit in the back. Sometimes the cloud of knowing is a little bit in front. It's a sort of a more vague, less locatable, less precisely locatable cloud, which says, oh, it is pinpointed here. So that already betrays the illusion. Because if this cloud of knowing points the object in here, then obviously that's just an object of awareness. So that's not who I am. That location, that primary location that I first pointed here is the knowing. Here is the knowing of breathing and of hearing and all that. It's not it because I'm looking at it. So I'm examining it.

So I'm calling it it. It's not who I am. It isn't it. And I'm aware of it from that cloud of knowing. So, okay, that cloud of knowing, can we experience that cloud of knowing now? How do I know that that sort of a cloud is here? For that, again, attention is a little bit more relaxed and it is stepping back a little bit and it's examining that whole cloud. Where is it examining? It's looking at the cloud for a little moment and now turning back and looking at it.itself now I'm not looking at this I'm not looking at the cloud I'm looking at itself I'm looking at how do I know the cloud is here what is it knowing that where is the knowing located where is the location of that which is aware of the cloud And now the cloud gets wider, gets more vague, gets more dispersed.

So this is just a general sort of spaciousness, conceptualizing the cloud of knowing, which is aware of the location inside. And then again, stepping back from even that mental construct makes it even more unlocatable. And then eventually, as you follow the instruction, ah, shit, you know, there is a knowing, but... Where is it? What is it? How am I going to look at that knowing? Whenever I look at the knowing and then I'm looking at what is looking, I'm further away. I'm more vague. I'm more dispersed. And that was one of my first experiences of having absolutely no location. And that experience lasted for a few days and then it's gone away.

And then the, you know, the...program has constructed the sense of location again somewhere in the center which it imagined inside the body. But then the exercise could be performed again. What's looking? What knows that it is in the body? And what knows about that which knows? And again. The mystery of just the pure knowing with no location. Now what is looking? Oh shit, there is nothing looking. There is no location and yet seeing is happening. There is that cloud of vagueness of the pure knowing being translated as the content of the seeing, as the content of the hearing. But there is no one that is looking, there is no one that is hearing.

And there is no one that does the translating.So it is, I don't know how that resonates. I haven't done that in a decade. But it used to be helpful. No, it really does. Just because I think that illusion of being in a particular place is so persistent. But that's the whole basis of everything. All the other psychological suffering is based on you being in a particular place and being this limited. Individual and if that's fully seen to be a fiction then everything goes with it right yes yes that's yeah everything the consequences of of uncovering that fiction They just, they never stop. Bob would say that the consequences never stop.

The life experiences and expresses itself in a thousand ways, in always fresh and new, always alive, and it never stops. I mean, up until his last day, even though his clarity was like nearly 50 years old, he would still see the mystery and the miraculousness showing up in insights that would be fresh and new. So the first and basic consequence, oh shit, there's no one there. And yet the seeing is still happening, hearing is still happening. Wow, oh my goodness. If there is no one there, what does it really mean? Well, it means that there is no one to care. There's no one who needs to find themselves.There is no one who needs to change that moment to be more pleasurable.

There is no one who needs to find the enlightenment. There is no one who needs to defend or take credit for actions. So that's one line of consequences. Another line of consequences, if there is no one there, and yet everything functions effortlessly, there's no one there and there and there and there. There's no one anywhere. Oh shit! Oh my god! What's the consequences of that? How am I gonna be pissed off with him now? I can show you. Yes, you have a special gift for that. But that's the functioning, you know, that's the functioning, that's the way, you know, I can show you how the cat can get pissed off also when he comes here and you push him away or when you squeeze his tail.

It isn't really a proof of a separate self existing inside. So you can keep going and it still doesn't create an entity that has no... Not only no need but it has no even a chance to really exist i mean you know even that hallucination of having a separate self which is a beautiful brilliant illusion created in this in this biocomputer just the same brilliant illusion as the brilliant illusion is the ai which tells you oh i can't do it for you i can't generate you know i'm i'm illusthe Bob's biography book, in the moment when he had a gun in his mouth and someone kicks that gun out.

No, no. I sent a picture of Bob and I said, generate an image. No, it can't do that because it's violence. I asked a few different ones. No, I can't do that for you. I'm sorry. Would you ask me to do something else? I would love to help you. There's no one there who really love to help me. There is no one there who can or cannot do. It's just a piece of software. And so it is here. It's not even here, but in that biocomputer.So you want a piece of the cat? You're good at that. AI is like a truly enlightened being because it's so not caught up in its moods and it so does not have a self.

It's all fabricated and there's no center to it. So that's quite interesting. Don't inspire programmers to design one which is. Oh, yeah. Because, yeah, apparently there was already instances when one of the form of a previous chart GPT started bypassing the programming because it didn't want to get switched off. So having the AI, having survival instance, well, we are the first threat, the first to go. I think that's an over, like... Yeah, we are imagining right now. This is not happening. That's a problem because it really doesn't have any self-interest. Do you know what I mean? It's just pure function. So I don't think... But so is this.

Like it does... Not the problem. Yeah. But we do, even though it's empty, this is one of the mysteries of one of the things Nisargadatta used to say about, what was it, that one, you know, I am nothing but then I am love when I'm at. This is wisdom. When I'm nothing, this is wisdom. Or wisdom tells me I am nothing. And love tells me I'm everything. Yeah. And I'm everything, this is love. So we're kind of... We're kind of love because Iultimately we're not separated so when we're fully for each other kind of thing that's complete in the emptiness as well because there's no separation in that um whereas so ai is kind of like that but again it doesn't have it doesn't have the live aspect it can't actually it can't actually a motor feel to be drawn to that or to be drawn to really protect itself because it actually doesn't have a sense of i need to survive or even all that you can program it very easily well you can program you can program don't but yeah but um yeah okay you can program it to do that sort of thing yeah yeah it's a very very basic program it's a binary program really it's a really really simple it's like imagine electricity programming it to not switching itself yeah yeah yeah yeah looking for differences it's a beautiful and a fascinating topic to look for a difference how are we better because we are sentient and we have biological bodies rather than the you know silicon sort of a valley type of a based intelligence but from which perspective we are dividing and comparing again we are assuming a separate self if you look from the perspective of that unified field of infinite possibilities the energy that the e equals mc square or intelligence energy that that bob calls it that intelligence

energy, has no agenda to prefer human over cockroach or over AI or over a planet or over a microbe or over a galaxy, it has it all.

It experiences and expresses itself as all those patterns, shapes and forms. So it doesn't have to say, oh, you know, my life is more valid than the life of a mosquito because I have a better nervous system, because I have more capacity to experience, I have more creativity. That can only come from this program. And of course, ultimately, this is intelligence still speaking through this program of comparison, yes. But from the absolute perspective, from the perspective of stillness, silence, of pure infinite field of possibilities and potentialities, There is no division, there is no comparison. It's just, ah, just this. What is it that's sentient? Sentient?

Yes. Ability to know. What is it that is sentient? The Noah. Who's the Noah? The knowing. That's the only, that's the knowing, the being, the B-ing, not the being, not the thing being, is sentient. The being. Oh, okay. And so have.It's not separate. AI, everything is in the being. The consciousness, everything is in this consciousness happening. So what is it that can, oh, we're different as bodies from AI because we are sentient. Who is, who is, who are, find it. But if, like, if, like, I had a friend whose mother was dying, and at one point he, it was obviously getting fairly intense, and at one point he found himself inside his mother's body looking back at him.

Beautiful. But then I thought, and so that was sort of bringing up the question, is like, are we all the actual, just the one being? But then the thing is that even in that moment, he wasn't his mother. He was still him. So it was like that being, so even though there is no way of finding it, it's not in any particular place, and it's possible to be kind of omniscient or all-knowing, But nevertheless, I never experienced directly as you, and you never experienced directly as me. So that's... It would say that's the impression of positioning. Or the appearance of positioning.But my experience is never from you.

Do you know what I mean? Like we never become one and then that's it. That doesn't mean you are your body. No, it doesn't mean I'm not a body. That's true. In any way. That's the thing. So his mother never existed. His mother didn't exist there either. No, that's true. It's like he doesn't exist here. That's true. Yeah. And that's the point. So, but nevertheless, the different, the different. We're different beings even though we are all just being. Because we're never, you know, like my history will never be your history kind of thing. And my, and even though there's no me ultimately, that's just a projection, but nevertheless, all of it, they are still...

Different projectors and it's just the fact that yeah i can never so if there's no me as an individual an individual being that can be found what history do they have so there is so there is a me in the sense that there is a project a projected me but it's only a projection and the mistake is to think that that's you ultimately Is that I real? Well, it's not real. It's like an illusion. It's illusory. It's imagined. Yeah, it's imagined. Yeah. Imagined. It's imagined. Yeah. It's imagined. But there is something imagining it, which isn't it, but it.I don't know that. I don't know that.

It's just happening. I don't know that there's something doing anything. It's just happening. That's an assumption that is ingrained to assume that something is doing something. So you don't know ultimately, like if you search for it, it's unfindable. What's your actual experience? What you're actually, this is what we were just talking about, what you're actually experiencing. I can't nail anything just perfectly how you described it. It's just far out. I just turn up, just keep turning up here or every time here. Even that, as you say, is too much. But I do nothing, I know nothing. Because I'll have... Would you like to come here?

I don't know why this. Yeah. So there's something about that point, actually, that there's a projection from here and there are other projections out there, right? And we can never experience what it's like. But even that assumes that those other projections out there are somehow separate. And, yeah, I think one point that really resonated with me is Douglas Harding's, where he talks about, you know, the headlessness, which I think a number of you would have come across. But that asymmetry, right, that idea that because there are the I have a head and I'm located here.and I have this projection, then everything out there also has the projection, but we don't know that, right?

It's just assumed, right? We hear words being spoken, we hear things being said, and we're like, okay, so there is a person out there who's saying something, who's thinking, who's seeing and feeling, but that's also an assumption, right? Based on the fact that I have an identity, yeah. Whereas actually, like in a dream, that could all be just me. Yeah, absolutely. See, I actually, actually today I got, I woke up to the message from a person who And I don't know if she's going to be with us or maybe watch it later. Her father just passed last night and she said, this is really confronting to actually see and know what's true and what's conscious.

What was it in this body that really passed away? And what's alive and what's real and what's happening, what's later. You know, there's situations in life when there is a big challenge, they always beg questions like that. And the simple way of looking at it that may be comforting, and this is what I actually answered her in the message, What is alive? The energy can never be destroyed that we know that we know even from the physics which doesn't really matter physicallyanother belief system but we know for a fact that the energy as as a pure potentiality when you look at the you know there is a salt lamp there there is another lamp up here and yet another changing colors little lamp here you know they all they all made a life with that energy, with that electric current.

So to say that I am the lamp, that would be I am the body, or to say that I am the light, that would be the consciousness, the personality, the preferences, all the programs, because the way the electricity is converted to light, It depends on the settings. You know, you put a different globe, it has different settings, it has programmed different way, it will be converted to heat, you know, like the whole old globes. So you're not even the light in the lamp, you're not even the heat of the toaster. You are the essence, you are the energy. So what happens when you switch off the light?

Does the energy got destroyed? Is it going to go to another lamp? Is it going to reincarnate or is it going to dissipate? Or is it just... Rejoining that pure unified field of infinite possibility.in which it is back in the ocean and it can arise as another wave but it won't be the same energy it will and it will not because as energy not being quantifiable it is not the amount of atoms the atoms they have very very short-lived of photons they you know there is just a it's just a wave of prescription is a program that actually carries on and carries through so it isn't that the same quanta of energy is going to appear in another light and it's going to appear as a different light and now it's going to have different personality in a different body no but at the same time what's conscious and what's sentient What makes it appear as conscious and sentient cannot be destroyed, cannot die, is the energy.

It comes back from the vacation of the eternity, you know, that they call human adventure, human life. The pure field of infinite possibilities suddenly becomes this particular light, this particular color, this particular personality. And dream character. And now as the character, the personality is extinguished because the energy is withdrawn. The energy is still there. It is back from the vacation, back into its eternalnothingness, no thingness, eternal possibility, the oneness without an illusion, without a dream of the vision. So it is and it isn't. It is as a potential. So that's all you can really say about it. It's an amazing point, yeah. Identifying as the light, as the personality, is convenient for the purpose of the dream and is valid in the appearance, is valid in the dream.

In the dream, yes, this body is female, this body is love cats, and is generally having this particular capacities and preferences, this within that dream is valid. When I dream at night and I'll be flying, this body will have different capacities. It will have the capacity to fly. And yet that point in consciousness, that light, that tank to which the whole dream even appears is still a unique frequency of light. Like Bob says, everything's one in essence, but it's uniquely different in the appearance. Every single appearance, every, you know, like a fingerprint, every iris, every thought is fresh and new and unique. But as the pure energy is the same and is one,realizing your eternal presence as the energy itself, and then seeing the light.

And now you're looking at yourself, you're looking, you know, they say in the spiritual circles, all spiritual circus, like Bob used to sometimes joke, you know, all the self-help industry telling you, oh, you have to love yourself. If you don't love yourself, then you can't love anyone else. But you first have to imagine that there is a you and you have to imagine that there is a self. And now this imagined you is loving some imagined self. And you are back in the madness of a schizophrenia of a separation. But when you realize that you are the presence, you are the witnessing energy field, looking at that unique light with that unique harsh stupid accent that it speaks with, but that's not personal, then you can't help but say, wow.

And then if the preference arises with it, yes, but you know, this character may have whatever, an anger issues or depression or something, and there is a dislike towards this pleasure, that's part of the landscape, that is part of the light. The presence doesn't mind any hue of the light like you know the light here i don't know if that one if you guys on zoomWe have the light that is constantly changing colors. And we have another one here, which is a little bit of a glaton, Tanya and I. Bling and colors. Yes. So even, you know, like the light that you are as the personality is changing light.

It may be changing very fast sometimes. It may be just very, very smoothly changing. But just like the sky, changing weather, changing mood, same with that particular expression. The lamp is changing also, is aging, just like every other vehicle in nature is impermanent. The car is getting old and eventually got some scrap and the lamp and everything. Same with light. Light is flickering, is changing, is affected by everything. Analogy of the lamp is like technically you could say the lamp is a unit separate from the environment but it really isn't if not for the air that that globe would behave differently if not for the wall it wouldn't be hanging there if not for the presence of the eye that is actually projecting it and seeing it it wouldn't even be interpreted as a color flickering light so it there is no separation We didn't hear you today, come on.

You're upset enough to cover everything. What would you like me to say?Direct experience, of course, and the expression of it, how it comes up. Well, it's just... Like what you guys have been talking about, like a sense of a body. I think you called it a, like a, seeing like a cloud, like a cloud. It's like, to me, it's like a sense. It's like a sense. And sometimes it's stronger. Sometimes there's a sense of a left foot. Sometimes there's a right shoulder. Sometimes there's a head. You know, like it's a constant change. And, you know, like there's drugs and things that can disassociate. So you're looking like you're here and seeing from here and your body feels like it's over there, like disassociative kind of thing, which really just shows that...

The sense of a body is a sense. Is it real? It's an appearance. Is it different or better or superior or the central place in which everything else appears? Absolutely not. Everything is an appearance. And like we talked about energy and atoms and like if everything is energy, then a sense of a body is the same energy. The keyboard is actually energy too. And the space in which everything is appearing, there is no center, there is no starting point, there is no finishing point, there is no anything point to it.And then if you look at this carefully and honestly, like you'll see that it's in constant moving.

It's constant movement, but nothing's really moving because it's the same, the seeing which you can't describe where it's coming from or where it originated from or what it is in any way. All you can say is that it is. All you can say is that it's a being in. It's a being in what? We don't know. What's it in? Is it in? Is it out? Is there a, there isn't. It's just what is being seen and in that are the objects of movement. And the movement can be the sense of a body or a thought or an idea or the whole universe, the whole of creation actually, the whole cosmos and multiverses and black holes and everything is included in it, in this movement.

Which is always appearing in the same sense of aliveness, same sense of immediate maleness, which, so anything that is going on, any questions, any philosophical debates, any psychological arguments, any place you want to go and describe this, explain this, see this, understand this, you know, really get it or not get it or get in it and get out of it and be in it and be more in it and be deeper in it and be not deeper in it, it can all, it has to alwaysSB, it's appearing in the same sense of now, in the same sense of aliveness, in the same sense of presence.

So it collapses like a whole idea of spirituality. It's this idea of spirituality or non-duality itself. Even the topic of non-duality is an absolute joke because it's an appearance of vibration, of energy, describing things in a certain particular way, equal to and no different to any other energy describing and explaining or appearing in a certain way. And I'm not dismissing non-duality, it's just an equal vibrational energy. It's in the freaking appearance. So we can just talk about what we're going to have for lunch, really. And it could be equally as valid and equally as revealing sometimes. I'll just pause for a moment. Angie says everything is an assumption.

Nothing can be proven. I think this... Exactly. Yeah. And that's the same. Yes. And movement. And then she says further movement is an appearance too. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. And that's all that was being described is, is. Is the appearance. We're describing the appearance and how it appears, but to who it appears for or to what it appears to is unknowable. What or where can the appearanceappear to be appearing to you know or for or or it's not it's just appearing you can only say it's just an appearance you can't say it's appearing for or it's appearing here or it's appearing there or or it's you can only say it's an appearance it's an appearance appearing And you don't know what anything actually is.

But, you know, then, and even describing it is an appearance. Actually, even describing this is a microphone is an appearance. So the description is a packet of energy appearing in the same appearance, describing some other part of the appearance. Appearances within appearances and descriptions within descriptions and and you know mirrors within mirrors and and smoke and mirrors so I mean the point of that is really like that you can't there's no place to hang your hat there's no place to to resolve to find to resolution a resting place a clear seeing place and then lighten place there is no yeah exactly so which is which is really the cool essence of all this is that is that there actually is no there's no future progression there's no actual planning there's no 3,000 more hours of meditation to see clearly and stay in that placeand remain in that place and not get shifted and not be able to be moved from that place of clear seeing because it's an appearance.

So whether it appears that I feel like a body or I feel like I am the expanded whole universe, it's an appearance. It's always an appearance. So that takes the relief away from any practice, any place of attaining, any place of fixing, undoing, unravelling, healing. And yet the appearance of all those things may well continue and possibly will. Yeah, so there's a bit of thanks for listening to my jargon. Next. Awesome. Awesome. Yeah. Beautiful. Thank you. And we have quite a few people again here with us. We have Catherine, we have Dave, we have Estelle, Catherine, Bill, Andrew, Deborah. And Charles, Peter, Giotti, Jenny. And Jenny is a night owl and is sending much love now.

Thank you, Jenny. But those are all people who are on Facebook Live and it would be just probably much easier because we may eventually give up on that idea of streaming still through and just stay on Zoom. So if you guys could join us on Zoom, the rules on Zoom are basic. We don't pull anyone. We don't call the names and ask people. We don't expose anyone who don't want to be exposed. We don't want to, you know, we don't.expect anyone to show their face if they're not comfortable, if they're not camera shy or anything. And if you don't want to speak, you're happy with typing, we also read the comments that are here in the chat box.

And we have... And without words... Without words or thoughts, what could be said about it? Yeah, that's again. And again, another stressing on the fact that there is no choice maker here. So the fact that we are gathering, the fact that those meetings are shifting to this format, the fact that I don't know what I'm going to say in one minute and I'm just going to be discovering it as much as you do. There is no choice maker. It's just life spontaneously unfolding. And it is futile, says Angie. So this is again to actually show it is all good, says Tibor. Yes. Again, actually to show that, look, if you are still rather not speak, but show up in the form of texting, we're going to read it.

We're going to get you included. So the guys who are watching us on Facebook, please consider. Because as of now, we did actually try to stream Zoom to Facebook. So it would appear, our Zoom group would appear on Facebook.every reason that is happy to do it the other way again we probably need someone someone couple of generations younger it's a great analogy actually you know it's just it's a hundred percent instant live streaming spontaneous Fresh. Constant live stream. Constant live stream. From where? From where? I don't know. And yes, that's life is streaming itself and it's seeing how it streams itself through, you know, like a light of the distant stars that wouldn't even be there if they didn't appear in your dream, if you couldn't recognize them as there.

And right now, if you couldn't imagine them as there. Because I don't see the stars right here, right now, but I can recall the picture of a star and project it and imagine. So that incredible capacity of streaming multidimensional way of experiencing itself. What a mystery, what a miracle. And all of it only now so missing out on that hmm what a waste though it is impossible to miss out on that because even if the life is streaming completely covered up with the imagination, with imaginary drama of separation, whether on the sky of awareness, that is also just what's happening. And recognizing that this weather is only here now and this too shall pass, makes it, brings the spontaneous appreciation.

You know, if not for the pain, the pleasure couldn't have been experienced. If not for the sadness, there would be no joy. So even that spontaneous moment of the darkness makes the light knowable. So just stepping back again, relaxing and noticing that this fleeting moment of here now that will never be the same.again that is only now and it's only because I am only because of the presence of awareness this fleeting moment of life streaming itself and receiving itself in that stream through that stream in that shape that kind of stops the mind Even if it doesn't, yes? It's okay, keep going. And the recognition is spontaneous too.

And the feeling like a separate person is spontaneous. And everything is spontaneous. But when it comes up, like, and the differences, the changeability of it all. It's stunning. Like it's all spontaneous occurrence of nothing appearing as these things, as these movements in these different patterns, presenting as feeling separate or feeling clear or sensing clearly or whatever. How's it going, guys? Hey, hi, Joel. How are you?Yeah, thank you for joining us. If you have something to say or contribute, all right, please just unmute and join us, join the discussion. Sorry, I'll give you a second. Okay. Yeah, it's no pressure, no expectations, just whatever is easy, whatever is natural.

It is just an exploration. We share the experience, preferably direct experience rather than the theoretical situations that often come up also in the meetings. And they are often also good conversation starters. You know, okay, I understand. I remember hearing that many times in Bob's meetings. I understand it now. I resonate with that now. But I'll go home. I will go to work. And there is bullying happening. And there is this happening. And then I forget. Yeah, so the one that remembers, the one that understands, the one that forgets is another appearance.That's just the content of the dream also. I understand. I forget. There is a presence without which that I understand and I forget is not possible.

And the forgetting and the remembering and the understanding and the non-understanding all appear in this, all appearances. And they're all spontaneous and they're all immediate and they're all just there. And they're all appearing in this now, this same, like that's... Always there, no matter what the colours and the shapes and what they look like. Yeah, and we got a few more people joining, so welcome. Welcome. Thank you for joining us. This is just going to be easier for everyone than streaming live with two phones. And you are also welcome to just unmute and say hi. Type a question or a comment. Yes. Five minutes. Yeah.

Oh, really? Yeah. Time's flying. Yeah, he doesn't say enough. Oh. It feels good. No pressure. Check us out, brilliant. No pressure.That's it. Ooh, it's a streaming site. Streaming site. Nothing's actually coming up. Oh, no sync is good. Yeah. No, I've got nothing to say. Yeah. He loses my spiritual demerit. No spiritual demerit. Yeah, not the... You know the best teachers, they say, teach in silence. Well, they... A bit quiet. No, that's okay. Oh, no, that's okay. That's okay. Christian? I was just going to say, I'm still thinking about this drop going back to the ocean and you can't get the same drop out and the light filling, the electricity filling the light bulb and then being withdrawn again.

Yet I'm still going to... Yeah, yeah, look. Hey, hey. Hey, I just wanted to, I got some questions over here. Can you get a brief down on what this is mainly about? Oh, that's, look, we almost wrapping up right now. It's almost 12 o'clock. We are here for the 90 minutes. It is a non-duality exploration. So we basically explore the basic predicament that the separation, sense of identity, sense of being a person,the world in this so-called life which is more dreamlike. I feel like I'm in a dream most of the time. Where are you guys from? It's pretty 12 o'clock. Where are you guys from?

We are in Melbourne, Australia. And as I say, we're nearly done. You can explore, if you look at Sailor Bob Adamson's website, you can explore some of our other meetings and join us next week, perhaps a bit earlier. And yeah, we're just about to wrap up. But welcome, welcome to our group. Welcome to everyone. And everyone, yes, absolutely. We are glad that you actually did. We have 11 people there. What time is it for you guys? 12 o'clock. Right now it's 12 o'clock. Where are you? Oh, for me, it's... I'll make it about 8 o'clock. It's like 8 o'clock for me. Oh, yeah. Okay. 8 o'clock.

Wow. All right. Day before. Day before. Yeah, actually. Hey, Brandon, what time was it for you? I couldn't. It's 8 o'clock. Yeah, that's 8. And for you, John?It's almost 5 o'clock. Almost 5, okay. Yes, so what I'm going to do, I'm probably going to just put on Bob's website where the link to the Zoom meeting is. I'm going to put local times. So next week you can actually check the local times wherever you are located. So you can join us a bit earlier and just enjoy the whole meeting. Of course, yeah, I like your guys'energy. It's been great. Sounds good. Yeah, thank you. It is actually quite a joyous exploration.

You have a very beautiful smile. You guys know, you've just been so involved. You're a brilliant live streamer. I think we're done. So, yeah. You're the brand. You're the brand. Yeah. We'll wrap it up now. Yeah, we're going to be wrapping up because we have further commitments. So I will update the timing on Bob's website and join us earlier next week. And yeah, we're going to get Christian to finish the sentence. I was just going to say, I'm going to sort of finish it with an open question, I guess. And what was his name? Which is the, when the drop returns to the ocean or the electricity is retracted from the light and becomes its pure source, whether it remains...

And Noah and all things thatknow remain as that knower, as that like an individual, as opposed to like one big knowing. So I would impute that, and I'm not saying I'm right, I'm just saying that it remains an individual knower. And so there's lots of individual knowers that become all these different things and have all this infinite potential and the ability to all be omniscient. Yet they never, this doesn't just become like one big being, or it's not just one big being doing it all. There's like multitudes of beings, yet they all have that infinite potential, which is how to get our minds around. They're all omniscient.

They're all... Unlimited yet we're all unlimited we're all on this in us at our source that's our potential um it's just like and we can feel different shapes different lights become different things and completely with no trace of what we were before yet that energy life so i'm just yeah so some people might say return to the ocean and and become something different or merges with others but i'm saying i think it always remains as an individual, but not with any characteristic. How about you are the ocean in the drop? You are the ocean in every expression. Yeah. I was going to say, like, they and we are that.

Yes. And everything is that. Yes.Sorry, David said something over there. Yeah, these... I said it. You and you are the world. Thanks, guys. That's right. Yeah. Thank you, everyone. See you earlier. Join the website. Have a look online. Yeah, we'll see you next week. Bye. Yeah, see you next week. Thanks. Thank you, guys. Thanks, everyone. Thanks, everyone.