This transcript was made by speech-recognition software, so names and some words may be misheard. The recording is the original: watch on YouTube.
And we have Julia and Blacken and Ross, Anthony, Tony, Michael, Dino and we got Bob and Tanya and Oopsie. Can you check if there is a sound? All right. Or should I replug it just in case? Okay, I'll just replug it.Blue moons. Blue moons. Would you like to do half a spill? I think I'm reading my story. Okay. Whatever comes up. Okay. It has a non-dual point here. Hmm. Yeah. I've got to wrap it to the end. Okay. We'll do. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. We'll do it. Okay. Let me just introduce and just welcome everyone who is with us today here and who is also with us online.
And see if we have if anyone can report back whether the audio is audible or not and for those who were hanging out with us for the last 12 months you may know and how the for those who didn't we had couple of days ago a little bit of a special event not really celebrating it's nothing to celebrate someone's passing but it's been 12 months since Bob entered the formlessness which is the natural state and we had a sea funeral ceremony we had a moment of returning the old sailor back to the sea and I maybe able to make a like a five minute snippet of a little video where we had a gathering with people who in love and care and gratitude for Bob had a little moments of memories and snippets of anecdotes or the way he influenced them or the way they met it may come live or not.
And for those who actually follow Bob's YouTube channel, you might have seen that to just mark that 12 months, I've uploaded a couple of things from the archives, a couple of old meetings. Also, the audio version read in Bob's voice of the book that he wrote himself, Beyond Mind, Beyond Words. I was requested over the year to republish the book so it is available in a Kindle version. So that has also happened. The republished version has actually, the Beyond Words is only one of five parts of the book. You'll find it on our website, which I restructured a little bit also because they are more of valuable assets, like MP3 files from historical meetings from 10, 12 years ago.
So you don't have to have the YouTube when you go for a walk or you drive the car. You can listen to MP3 straight on. There will be a link to a new book. I was hoping to finish the biography and it is finished. It's just being reviewed by...friends so it will take a little longer to make sure that this watertight and good uh the book the parts in the book is just one part that is written in a similar way as beyond words beyond mind and it has never been published before it is intelligence energy versus thought where bob is diving into the origin of duality how what is the distinction even though there is only one energy but how it appears as a thought versus staying unappeared as a background.
It's a beautiful and interesting piece of reading. We also have, and that's what opens the book, the version with a little story of how it came about of Beyond Words, Beyond Mind, retitled as Awareness Speaks, which is elaboration, more of a channeling of Bob's message through a dear friend, Andrew. Lynn, who on Bob's request, Bob gave him the manuscript and said, do something with it. So Andrew just sat down in a moment of joining and aligning himself with everything that transformationally received from Bob over the years, landed in the very similar style. So you'll have the elaborated version, which Bob totally approved. He actually loved it to the extent thatHe says, publish it, publish it straight away.
Put your name on it. It's really good. But Andrew didn't want to go about it. There was some differences in politics in the Sangha. He just threw it to the bin. 15 years later, one of the friends, he's shown that found a digital copy, re-edited it, Andrew shared on a Zoom meeting with our groups where 20 people unison decided that this is brilliant and it can't be just left in the drawer. So this is one of the parts of the book and there is also a transcript from Bob's beautiful commentary on Sins in Mink that our dear friend Jenny from Sweden really manually transcribed from the video because we couldn't get the manuscript any other way.
You may want to check it in. I don't encourage anyone to spend money. As always, as all Bob's work, the price is put as low down as possible. The royalty is like $1. So if anyone has a feeling that the website costs everything, you want to donate that $1, you can buy a book just for that reason, to have it published. Most of the materials you find free available online you have beyond words now read by Bob on my channel I put itit also because I found it we did it with Bob together at some point I found it really valuable to have it repeated you know the Bob message if you know nearly 50 years he would repeat the same set of pointers capturing that nature of nothingness from as many angles as possible because the way we got conditioned was through repetition so the way we get free from conditioning is repeatedly looking at those hooks which keep the identity intact so the version of beyond words beyond mind that i put on on my channel and is where i repeat bob's voice he reads the paragraph and i repeat the paragraph so you'll see which one kind of sounds better or or reaches better for Yeah, options are there.
And the MP3 options as well. So that is for the marking of a year in a formlessness. We don't have that or the ashes any longer here.And the meetings actually lasted for a year, which nobody knew whether it is going to happen or not, that we're going to be gathering at home just the way he did. But it seems like they're organically coming to, they're thinning up, less and less people is bothered driving because it's so much easier to tune online. And that might be the calling for restructuring the meetings. So we are looking at having a Facebook Live still, but including Zoom, where people could join us on Zoom.
Facebook Live will be plugged to Zoom. Perhaps meetings at home we may consider having once a month instead of once a week. So we will have the live participation. And we will keep them uploaded on YouTube as long as they last. That will be just for the convenience. That's so far for the organizational things. Next week, next Sunday, we're going to have the anniversary of the memorial that we had 12 months ago. So now Bob would say, cut the crap, go back straight to non-duality. Though everything that I mentioned is really, really going back to non-duality. You can check those files, you can check those videos.videos you can check whatever you find on the website I will work with AI maybe to make it nicer because for now I just didn't really have that much of an incentive so it's really basic and back to non-duality it is really a set of reminders of bringing back the awareness to the source of it to the fact of our own existence to the joy of being because the joy of being is naturally there unless it is covered up and obscured by the concepts that something is wrong that something should be different.
Something shouldn't be there because I don't like it or something should be there because I do like it. But when we look and investigate and see if there is any I that does the liking and we can't find any, then perhaps what it is, as it is, without relating, referencing it to any sense of ownership, any sense of identity, is just natural and if liking arises that's what arises if disliking arises that's what arises and from the perspective of pure presence in which everything arises liking disliking urges ideas judgments thoughts feelings from that field of presence that you are and the arising of the content all the content is is a call for appreciationBecause it's a momentary, changing, impermanent appearance that flashes on the screen and goes in no time.
So even if this is a flash of eruption of a volcano or this flash of the anxiety just showing up in that witnessing presence, it is a call for, wow, my goodness, wow. If it doesn't happen to me and if it is not personal because there is no one to own it or to be related to, Every situation, every moment is pure and perfect as it is, even if the body is experiencing discomfort, even if the body is shedding tears, even if the body is missing something or is experiencing pain. That field, that pure presence in which that particular set of momentary reactions that will not be here in a minute, that are fresh and new, that call for that space for acknowledging and appreciating and for just being with it, whatever comes up.It's really a celebration of the uniqueness of those dancing patterns of life appearing as the other, as the form, as the energy.
And as they say, you know, like in year and a bit of anniversary of that beautiful body-mind pattern that Bob was, you know, like love it while it's there. Because the pattern, the form, the body, the body of a feeling, the body of a mental image. It's not going to last. It's only now. Love it while it's there. Right now, we love this man as he's there as a thought form, as a pattern of mental image, memory, and a feeling that is reflected in the heart. And that's beautiful too. That isn't again a call for misery and self-pity it is also a call for appreciation everything including the sense sense of loss including the preference perhaps so from the perspective of presence that you are because that is a direct experience and you can verify it right now are you not present are you not here are you not existing well i'm not asking to say i am or i'm notWell, just maybe see if you can not be, not exist.
Not as you, a person, but just a pure presence, pure existence. And you'll see that it is effortlessly here, it's never not here, because the shit that comes up is noticed, is cognized, whatever it is, there is an awareness of stuff popping up. There's some things there, seeming things there popping up. That are known of. So the presence is there. We can call it me, we can call it I, we can add to it a history, add to it a sense of identity, say that that presence belongs to me, the body, that the consciousness is only generated because of the brain activity, and all the other thoughts and concepts and ideas can be added upon it.But without those thoughts and ideas and beliefs, it is still here.
You don't disappear without the thought. Being is primary. The interpretation or meaning put on it shows up after. So life is really, really simple when we go first with the certainty, with the direct experience. And then we view all that is made of it, the meaning making machine, we view it as an adornment. The space of presence is here. And then the adornment, all the decorations, all the ideas, the positive mood, the negative mood, the low self-esteem, the high self-esteem, the story from yesterday, the fear about tomorrow. All of that is just filling up that mirror, that pure presence is being reflected in it, in that field, in that field of being.So that is how simple it is.
What's wrong right now if we don't think? Nothing. And then the thought comes up, yeah, but that can't be it. Well, but it is. No, it can't be. There must be more. Well, but it is. That's it. If I don't think this moment, yeah, but... Yeah, but, but, I know, but. And that's where the habit of engaging in that amazing entertainment system that the mind is, is back in force, in a front seat, the illusion of control, illusion of driving the car, illusion of being a seeker, that there is something else that I... The seeker will find later, tomorrow, in the next lifetime. All thoughts, all mental images, existing only because of the energy of attention, which is a belief, borrowing life, like the metal rod in the fire, borrowing the life of a fire.
And becoming red and becoming hot like a fire of itself a dead corpse completely benign can't hit you can't can't shine the light so those ideas those thoughts those seeming identities i am a person in the body i've been traumaI had a bad experience, terrible childhood, or I have great potential and I'm wasting it. I'm not doing what I should be doing. All this stuff is made of thoughts that borrow the attention, that borrow the life of the fire, of that source of all existence. And they seem real. But the moment you pause, where are they? Where is the identity? Who are you without the thinking, without your story, without the past?
Is there a past?And of course, you will see again the mind coming into the picture. Look, you know, of course, there is a past. I broke a leg yesterday and now I have a plaster. You see, there is a consequence. There is a proof. Okay, but if that is also recognized as the meaning-making machine, the storytelling machine, Is there a past? And you will see the very, very close resemblance of constructing of that world, constructing of the past of that world, of my own history, being not much different to the dream. How real is the dream if you don't remember it? And where is it when it's gone?
Where did it go? Where did it come from? Where is the past?And anything, can you grasp anything, any idea? Can you show me the identity or the mind or the thought or the yesterday or the memory or the fear? All of that are reflections in that space-like presence, bodiless, mindless, free, timeless, boundless, spaceless. If you sit in that emptiness of being, emptiness of self, You see that without the thought you can't put the timeline or shape or space or circumference. You can't put anything on it. It's just here.And it's delightful. There is nothing wrong. There's nothing wrong in it. And that is probably one of the biggest sources of confusion.
And that's how and why Nisargadatta is so cherished by so many. Although he has some poetic expressions of I am the world, I am God, I am the universe, he also makes it very, very plain and simple, bringing it back and stripping it off all the illusory, imaginary, superior, heightened state of a cosmic union by saying, there is nothing wrong anymore because there is only something wrong when you think about it when there is a thought appearing and is believed to be true when it's messed up the map is taken to be a territory the thought is being taken to be a thought to be to be the realityWithout that misconception, without that adoption of a mental projection to be the reality, there isn't anything wrong.
There is never anything wrong without the thought. Life is simple. There is no death. There is no dying. Those are all thoughts. There's no going anywhere. There's no becoming anything. Those are all stories. Life just is as it is, is plain and simple and beautiful and present, is right here.even when there is discomfort. Without labeling discomfort, stomachache or headache, without labeling it, is the energy pulsating, experiencing and expressing as everything. And it is the expression is lively, is changing. It's like a movie. It's constantly action going on. Sometimes that river of life may be going a little bit slower. And the body may experience the sense of underwhelmed.
And other times it may go faster through the rapids and waterfalls, like Bob's beautiful metaphor of the river being, you know, going and rushing and the system gets overwhelmed. Yes, that's the experience. That's the roller coaster, ups and downs, and off it goes. But grabbing a bucket of water and putting it on the bank of a river and saying, this is I, and trying to keep up with life is ridiculous, is impossible. Relating to the stagnant water that is dead, this is me. I am a person, I am a woman, I am Australian or Polish or American or whatever. It's laughable, isn't it?I think that's kind of half of the spiel.
Julia, I want to continue. I'll keep the cut on your lap. You have something to say about this? If somebody were to ask me what the game changer, I think, of this understanding of non-duality, it would be that just to see that, I like this quote from Nisargadatta, that wisdom is knowing that I am nothing and love is knowing I am everything between the two life flows. It brings me back a little bit to, actually it was a guy I met long before I met you guys, not too long, but. Before I met Bob, who, because I was like always like, oh, I'm everything, I'm everything.
He's like, you seem to have down that you're everything. You need to see that you're nothing. You need to die before you die. I'm like, what the fuck does that mean? I didn't understand that, but that's what I'll go into a little bit about what's dying or whatever he's saying is should die is really just the idea of whatever this When he's saying, I should die before I die, he's talking about the idea of the me, which I didn't get at the time, but that's what he's referring to, is this idea of the me. And I think there's a video somewhere online of Krishna Murthy talking to some psychologists.
And he was also talking about the me being the cause of the psychological suffering, which I've heard Bob say many times. But he was also saying, talking about that, and it's this,meanness that she doesn't have. She doesn't have this sense of meanness because that's a thought, but she still can act like there's a me sometimes. Anyway, I am... I wanted to, I was sharing a story, which I didn't quite finish, but it has a bunch of non-dual pointers and the helpfulness anyway. And even though the helpfulness is for a me that is not what I am, that's where I sometimes am. It's helpful sometimes for the body-mind, even though that's not what I am.
I don't know how else to say that. But it was. So before meeting Bob and Kat, what introduced me to Bob was the Sedona Method. And the Sedona Method has a lot of inquiry or investigation. And one of the forms of the investigation is simply just a question. Can you find the one? Who can feel this, that, or the other thing, when you want to let go, you're holding on to a resentment or something, can you find the one who's holding on? Can you take a look and you investigate, right? So I'll go back to my story. What happened was, I think in... I should say that I have a medical condition that was diagnosed in 1987 of bipolar manic depressive illness.
Or I had it. I don't like to say this is something I have. I have a history of it. Right? So this was diagnosed that... The diagnosis I received.Even it's pretty accurate. I mean, I've been in loony bins, which I'll tell you in the story, where, and I think actually, digressing a little bit, but in the biblical story where Lucifer,
ends up becoming Satan. What happened was not that he thought he was God. He was better than God, which means you're separate from God. You know, if you're more than that, you're somehow higher than. That was the big mistake. Or to think that you're less than.
It would be the same mistake, right? So that was his big sin that he went to hell for. Anyway, another part of my little path is Christianity, right? So I was, that was part of my thing. And so anyway, I ended up having a manic episode. The last one was the year 2000, and then I found out about these vitamins. And vitamins from truehope.com were game changers for me. They made two babies possible, but that's not really the story. So, but I should say that I had been four years without taking my vitamins and they worked. But I had been doing a lot of letting go and that also helped.
And I think that's what enabled the four years of no vitamins really was that anytime I'd catch myself holding on a lot, I'd let go. But what I didn't catch was it was so sneaky was this identification rising. You know, didn't just didn't didn't catch it. And that's just to see all now if I ever go batshit crazy. And that's the thing to say to me. Right. Maybe you are that. Yeah, let's take a look. Let's investigate because Bob used to say the false cannot stand up to investigation. Right? So I was buying, and what happened was I think it caught.about because one of the symptoms of a manic illness is you have racing thoughts.
And because of the racing thoughts, you're not really being present with any one of them. You're just kind of jumping to the next one. So you jump to the conclusion. So the conclusion that was jumped to was, I am the reincarnation of Eve and Mary. That's pretty special. And the second coming of Christ, I'm like, well, that's a consciousness. But then I was also the queen of the universe. So these are like, there was definitely a me that was like, I'd been identified that can reincarnate that was holier than and really special. Right. And so I. Anyway, on this day in particular, as I said earlier, for the story, I walked over to my next-door neighbor's house, well, buck naked, and told her I was having mental telepathy with Tony Robbins and that he was going to be setting out his helicopter, who was going to fly us to Air Force One, and my husband and I were going to be flied off to the Vatican where we'd be remarried by the Pope.
And I'm talking to my neighbor while buck naked, want to come? And she's just looking at me like, oh, I don't think I can make it, but thank you for inviting me. But later that day, I end up in a loony bin like three hours from my home, but in a really bad neighborhood. The doctor would have wanted me to take the drugs. I was refusing the drugs. Because I'd taken vitamins and they worked. So, but anyway, I'm in the loony bin and what I was, I can only.also say is there's a difference between insanity and stupidity. So I was crazy, but I still had the programming, you know, and some of the tools, some of the ideas, the false cannot stand up to investigation or whatever, you know.
So then what happened was I, it was a thought that occurred. I didn't choose it. It just showed up. It was kind of a convenient thought. The thought was, well, you know, they're expecting me to sleep now. I didn't have my precious with me. I'm supposed to sleep. So the thought was, well, I'm wondering what they would consider to be my delusions of grandeur, because that's one of the symptoms of a manic episode or a manic illness. And it occurred to me, probably the thought that I'm the reincarnation of Eve and Mary and the queen of the universe. And then I took a look at that thought.
And then the other thought came up as well. Maybe I am. You know, I mean, you can prove that I'm not this. I mean, people think they're the reincarnation of Queen Elizabeth or something. I don't know, but maybe I am. But, and then I remembered Bob's quote, the false cannot stand up to investigation. And so I'm like, let's take a look. And then the Sedona Method question jumped in, which I learned to preface. And I preface it with this because it helps to lead the question. Are you this form? This body? I'd already figured out that can't be what I am. That's something I've explored a lot.
It helps to see a corpse, by the way. No, it can't be this.So if I'm not a form and my body, this is all neti neti, you know what I mean? If I'm not a body, I'm not a body. I'm not a personality. I'm not anything. If I'm not anything, can you actually find the one who can be the reincarnation of anything? Or the queen of anything? And I'm not going to tell you that the head went silent and I was just all silent. That didn't happen. But there was a brief moment of silence, seconds, when I investigated. No, nothing. Emptiness was the response. Can't find a fucking...
No. No. Can I in that moment I could no longer believe the delusion the thought I am this reincarnation or this specialness or whatever and They also in that moment there was a oh shit. I started to believe my thoughts I call fuck I didn't catch that you know and I started to go back to right back to here and This is anything that's going on in my head right now about anything. And there were a lot of things that could disturb me. It's a dangerous place to be, you know. I mean, I did get beaten up on my last day in the loony bin, right?
And they don't let you sit and meditate alone anywhere, you know. So all I could do, and because there was another point that Bob had given, I love this one. Do you think that little flap of skin is going to shut the world out? Because most of us are like doing it, trying to like sit somewhere to be in this. The stillness is already here. It's what's.between the words it's how you understand the words it's because the words appear on this so this is always here so just come back to here not that I could leave but but but that the attention can go off you know what I mean and so bring it back to here so just bring it back to here I can't leave it but here just and that's all I did And it lasted a week, didn't it?
So within about a week, my husband, who I'd been married to for 15 years, he could tell if I'm even mildly irritated. The doctor, and then I actually shared something about this. Once we take ourselves or anybody, anything we put, I've got this T-shirt here, you can see, it just says, you are. Anything we put after is M and R is bullshit. That's a concept. It's a label that's being bought into. And it's now we're saying this is what you are. You're an asshole. You're a liar. You're this. You're that. I am crazy. I am this. It's all now. Let's come back to before anything we put after is M and R and just stay with this M.
You know? That's, I think, what helped me tremendously as I was going through this week. Because there were times, like the doctor, there was something other thing that I just thought of. I shared it the other day on Facebook. There was a study that was done in the early 1970s where somebody just did an experiment and they sent... People who were not crazyinto the hospital and just said, I'm hearing voices. And the doctors in the hospital just, oh, they're schizophrenic, they're bipolar, they're whatever, and then they've got now this label. And they were in there for 12 to 16 weeks because the doctors were like, they're crazy, right?
So then they found out about the study later on and go, okay, we'll do it again. And they thought they would do it again. They actually never did do it again, but then they kicked out, they said, 12 people, you were faking it, so they kicked them out. Okay? Okay? So that's the trouble with any identifying, not just for me, but for anybody else. Because if there's a you, there's a me. Right? And if I'm taking a you to be an entity, well, then I could be that or whatever. So there is no, anything we put after is M&R is bullshit. And anyway, that was for me the way out of insanity in that particular moment.
And I found it very helpful to just anytime I catch myself holding on longer than a toddler, Not that I do that, but who would do that? But it happens, you know, and it's just every time it's seen, it's much easier to just come back to, oh, yeah. I don't take it very seriously because I wouldn't do that. No. That's it. That's beautiful.That's so good. Thank you, Julia. And this is really a beautiful, again, illustration and invitation. You know, people who are listening to us may want to find Julia one way or another. And she's helping people dropping and letting go and looking into it.
And I keep encouraging her to make it a book. Because it really is revealing, you know, whether you have a delusion of grandeur or you have a delusion of separation, there isn't that big of a difference, really. It's still a delusion. It's still, yes. They don't have a delusion of not enoughness. Yes. They just call it low self-esteem, which is kind of normal. Right? You know, there's a story I heard about the Dalai Lama. He just didn't even understand. What do you mean low self-esteem? How could that be? What do you mean? I don't get it. And he had to be explained that people were buying into a self that could be higher or lower.
Right? That's all. And so that was bought into. And that's habit. That can happen. And I think actually just thinking reinforces the habit. So like if you observe your thinking, just once in a while watching the mind and seeing how it operates, in addition to the appearing in the pairs of opposites, you'll notice that it also, there's a lot of that word I in it. You know? And that's fine, I guess. What's important is it'll happen, I guess, or it won't.Take a look. And so Bob would be like, yeah, I use the word I, but it doesn't mean what I believe I am. You know, and when I say I, I am.
We were chatting about this the other day. Yes, I'm referring to this. Meat suit with thoughts, the memories, the stories, the patterns, all of that shit. That is what I'm, but I don't think that's what I am. You know, but once in a while, I think there's just this habit. But then it's like Bob said, you know, that you see it and then it's once it's seen, I don't judge it. Because I know, first off, I know that like there was this pointer of like choosing thinking. Who the fuck would do that when you realize that it's the thinking that makes us feel like shit?
It's the thinking that is making, it's like they're saying when I'm insane, the problem is mind. You know what I mean? What's the problem? The problem is belief and thought. That's really it. And so we're believing in identity and a delusion of not enoughness. I'm or I'm not. You know, I'm not enlightened enough. You know, maybe if I my head was still and silent all the time. And I never had a thought like, you know, and I'm always present in whatever is. Like not going to any, then I'm enlightened and then I'm enough because now I'm like living like the Buddha back to when I was, when I was six.months old and I didn't have thought back then some people seem to forget their little babies are little buddhas yes you know but um I think that all that's ever happened is was just a habit that started at the age of two when I when there was a take in myself to be this Julia I body mind personality whatever because how many toddlers do you see holding grudges I mean others of you have had kids you know maybe if you don't have kids you can you could be around somebody else's toddler and you can just see they get pissed off for sure you know they'll get angry But they're not talking about it six months later or six weeks later or six days later or even six hours later.
Usually. You know, they just, and they explode like the dog does or the bird does. It was a pointer that Bob had made about the birds, you know, or maybe you did. You know, if you run up to them, they'll fly off and then they... Go back to just eating stuff, you know, like nothing ever happened. They don't go, oh, you're evil. You have to get me. I better hunt. I better set up a plan and make sure this doesn't happen again in the future or not. They stay here. So I don't think they have the habit. You know, there was something I... It's kind of sad, but I've heard dogs, like there was a study with a dog that was taught words with buttons.
Happy, sad, outside, inside, food, me.You, what? And the dog is now taking itself to be the name of the dog. And now it's got depression, poor thing. You know? Because it's buying itself into being this entity. How sad, poor fucker. But maybe... Yeah, but there is a beautiful aspect to it. And it's a great point. It just really demonstrates how the identity comes into existence and what comes with it. The sense of isolation, separation, loneliness, all of that, without which... The freedom is impossible. You do, you know, to actually find your absolute unboundedness. Because I think they're already free. And so are we. We just tell ourselves we're not.
So they never told themselves we're not. But you realize that if you are already free, you are unaware of it because that's all there is. So there is no appreciation for it. Yes. Like you don't have any appreciation for the air you breathe unless someone will stick your head under the water for three minutes. Right. So the same thing is, you know, there is intelligence to life much greater than every idea that we may want to have about it. So if there is an identity, there is a program here forming that sense of separated, isolated, miserable, poor little self. And the more that poor, miserable self is suffering and seeking and looking, the more appreciation.
In fact, there is almost direct.correlation in that blast of so-called enlightenment or a freedom depending on the amount of darkness you know when the darkness like this is why a lot of seekers say oh for me it is just a slow shedding of the ideas because I didn't go through the black night of the soul like Bob did when he met me, Sargadatta, his life fell apart. His wife left him. He had nowhere to go. He was living in the ashram, shoveling the cow shit. And he expected he would just die there. There was absolutely nothing in it for him. It was just the dark night of the soul.
In that, hearing the message and really hearing it was like he could pinpoint day and the minute and the hour of that great awakening as if it was an event that happened to me even though he would say look this is just a story realization there is no me completely obliterates the idea of awakening happening in a certain point to a certain me because there is no one there But when I came to Bob, sorry, also in a moment of dark night of the soul, when I split up with my partner, I was on the other side of the world, completely isolated, and there was nothing in it for me.
I just didn't really want to be with myself, with the world, anywhere. I was just crying my eyes out with... One of the lowest points of my life and suddenly it landed that there is reallyjust this moment unfolding as it does with the story thick and layered with pain with embodiment of of the of the misery that has been believed by seeming entity and suddenly that entity collapsed of course nothing happened for the person because the person wasn't there anymore but the darkness lifted in one moment in instant it just and there was never a sense of separate identity there life is a mystery reactions are still happening in the body the headaches are happening the anger outbursts everything is still happening but there is no claiming of a self that is good enough not good enough bad enough or should be different or in the future we'll get somewhere else or become something else none of that shit and it happened in an instant but the people that i met over the years in these rooms and before that unless they really hit that rock bottom that would be just a slow realization one moment of the time, hmm, there is no one there.
Well, the illusion of self, the sea still looks blue and the sky still looks blue and there is still illusion of a self being in charge or controlling or doing something right or doing something wrong. That's just how the projection is happening. That's how the whole machine is designed. But really there isn't anybody there, even though it may seem like it is. So the knowing is prior to the projection.even though projection looks the same. The mind is still chatting, is still commenting, judgment is still arising, but it is all happening on autopilot and the presence is witnessing all that. I'm not the one who is speaking the words that are in my head.
I'm the presence in which the speaking happens. I'm the registering field that registers the speaking, the feelings, the hearing, the seeing, and that's much more peaceful here. Whatever the content, you know, the surface of the ocean can be rough, but the whole lot is very, very peaceful. And some of the programming of the body may be holding on to a grudge, just like the dog, you know. If you have the dog being maltreated in the house, kicked by one person and cherished by the other, dog doesn't hold to the grudge but it will stay away from that person who kicks it that's the natural learning we engage with the thinking habitually there's no we even doing it is a habit of engaging with thinking and the habit is justified by the idea of learning that oh if i don't ruminate if i don't elaborate if i don't analyze it i will not draw the lessons i will not and and there is something in it you know the repetition is a form of learning too.
But mainly the mind component of learning is completely visceral, instinctual.If the body is maltreated like that dog, it will instinctively crunch and walk away. It will instinctively resist showing up in certain settings, whether the narrative goes on or it doesn't. So, yeah, go for it. Yeah, and mine was more like sort of... The ocean is quite still, though not in respect of the dog patterns that are definitely there. So it was just like, you know, go to a retreat and I came here in one week and it was like, oh, have a look inside. Is there a little Tony running around, you know, two or three good looks of about a minute each?
Yeah, nah, it's not there. So that's easy because I always believed the universe was just an unraveling thing and this was just all energy doing its stuff. And so the idea that, so it was only ever a held idea. It wasn't like, oh, it feels like there's a me. That was never there. It was just never questioned the idea that there's a me. That there's like... But that me was just like an icon. That was it. You know, it was still, you know, there was the notion that me did stuff, but there was no notion that it wasn't the, that this me wasn't just, representative of the collective everything that happened till now in this space and in the next moment was only ever a consequence of you knowa theory had come up that it was a mass and you know the mass was moving with whatever momentum it had and then it was all intertwining and there was nothing outside of this and there was because everything's already included in the universe there's no catalyst outside to ever make that different so this unraveling could never be different from what it was so why are people going on about you know parallel universe or another option or regret that they didn't do something else it just made no sense because you know there was never going to be anything different than what happened now and that was just how you know it was seen from here but but the notion of oh tony's seeing that that was never questioned yeah but it wasn't but it it was never once it was looked at there was definitely never a history of it feels like tony that was just not there either so that part was very easy you know it's just like oh yep okay yeah totally it's just energy everywhere and that's it bubbling around that's it But moments of no thought was much more, still like hardly ever there because, well that's recognized after a few months, it was recognized of coming to Bob's.
And some of those like online people who are sending the energy, that seems to, there's a guy in Namala who's pretty good at that in Sedona and that seemed to dispel it. For a few minutes, you know, maybe, and then the light sort of like joy would arise and the face would curl up and, you know, you just, oh yeah, that's that light satisfaction.Chocolate ice cream does it too. What's that? No, I hate chocolate ice cream. I don't really, yeah, no. It's chocolate. Chocolate's only good as real chocolate, yeah. And so... That emptied everything out. So, you know, wait for thoughts to come back in.
Okay, the thoughts aren't coming in. Okay. What was I talking about? Yeah, so... So what sort of goes on here though is somewhere between, like there is a process that takes place which is all part of the swirling energy to release the hang-ups and the triggers and stuff like that and it's a complex process and it's always different and it's just noticed that it's just notions popping up, notions pop up and then something happens, there's an actions and notions and then more freedom and less being tripped, less... Pattern being triggered so I guess it's somewhere between the dog and the human so it's like there's an ability kind of sense that it's a me anywhere in that process but there's still a you know s load ofpattern behavior taking place but less as this other pattern of releasing patterns is also taking place um in fact the early part of this meeting there was a bit of bit of observation well no i can't say observation but there was some of the energy here was um who knows how like connecting I can't say there's a rareness because that makes no sense like something was going on and there was noticing of like notions popping up of oh that's just a new way of seeing that that might be useful if I write something about no free will that you know and then there was a certain amount of like some energy oh are there any contracts going on between this character and the other character on the ghostly realm oh let's you know and then oh it seems like a no or a yes and and it meanwhile just knowing that that's just energy stuff and there's no real truth in any of it or lies in any of it um it's just something else that was playing out and you know was anything in you know in that realm
That's against complete freedom.
So, okay, let's dispense with that then. But all that is just a notion and that's just an energy play and that's just a phrase that comes up, a way of phrasing something that just pops up too. It's just, you know, all is just completely, there's no way of knowing. There's no knowing here. Like that's the way I see it here anyway. There's no knowing. Of what any of that might be, there's any naming or apparent knowing, it's just some kind of flow, nothing, you know, nothing, it just seems ridiculous that it can be accurately understood in any way by anything you know like where does the understanding even come from you know that's not known for sure and that's brilliant yes that's brilliant that's actually the final truth the problem the old problem that people have is trying to grasp it with the mind and that's impossible that's not difficult that's impossible that can't be done Mind is a noise production.
How can the noise ever get to the silence? And why? Kill the mystery. What even the idea that there is a self that will have it worked out, figured out, you know, enlightened people, they know the answer to the world and the universe and I want to know it too. Wow, preposterous. Yeah, I wouldn't know because my journey was so completely different from that seeker thing. So I wouldn't even, I can't even know what that experience was.It's like the final answer, much, much easier than having it to be explained that that can never happen. Except the experience of being free is the last thing to happen here.
So there's people that have a big, you know, period, years of just freedom. But the patterns are still under there. They haven't been dispensed with. The um and then sometimes they just pop up and not not that freedom off its perch and here it's more like yeah that freedom all just seems to be normal but um there's a very heavy bunch of patterns and just continuing and um being triggered and it's all around discomfort. Oh God, how am I going to get, I'm so tired. How's the next step going to happen? Like, and even though those words, those sentences have I and all that, that doesn't really mean anything like any kind of reflection on, you know, oh, that's interesting.
It's more like, oh, the thought pops up. Oh, eyes in there. As soon as, you know, it's heard, then. You know a pattern in here gets triggered they won't believe that you know what i'm saying you know especially in australia it's worse in new zealand but there's a lot more like what an idiot going on it's so polite you never know it takes you years to figure out that's what they're thinking in new zealand you have like a deep conversationand you get all upset with each other and that's that. But, yeah, it's more of an effort to confront but less of an understanding of how people are feeling about it.
Anyway, that's, yeah, another digression. I forget where that was going. But that's, yeah, that's brilliant. That's an expression. It's lovely. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm going to, and then there's such a point. And relief, you know, relief pops up that there was no seekership going on and, you know, and, yeah, just appreciation pops up, but it's nothing special, you know. That the things that, you know, don't bother me and things that do bother just, well, they're just what's happening, you know. That's it. So how can you complain about it? Because there was never going to be an alternative. That's right. There's no one, there's no blaming to be done.
There's not even, there's no one to blame. There's no blaming to be done because it's only ever just unraveling. Yeah, absolutely. It's so simple. I'm just going to include a few people that have commented here with us. And there is... There are welcoming message and audio is good. And Anthony says it was very touching. Thank you for sharing. I knew Bob was resting in the ocean of consciousness, but now I know for sure. And... Leslie says, love to you all from Italy.New York and Julie says Julia the idea of something wrong is also a concept absolutely and she also says I like how blunt and direct you are Julia yeah I love it too same here as Tanya as well and Anthony says early on I went a bit crazy but it all pauses and with the grace of people like Bob and his words we find our way hmm and he also says I came back to life with the thought I want to be hope rock bottom can be just what you need Amazingly so.
Sometimes that depth of suffering, the depth of darkness, is what creates the appropriate contrast for the appreciation of life, of light, of lightness. The enlightenment called, you know, being bathed in light with lightness. So the heaviness and the darkness of life, again, there is intelligence to that whole dream. Without the contrast, nothing is experienced, nothing is known. Without sadness, you wouldn't know joy. Without sickness, you wouldn't appreciate health. So animals who live in the natural state, there is no sense of separation, unless you train the dog to have the identity, of course.There is no appreciation for the freedom because it has never been lost. It has never been obscured.
So it's taken for granted, completely taken for granted. While that unique pattern called human has that unique simulation of fake... Costume of identity, the car or the vehicle or the house, which it considers to be his true self. And then through questioning and through repeatedly, sometimes it needs to be repeated. Even Bob, who had one big blast experience with Nisargadatta as he walked out of the room. The mind was back in charge on the front seat, seemingly, because it's just a set of mechanical program. It can never run the show because it's just a narrative program. It's just a language model. It does not have the capacity to beat your heart.
Unless you define the mind as all sets of programs. Because the whole biocomputer is run in an incredibly complex way, though even that is an appearance in the presence or in consciousness, because if you look in which way the dream body is run to be able to fly, Is there any blood flow going on there, moving oxygen through the veins, through the limbs? It is not. So those things, all those placebo effects, you know, the physical world,physical experience, the adopted reality, the agreed upon rules of gravity and of weight or of, you know, the hurt and the punch and all that are absolutely fascinating. And you can stay in the mind and explore the theories in the observer effect and the quantum mechanics forever and ever until the end of time, because time has an end there.
And the beginning and all the stories that exist in time exist in science or religion but the immediacy of this moment unclouded by that mental construct is always prior and it's always here it doesn't have to be sought it can't be found because it hasn't been lost And it is always home. You can take a breath. And will take you straight out of the head back to the heart and there you are right here never not here even if the entertainment system is projecting the tomorrow and and and and the yesterday it is happening here it is happening now And what's the miracle? What the mystery?
Wanting to understand it is appearing now. Wanting, the urge, I want to, I need to, I must. Because otherwise, how am I going to be in charge? How am I going to mitigate my fear?How am I going to control the thing if I don't even know how it works? Well, again, who wants to kill the mystery and why? Why not let it run the same way the seeming blood is running, the seeming breath is running, the seeming heart is beating? That thought, the next thought, the next idea that's going to arrive in that screen is not controlled by the mind, is not thought by the entity, is just happening.
And wow, if you are the space of wow, witnessing the happening, what do you ever have to do? What do you ever have to know? What do you ever have to grasp, control or understand? And that's what you are if you strip yourself from those conceptual ideas of being something or the other. That's the direct experience. It is not a self-hypnotism which right from childhood was telling you that you are the entity and you rely on those descriptions and all those thoughts and words and holding on to that identity habitually. You're not doing it. There's no one doing anything. But habitually it sticks there like a second skin, like a car or house.
And it feels so real because it's repeatedly reinforced day in and day out, every day of your life, every hour of every day.But the thought is paused and existence is there and identity is not. And you're still here with or without it. And without it, nothing is known, nothing is understood. Without the thought, you can't say there is a planet rolling around the sun. You can't say it without the thought. And this moment, this magical, mysterious moment of existence, furnished with all the appearances, the sounds, the sights, the sensations, wow, unique, ever fresh, never not here. Without the whole story and with it too because the story will seep in the interpretations the labels the judgments it all seeps in but prior to it the mystery of aliveness is just shining in its own light Then again, more of the layers of constructed reality fills it up.
But it doesn't ever cloud it or kill it. Like Bob's reflection metaphor, the mirror is always here. And the reflections don't touch it. They don't contaminate it. They don't obstruct it. And mirror doesn't mind. It doesn't judge good reflection, bad reflection. I don't want this reflection.I don't want the other. It doesn't say they are real. It doesn't deny the existence of reflections. It doesn't assert the existence of reflections. It is just there. And you are that space-like mirror, that presence, that witnessing, that pure existence, reflecting every appearance as it is without including preference for one or the other. That preference is also appearance. The urge to go and have chocolate ice cream or the urge to go and label or judge someone or to punch someone.
Those urges are appearing in that space like awareness in exact same way as the sound of the traffic is appearing. Or the gurgling of the stomach is appearing. There's no difference. It doesn't appear to anyone. It appears in that clear, reflective surface of presence, of registering, of awareness. And the sense of, oh no, this is personal. I shouldn't have thought that. I shouldn't have said that. Even that thought of things being personal is just another appearance, no different to the rainbow, no different to anything else. And all of it is just a call for appreciation. Look at that mystery. It is, this moment is alive and it's fresh and it's never ever going to be the same again right now.Only now is the moment to actually just rest in that singularity of being the space-like awareness and let it shine.
Attention will naturally go from one channel to another. You don't have to even direct it. You don't have to keep it on the gap in between the thoughts. You don't have to keep it on the sounds. But it may come up as a discipline. Okay. The thinking naturally relaxes. When the attention is evenly distributed between the five senses seeing hearing tasting touching smelling sensing the back or the breath naturally that processing capacity which is evenly distributed has much much less of the of the with streamleft for the imagination and that's a respite that's a little bit of there's more subtle joy or pleasure or appreciation in it unless of course the imagination contains something really really enticing really pleasurable yeah that can happen too but if it is habituated to always prioritize the imagination that which is not happening presently but that which has happened or will happen or potentially can happen that which is not then of course the habit gets formed.
And in the moment, there may be an imagination going into a beautiful plan of a next journey or the next long kiss or whatever it is. But in the same token, the other side of the coin will also be preferred because it gets habituated. So having that mind stream prioritized and always engaging the attention with that which is not happening right now, it backfires because this imagination is what contains the self-image. It contains the identity. It contains the referring or relating everything to the imaginary self-center of the me. And the me is in a state of pleasure fantasizing about the Copacabana beach. And the me is in a state of turmoil, fantasizing about someone else, you know.losing my boyfriend or girlfriend or getting ripped off or losing the job.
And if that is an autopilot setting of the machine, the machine is going to be in a perpetual state of suffering. But just registering that habit pattern. Is already changing the dynamic. That's the observer affecting the quantum mechanics. Just registering the working of the machine, like Julia quoting Bob, you know, see the mind, see how it functions, see how it always shows up in a person of opposite, see how it always offers the interpretation of what is happening, putting it in a context, making it to a story, making it to something meaningful, relating it to me. And making that me seem real. While there is so much going on, Just be curious about that incredible mystery of that fantastic projection.Do you want to say something, Anthony?
Well, I found it interesting you mentioning, and please say it again, like having an even distribution in the experience of all your senses. So often I spoke about how energy appears in the body. And we've spoken about Allowing. To allow.Because if we allow the mind to take over, it says that it doesn't want that. So in the allowing. It kind of disappears in a space. But in the experience. Of recognition to allow Yeah, it's almost like slam dunk. That's often what we're taught, at least what I bring up. So the act, or not the act, the experience of seeing that which cannot be named. Relative what is that's revealedin the experience of investigation, right?
I'm trying to use words that are correct in how we're talking. In the field of awareness. We see our thoughts and we allow our thoughts to just move. Right. Yeah. If that's how it appears to us. Yeah. Right.So the skin sack. Says that I have an intrinsic relationship with my awareness. And that in the experience of my awareness, I can see actions that I've done in the past from the learning. I take a different path. That increases, in fact, irrefutably, in the skin sac's experience of life.that balance of all the senses increasing. The realization that is which revealed in the investigation, having a more harmonious experience of life.
Right? Yeah. So basically what I'm saying is that I'm using my awareness to make different choices in life and it revealing itself in a more harmonious experience.Now, with the understanding that even if it's bad, it's still occurring. Even though the mind says that it's bad, it's still occurring in the magnificence and wonder of life. The fact that I'm breathing. You're right. You put your head underneath water, you're going to want air, and that's going to be a hell of a lot more important than whatever was taken up your mind in that intense emotional experience.So the skin sack says, why not use your awareness to actually make better decisions in life?
And you can also see how even that happens absolutely on autopilot. The learning process of a dog is just like that. There is no one there saying, oh, I'm going to stay away. There is a family of a mother and a father and four children. And the father hates the dog and the mother appreciates the dog and the father punishes the dog. And the dog's awareness or the dog's body meat sack or skin sack, whatever, doesn't say, oh, I'm going to be avoiding the guy who's kicking me. It doesn't say anything. I will say, but I will do better choice in life. I'll be hanging out with the oldest of the kids, or I will consider the mother the alpha in the pack.
It doesn't say anything. And yet, naturally, it all flows. We are different to animals because there is a narration saying, oh, this is my awareness. I am choosing to take better decisions or to make better choices. But even that narrative is just an appearance. Yeah, I know. Yes. Yeah. Brilliant. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. So. It almost feels silly, even me talking about it, because what we're talking about,Is everything just appearing in the context of awareness? Yeah. Including upgrades. Including upgrades and better decisions. Yeah, yeah, all of it. Yes. At the same time, can't we say that everyone in their own experience of life has implemented or had an experience of seeing that which can't be named based on a condition that they were currently experiencing.You mean seeing that which can't be named means not really seeing it, but being unable to deny it.
Because you can't see it. The moment you start objectifying it as something, that's not it. Yeah. The seeing that there is no thing that sees. The sense of presence that cannot be denied, cannot be named, cannot be objectified. You cannot say there is a difference between the seeing of a dog and the knowing of a cat or knowing of a person because it has no qualities. It isn't that the dog seeing is more warm or is more colorful because it's just the same. If it has no qualities, it cannot be affected by the conditioning. That is one thing that is unaffected by anything. The behavior is totally heavily, the programming of the machine, the perception heavily affected by conditioning.
I think the based on word is the fuzzy. Sorry. Yeah, the based on is the real fuzzy. So, I mean, I know you're trying to get down to the very simplest level and then based on becomes like, yeah, what really is based on, you know, also that's completely unknown as well. So there might be an assumption that that caused that or that there was some chaos theory and they both happened together and there's, you know, some connection.somewhere or some aliens might have even you know more accurate view but at the end of the day based on a so damn fuzzy that that really there's just no knowing of anything really well that's true that's true well what we were talking about is is the balance of all the senses happening in the present moment.
And of course, it could happen even in the most intense struggle. In fact, we talk about there's many stories of people experiencing the dark night of the soul. Going to, sending you to a place that allows you to reflect. Or for whatever reason that the mind can come up that is an experience of self-reflection. It's an experiential energy of some sort. So I'm asking a question that's unanswerable, I suppose. Yeah, there's like, yeah, experienceable energy of some sort. Like, there's not, I just like when Bob said, there is no void. Yeah, that's it. You are limitless. You are limitless beings. Yeah, there is no void.
There's no nothing going on. There's no blackness and nothing happening throughout everything. But I think that's all that can be said at the end of the day. There's just no nothing. There's no nothing. So, yeah, experience can't be denied in that way. Yeah, there is no nothing. And yet, and yet, it's not a thing either. Bob would say, no thing. Not nothing, but not a thing either. No distinction of, or no conceptual. Nothing can be said about it.And it isn't even an it. Nothing can be said about it, but it's not it. It is right here. It's right here. It's the pure singularity of existence, the presence of consciousness.
Those are already too many words. But it isn't even it, awareness out there. It is right here. Experiencing is almost too much. You're right. But what I'm saying is that we can be. I don't have the words for it. I guess, you know, there are things in life that happen where,at least for me, at least for the skin sack, Luli loses the awareness of that which is, that can't be named. Yeah, it gets obscure. Yeah, so that's what I'm... Yeah, that's what... As best as I can describe it. Yeah, that's absolutely correct. And that's the experience for... The content of the experience for the majority of...
And including, probably, one could say, 100% of the animals. They don't, you know, fish doesn't know anything about the water unless you take it out of the water. So Bob would say we are not dull or stupid, but we are ignoring our true nature because we've never been deprived of it. It's been always here, so it can't be visible. It can't even be really appropriately acknowledged. It just cannot be denied. So attention goes straight away to the objects. The whole processor is tuned in not to look at the space, but to look at the objects in space. Not to listen to silence, but to listen to the sounds obscuring the silence.
The whole processor is wired to look at obstructions because it is the obstruction can be a danger. So other people, other places, everything that appears in the space, space is ignored.Silence is ignored. Yeah, and for that whole process, I quite like, it's still a concept, but it's, you know, slightly simpler, is that, I think Bob used to say condensed energy or something, or, so it's like more congealed energy, so it's just that whole experience, I suppose, that whole thing is just more congealed than freedom, I guess. And I like to think of like, you know, if there's a vacuum, then the particles flow into that vacuum.
And so, you know, so you could kind of say there's freedom out there and there's more congealedness out there as well. And then that whole experience is a bit more congealed. I see it. I see it. It's super clear. It's just that from... My experience is that usually when things are quite pleasant, Yes. There's a self-reflection that seems to be more natural than when I'm running, if I'm running for my life. That's right. Which hasn't happened, but I'm just saying, like if you're driving and you're trying to avoid an accident. Mm-hmm. Maybe, in fact, you are as clear as possible. Maybe that is a super clear.Experience.
You know? Yeah, if you particles are involved. I don't know. No, you're right. It's a good observation. Yes, this whole biocomputer is wired to keep the body safe. So when the body is safe, it can engage in entertainment. It can put the Netflix and watch a drama and do self-reflection and talk about me, me, me. This is my story. This is my drama. This is my guilt. When it's happy, oh, I like it. I don't like it. But when there is running for your life, that goes quiet because all processing capacity is there to protect the body. And that is, yes, you are much, much closer to the natural state when you are not constructing the story of a me, of a self, when you are in a peaceful situation.
But of course, you know, that's why thrill seekers, you know, the mountain climbers, the airplane jumpers, they get so hooked on that state of absolute presence, complete presence when the body is threatened and there is no sense of identity whatsoever because the body can't afford it right now. And I, yeah, you're totally in the now. Totally. As they say. When you're aware of being aware, you're in the mind. And you're most likely to fuck up. It's memory. Oh, I am now aware of being aware. This is mind stuff. You're in the movie. That's dead.You're imagining what it was. It was where you were. You know, this imagined past, like you described.
The real clarity is absolute attention directed at what is happening right now for the sake of survival. Clear, crystal clear. Nothing else. I got a good example. You've seen the movie Sully. I know about that story. Brilliant, but it's true. So it was also called Miracle on the Hudson. It happened a few years ago. And this Captain Sully was flying a commercial airline. And there was a bunch of birds. They flew into the jets. And he had to do an emergency landing on the Hudson River. Nobody died. You know? But as all this was going down, he had to, he was, he's like, people were saying, well, did you pray?
He's like, no, I let other people take care of that. He just stayed with whatever the hell he was doing right then and there. Didn't go into, oh my God, am I going to die or what's going to happen? Or nope, just, and I think that. Really that to the degree that we go into our thought that we escape that's what i've noticed whenever i fuck up the most it's because of my i'm really not being present with what's happening right now i'm like in my i'm rushing to the future or i'm worried about something that happened in the past or whatever i'm not anyway just And the Thrill Seekers, it's just a version of, I don't know, not.having to do this with the uncomfortable emotion type release pattern release process that's not taking place but you know if you phone up a you know thrill-seeking company and organize a time you know and you just experience it without doing that other uncomfortable process happening.
Instead, it's just straight into the result. And for what that's worth, that may then lead on to, you know, the full-on result or probably just be back in the, you know, life's super uncomfortable if I don't go and get another, you know, experience right away. And it's always just that whole avoidance pattern. Yes, that's avoiding the real release, the pattern releases, the dog, human dog pattern releases, you know. And so is any addiction, you know, the thrill addiction is no different to drug substance addiction or sex addiction, shopping addiction, gambling addiction. Everything is to break the pattern of that incredible suffering coming up from just being really stuck in the personal story that doesn't have any reality, but is habitually trapped all the attention in there.
So those patterns are also. They also completely innocent strategies that are gone wrong, you know, strategies. One of the guys who used to come to his meetings, his daughter cut herself and put salt in the wounds. That's, you know, eventually down the line, it becomes dangerous. She's been hospitalized many times.not a perfect strategy but in the moment there was no other strategy available we had a guy on our zoom meeting who got hooked onto um like sex addiction masturbation porn whatever no other strategy completely innocent but it down the road it become habituated and it become a great source of suffering bob was an alcoholic that is how that machine is is asserting its survival it's just it's evaluating possible variants of surviving and picking one that is most convenient.
And the strategy of I'm me and I can do something. That's like another avoidance strategy. This is just the narrative because, you know, because the strategies are coming online without that narrative. And then... That's another strategy and all that stuff. That's another... Yes, it comes... That's another way the entity... Doesn't sit with the uncomfortable. Yeah, yeah. It comes post factum. And then it actually has, it backfires. I also have a couple of things that I want to read here. And Anthony says, I love how Native Americans would pray and sing to the great mystery. Wow, I didn't know they do that, but yeah, definitely beautiful.
Yeah, be open space of curiosity and look at the mystery. Without any need to know anything about it, just being wow. And Julia says, I remember one chapter in Bag of Pearls discussinghow as humans we continue to accumulate and amass based on concept that we need more to be complete. Similar to upgrades and life improvements. It's a great topic. I wish, Julia, you actually told me that three or four years ago. I like the name Bag of Pearls much more than Bag of Pointers. Yeah, it's a lovely, lovely, lovely name. It just didn't cross my mind. Anthony says, better maybe to look to the denial of being than trying to look at being itself.
That is a fantastic point. I wish we didn't go that close to the end of the meeting. But yeah, this is a great idea. And I hope we can maybe start from that next time. But I'm actually quite disappointed. I didn't hear Michael. I didn't hear Dean. I barely heard you. I didn't hear Ross. So anyone's last few minutes? Just with Sally quickly, I mean, they analysed everything he did and said he did the wrong thing, he should have landed. So he did all the machines and the computers and all the logic and the sense and said he should have landed at the airport. And then they were proven wrong in the end.
So him being in the moment was right. Yeah. Just, yeah, just, just, just, you know, just so good. There you go, Russ. Yeah, yeah. I was just going to talk.about fairly superficial. Mind appreciation of seeing that there is no thing seeing, And that is just the most, we make models of things. We model the universe, the world and all the rest. The most basic camera. Is just take a shoe box and put a pinhole in one end. And all the light rays come through that pinhole and produce an image on the other side of the shoe box which is basically dark but just allows a little bit of light to get through and that little bit of light the rays project to the other side turn upside down and produce an upside down picture of grades of light and dark.
So it'sNothing. It's actually a physical. Reproduction of the fact that there is no There is no thing seeing. And yet produces an image that gets refined and refined. The light's broken up into primary colours and primary lights, producing a beautiful picture, like in the iPhone that was used yesterday to take photos of. Images of a lovely day at the seaside.And there's no thing seen. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. How did you wrap it up? I just said that's a great analogy. It's imagination wrapped up in a nutshell. Beautiful. It's pretty just a 2D kind of thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 40 or 50. Yeah. Yeah. You know, just to finish up, anyone present here today who believes they're not, you know, they're not present, please step forward.
I'm not all there.