This transcript was made by speech-recognition software, so names and some words may be misheard. The recording is the original: watch on YouTube.
Okay, so the basics. There's one person coming here. The basics. The experiential awareness of existence. Something that we are all aware we can't stop it, we can't pause it. Let me see.No, there is no new, I don't think. Yes, so this is the basic predicament that people often feel a little bit burdened by life. They believe that things should be, could be, or would be different. If, and then follows the... Follows the dream if i had more money or if i was smarter prettier thinner taller or if my mother loved me or i had a better job or whatever or if i achieved the enlightenment i got enlightened or i got clear or if I got rid of my ego or whatever, whatever is the story.
So generally there is an existence, there is consciousness, there is, there is simple presence. And, On that screen of simple presence, the story comes up and the story says this is no good. As it is, it's no good. It's not good enough. It should be, could be, would be different, better if. And then follows the conditions.And this is where the investigation is invited to have a look what stands in a way of simple, quiet appreciation of aliveness, the simple, basic love of being, the sense of contentment in existence. If not, a deep appreciation of it, because even that's on the menu. Maybe not all of the time when you are hanging on the cross, then perhaps appreciation is a little bit of a far-fetched expectation.
But the simple love of being. Even if it shows up as a preference for pleasure over pain, even if it shows up as a fantasy of some better dream, underneath that fantasy, there is that very, very basic presence, basic awareness of that presence. And basic appreciation, which in Hindu scripture is called Sat-Chit-Ananda, being, knowing and contentment or stillness or loving to be. So that one is called the reality. We say this is reality. This is what is. This is the pure existence. Everything else that doesn't fit the definition.of Sat Chit Ananda, goes into the basket of Nama Rupa, which is name and form. And name and form, labels, interpretations, the 10,000 things, the stories, the thoughts, the mirages, perceptions, sensations, all of it.
Is called Maya, which is illusion. So reality is that which doesn't change, Sat Chit Ananda, presence of existence. No one is not present right now. No one is non-existent right now. Even if you try and imagine that you don't exist, it's quite obvious that you even have to exist to imagine. So the existence never changes. It's always there whenever you look. You could, of course, come up with the idea, but hey, 100 years ago, 100 years from now. But that is an idea present right now within that existence. So whenever you look, you check, existence is the reality. It's always there. It never changes. It doesn't get hot, cold, big, small.
It's a baseline. Awareness of existence. Not only you exist, you're pretty certain about it. There's no doubt about it. So that's the reality and unreality.or illusion or fiction or maya or dream is everything else everything else everything that changes people change their names their body are changing all the time they're growing old or they paint their hair or they get the hips and knees replaced, whatever. It is changing since birth. Every moment there are cells in the body dying and being replaced by another cells. The mind is constantly changing. You can see the stream of thinking. Sometimes the one thought persists a little bit longer, seemingly.
But it usually is just a fresh and new thought appearing in a similar shape. It seems like the oceans are existing, but even they or mountains or planets, even they are only there when you look at them. Where are they when you don't? And even they, even solid objects, are made of subatomic particles that constitute matter, that are constantly changing. And even things seemingly solid that may last billions of years, they're not eternal. Nothing's eternal. This is all changing. And reality is that which doesn't. So looking for the reality, looking for the truth, truth that doesn't change. We can't look outside.We can't look into the objects, into the names and forms and ideas.
We can't look into philosophies, religions, theories, even science. Science is full of models and those models are constantly being updated. They are changing. So there is nothing. That you could find, there is nowhere that you could find the truth, which is the reality, which is that which doesn't change. In the mind or in the perception or in the experiencing. Because everything there is just constantly fleeting, is constantly fluctuating. Your feelings constantly changing, your moods, your self-image, your concept about yourself. Your concepts about other people, politics, world, constantly fluctuating. And the reality is that which doesn't change. So that reality, that presence of consciousness, presence of aliveness, that certainty of existence, is always here.
And it never changes. You can see how it's been with you always, even through the seeming memory. When you think of the 10 years ago or the time when you were 10 years old, the presence of existence was just the same.It wasn't bigger or smaller. The presence of existence, the awareness of existence, the beingness is always the same. It doesn't change when you get slim or you get fat. It doesn't change when you put something funny, funny clothing, or when you put a mask on your face. The sense of existence, that witnessing presence is always here. It only gets obscured and only seemingly by the content, by the story.
So what you are seeking has never been hidden. The idea of finding enlightenment or becoming enlightened in some future is preposterous. It can't happen. It is a reality. If it was to start tomorrow, it wouldn't be a reality. It wouldn't be the truth. If it isn't already present right here and right now, then it isn't the truth. If you are to find it or embody it or become it tomorrow, then you will unbecome it day after tomorrow. So it's rubbish. So we're looking at that which is looking. We're looking at that pure presence of consciousness that is registering all the changing phenomena. We can see that all that changing, fleeting,phenomena appears in that presence of existence, in that which I am already, that which I am already, that which you are already.
So Bob would say, start from the fact that you are, and then see what seemingly obscures that. And nothing can really obscure it. You don't stop being when you are obsessed or preoccupied about some dramatic story or offense being taken or sense of things being urgent or important or personal. You don't stop existing when you are in that sense of distress and self-obsession. Oh my God, this is really me. See, there is a me, the me, the solidity here.Existence is still there. And in that existence, the sense of solidity, the sense of importance, the sense of urgency is appearing in right here, right now, in this eternity of now that never changes again.
Wherever you look, whenever you check, it's always now and it's always here. Again, another thing that is trustworthy, another pointer to the reality. The truth never changes, always here.So if the sense of personal agency arises within that awareness of existence, That sense of personal agency or that sense of being separate is just another phenomena. Let's look at that phenomena. What characteristics does it have? When I say, I remember there was a guy, I really liked him. He used to come to the meetings like 10 or 15 years ago and he used to insist. That look i've seen through it i know there is nothing there but there is still a sense of me i still feel like there is a me and i say okay can you can you describe it and he would use his name he would say i feel that there is still that person here let's call him tom okay tom is still here okay so what is it what is tom That's just a label.
You're not the label. No, no, but it is a strong sense of some agency. Okay, so what are components of it? The contraction, the breathing, the capacities, capacity of seeing, of hearing, of thinking.Well, are they really associated to that idea or mental construct? Without that mental construct, do they disappear? Let's say that the sense of things being personal, let's say someone just criticized me harshly and I feel crunched by it and crushed and oh my God, my heart is... Breaking and the survival instinct grows oh maybe maybe she's right maybe i'm worthless everybody hates me i'm gonna get excluded from the tribe and die so all those sensations coming up with that sense of contraction And they are exactly what is appearing.
The sense of agency, the sense of limitation, the sense of contraction, the sense of shallow breath.And then if we define that sense as myself, then okay, what happens when it is not there? Yesterday, before I received the bad news or whatever it was, that sense wasn't there, the sense of urgency, the sense of being unlovable, not good enough and all the other nonsense. But the consciousness was still present. There was no problem. So how this temporary arising sense of agency could be me? If existence is still there with it or without it, how can the feeling of something being painful or being urgent could possibly be me?If without that feeling, again, existence was still there.
So what am I then? If not that pure existence, if not that pure field of experiencing, the pure cognizing emptiness, And those are labels, of course, and none of those labels. But in the direct experience, there is undeniable fact of existence that can't be paused, can't be stopped. I can't stop being even for a moment. So I don't know how not being is.But I can seemingly believe some bound that is upon it. I can say I am a being in this capsule of skin and bones and fat and whatever else. But that's a thought. Before that thought came up, the being was still there. When the new being comes into existence, it doesn't have that concept.
When my cats are roaming around, they don't have that concept. They don't have the idea that I exist only within that costume. No, there is just existence. And the existence, you know, when you look at a little baby, it is kind of a cute thing to do, to see how the baby is stretching their arms and legs and wobbling and moving. Completely uncoordinated, discovering the link between the urge and the extension of a limb. Because that one develops slowly. And then later on, the narrative comes on board and it says the program gets installed of recognizing and associating symbols of language with the action and saying, I did it.I lifted my arm.
I spoke these words. I painted this picture. So this is how the grand illusion comes into existence. The spontaneous functioning appears everywhere in nature, through every vehicle, that intelligence or that life essence or that pure existence, pure potentiality. Expresses itself as a form, the human form, the form of a tree, the form of a cat, the form of a tsunami wave, or the wind, or the planet, or the cancer cell in the body. Or the saliva or a sweat all of those are different manifestations of that pure potentiality of that pure field of energy which sometimes is called omnipotence means all energy every single expression of energy is the omnipotence or the godliness omnipresence omniscience through this body That pure field of energy, that pure potentiality expresses right now as talking and moving the hands.
Through the wind, it expresses as moving the branches of the trees. Through the waves, it may express as... You know bouncing over the the jumpingor destroying the cities. But it is the same field of energy. In a different vehicle, it has different capacities. In a human body, it can see, hear, taste, touch, smell, think. And it can imagine. It can imagine that it is separate. It can imagine that it has free will. It can tell itself stories about me. Me being unenlightened and getting something tomorrow. Or looking for something and finding it later. The dream of separation, the fantasy of separation.So this is the human capacity.
As far as we know, the animals which do have language don't really have well-developed symbolic language. So they don't associate themselves with the image, mental projection of their bodies. Humans do that. Cats don't do that as far as we know. So humans do that until they don't. Because little baby doesn't do it. It just discovers. Urges and actions, behaviors and actions happening. When the body is feeling like taking a breath, the breath happens. When the body feels like urinating, urinating happens. When the body feels like speaking, gurgling or laughing or crying, it all happens. There is no credit-taking capacity installed in that baby. It is all completely spontaneous.Later on, when that software gets installed, of saying this is I, this is me, I'm separate, I'm individual.
And in comparison to some other patterns, I'm better or I'm worse, I'm superior or I'm inferior. And I have to get better. Because as I am being separate, being vulnerable by being the body which can be destroyed very easily, or being the mind which can be hurt very easily, with that vulnerability, I have to constantly fear annihilation. Being the body, I'm going to die. Oh, my God.So the fear, the fear of dying, the lack of safety, the lack of security, the dread of existence, the heaviness of constant vigilance, self-protection and churning dark scenarios, what can go wrong and complaining. How I don't have what I should, what I would, of what other people have.
And habitually believing all of that to be truth. Wow, what a nightmare. Suddenly, what a nightmare.But when we see how that magic trick of confining limitless openness, space-like potentiality, pure freedom, pure registering presence into tricking it into believing to be a limited separate vehicle, when we see how that comes along, suddenly, instead of being bound to be a slave to that thinking capacity, there is a possibility to marvel at it. And just say, wow, amazing, how convincing. All that brilliant illusion, all that colorful dream, how convincing.And that's a different ballgame. That's a completely different way of experiencing. Experiencing is the same, but the overlay of interpreting experiencing and relating it to the imagined self-center has been the liberation from it, liberation from the overlay of the dream.
It's the only liberation there is, by the way. There's no other sense of liberation because there is no one to get liberated. When that whole overlay of mental chatter, constantly imagining a little person there and constantly translating whatever is happening as relevant to that little person or irrelevant to that little person, important to that person, urgent to that person. When that whole layer of constructed reality, of imagined reality, is seen true, it may still go on.But earth still looks flat, doesn't it? You go to the supermarket during Christmas and there still is an appearance of Santa Claus. But you're not afraid to travel that you're going to fall off the edge of the earth because you're not believing it anymore.
So even though the overlay of those narratives relating everything and constantly commenting, chatting and complaining mainly. If that one is seen through as completely mechanical piece of software running of its own, there is no me saying anything. There is no me making any decisions, any choices. There is nothing going on apart from the natural functioning going through all the channels, seeing happening by itself. No one does it. Heartbeat by itself. No one does it. Speaking by itself. No one does it. Thinking. No one knows what they're going to think tomorrow morning or in five minutes. It happens by itself. That overlay of imagining the world covering up the simple reality of that present immediacy is also happening by itself.
You're not doing it. So you can't stop it.It's a simple recognition of the mechanicalness of that function that is a liberation. Because if you see that you are not doing it, you see that you don't have to fix, alter, modify, change, stop it at all. And the next thing is see if you can do anything at all. See if there is anybody there to do anything. The presence is there, of course. But see if that presence belongs to the
mental image that we used to associate it with. We think there is some little person somewhere there, somewhere here maybe or here, somewhere in the upper body usually, isn't it?
It's usually the upper side of the body, there is some sense. But is that sense really who you are? Could the sense be who you are? If you are aware of the sense, could you be that object in awareness?So the sense, you are aware of the sense, just like you are aware of the sounds. You know the sounds. If there is a feeling of something being extremely personal, awareness of that feeling is no different to awareness of the walls in the room. You're not walls in a room. The sense of things being personal is equally impersonal. There is just an object appearing in awareness. And awareness is what's always here, never far away.
It is actually what you are.Limitless, spaceless, boundaryless, birthless. It doesn't have any time. It doesn't start or stop. There's nothing that you can say about it. It has no dimensions. And it can't be objectified. It can't be imagined. That's why Bob always hammered it down. Stop trying to imagine it. Stop trying to grasp it. It can't be grasped. It can't be imagined. It can't be achieved. Because it's never not here.So there is a sense of presence that doesn't have any sensory component. It's a pre-sense of presence. Pre-sense, presence. And that sense of presence is interpreted by the thinking capacity, by the narrative, as the thought I am.
Now, the sense of presence, which doesn't have any boundaries, which is just here, is interpreted by the mind as the I am, and straight away the presumption follows I am inside the upper body somewhere, either the body or inside the body. Questioning that presumption. And seeing, even if there is in the body somewhere, how would you know? Where are you looking from? How do you know?And who is it that knows that? And then you will see that the sense is being known in the awareness that is unlocated. It may feel like, oh, yeah, you know, the awareness is kind of around here and feels the sense here.
Again, how do you know? Where are you measuring it from? How do you know it's about here? And you will see that the deeper you look, the less certainty, less boundary, less concepts is left around that here. You can't say how big the here is or how small. You can't say whether it is a point or whether it is a space. Because it can't be objectified. But it can't be denied either.Same with nowness. You can't say when the now begin and how long does it last. It's a minute, it's a second, it's a microsecond. All those concepts, they don't come near the immediacy of this moment that is beyond description.
And that immediacy, that here and that now, that sense of existence, certainty of existence is here. And you are that. And you can't stop it. And within that space-like awareness, within that field of knowing, that consciousness, now the sense of contraction, sense of urgency, sense of things being personal, sense of things being emotional, sense of personal story, a trauma, a childhood, relationships, relationships with my work, with my finances, with my partners, with my friends, cats, dogs, planets, my health. All of that is appearing on that screen of presence. What an amazing appearance.But you are the screen. You are the awareness, not the dream character which narrative is talking about.
Yes, Ivan, would you like to unmute? Yes, what I find so very beautiful to highlight is that what we are looking for is what is looking. And when you're, yeah, that is so beautiful, what is looking. And, you know, we can't see our own eyes and that what is looking, yeah. That is it, it's looking through our eyes, but we are not looking, it is looking. And that's so beautiful and so overlooked. And when I hear that, it touches me. What is looking?Yeah, thank you. We can invite everyone to just put your attention for a moment on that source of attention and see what's looking.
Is there any object? Seeing, knowing, it sees and knows everything. Yeah, it's the cognizing emptiness and it knows everything. We don't know and we don't see, but there is seeing and that is seeing and not we. And it's so overlooked because everybody thinks, oh, we are listening and we look and we know. And yeah.Yeah, in the same way Bob used to say, you know, instead of identifying as a seer or experiencer, see that what is actually going on is the ing, I-N-G, the seeing is going on. The idea of separate seer doing the seeing and looking at this, that or the other comes only in the language.
Cat doesn't have that concept. The seeing is happening through the body of the cat.It doesn't objectify itself as the seer and the mouse as a scene. It's just the life essence, the pure cognizing emptiness utilizes the body of a cat or a bird or an eagle or a wolf, utilizes its capacity for seeing. It's like, you know, life through the human utilizes the capacity for seeing, using the capacity for thinking and building a microscope. The human pattern doesn't have the capacity to look into the atom, but it has the capacity to design the equipment that can help it. Or look into the sky and see the galaxies, the telescopes, is still the life using the capacity of this human pattern to see that far and that close.
It uses the same capacity of the human pattern to build the camera or a drone. I don't know if you saw those beautiful documentaries of David Attenborough, who actually has the most beautiful footage of the planet from the drones, animals, wildlife being photographed from the drones. Suddenly, you are the consciousness. Looking through that drones and the image is being transferred and it is registeredin the field that you are. All that is happening within that awareness that you are. Including cats and dogs and eagles, which are not present right now. I mean, they're present as a thought, as a mental image. When you recognize that what is looking, you are looking for, then the whole game is over from looking or from searching because people don't realize that.
But it's very simple when you see that what you're looking for is what is looking. Then it's game over.It's so simple, isn't it? Yeah, game over. What are you seeking? It's already here. There is nothing to be found. The seeking, the activity of seeking is just like the activity of seeing. It's no different. It's a spontaneously happening activity within that which is already effortlessly here. Seeing through the seeking, the same way you are seeing through the seeing.That's it. That is a liberation. Yes, but I still want to have more money. Good on you. That desiring is happening within the awareness. Yes, but I still want the cosmic union with the universe and eternal orgasm that never ends.
Yeah, that's another urge, another desire appearing in the consciousness. Hi, Cornelis, would you like to meet? Good to see you. Hi, great spiel, thank you. I haven't been around for a few weeks.And when you say game over, Yeah, there's some part of the game that's over, but the appearance continues to, the energy continues to do its thing and the things rise up and they float away again. And here, the metaphor that arises is like, a frying pan where you can burn the cheese and burn the meat and it gets this crusty build up but then you wash it and like it's like nothing was cooked in that pan so seemingly moment to moment stuff's going on and as always the character is drawn into it to deal with it or to be sort of a victim to it.
At the same time, it's always not there. And it is, it does put everything on the same level. The walls are the same as the thoughts and that no particular person is any closer or any more important than any other person. Pen or a packet of cigarettes. That's, uh,That's kind of astounding and beautiful and there's nothing to be done. And you talked before about this give attention to sheer being, just, and Nisargadatta calls it I am. Which in itself is an error, like it's a mistake, but it's the primal mistake. Like, I think that I am, and so there's all this other stuff. But if that's relaxed, relaxed is the only...to relax seems to be like the verb.
It, it, it, um, Nothing happens. But it all keeps happening. So, yeah, the game's over, but the game continues. I guess it's the other story of the football game. If you turn down the commentary, the game still keeps going. The guys on the field keep playing, but there's no voiceover telling you, describing it. Riffing on it and trying to interpret where the ball went. It's just kind of does its thing.Yeah, that's spot on, spot on. The game goes on, even without the commentary, even with the commentary, but the commentary is not being followed. You know, the commentary may still be there, but the attention is not on it or is slightly on it or is just...
It really makes no difference. I mean, it makes a huge difference for the quality of the experience of the dream, for the satisfactoriness of the dream, if the narrative isn't taken to be the truth. The dream can still get quite unpleasant. Absolutely. I've had some physical stuff like teeth. Teeth is really scary. And then muscles. And there's nothing you can take to stop the pain. But even that, it either goes away. Or it doesn't and either way it's just what it is which um seems new Yeah, and relationships with people can seem sort of complex and weird and hard to deal with, but then it's over.as Bob's metaphor of the sky writers, use the exhaust fumes from the plane to write words.
And it's just gone so quickly. It's like, oh, yeah, wow, like a love heart, and there's my name, and that's great, and it's gone. And everything's like that. Everything's like that all the time. Yeah, it's just like the dream at night. If you remember your dreams, you may not remember many, but, you know, depends how busy the life is. But sometimes you may even remember one or two. And I see how convincing it looks in the dream when you run away from somewhere or someone is chasing you or you're doing something, arguing. It just feels like that's the reality. It's a solid reality. And now this vehicle is responding to whatever the seeming environment is presenting.
And that one is happening. There's no way to stop it. Just like, you know, the toothache is happening or sicknesses are happening. I had a conversation this morning with my friend who is a ship's captain, and he's faced with a really, really hard decision of firing his chief mechanic because he repeatedly puts the ship in danger because he's a chronic alcoholic. And he's only 40. He's got young children. But unfortunately, the duty of care is...of the captain is to keep the ship and the crew safe and with that guy he can't it's no choice there is really no choice to be made however all the feelings seem absolutely real and the possibility is there because i had a couple of friends that i was studying with They hung themselves in a situation like that.
The dream gets so absolutely dramatic and so incredibly unpleasant that the only compassionate thing to do is to escape in the only way that is available. And what's, you know, who are we to judge that? Though, of course, let's hope it never goes that bad with the toothaches and other stuff. And, you know, if there is any other possibility to remedy the situation, it will probably be preferred because of the inherent love of being. But if there is no other escape or if there is no perception of other escape, if in the conditioning it doesn't look like there is the other way, then loving to be will just make it a hobby.
Within the story,I've been there at that point where, and I think of it, okay, the mental thought to destroy the physical would be some type of relief. So if I could just like stop everything. there's no longer the same, I guess it's a, what is it? And it's an attachment to the dream. Like that seems to have, it's like, I don't know, there's plenty of ship metaphors, but the moorings have come loose and like, And it's quite remarkable that it's so all-inclusive. Like there's not, It doesn't seem to be any special thing that you hang on to. Because it becomes clear that it's all within the scene.
And you're not in the scene, whatever you... Yeah, again, language gets in the way because how can I speak about this experience without referring to a first person pronoun?Yeah, I think I said what I wanted to say. Yeah, Bob used to always look at what is happening and the situations would get really tough, you know, the health situations, the family situations, financial situations throughout his life. And being grounded in that space-like presence, he would just, with that beautiful... Baby look with the curiosity and openness. I wonder how is life going to resolve that one? Show me life. How are you going to do that? I'm curious.
Because I'm not the doer. I can't do anything. I can just, I'm the presence. I'm the witnessing space. I'm the registering field, the cognizing emptiness. So I'll be just cognizing the self. self-aware universe resolving whatever the entanglement and stuff and you know it resolves sometimes things get better sometimes things get worse and eventually the body takes its last breath and that's also a way it resolves itself that's that's the way it resolved the the old age or cancer or whatever It always does it through the thinking or without the thinking. I have a question here, I think, from...Birut says, Haikat, I get it that I did not choose my parents or my gender or the way I walk.
Can you reconcile it with when I choose to eat at 12.15 instead of 12.30? Yeah. Trace back that thought. Birut, when you actually decided to eat at 12.30, how did you do that? If you chose it, if you decided to do that, how did you actually do that? Can you teach me? Because I have no idea. I mean, in my case... The thought arises and I discover it. I'm the presence in which the thought arises. Eat early. That is already charged thought, which has so much energy in it that it is practically a commanding thought. Sometimes the thought arises, oh, and it's not very charged and it has maybe in it.
And there is a seeming like, you know, fluctuation, vacillation. Oh, maybe yes, maybe not. But how did I think that?I wouldn't have a clue how to fire the electrical impulses there in the synapses. I wouldn't have a clue how to interpret those things into a thought. No idea. Though as the cognizing emptiness, I discover the idea arising in consciousness. I can trace it back. I can put a story on it that let's say my neighbor inspired me or I have plans for the rest of the day that also were discovered in consciousness. Planning happens just the same way as everything else happens. The body sits in front of the computer, opens Google Calendar, sees where there are gaps in the calendar and plans the activity.
How does the body even get up and moves? I wouldn't have a clue. I wouldn't know how to move one muscle of my body if I was to do that. So I discover that as the cognizing emptiness, there is an urge. The urge lifts the body up. Magic. And then the typing happens. There is unconscious competence there already knowing how to do that. Amazing. And I'm the presence witnessing all of that happening. And then suddenly this thought arises. Call your mother. Wow. Where did that one come from? And then the.the thought arises, oh, you have decided, you follow up on your choice or your decision.
Wow, what an interesting idea. Cool. But there's no belief because there was a clear realization that there isn't anybody who could do that and even if there was i wouldn't know how does somebody do that and obviously it wouldn't be me if i saw it and obviously it would be some sort of a i don't know program or some Yeah, if there is anybody inside who can think the thought, well, I'm definitely not that. I'm not that somebody that thinks the thought. That somebody is arising within the consciousness that I am. I'm aware of that somebody, but I'm not because I couldn't find anyone there.
So the idea of free will, the idea of making choices or decisions,
is one step too far from the basic recognition that there is no one to do it. Whether I have free will or I have decision-making capacity or I have an ego that I need to get rid of, is secondary to the question whether there is an I to even have it. Is there an I who can choose the thought? Is there an I who can have free will or the power to decide? Because if there isn't, then the question is irrelevant now. The thought is being discovered in consciousness. Who thought that thought?Like who perceived those objects in the room?
The assumption is that it was me, that it was I. But then again, look again, who's looking? Look again, who's thinking? Is there anyone, anything, any sense? Am I this sense? Am I the sense of contraction or that sense of me which does the looking or does the thinking? Because an hour ago, this sense wasn't there. But the existence was still there.I don't know, Birud, if that answers the question, or would you like maybe to unmute and specify a little bit? Yeah, I think you did answer the question. I need to sit down and I hope that I have captions on and I can have everything that you said.
I can read it again and can upload it, you know, sync in. But you're saying that you have one step. Too far like the first of all like you know who is there to make this choice so i think that is uh that is something that i will certainly certainly dwell on now in the same line i have another question which is you you mentioned that there is this ever-present consciousness it's always there it always will be but you know the body if the body is there then I know that there is presence what what's my way of how do I know it's ever and I know it's experiential thing maybe and I look like an idiot right now but it's like it needs something to have thatperception of that consciousness.
Yeah, so if you look at the consciousness the way, look how beautiful little lamp Tanya got me. So the consciousness is the light. The body of the lamp is going to die in a thousand years, a hundred years. It's plastic, so it will take a while. But the body of that light is going to die. And the light is not going to be there without the body. But the electricity that produces the light, can that be destroyed? It can never ever be destroyed. Energy cannot be destroyed. It will change form. It will appear as a movement somewhere else or something else. The light is not going to be there.
The lamp is not going to be there. This is where the differentiation between the awareness and the consciousness or the pure field of potentiality, that pure essence or pure intelligence. Is actually helpful. This pointer is limited because it's all one. It's not like there is a separate potentiality and then, you know, like awareness and then consciousness. But that field of knowing or the field of potentiality expresses through the body as consciousness, seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, smelling, thinking. Without the body, seeing, hearing, tasting,Touching, smelling, thinking is not there. The energy is still present, but the consciousness as such isn't. But you are not the consciousness. Consciousness is expression of what you are.
You are that infinite field of awareness, the space-like awareness, the emptiness cognizing. The consciousness is just an expression. That's how, you know, you're not the person. Person is also an expression. It's the interpretation of that stream of consciousness. Consciousness is the light, it's not the electricity.And then also, you know, people who are identified as the consciousness or who are identified as the body, obviously there is a limited identification, identity. You know, my seeing is the same capacity as your, but if I call it my, then I see something else than you see. And then as the consciousness of my seeing, I'm different and I'm going to die.
But if you are not the consciousness, if you are the space-like awareness, if you are the pure energy, you can never die. The body will go just like the body goes to sleep. The consciousness goes into a sleep mode. Sometimes there is no dreaming. There is no, you know, visual content of it. It's just a deep sleep, just as if you would have the, you know, the computer put on a pause, on a sleep mode. It's not dead. You're not dead. The aliveness, the existence is still beating your heart, is still breathing your lungs, is still potentially there. If someone clapped next to your ear, the consciousness will return very, very quickly.
But you are prior to the consciousness. You are still the existence is still there. You are the existence expressing as consciousness, expressing as Birut.And also, you know, even if you are still attached to being a consciousness, You're going to be tormented by the fear of what is going to happen tomorrow. Realize that tomorrow never happens. It never comes. Tomorrow is only an idea. It's only a mental projection. What is always the actuality is today, is this moment now.And I remember when Bob was asked about, you know, he was actually asking nurses whether the cure for cancer has been already invented or not, you know, like two days or three days before he passed away.
They said, nope. And he said, well, then it will get me. And he would laugh. Because he would also say, I don't know anything about taking my first breath. Do you think I will know anything about taking the last one?What business is it of mine? None whatsoever. It's just this moment now. This is aliveness. And this moment now, the seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, smelling is happening. Other moment in thousand years or in 5,000 years. It's just a mental image. It only exists as the imagination, as the story.If you put all of your heart with the truth, with the reality, which is right now, right here, And you faithfully stay with what is, rather than scare yourself with nasty images of non-existence, which can't even be imagined.
How can you imagine non-existing? But because the mind can't conceptualize it or imagine it, it goes into a survival mode and panic and hysteria and all that.This is where love for the truth helps. Truth is that which is right now, never changes, always here. The presence of awareness, the presence of consciousness. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for asking. And I think we have a couple of questions here. Yvonne says, with game over, I did not mean that the dream is over. Dream goes on, but the searching. Awakening to the dream not from the dream absolutely enjoying it to the fullest yeah the game of seeking is over absolutely thank you yvonne and marianne says i see kimo is here last thursday i had two questions for him but then he disappeared maybe they are irrelevant now kimo would you answer a couple of questions from marianneSure, maybe.
I usually like to just share rather than stump the dummy, but go ahead. No, you can just share and then see if the questions arise again. Go ahead, Marianne. You have some issues? Yeah, we can hear you.No, now you muted again. For a moment you were unmuted, now you muted again. That's good now. It was last week that you spoke, so you had a whole lot of things that you said. But I was responding to just one or two things that you said. And in a way, since then, some answers have occurred to me anyway. I was quite keen to ask you and you, I would love you to share, you know, when you share, it's always very, very good.
But one of the things I responded to was, I can't remember what you said, but I was remembering that the something paraphrasing that rest in the Buddha or Nisargadatta saying under the umbrella of under my umbrella or trust in me so the problem I had with those things was it seems wonderful and even Bob said relax just relax And the problem I have with those is it implies that I have a choice, that I'm a doer and I can decide.to relax or rest in the Buddha or be under the umbrella of Nisargadatta. And I don't know how to, what to kind of do there. And of course, then there's no doer.
So then I get all confused. I'm going to leave it over to you now because I know you will have plenty to say. So thank you for what you said last week and I did get a lot out of it. Thanks. Yeah, hi Marianne. I don't remember saying anything like resting under the umbrella. Of the Sargadotter. Maybe it was someone else. It's possible. That doesn't sound like a pointer that I would give. But it is 3.30 in the morning for me, and I'd just like to share about waking up in the middle of the night and kind of my experience here. It's like just pure presence and then the stirring of ideas and then the idea of the body.
And it's like just such a stark. You know, that the pre-sense, that the consciousness is here prior to everything. So it's obvious that the thoughts and thebody aren't conscious that their appearance is in it. And then the idea started to occur to me about, I couldn't get a hold of my brother yesterday. I want to thank him about something for being understanding and just kind of chuckling about the personal intercommunication there. And then just logging into here, like, oh gosh, someone may ask me to speak or something. So that felt like fully putting on this character type thing. And it just feels so odd in the middle of the night.
And so you're right about the doer. You know, where would you place the doer and who would be there? There is doing that takes place, but are you the doer? The doer is not separate from you, but can you make your identity this doer? Just like you said, how can I... How can I be the doer? You know, I have this identity of the one who's relaxing or the one who's trusting my guru. I mean, that can definitely come up, but is it true? Is that your actual experience? Or just experiencing, right?Thank you. Yeah, thank you. That's so beautiful, so simple and straightforward. Yeah, it's like you can see dog is not the doer.
And you can still train the dog to sit and lie down and it doesn't have a concept. Yeah, yeah, but I'm not the doer. I'm not going to do it. Well, to not do it. Is the same principle as to do it. It's either the stimuli appears in the awareness, it either calls for the response or it doesn't. So if Bob inspires you to relax, relaxation happens or it doesn't. Doing happens or it doesn't. So when he is bringing up the pointer that is supposed to inspire his loving compassion that is appearing as that pointer, and it isn't to confuse, it isn't to suggest that, yeah, look, you are not the doer unless you follow my instructions.
No. Is like he will tell you hold your breath and again the response may happen the body is responding just like the body is responding to the cold weather and it gets shivers the responses happen the actions happen the doing happenseven with the absence of the imagined self that does it, all the actions, including writing the PhD, including bringing up children and building houses or killing people, all of that happens. And it is all somehow... In response to the prompts from the environment, whether in a form of conditioning or a form of some inflamed actions or something. And I say, Marianne says, Kimo, those weren't your quotes, but what you said set me thinking things, recalling quotes.
Okay, lovely. And we have Stephen, would you like to unmute?Thanks, everybody. Thank you, Kimo. Very good description of, especially the experience of what this, as this mind and body tends to come online. But I was thinking of Marion's thing about, you know, we say to relax and don't do anything and Well, who's there to not do it? But this is all pointers. And clearly, if the mind's caught up in loads of thoughts and somebody says to them, well, try and get into the body. That clearly feels a lot better and definitely there's this sense of me doing it, but you know, we're working on this stuff and if it could all just drop and it would do, like if the mind just gives up completely and this belief in a self just gives up completely, then fine.
Clearly there's I mean, many of us may have done meditation practices and nothing that can be done by this imagined self, which can get to this because we're the awareness anyway. So that's the thing. But I still think it's worth doing these things. I mean, clearly it's...But somebody caught up in loads and loads of thinking. And I mean, if you went down the Buddhist road, you got your five hindrances of worry and doubt and all the rest of it. In certain techniques and whatever can say, hang on, this is all going on in the mind. So I still think it's worth, you can't say there's somebody doing it because it's like somebody will take notice of somebody's pointer that somebody's pointed out or it won't.
And then you're getting into this mind thing. And I don't know if I'm pronouncing your name correctly, Bira, but your point about when we make a decision to eat at 12.30 or 12.15, that's quite an interesting one. And I think it's what's helpful. Again, you could call it these practices or just the way we look at things and what's going on in our... Our being. I was looking at this and I think it's, Bob said it was about learning how the mechanics of the mind and I had something the other day where I was looking at, I was always interested, I always have been interested in religious icons and I was wondering where this idea of a halo came from.
So I looked it up on Wikipedia and as I was going through it, apparently one of the things that it used to be called a nimbus. I thought I've heard of a nimbus before so I looked up nimbus and it means cloud in the light behind a cloud.And then comes up this thought, oh, cat. So I get this picture of cat because I know cat. Captain of ships and knows lots about clouds. And you can say, oh, that's interesting. I thought of that. No, no, I didn't think of it. The word Nimbus hit the eyes because of past history and knowledge of the English language, it's interpreted.
Then there's an interest comes up. I'll go and look that up. And then an image comes up, picture comes up of cat. You know, well, there's nobody in here going, oh, right, now I'm going to think about cat, you know. And I think that helps a lot, just watching the mechanical nature of the mind. One other thing that came up was this idea that there's somebody in here deciding things. And that seems to be driven a lot by just things occurring. And it made me remember a job I did years ago, because I was given this job ofconverting tapes, spiritual teachers' tapes, into CDs. And so there was hundreds of these things and they take ages.
And so I set myself this task of, then it was a top floor of this building, so I had to climb three flights of stairs, set a tape go in to record to a CD. And then go on. And then once that one finished, I go and do another one. This went on for months and months and months. And then one day, as I put my foot on the first stair, this thought come up, I just can't do this anymore. And that had never occurred before. It was sudden. Anyway, I just couldn't because I was bored with it. And so I asked another person to do it.
And they were okay for a few months. You know, then they had, I think they had enough or something. But this, and I think those things really helped to just, just chip away at this idea of a, a me, a doer in here that's doing it. And again, about practices, the one, the idea that what I like lately is just this opening up the, you know, open up the thing and realise there's no head here sort of thing. That seems to help a lot.Anyway, somebody may have got something from that. Yeah, I'd actually like to talk about the halo, if I could, Stephen. It's very interesting because there are a couple ways to look at a halo.
The traditional way to look at a halo is, hey, look at this. Look at this enlightened prophet. There's this ring of light around his head, which must mean he's incredibly compassionate, full of piety, or he realized, you know, there's just an explosion there where this light is around his head because he's enlightened. So it's like the ring around the head. But the other way to look at it is that there is this circle of light and a head is appearing in it. So there's actually no one there. It's just the light in which the head is appearing. And it's just really a full extension that that light we see around the head, but it's but it's really the light that's bathing the entire appearance.
So there's no one enlightened with a halo ring. It's all the halo with everything appearing, even the seemingly. Mind constructed this is a bad person or this is a bad activity. It's all bathed in the halo or nimbus.Thanks, Kima. That's great. This idea of just this head appearing in all this stuff around us, I think is, well, yeah, that's it. Beautiful. I also wanted to thank you for the highlight, you know, of really, really watching the mechanics of the mind because it's so revealing. It so betrays the illusion. And it was a beautiful example when you said, you know, how the thoughts are cascading, you know, like one association follows the other and it's just completely random and one element changes.
So it's just so revealing that you couldn't have planned it. You couldn't have foreseen it. You don't know your next thought. You don't know your mental image. It's just, it's amazing. That's why Bob would say, you know, watch the mind, see how it functions. And oh my goodness, you'll never be short of an amazing entertainment. And also. It will be much, much, much harder to get fooled by it. And Cornelius, would you like to unmute? Your story about the halo and the nimbus, I was thinking of the, it's occurred to me that the third eye, which I never, I love Hindu art and Hindu religious iconography, but I never got that thing.
I mean, this eye that's there, it occurs to me more recently that this is, it's a metaphor for like a way of seeing things that aren't here, of seeing the thing that is unseeable with the eyes. It has no qualities. It has no qualities. You can't describe it, but there's a... Is an attention that can be given to it that is beyond everything else, although it's here and it's quite ordinary. So I feel like that's what the third eye idea is. That comes from your Halo story.Yeah, yeah, they have all sorts of reminders and associations, remember, about your godly nature and all that stuff. But we have a comment here on the screen from Nadine.
Why do we constantly grapple with questions about the meaning of life? What happens after death or science, although we know the mind will never be satisfied with any answer? Good point. Why do we repeatedly find ourselves caught in the vortex of the need to know the answers? That is a beautiful question. See for yourself, because there may be different motivations. Some people are actually going for the mind for consolation of fear. There is a fear, you know, and there is a promise also that mind makes that if I know, I'll finally relax. So this addiction to thinking and this delusion that it has, it will give you something that you don't already have.
Or also even the idea of just killing the mystery of life, that I will be the one in charge. I will be the one who knows. I will control life when I know the answer. I'll be more empowered by information.So this is not only the addiction to thinking, it is also addiction to self-referential thinking, because space doesn't need to know anything. Space is absolutely content with the mystery, the needing to figure it out, needing to resolve. See what it is for you, because it often comes from that existential angst, the fear of, you know, what happens if I don't figure it out, you know, like, what's the meaning of life?
What if I waste my life? What if I waste my whole potential? Everybody else has it figured out, but I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know where I'm going. I don't know what's going to happen. I lived like that. When I was younger. And it felt like hell. And it felt like, yes, I'm the only one who is just lost, completely lost, confused.But this all comes from the sense of very, very strong sense of there is an I and that I should know something. It should get somewhere. It should achieve something. It should amount to something. It should get it figured out. It should not waste its potential.
So the first question again, is there anybody there? I think there's some other comment. You are the only one cut. Yes, rhetoric question. Yeah, it is actually the same question as, you know, how do I make the right decision? Or how do I follow the right guidance? Or, you know, how do I know what should I do in life? Who should I choose to be my partner? Or whether I should leave my partner, I should stay, or whether I should invest my money or not. Any sort of questions like that, any wanting to know, implies that there is someone who has the capacity to choose their destiny.
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Your job is to just relax and witness the obsession that the body is acting out on and realize that you are free. The body is obsessing, but you are not this body. The body is also breathing, but you are the witnessing, the presence in which that happens. And then whether the following and looking for meaning or mitigating fear through concepts to adopting belief happens or it doesn't. Who cares? It's just going to be a different movie. But if you are the presence, if you are the consciousness in which that movie is played, you're already free and you don't mind. Amin. Hey. Hey, you hear me?
Yes, yes, good to hear you. Yeah, hi everyone. It's good to hear you too. I loved what you said just now, Kat, and I just want to resonate with that and add that. The trust comes with experience and this miraculous resolution that you just spoke about is soBefore it happens, it needs faith. And then it becomes experienced and becomes trust. And in my experience, at least, it's like that. And the deeper the trust is, deepening or integrated or experienced. And the deeper the relaxation gets into the system. So yes.That's it. Yeah, thank you. It seems like, yeah, the trust and even reflecting on things, you know, like that's how, if you are inspired to look how the river always find its way to the ocean without needing to think about it.
How the weather is always, you know, the atmospheric pressures and fronts always resolve themselves without needing to think about it. And everything in life is a holographic universe resolves itself. And sometimes, you know, I was, I was, I mentioned that When, you know, the guy that I was studying with, he actually got into an alcoholism and he hung himself and Bob had a gun in his mouth. And those are also ways life resolve itself, but it doesn't touch life. If the body is destroyed prematurely, it doesn't touch life. Life is not, life is an energy. It can't be destroyed. So even if there is a situation like cancer and there is no cure for cancer and the body drops dead, there is a resolution that is also one of the resolutions.
And trusting life. That it will move like a river in the absence of resistance. Resistance causes suffering.But openness and trust causes the smooth cruising with life. It's really like moving with the river. And like Amin said, yes, the trust, natural trust is being discovered as you reflect, as you notice how things resolved, how you didn't grow your arms and legs in the womb. You didn't have to do it. Life has taken care of it. And, you know, maybe you're quadriplegic or maybe you have underdeveloped arm or something. Well, that's okay too. And life also finds the way to remedy it in a way or to make it a strength or to make it an experience, experiencing itself through limitations.
Sometimes things resolve themselves in a way. Like Bob, I sometimes chat with another friend of mine who's got one of her sons has some issues with alcohol, potentially drugs also. And I say, you know, and he's a 19-year-old and oh my God, what a horrible tragedy. And I say, well... Just think of Bob. What a horrible tragedy would it be if he got sober at 19 and never found the truth and shared it with us. Sometimes things get worse and that's the intelligence of life that you can trust. Kimo, would you like to unmute?Where are you, Kimo? I saw you for a moment. Oh, I didn't unmute.
I'm going to try to do this quick. I thought I heard something about the fear of death, like what happens when we die or, you know, there's the fear of. So in a way, it could even be more unsettling to die than to actually see what's happening. The natural state is peace itself. We assume that life is the waking state, but it's actually peace itself. And as Buddhists say, emptiness is form and form is emptiness. And I've had these discussions with people where I've alluded to the fact that emptiness is primary. But you can't have emptiness without the form. But you can have peace. There's the peace of the natural state.
And the waking state is actually what I was talking about when I came to this meeting. But it's not in negative terms, but the waking state is like an agitation within the peace. It doesn't touch the piece, but agitation, I'm using that word as far as like when you stir something with a spoon, not necessarily negative, but it's like motion.You know, there's perceived motion in that piece. It's emptiness appearing as other. But we're talking about when that agitation ends and I die, what's going to happen to me? Well, the agitation already isn't what you are. It's that peace. And when the form is there, we refer to it as emptiness, as that polarity.
But it actually is primary. Your natural state or your continuous state isn't the waking state. It never has been. The waking state is an appearance in what you are. So it may actually be scarier to contemplate that because if you're thinking, what we're not pointing to is that, hey, we're here, we're talking, and I'm eternal. You know, I'm going to go on. The waking state character is not eternal. When we point to eternity, it's that peace itself, that empty substratum of consciousness in which this is all appearing. So I just want to add that.That was beautifully put. That was absolutely beautifully put. Yes, we are not the light.
We are the electricity behind it. Light will die. Consciousness will be off. And who cares? Electricity doesn't. The stillness, the pure potentiality absolutely doesn't. Yeah, but that was put, I like it the way you put it, you know, that waking, that there's a movement within that pure potentiality. It's not who you are. It's the disturbance in the field. But what a dream. What an incredible flickering entertainment. Enjoy it while it's there. So thank you, everyone. And we're going to be here in a couple of days. So see you then if you dare to join us. Thanks. All right. Love. Bye-bye. Thank you. Thank you all.
Bye-bye.