This transcript was made by speech-recognition software, so names and some words may be misheard. The recording is the original: watch on YouTube.
Yeah, in the last couple of days, I think one was yesterday, one was today, just a moment ago, I actually reconnected with a couple of people whose life has been profoundly transformed and permanently, one could say, transformed because over the years it lasted by Bob's presence and his pointing. One of them, some of you might remember, she used to hang out with us, Tanya. You may remember Tonya from Ireland. Ah, a gorgeous, absolutely gorgeous, you know. I think we might take a screenshot. So this is Tonya.And she is sending love to absolutely everyone in the group. That's just a screenshot from the conversation we had.
We had maybe half an hour, an hour ago, maybe. So she used to be a part of this group. She used to ask questions. Then she started landing for her. And she used to help out, point, explain how it has landed for her. And it was very, very helpful. A lot of people heard it. And yes, her life is unfolding as it should, effortlessly. There are some ups and some downs. But she said the one thing that she can say about it is beautifully simple, beautifully uncomplicated by the stories and dramas that we usually put on. And that is the invitation, living the life just like anything in nature lives the life, just like the planet lives its existence, you know, exists effortlessly, hanging in the air, not doing anything.
And yet having all those ecosystems and rivers and fires and weathers and everything. Just like any other animal or bird or insect or anything. It's only human pattern that has this software of narrating what is happening, creating a drama of what is happening or any other story. Positive story is also a story. But knowing.that this is just a tendency, one of the different tendencies that every single pattern has in the functioning. You may appreciate it and enjoy it rather than being enslaved to it. So everything as it is, is not good, not bad, is as it is. And in that as it is-ness, there is a simplicity of flow because the body is already conditioned to respond in a particular way.
So you may as well learn and discover how is the body going to respond, what emotions are going to arrive. On the scene, what thoughts, what relationships, what situations. And life is just then a ride, an endless discovery. And there is no one who is particularly preoccupied with trying to fix it, alter, modify, control, manipulate it. Because it unfolds already as it should. Everything's already taken care of. If the thought is required, the thought shows up. If the action is required, action shows up. If the action doesn't show up and the thought says it should, well, obviously the dream goes on. With some actions neglected, with some things undone, the dream still goes on.
So the verification, the proof is in the pudding.I had was yesterday and I hope he will show up at some point again. Someone, some of you may remember Connor. He's been here fairly recently and he had this great fortune of, because he used to be in Germany all the time, then he went to Thailand. In Thailand, he stumbled upon Bob's friend from like 30 years, which was pretty amazing in itself because what's the odds? And then he has shown up at our place. Was it January or was it? Yeah, I think it was January or maybe December. It's just recently. Bob was already here downstairs living bedridden.
But Connor was basically reflecting back the light of love and gratitude stemming from the clarity that there is no doer, that everything that happens in life, everything in a way that his life unfolds is just the content of happening. It's not personal. He's not. Responsible he's not doing any of it he's the presence in which that happens therefore whatever happens even if there is a thought oh i would prefer something else that thought is not being believed Because majority of attention and really the heart of the essence lies with what is, discovering what is, being with what is, savoring.exploring what is, rather than daydreaming and speculating what is not and what should be.
And that's a different mode of operating. That's the mode of operating in which there is effortless joy. Because the chatter which says, I shouldn't be this way, it shouldn't be this way, they should or shouldn't be treating, thinking, doing, that is completely disbelieved. So it may not even appear. But even if it does, if anything, it's an invitation to laugh.So that makes the whole dream adventure of discovery. Where am I going to be next moment? Like Bob used to say, how is that going to resolve? Any situation, any potential problem, which of course is only there when I think about it. Where are my problems if I don't think about it?
Where is my identity if I don't think about it? Where is my self-obsession, preoccupation with how am I, what am I, am I good enough, am I lovable enough, am I smart enough? Where is the whole self-obsession if there is no thinking?And what is life? When even when the thinking or if the thinking is going on, what is life? If the thinking is not being attended to, if the thinking is just a background noise, the same way as the passing car is a background noise. And that one cannot be answered theoretically. That one has to be experienced. What's wrong with right now if I don't think about it?
Who am I if I don't think about it? Where am I if I don't think about it? Do I have a face if I don't think about it? Do I have a home, country, nationality, name, if I don't think about it? Do I have a weight or gender or parents or siblings if I don't think about it? Do I have a past?Do I have a future? What is the I without thinking? Is there an I without thinking? And you can see that there is an existence. There is always that luminous, radiant existence there. There's never not here in which all those questions and investigations and everything unfolds.
Whatever shows up, it shows up in that I am, in that presence. The mind translated into the thought, I am, a primary thought. This is me, this is I, this is my presence, this are my thoughts. But this is just a narration. Again, if I don't think about it, what's wrong? What am I? Who am I? Where am I? Can I even say anything about my location? Apart from perhaps a here, here, here, now. That's the experience. But what is the here and now? You need the thought to elaborate or explain.And thought is not a problem. That whole line of investigation, who would I be without the thought?
What would I think? Who am I without a thought? What's wrong with right now without the thought? That whole line of investigation has just one purpose, not to stop the mind. Not to stop the thinking, but to verify whether without a thought the existence is still there. Because if it is, then that's the proof in the pudding. You are prior to thought. If you didn't disappear without the thought, if there is still presence there when the thinking is not, then thinking is secondary. Thinking is redundant. You are not the thinking. You are not the thoughts, you are not the descriptions or that conceptual image made of thought.
You are not what has been temporarily suspended for a moment and didn't make you cease to exist. If the thought is not there and you are still there to see the thought is not, that's the proof that you are prior to thought. You are and the thought appears on that or in that, in that is-ness.So now you can see thought in a completely different way. If the thought just appears, where does it appear? Why does it appear? Who does it appear to? And does it really even matter? It's just an appearance. It is there right now. It's not going to be there in a minute.
Where are yesterday thoughts? Or the thoughts from 10 years ago? Where are the thoughts from tomorrow?So the relationship that we have to thoughts, because the thoughts relates to me, it becomes personal. Let's say someone has a thought and I just learned about it. Someone has the thought that I'm stupid or I'm pretty or I'm ugly or I'm poor. And that's about me. Now this becomes inflammation. It becomes hurtful. Or let's say there is a thought arising in my own system, so-called my own system, the narrative, the silent thought, which says I'm not good enough and I'm lovable or I don't deserve or I should be ashamed of myself.
Again, it relates to the I, it relates to the me. The thought that arises and comments on the color of your socks or someone else's socks doesn't cause the same inflammation. But the thought that relates to the me, to the idea of me, especially if that is a negative thought, because the negative thought causes, again, the sense of urgency and danger, the survival. So those thoughts cause the nightmare. Those are the production of the nightmare, of the dream in which there is an I, that I is limited.has been described as something less than, something not enough, something separate, something inferior. And it hurts because in your hearts of hearts, you know that's bullshit.
It can't be true. All that you know experientially is that you are, but you don't know how big or small you are. You can't tell what you are because you are it. How could you possibly describe what you are? You would have to describe it, you know, like put the circle around it. You would have to be outside the circle to even be able to describe what you are. And that wouldn't be you, the one that describes. So you can't really know it. It's unknowable. Some people say, oh, I know what I am. I am God. I am absolute. I am love. Or I am nothing.
Well, neither of that words is what you are.But that you are, you can't deny. That, thatness of being, that you are. Mahavakya, that you are. That, you know that you are. And in that knowing, what's missing? What's lacking? Anyone has any objections to the certainty of presence, of existence, to knowing that you are, that knowing that you are is here, is present, is effortless, is undeniable, is easy, is simple. And without the thought obscuring it or the thought diverting attention into a drama, there is nothing wrong. It's quite sweet to be and to have that awareness of existence.Sitting in that, really bringing the attention back to the awareness of presence, is quite blissful in a way.
There is unspeakable joy in that miracle of existence itself. And then the thought comes and starts comparing it. Yeah, okay, but my neighbor has more money. Or my husband's cheating on me or whatever. And now suddenly that miracle has been obscured by the content. Suddenly the drama has been personalized and confined. And there's nothing wrong with that either. This is the way, again, life plays the game. But if you see that this is a game, it's not going to hurt. You go and you watch the movie and you enjoy the movie and then you switch off the TV and you can have appreciation for all the drama that happened in it, for all the pain and all the pleasure and all the ugliness and all the beauty.
If you see it in this manner. Then you see that it is necessary that sometimes the body goes through pain, that sometimes the body goes through absence or loss, because without that, the opposite wouldn't be experienced. There is no pleasure without pain. There is no sense of completeness without the sense of deficiency.They have to coexist because the manifestation is dualistic. There is no other way for the manifestation to be. If everything is made of one substance, there is nothing made. If everything has one taste and there is no taste. And in essence, it does have one taste. But it appears as the 10,000 things. Just like in the dream, the dream doesn't have any substance.
If there is a substance, it's just the electrical activity of the brain. So it's the movement of energy. But it appears as elaborated world or worlds. Full of interactions and experiences, incredible experiences. And where is it? What is it made of? Or the daydream. We can all go into a fantasy trip for, you know, like a guided visualization, for example, guided meditation in which you just bring the light, blue or red or whatever, into your leg or hand or whatever. It's a beautiful, very, very pleasant daydream. Which there is nothing wrong. I'm not making fun of those things. There's nothing wrong with any sense of pleasure appearing in the dream.What is a little bit of a trap with those type of activities is that there is a backstory there.
That there is a me that will get something from it and it will get me somewhere. I have one of the regular appointments with a guy from America that I'm speaking once a week who does those beautiful, pleasant visualization with, you know, like heart frequencies and lights and galaxies and planets. I say, wow, I hope you enjoy it to the fullest. But you don't fool yourself that this is anything more than just a passing phenomenon. There is no truth in any experience. Experience of a cosmic union or multi-orgasm or crucifixion or death or psychedelic is an experience. And that experience is only possible because you are.
You are present. There is an existence. Existence utterly aware that it exists as as bob's definition of consciousness said because of that because of that consciousness the incredibly colorful dream can unfold dream and a daydream and the fantasy and the present moment presentexistence of seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, smelling, which is also a dream. There is nothing that is not a dream. Whatever is experienced is a dream. Reality cannot be experienced. Reality, which is the presence of awareness or awareness of presence, doesn't have any texture or flavor to be experienced. It is the experiencing itself. In that field of stillness, there is the movement. Experiencing itself, that which experience is not an object, is not objectifiable, is the pure presence.
In that pure presence, in that light of knowing, everything comes and goes.And that you are, that pure knowing and that you are experiencing right now, that in that light of knowing, your childhood happened, your dream last night happened, your fantasies about tomorrow happened, your traumas or dramas. Your dreams and shames and wounds, everything happened because of that presence. That presence is the only thing that is unwavering, underlying everything unchangeably here, always present. The body is changing, the thoughts are changing, feelings are changing, dramas, attention is moving from object to object, from story to story.That movement is appearing in that light of knowing, in that pure consciousness.
I see there is a comment on the screen. Wake up and keep dreaming to everyone. Oh, Jay. Ian's brilliant. I love those comments. And he says, God, such clarity. Oh, thank you. Yes, it's not mine, really. It can't be possessed. It's just a simple, you see, you resonate because you can't argue with that. Is so shamelessly simple, really. You can't argue with the fact of your existence. You can't argue with the fact that everything that appears on it is passing phenomena. It's obvious. Now the question comes, and it usually does. How do I get there? Or how do I stay there? And that's a wrong question.
Because the I, your essential nature, is that presence. You can't get to what you are. You are that presence. You are that light of knowing. You can't become what you already are. You are that field of consciousness in which everything happens, including the dream of a dream character longing for... A future realization of future sense of compthat will be achieved and added to that dream character, which is absolutely nonsensical, impossible. Not only the dream character is just an image, mental image, which doesn't have any sentience. It can't get anything. Nothing can be added to it. Because it's insentient. It's an image. It's like a cartoon character on a page.
It doesn't, it can't get anywhere. It belongs to the page. It will end with the page. It's not real. That's not who you are. And having that dream character seeking something else, not this moment. I believe that there is a character and this is who I am. And I believe that in the future, this character will liberate itself from the dream. No. Character belongs to the dream. It is part of the dream. And liberation from the dream. In that presence of awareness is not on the menu. A recognition of the dream is, but not the liberation. Liberation of the dream is when the universe collapses, when you go to sleep or when you die.
There is no dream then. There is no one to report on it either. So as far as we can talk about direct experience, the dreaming goes on. And if there is anyone who has a problem with that, who wants to get out of the dream or wants to awaken from the dream,Look again. Who is there? Objecting to life. Objecting to life expressing dancing as that dream. Is there anybody there? Or is just a plain objection arising from the complaining mind which is designed to always find something better, reject what is and get something more pleasant, more safe. More fulfilling. That's its job. But you're not it.
You're not your complaining mind. You are the awareness in which that function, mechanical dead, mechanical program, repeats itself. And that program runs in every creature. Of course, you know, in our cats, it's not going to be narrating because it doesn't have symbolic language. It can't use the language. It can't objectify things. But it will still follow where there is more pleasure. When I give the cats a few biscuits on the plate next to their dinner, I assure you, the pattern of following pleasure and seeking for something more pleasurable is very much there. But they don't go out of their way because they don't have a story that there is something to get.
So if the opportunity to get more pleasure, to hop on the lap and get pat and purr presents itself, well, they'll embark on it. But if the opportunity doesn't, there is no obsessing about it.There's no thinking, imagining. And that is the simplest. way of effortless living. There is nothing that needs to be done. If the opportunity arises, the body will respond to it according to its conditioning. Some people get more pleasure, Tanya just tempting us here with Easter eggs. Some people will have more pleasure with rejecting or resisting that temptation. Some other will have more pleasure of giving into that temptation. And according to which way, oh, Tanya is a glutton.
And that is a discovery of a lifetime. What is the body going to do? What is that dream character body mind going to do? Is it going to give in to the temptation or is it going to resist the temptation? Let me see. Let's find out. What's the next thought going to be? I'm curious. I wonder. What's the next action? What's the next complaint of the mind is going to be? I wonder.Okay, children, you can... Being like little children that make you enter the kingdom of heaven. If you are like in a kingdom of heaven, rooted in the sense of effortless existence, yes, being like little children is the most natural thing.
Being curious, being open, being harmless in a way. And even when, you know, you're not harmless, that's okay too. There's no one there doing it. That's it. Doing, doing, it's just happening. Yeah. It was just, you know, so beautiful and clear, as always.There's a lot of gratitude and love for how it comes out of this. Can't stop looking at it. No. So lovely. I was drifting off. Jenny, hey, would you like to come in? Yes, hang on here. Thank you for a beautiful spiel. I just had such an amazing, beautiful experience. Because it is an experience, as you say, everything is an experience. You know, when you started your spiel, I just, the body just brought me, kind of like taking action.
So while I've been listening to the wisdom pearls just pouring out of you, I just watched my body. Go down into the basement, take care of the laundry, put in a washer, fold it, put it into the cupboards. And for a split second, I could notice that there was a pastime judgment.flowing into my head that, oh, you're not totally present now. You're not really there. You know, I could really see, you know, that that would be inappropriate and daddy, daddy, daddy, da. And it was so brilliant because it made it so very, very clear that there's nothing ever wrong with the actions we make. It's just the narrative that we have to watch out for.
Like you mentioned, and like Nisargadatta pointed out, and Bob pointed out numerous times, watch your mind. Just be curious and watch the mind. And it was so cool because I suddenly felt like I was in a 3D movie. You know, at the same time, I was resonating deeply with every word that came out of your mouth. And I could feel the flying of those old judgments somewhere. And in the midst was just this beingness that also saw the body do false things and put them there on automatic.And it was so, so, so, so clear that there's really nothing ever wrong, you know. And you put, I had to go to my notebook and write down one line that was so brilliant in its very interesting formulation.
Where are the thoughts from tomorrow? You know, which is, you know, grammatically a concoction because it can't be from when it's from tomorrow. So it both points to, you know, the time also just is an illusion. But just that question, where are the thoughts? From tomorrow. It's so brilliant, you know. It's like there is no tomorrow, you know, and there is no way to know. So that's just what I felt like sharing now. So thank you very much for this opportunity. I come back week after week after week because the unfoldment, it's like a, it feels like, Life is lifing and unfolding and they're so lovely just to see what shows up, you know, what pops up.
So thank you so much.Yeah, thank you. That was a beautiful point to really bring back home that there really isn't anything wrong. It's just a narrative which is so mechanical. Nobody's speaking there. There's no me judging me. There is just, you know, program. Yeah. Yvonne, would you like to unmute? Yes, I was thinking when I heard this that nothing ever happened. Well, nothing ever happened, but then when the eye comes in, then there is all the commentary. But before we were in heaven or we were in oneness. Reminds me of the cause and miracles and in eternity when all was one crept a tiny mad idea at which the son of god forgot not to laugh about so we didn't laugh about when the eye starts in but it's only yeah noticing that it is just a thought and have nothing more Yeah, without the thoughts, there is still oneness and eternity and yeah, fill in how you name it.
That's what came up by me.Beautiful, I love that quote. I always forget the first few words, but I love that quote from Cosmic Miracles. The sun, the blood. Yeah. Most beautiful part in the whole tech book. It is. Yeah. Yeah. I think it says the son of God remember not to laugh. Yeah. Basically, it's just, yeah. Which the son of God remembers not to laugh about. Yes. A little bit wrong. Yeah. An old joke. Just like the rest. Yeah. Yeah, didn't take the joke. It needs the joke explained now. So we are explaining the joke now. So the son of God remembers the laugh. We can laugh now.
Absolutely. Absolutely. And that's what happens when you realize, oh shit, you know, nothing ever happened. Yeah. Yeah. In the beginning when I heard that and I thought nothing ever happened, nothing ever happened. But yeah, now I see nothing did ever happen, only in a dream. Yeah, yeah. Okay, Amin has the hand up. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, come in, Amin. Yes, hello. You hear me?Okay, great. Yeah, great sharing. I was laughing about the Son of God remembering to remember and forget. And yeah, thank you, Kat. It was a nice, very nice spiel. I loved also your sharing, Jenny, when you shared about actions and going into your daily actions and the program saying, what are you doing?
You are not hearing such experience also here. So it was good to resonate with it. I don't know what I want to share here more.Yeah, no, I think it's just that. Thank you. Thank you, Amin. And now I'd love to invite, you know, anyone to bring up what is really standing in the way for that effortless realization of presence, of presence, current presence. Because, you know, let's face it, if there is any seeking, oh, thank you, seeking going on, that is because the attention is persistently gone into a dream. Josh, would you like to give us a little bit of that? Yeah, hi.So. Whenever you ask the question, if you're aware, you can only ever say that, well, yeah, you are aware, or you can say that you're not, but actually you need to be aware to repeat that.
It's interesting in this case, in the case here, whenever that's recognized and it's found to be effective, oh, you know, there's something fresh, there's something with a bit of kind of got a zest or an interest to to it that's a new kind of angle.the mind quite successfully comes in and co-ops it saying, okay, now I do that. Now I do it like that. And, uh, And then actually that specific, quality seems to no longer be accessible. But when it's kind of looked back into, of course, you can't say that you are not present. And aware. So, yeah.Yeah, that's a good point, Josh. Thank you.
Yes, this really, that taking credit habit, you know, that program of I, I will do that, or I will get there and this will help me, or this will deliver me, or this will enlighten me, or this will, you know, create some... Improvement or some growth or something. This is what you meant? Yes. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Thanks for that. This is a really, really good insight to actually see that this is how the dream takes over again. The entity, the identity of an I, the hope for future. And the idea of doing, the doership. I can control that dream. I can fix what's broken.
This is on me. This is I. And we could see how ridiculous that idea of doership is, looking at the elements of nature. How is the sun doing day and night? It knows nothing of it. How is the planet doing day and night? It knows nothing of it. How the nature does the seasons, the tides, the weather. How is the bear fattening up for the winter? It knows nothing of it. It just bites one salmon's head at the time.It knows nothing of it. It's the human story that contains the time and the person imagined entity existing in time. And that comes with the added agenda, goal, setting the aim to achieve.
This only happens in the story. In the ever fresh present moment now, there may be arm lifting. Why did it lift? Oh, I lifted it. I didn't. I didn't manufacture the thought which inspired the body to move the arm. The thought just appeared. And because the thought had emotional charge to it or energetic charge, the action followed. I didn't do it. Same as I didn't beat my heart. I didn't take that breath. I didn't grow my hair.I don't know what's my next thought going to be. I don't know what my next response is going to be. How can I respond if I don't even know what is going to show up in a minute from now?
How can I claim that this is what I'm going to do? If that is completely dependent on even... The memory, let's say I can plan my day tomorrow. I'm getting up at this time and doing that and that and that. An illusion is persistent. I can schedule it in the calendar and it is likely to happen. But is it really me doing any of it? Because the original thought of planning the day, where did it come from? How did I make it? How did I make that thought happen?We don't know how anything that arises in the dream, how it arises, where it comes from. We don't know the origin of anything, of any thought.
Let's alone the origin of the thought I. How is the I making the thought about I? There's no one there making thought about no one, not even making the thought. It's just the thought being discovered. The taking credit program is being discovered.and seeing, going through the day and catching yourself on that incredibly amazing persistent illusion of doing. Oh, I will pay attention to this now. Oh, I will sit in the meditation now. See, I'm sitting now. I'm meditating. See, I did it. Again, that inspired thought, our eyes shone up in the screen and that thought did it. Well, that's too much to say, of course, because it's the whole universe which did it using the thought.
Which did that memory of the past meditation because it's not happening right now. Whatever is happening is the dream, is the vibration of energy. And whatever is made sense of it is the program that interprets that vibration of energy. If you find yourself in a culturally diverse situation, and you see a Japanese person and a European person bowing down to each other, you may have the interpretation, oh, the Japanese is lying or is hiding something, it didn't look in the eyes. Oh, or the European one is an aggressive because it has persistent gaze. That is the interpretation. We have the interpretation of every situation. This is constructing the world as we know it.
The world is constructed.It's made of interpretations. It's made of preconceived notions that are pre-programmed. The strategies, the perception lenses that developed because we were growing up in a particular household with particular climate, particular food supplements, is completely mechanical. There's no one doing a thing. Going through the day and realizing and noticing how that persistent illusion of me moving through time, me doing what is being done, me thinking what is being thought, how that comes into existence and pausing for a moment, just for a moment. And looking back, is there really anybody there?Is there really anyone doing anything? Or is just an ever fresh discovery of every ever fresh moment in which the thought arises, causes action, narrative follows, takes credit for the action.
Now responds with judgment or guilt or pride. Brilliant. All that, watch the mind. Watch the mind, see how it functions, see how the illusion is created. And marvel. It's marvelous.And stop there. Don't try and figure it out because you won't find the answer in the moment. That's it. Yep. Watch it and do whatever you call it or be, you know, can't not be aware. And that's it. That's it. And enjoy. It's pretty marvelous. George, did you want to add something? I forgot.Yeah, I forgot. It's okay. What was the last thing you were talking about? I think it was related. Persistent illusion of doership. Yeah. You could say that the mind is constantly doing that or attempting to claim.
And name everything, but it really doesn't ever, it's never capable, well it can never go all the way because the word or the mind can never describe the truth or the actuality. It's always just aYeah. Yeah, yeah, you're totally right. See, the mind isn't even an entity with any capacities. The mind has no capacities. Mind is just a thinking process. So mind can't understand. It's a thinking process. It's just a stream of thoughts, one after another. So you can't find anything in there apart from the stream of thinking. It can't modify, understand, it can't do anything because it doesn't have any sentience.There is no, you know, central processor mind.
There is not a central station called mind. Head office. Head office. We use the word mind shortcut. It's, you know. Symbolic of the what we are aware of is this you know phenomena that comes and goes comes and goes comes and goes all day long and that phenomena is just a vibration in space.It's gone. It just doesn't, you know, have any intrinsic reality of its own. What enables it is the awareness that sits there all the time in which this occurs. But it comes and goes. It's phenomena. It's transient. There's no solidity to it. Fades in and out. Sometimes it's louder, quieter, constantly changing. There's no, you know, mind is synonymous often with, you know, the words, words ego, time, me, little me.
And when you look, when you really look,Can you find it? Can you find that reference point, the boundary, the circumference for mind? Or little self or ego or any of that. It's just an awareness of... What we call thoughts, which are just these, can't even pin them down. Can't, you know, they come and they go like in a flash.There's no one there to create those vibrations in space. They just happen. Yeah, Josh, did you want to add anything to that or we give voice to Jenny and Amin after? Yeah, no, go for it. Thanks. Where are you, by the way? Are you at Sanjay's place?
Yeah, I think in the... Uh nick ranburn oh cool yeah say hi from me yeah yeah they're in india well he's in india right now all right cool cool yeah okay jenny would you like to unmute Yes. No, it just popped into my mind, you know, that even when we, my mind, haha, that, you know, we even say I mind or I don't mind, which directly, you know, points out that mind is as illusionary as the eye, you know. I mean, if there's no I to be found, then there's definitely no mind to be found either. So it's exactly like Tanya said, go out and look for it, you know, investigate, investigate, see, like, can you pinpoint it?
Can you find it?Where does it lead you? If I would start to look from my mind, the closest I would come to would be, you know, a thought. And then we have already come to the conclusion that, well, a thought is very fleeting. You can't really grab a thought. You can't. Capture a thought with your hands. So therefore, if mind and thought are kind of synonymous, then we cannot grasp and catch the mind either, you know, as little as we can catch a thought. It's just synonyms. Again, words,
labels, labels, labeling things, thinking that we could not exist without the labels, you know. Certain things might be a little bit more complicated in communication if we didn't have any labels at all, but on the other hand, it might be quite fun.
saying, we could try here one day talking about non-duality without using any words, just body language. Well, funny enough, it works sometimes. I used to work at sea and I have witnessed quite a few situations in life where there would be... Mainly, I was working with Norwegians then. And they would meet Filipino ladies who did not speak a word in English or Brazilian ladies who did not speak a word in English. But with the body language, show them such adoration and such... Love that boys would abandon their families and go and live with a merry prostitute and take her out of the funhouse and maybe along the way a few years later she would speak few words but it wasn't necessary at the time the longing for love longing for connection for being seen through the eyes of absolute adoration looking someone you know i had Bob speaks to them.behind i had someone looking at me like this for nine years and nine days oh what a dream so i had those drunk captains sitting in the in in in the brothel and and and having those girls giving them this look of course they would die for it And probably a lot less misunderstandings, you know, when using body language.
Is that with our pets? Oh, absolutely. Yes. And small children. Small pre, you know, preconceptual children. Yeah. Yeah. You know, the communication, as you say, might even be purer because it doesn't come with all that conceptual idea, symbolic language to confuse everybody. Yeah, it's kind of funny now. Yeah, go on. Yeah, no, I was just when Tanya said pre-conceptual children, I heard preconceived children and I started to giggle. Yeah, those two, absolutely. Those two, exactly. Yeah, it reminded me of a friend of mine. She comes here sometimes. She's happily married for whatever the time, but she still says whenever she can, whenever the husband doesn't hear, that he's not.love of her life her dog was they were 18 years together never once they had argument he loved her regardless whether she did something stupid or thought some negative thought it was love was unconditional and yes they are so easy to love But yes, ask the space, ask the presence that you are without the thinking, without the concepts, without comparisons and need to have someone molded to your pleasure.
That love is what you are. You are that unconditionality that accepts winter and summer and darkness and light. And when the thoughts are out of the way, that is it. You know, you love the dream with crucifixions and resurrections and all that is included. And we have Amin and after Amin, Yvonne. So come in, Amin.Yes, I had something to share, but with all the sharing there, I don't know what to add. It was just beautiful to connect to the fact that, yeah, it was there and... It remembers me the words of Bob when he says, seeking. And yeah. It's so... Yeah, I don't even know how to describe it now.
It's so simple in a sense. Yeah, of course, it doesn't need any words.Maybe when... When there is the will to change something or to Yeah, to add something to what it is.It's very... Been like a question to get curious about What is wanting to change what is ever changing? What wants to add?to something that is so So already fully... Truly alive and fully perfect. And yeah, asking this question,Yeah, I don't know. I don't know what I'm saying. I let the mic. Yeah, Tanya was just saying, yes, it's a very good question. That's the ultimate question. Is there anyone doing anything? Yeah. And we have Yvonne and Josh after.
Yes, I was thinking about the animals with the unconditional love in the body language. And my neighbors have two cats and they are traumatized. And when they are not at home, they ask me to feed their cats. And the first time she said, no, they will not come to you. But they came the first time they came to me and they were very gentle. And one time I was at a camping place and there were people that had two dogs, the same as we did, the same dogs as we had. And the woman told me that nobody could walk the dogs. And I said, okay, give me the belt and I will go walking with the dog.
And I went for an hour and there was nothing wrong. It was very nice. Nothing wrong with walking with a dog. So that's what I reminded when...When the animals can see the body language, when you are good for them or you're not good to them. That's very beautiful to see. That is beautiful. It is. It is beautiful. And it's, you know, perhaps, and it's just a concept, something to think about, you know, when you are around those animals, you are free of expectations of behaviour. You just took them as they came. Yes. No expectations at all. That's right. That's right. And it can be like that with seeming people also.
Yeah, but that's the same. They respond too. Yeah. Dogs are different. Animals are different, I think. They don't think as we do, but they feel more. They see at your body language more than people do, I think. Yeah, I don't know what the difference is, but I think animals are different in that aspect. Yeah, they don't hold the conceptual image. You know, they learn behavior, but they don't hold and they don't project that conceptual image. So if they didn't have any prior experience with you, they don't have anything to relate to. So they are open.They live in a natural state and they don't make all kinds of stories as people often do.
Yeah, Bob often says that, you know, we have because of that capacity of thinking, whenever someone comes into the room, we have a concept about that someone and that someone has the concept about us and he or she has a concept about themselves. So how many concepts is there and which concept is right? And the concepts are clashing. They're not, you know, they're not. Reality yeah they and also they they're not the same you know my concept of myself this was this was how the whole dream bubble bursted because i was explaining bob how my ex-partner had a concept about me which was so incredibly insentient and so mechanical in a way i mean every concept is mechanical it's just a set of set of uh ideas but but his concept about me was so far out from my concept about me that the contrast was unbridgeable it we could not bridge that gap he never saw me for what i saw myself but in that description the realization down that he did not see me as i saw myself But I didn't see me as...or what I am not either.
His concept was different to my concept, but they were both concepts. His concept of me was a little bit less sentient. My concept of me was a little bit more kind of sentient or vulnerable, but they were equal. In the realization that they were just mental projections they were images what i am is absolutely beyond knowing is unknowable is an is a mystery he saw certain aspects which he interpreted according to his conditioning so i was ship's officer goodness what an identity and a smart ass come on really does it really grasp or come even near the mystery of of life and existence and and and incomprehensibility of the of the way that particular pattern responds to itself to the concepts to the situations is complete is is a joke conceptual image is such oversimplification limiting limiting oversimplification But so was mine.
So was mine. My concept of being vulnerable, of being sensitive, of being fragile, of fearing rejection, of being, you know, like for me, poor.girl who doesn't want to be hurt, who just, you know, is equally, it doesn't contain perhaps a profession, but is equally limiting and is equally oversimplifying the mystery of existence is equally not true. No concept is ever true. And when you see that your concept of yourself, other people's concept of yourself, what is your mother thinking about you? How is she seeing you? Is it the same as the way your father sees you or thinks of you or your partner or your child or your boss?
You will see so many different images. Which concept is right? And now take the concept you have of yourself. When you are in a good mood, when you are in a bad mood, where you are a little bit fragile, vulnerable, or feeling a little bit embarrassed, how is the concept of yourself? How is the concept of yourself when you are five-year-old? No concept is right. No. So who are you without the concept?And you can't tell. You can't because it's unknowable mystery. You can never, ever find it out. But you are. That's unquestionable. That's a fact. Thank you. Thank you, Yvonne. And we have Josh has the hand up.
We have a couple of comments here.Cool thing that awareness experiences or is the experiencing of. it's automatically full. inclusion. It doesn't, uh,in any separate reality. A really cool, analogy or idea about that is Bob's, can you, Can you think of or postulate anything outside of space? And you can't. You can try as hard as you want. You can pretend that there's an alternate reality or dimension that's in some other place, or you can even experience, you know, a galaxy 20 million light years away. But there's no division or dividing line because even if there's a separate dimension or whatever, it still have to be somehow related to the other dimension.
I don't know if I, hang on, I can draw a picture.So here you have dimension A and dimension B, and they're separated by something, but it's all still contained in the same space. So anyway, I... Also, the dimensions, and even when you say, you know, experience the galaxy 20 million years ago, or light billion, light years, whatever, those are concepts. You know, the experience of the content of seeing being a sky. It's a direct knowing. And the concept that there is a galaxy, that's a label, that the galaxy is that far away, you can see how quickly the interpretation comes into. The seeing is singular, and then interpretation comes and divides.
This is the galaxy. This is not the galaxy. This galaxy is 20 billion years away, light years away, and this one is not. And you see how very quickly mind contributes. I mean, the mind is just the narrating capacity, contributes, regulates and segregates and divides the world into those symbols that are understood and can be processed and operated on. But direct experience doesn't contain any time. There is no time in it. Direct experience doesn't contain any labels. They are also added. You know, the...way the animal experience the night sky it knows nothing about the galaxy 20 billion light years away but it experiences the sky the pure seeing it's it's just good to see how you know how quickly the the the narrative the interpreter comes up if there is a belief or concept being entertained about other dimensions that concept will will again bring itself into the awareness through the image or drawing.
If there's ever an experience of a galaxy 20 million light years away, it will be now. Yeah. It will always be now. Yeah. See, you really, there's no requirement to make it complicated or it's fun. It's fun. But, you know, perhaps it's, you know, could be, you know, less helpful than just leaving it as it is. That's it. Yeah. But still, there's nothing wrong. Anything in the dream, in the illusion, how could it possibly be, you know? How could one blue be better than another blue?When none of it has its own reality. And you did a point, Josh, with that, you know, all inclusive inclusion that, you know, in the space that is the potentiality for the energy expressing as everything.
In that space, the concepts are arising. The concepts are also, the conceptual images are also vibration of that same source energy, the same life essence. Even the most ridiculous and outrageous concepts are still that same God vibrating into the pattern. The same love one could say, which is the active part of a so-called God omnipresence, whatever. So Marianne says, the unconditionally loving husband sounds like mine. Lucky me. Yes, some dreams get that. Some dreams get that beautiful little aspect. Some don't. And they're still perfect dreams. But yes, it's definitely a yummy, yummy, yummy part. Bravo. Perhaps Marianne says we all unconditionally accept each other in this Zoom room because we share the same longings, finding happiness.
I failed to get the words right. Yeah, absolutely.I mean, you know, yes, we are recognizing that every appearance is one in essence, is multitude in the form, but one in essence. So, yes, we totally sharing space. And because we are. End of story, says Yvonne. Absolutely. The miracle of existence, the radiance of being. And Marianne says, yes, Yvonne, I've experienced cats all over the world gravitating to me. A total stranger, just because I love cats, I suppose. In Taiwan, I said hello to various cats and they ran to me, tails shivering, wrapped against my leg. I can't speak Taiwanese. There you go. They don't need the concepts.
And Zulma says, animals like us have been conditioned by no one. Some call it life. Absolutely. Yes, they condition, they don't use conceptual images, but they do have conditioned responses by all means. You know, if the dog gets kicked by one person several times, it won't hold the conceptual image about that person being evil, but it won't go there to get another kick either. The behavior is altered. And Marianne says, thank you, Tanya.Experience is now. Absolutely. And Yvonne says, experience is of the me. Nothing ever happened. Yeah, experience-ing. And the end says, Kat, could you please upload today's Zoom? Your spiel was so great. Oh.
I'll get into it. No, you, sir. What were we talking about? Concepts. Yeah. So all these different concepts and, you know, the description of concepts, like it's really very simple. Because what's been talked about here is very, and what's been talked about through the ages and all the teachings is non-conceptual awareness. That's it. I mean, how can a concept that I have conflict with a concept that she has of... It's crazy. My concept disagrees with your concept. I didn't create the concept. She didn't create the concept. No one created the concept. The concept is an appearance and a description that came from nowhere, that goes to nowhere, that was nothing.
And apparently it argues with itself about the other person's concept being right about how is it even frigging possible? It's non-conceptual. Awareness. It's just non-conceptual awareness.the communication, you know, with animals and all communication with people. I think like it's incredible. You can talk about nonverbal communication. You can talk about all these types of communications. And, you know, I think. The greatest, someone said this, the greatest problem with communication is the belief that it took place. And that just blows everything out of the water because imagine that, imagine you think we're communicating with each other, but there's so many levels of this communication. And the words are some of it, or the body language is another, energetics are another.
There is nothing that can describe or know or understand, comprehend any of this, what's actually going on. And we call it communication. Oh, I'm communicating with you. But really, like this, what has made this say I'm communicating with you? What has made the nod in response? What is, it's the intelligence energy creating a pattern, interpreted in some way through some machine saying, oh, I communicated with you and you communicated back and this made sense. It's all, it's a non-conceptual awareness. That's the part of the whole joke. And it's pretty, pretty cool. And Josh, you know, the A plus B, the A and B stuff, you don't want to tell me what to do with that.
What do you mean? No, no. Come on, now we have to say it. No, no, no. No, I know Josh and I can tease him a little bit. And yeah, I think, what was the other things that were covered? Well, I haven't recovered. I don't know. I have conditional love. Oh, no, that's your topic. Oh, come on, come on. He's got his boyfriend down there in his place, a dear Sambo. And what a dear, dear. Oh, my God. Tell us about unconditional love. Come on. It's pretty incredible, like, having it. You know, you're just face-to-face with this animal, and he sees me from my bedroom, and I was angry once a few years ago, and I'll never forget.
There was this anger in my body, and I look out the window, and he's running laps around the paddock, and his orbitals, his glands were swollen, and he was going crazy. And I looked at him and he looked at me and then we just we came to each other and met and everything subsided and it was like this lovely, could have made a movie out of it because it was so almostromantic because I was angry, he was going crazy, and then we noticed each other. And in the noticing, we came together. And in the coming together, everything just subsided. But to claim to understand what that is, what kind of communication that is, or, you know, it's just an explanation of what happened.
And we could make a marvelous, you know, enchanting kind of story with it. That could be nice. But he's actually, oh, yeah. Yeah, there's my little boy. Oh, that's with his garland, yeah. Funny. Yeah, he's a gorgeous thing.Yeah, and this is a great demonstration of unconditionality and of a natural state. I like that comment there, I know. I know. I'm spotted upon. No, I'm in detail. Oh dear. Oh dear. Yes, Jenny, would you like to? Yeah, no, in regards to communication, I avoid, if there's one thing these days that I find, that's, how shall I say? That is taxing energy-wise, let's put it that way, is to observe when there is miscommunication, big time, you know, between two human beings.
And especially when I see it happen between my children and their partners.When I see, you know, how it is the words in themselves that are causing, you know, the conflict that if they would just shut up, you know, full stop, like Bob would say, it would. Give them a break, you know, to take a breath. And there, that is, It's been interesting to watch myself to just observe, you know, and to remind myself that even that is just an expression of life. The life force moving through them. But I have to admit that I'm trying to ingrain the word stop into their vocabulary. So as soon as I'm involved in one way or another, I just tell them, stop.
Just stop. Stop and breathe. Stop and breathe. Stop and breathe.I don't think there's any much more I can do, you know, and to point when they invite me to, to point, you know, to mirror back to what I observe. But in a sense, what I would like to. But I know I can't because we cannot do things, make things happen, is to affect the pattern, you know, to affect that wave pattern of miscommunication. Anybody have any good suggestions on the non-doing doing I could do? I see cats laughing. I can tell you what would have happened if mother of Bob managed to effectively stop him from being a drunk.
She would spare him a lot of pain and she would spare him from a lot of freedom. Sometimes those miscommunications that cause a lot of pain and a lot of suffering are really the greatest gifts. We know how the suffering transforms into the peace. Yeah. So just love them. Just love life. Fighting. Thank you for that reminder, Kat, because, you know, it's funny. I always say that about myself and my own life experiences. That without those, I wouldn't be where I'm at today or life wouldn't have lived me.to this livingness of today or whatever, would be the correct and newer way of expressing what is actually happening right now.
And also... Yeah. So thank you for the reminder, because it's really important, you know, that, yes, that it's difficult. Sometimes it's easy with mother, you know, trying, thinking that the conditioning is that mother should be able to save and to correct and to be that blah, blah, you know, read everything for everybody. So I really appreciate that. And also that this is an important aspect, you know, if you notice the urge of sparing a suffering, recognize the love and stay with that love, because this is beautiful. The fact that you don't want to hurt anyone, you don't want them to hurt each other. That's the inherent beauty of your own heart.
And that begs acknowledgement, not necessarily followed by action of changing, fixing, altering, modifying, manipulating, controlling others, but just recognizing the love behind. And if you stay with that recognition, action may happen and that won't be you controlling, manipulating, that was just the action following the, it doing happens, but there is no, there are. Yeah, absolutely. You reminded me, Kat, when you describe how, you know, with me,meetings here back in the day that was used to become really aggressive sometimes and hair pulling and almost punch-ups and people taking themselves very seriously and Bob would just sit there yes right and not intervene and just let it happen until it got to a point right And then something might be said.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, but thank you. Yeah, yeah, until energy moves to intervene. Thank you for that, you know. So there's not just a thought, there's not a planning out of anything, but just to let life naturally flow as well through them as through me. Unaltered, uncorrected and unmodified, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. You cannot stop yourself from doing just as much as you cannot start yourself on doing. Yeah. There is no you doing. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. And we have a couple of comments here on the screen still. Concept that is, Jens, concept or no concepts are all appearing within the same.
Within the same absolutely and that's theThat's the final. They just appear to be. They dream the fleeting matter. They hear to blow them a kiss and off, see them changing, going elsewhere. And oh yeah, they have a fight. It should have a fight. She says, and Bob's mom kept the door open by giving him the freedom. Yeah, absolutely. I think I'm going to have to say that, but maybe it's gone.Yes, so Bob often used to say, you know, no doubt that was the Siddhartha's quote, no doubt everything is unfolding or the universe is unfolding as it should. If the universe is unfolding in a way that there is a lot of psychological suffering happening, well, that's exactly what the universe wants to unfold like.
I mean, one thing is anthropomorphizing, it is no one thinking there. But that's exactly how it is unfolding or seeming to unfold. And there is nothing wrong, really. From the ultimate standpoint of life, there really is nothing wrong. Because nothing ever happened. And whatever fleeting phenomena is appearing from the screen of awareness, is appearing well that's again that's that's the part of the dream that uh that i'm kind of finding myself leaning towards is appearing for the appreciation whatever it is there whether it is a very very scary horror movie or whether it is very very romantic love story or whether there is an up and down adventure drama it is there to be acknowledged appreciated because it appears to be it loves to be for that love of being showering love back on that being in the form of the dream in the form of imageIt's the story too.
It's a story that anything happens for a reason. Nothing happens for any reason. It's just spontaneously unfolds. So even the idea that happens for the acknowledgement and appreciation is just a thought. It's just another dream. What a dream. What a sweet dream. Very inspiring, at least in this machinery it resonates. Yes, I wanted to respond on Jenny when she said with her children and yeah, non-duality is not about helping the person or having compassion for a person, but yeah, maybe the ultimate compassion because you don't want the suffering go on. So you don't want to give the person anything. And that's the ultimate compassion. Yeah, yeah.
Ultimate compassion, beautiful. Just recognize the same life behind. There is no person. Yes, that's what I want. Yeah, yeah, beautiful. Just one life wearing tons of different costumes, playing the insect, the mosquito, the galaxy, the red blood cell, the broken pants. Let's not deny life anything. Yeah, let it have a ball.As if it matters. Let's not even deny the life, play the silly game of denying life or resisting life. It's an impossible dream. And last word? No. Anybody got a sewing machine? I have one. I have one. I actually do. Hands. Use the hands. We all have sewing machines. I'm not going to have him taking his trousers off.
Why not? It's just an expression of life. Exactly. Okay, you know what? Sleep this. Make a shot of this. I can cut them off. This isn't no longer PG rated. Right. Yes. And how are we going to be uploading it? It's serious. Okay, bye-bye. This was the non-dual laughter finish, you know, the cosmic laughter. Yeah, the son of God did not forget to laugh. Yes, so we are laughing for him, reminding each other to laugh. Have a beautiful weekend.Thanks to you. You too. Bye-bye. Bye-bye.