This transcript was made by speech-recognition software, so names and some words may be misheard. The recording is the original: watch on YouTube.
Live! Starting from the names, Tass, Ross, Klip, Asha, Eamon, Dean and Kat and Tanya. Come here, come closer. Yes, so there is just a few of us today. I hope we're going to really, the smaller group, have this advantage over the bigger group that we can really, really go deeper into the topics. There is no, there shouldn't be any social anxiety in sharing and speaking because there's not that many listening. So yeah, let's see how it flows. We already hear. Everyone is present and aware of being present. And in that presence, everything happens. Without that presence, nothing can be experienced. So the whole experiencing, the field of experiencing is there because of that presence, that sense of existence that is already here fully, equally for everyone.
There is no one who is less present or more present than anyone else. There is no one who is more or less aware of being present. It is almost like a binary. It is there. End of story. Full stop.That's really where the story ends of the enlightenment seeking awakening. But there is also where the story begins of the dream. The whole dream exists because of the presence of awareness. And all the stories about me being born in time, to the confine of the body that is growing, that is breaking up, that is good or bad, that has these relationships and these afflictions and these desires and dreams and preferences.
All those beautiful stories, all those beautiful ways in which that presence, that awareness of presence expresses itself through the myriad of channels, the channel of seeing and the content of seeing, those beautiful colors and shapes and patterns and forms, the channel of hearing, the sounds, the words, the music, the stories. The sounds of the nature, all the sounds and the silence which enables them to be. And the channel of thinking, the imagination, the memory, what an incredible channel of experience and expression, just because that presence has that vehicle of experiencing and expression.and the channels of touch and the channels of taste and the smell so rich so incredible and so inclusive because so what's the word where you can actually switch in between the channels and there's just making that dream so intense and so beautiful and still all of that because there is awareness of presence there is an existence without the life essence flowing through that vehicle, as Bob often says, what would have corpse ever experienced?
It has the voice box, but it can't speak. It has the eyes, but it can't see.So on one hand, celebration of the aliveness through all the channel of experiencing, all the freshness and newness of each moment, all the intensity of the sensations, perceptions, is the affirmation and the celebration of life itself. Because without that life, it wouldn't be possible. So there are schools and pointers saying that you should hate this world because this world has nothing for you. You should hate the appearance. You should reject everything. Well, who is there to love it or to hate it? And that idea is also an invitation to actually investigate.
Is there any action that can be done or performed for that? You know, discarding of the world to get into the essence that animates the world. Is it even necessary? Because as Bob points, what's wrong with right now if I don't think about it? Easily and quickly you realize that there is only one answer, there is nothing. There is nothing wrong. There is nothing wrong unless you think about it. That's also Nisargadatta's best description of the natural state. There's nothing wrong. But does the thinking have to stop?Do you have to or anyone or does it have to be a rejection or hatred towards it? There is no need to hate the world.
There's no need to reject the sensory perceptions and experiences. There's no need to stop seeing or hearing blind mutilators. None of that in order to recognize the life behind. There's no need for austerities and what is it, ascetic practices. I had a friend who used to get up at midnight every night. He was a Zen practitioner. And bow down, do the full prostrations 500 times. The pain in the body, the self-torture, humiliation of the body, all because of the belief in the idea that that is going to give him something in future.So this is really the non-duality is about resonating with the simple undeniable fact of existence of presence or awareness of existence or presence of awareness.
That's the base. And questioning everything that stands in a way. Questioning the ideas that seemingly obscure it, that I'm not it, this is not it, it may have to happen some other way, some other time, it may have to look different because this moment as it shows up now is not good enough because I have an idea. That it has to be bliss, it has to be freedom or love for everything. And this is where Bob invites people to look out in nature and look at animals. Do they really look like they love everyone? Do they really look like they are, you know, showing the other chick?Whatever the pattern is conditioned in the body, the body is an extension and it is inseparable from the environment that has conditioned the pattern.
If you see the pattern of a murderer or a bully, That is what the environment has conditioned that body to be in order to survive and continue experiencing an expression, continue being the eyes and ears for God or for life. If you have the body that experiences and expresses love and kindness and generosity and beauty, very little suffering, more of a sharing of the natural joy of existence, that again, is on environment, even if that is only a result of self-inquiry, which brings about that qualities. When you look at Bob, environment has not conditioned him to be so beautiful and generous and loving, direct environment.
When he was 18 year old or he was 20 year old, he was transported in a pad cell from Japan as chronic alcoholic with anxiety neurosis. The diagnosis and the disease that has never ever been treated in any other way than through self-inquiry, which was also on life on end.environment. Environment brought him to a settings and situations which made him look and question. And again, there was no him. There is an illusion of self that is doing the inquiry. Illusion of self that is practicing or seeking, looking for the truth. There is just that dynamic of life playing the hide and seek and pretending that, oh, I'm lost.
I'll pray. But once the mind opens up, the seeker is the first thing to be seen to be an illusion. So if the seeker is an illusion right now, when has it ever been the truth? When did it ever exist?So is there a seeker unless I think about it? Is there anything wrong unless I think about it? And then the seeking may be happening. Again, you look out in nature and you will see the seeking happening. It's just the pattern of the body. You know, a squirrel seeking for nuts. And the polar bear seeking for salmons to fatten up. But again, do they experience sense of lack and sense of seeking?Or is that the after story that is being put up by humans who interpret?
Because as far as we know, they do not have the narration. Labeling the senses, there is an urge, there is a thirst, and there is finding water, and there is drinking. That's what's happening. And there is no idea that there is a me lacking something, missing something. And it is fairly easy to see that we are no different. Apart from that pattern of narrating the urges, human body is as much as any other animal body tuned to seeking fulfillment of their needs. The breathing is happening naturally. The thirst comes up when the drink is required. The urge comes up and it is narrated, it is translated as a thought.And it's nothing wrong, it's a wonderful capacity that this human pattern has, because as much as the thought creates the illusion of separatedness, because the language is symbolic and the language divides, and it creates subject-objects, That very capacity makes it possible for seeing through the illusion and fully appreciating what for the animals is taken for granted.
The natural state in which our cats are persistently living all their life, like the fish in the water, it can't be appreciated, it can't be known, because the knowing in the dream is only possible in reference to its opposite. So the natural state of a baby is taken for granted, it has never been lost. The natural state of the animal, or the tree, or the cloud, or the sky, is not recognized, is not being known. But once the life itself dreams the loss, of that sense of oneness, dreams, a nightmare of separation and longing for the liberation from that nightmare. It's not real, it's a dream.the life, the godliness, the omnipresence, the omnipotence.
Creates of itself and every piece of creation is as brilliant and as perfect and as convincing as that whole source as that godliness then yes it appears real that's the point so it appears so real that majority of the dream characters in the dream never even look to question it They're not interested. They don't come to this room to look into it. They're fairly happy to just life having a ride and then casting the body and returning to its natural space like non-experience-ing. But in the case of life moving towards itself, towards looking, towards questioning, finding itself in a position of longing, usually caused by very, very intense sense of suffering, sense of isolation, sense of...
Instinct or intuition that there is more to life than just that confinement that horrible cage of concepts in which the main concept is there is a me and I am not good enough I'm unlovable I and there's something wrong with me everybodyelse got it right they somehow cruise through life and they avoid that sense of being lost that sense of being small insignificant unlovable that is also a way life is calling and longing for itself and once this sets in a picture I think that's a good one. The trajectory may change. The trajectory of that experience, of that dream may change. And then the seeking starts.
And a seeking is another trap. As beautiful as it is, the seeking is just, again, a phase of a dream. It belongs to the dream. There is a beauty to seeking because there is a longing. There is a longing for that love unconditional, that joining. So there is a sweetness to seeking. But when I speak to people, especially on the individual meetings, there is the one theme reoccurring, the persistent identity. This is who I am. I am the seeker. This is me. I can't be the totality if I'm already that, the seeker. Just completely engrossed in sense of missing and longing and something and everything being wrong.
And yes, when I dive to my heart, there is a sense that, of course, there is...You know, I know what I want because I know it inherently. That longing for love comes from knowing it. But those are just the momentary glimpses of respite from that constant seeking. Oh, I had it and then I lost it and then it's not there anymore. And the I is always there. So the invitation is to look, what is it that is really always there? What really is it? Is it really an I? Is it a seeker that is always there? Is it the longing that is always there? Is it the emotional insecurity that is always there?
Like scrutiny of looking is it the body that is always there and if it is the body see how the body is really completely different to the way it was a month ago or a year ago or if there is a sense of inadequacy that is always there. See how that sense of inadequacy also changes the same way the body changes. It's stronger, it's weaker, it's more on the insecurity side or it's more of the self-judgment or self-hatred, self-rejection side. It's constantly changing. What is it that doesn't change? What is it that registers the changes in the body and the changes in the mental state and the changes in theconceptual image that we hold about ourselves.
What is it that knows that, oh yes, right now and for the last 15, 20, 30 years, I am a seeker, that's who I am. What is it that is aware, is noticing? And where is it? How do I know that this sense of insecurity or vulnerability is persistent, is always there? Or how do I know that the narrative voice that says I is always, almost always there? How do I know that? What is it that knows that? What is it that registers? Whatever the illusion of self appears to be, It may appear to be a body, it may appear to be a mind, it may appear to be a feeling, especially a vulnerable feeling.And that lovely concept that Bob always brings that is, I hope, speaking to the heart, the uncontrived singularity of the pure knowing.
The pure knowing. It's not I know or it knows. Even though we can say the cognizing emptiness knows, the cognizing capacity of that space-like awareness, that is what knows. But at the same time, that is what I am. The sense of presence that is so close and so intimate and so... More than anything the essence of the being of the heartThat is the I am before it is translated by the mind to the thought I am. That is the knowing itself. Not my knowing or... It's just the no ink in that, in that presence, like in that space of seeing, everything occurs, everything appears, including the body and the perception and the content of perception in that space of being.
Everything, even seeing, hearing, everything appears in that space of knowing, that knowing space. In a way, one could say, I am not an entity behind the eyes that is looking. I am the whole seeing. I am the whole space in which I am my gaze. That's whatever is appearing in it is appearing in me. I am the being. Whatever appears in the being is appearing in me. The whole world, the whole dream appears in me. And we usually realize that when we wake up from the dream at night. Oh my God, this intense, colorful world with actions and conversations and people and places.and environment and room or sky or space, it all appeared in me, in the presence, in the consciousness.
It doesn't have existence outside of consciousness. And neither does that, neither does this dream with all that it contains. It appears in consciousness that I am. It appears in the presence that I am. And without the separating thought, it is obvious. It is experienceable. It is undeniable. Without the thought that tells me this is me and this is not me. This is myself and this is not myself. This is the world. Without that idea, where is there any boundary? Between the seer and the seeing and the seen. Without the symbolic language putting segregating and separating things, indirect experience, where is there any sense of separation?
Is unexperiencible.I often have people also tell me that, look, you know, I totally resonate with everything you say and it is all obvious. Yes, I conceptually, I get it. Intellectually, I get it. But this is not my experience. Well, it's quite the opposite. It can only be experienced. It cannot be conceptually understood. It cannot be intellectually understood. There is no such thing as intellectual understanding. Intellectual understanding is imagination of belief.When I'm describing the world, I'm describing the experience, I'm describing, and you also see in the same way. Every seeing happens, the seeing is actually what's unfolding. The seeing, like Bob says, you wake up in the morning and you open your eyes and a seeing is there, the capacity for seeing is there.
Nothing needs to be done about it. There is no need for understanding, intellectual or conceptual or any understanding to go on for the seeing to be experienced. That's the direct knowing. The seeing is happening. Now the intellect comes and says, okay, this is I seeing and this is what I am seeing. And this is the concept. And now bridging that concept by believing or intellectually imagining that this is just a concept, that's not the point. Taking that whole narrative, that whole mental clutter aside, pushing it aside, and diving back to the heart of hearts, direct experience. No thinking, okay, I believe it, I can relate it, or I can imagine it and agree with it.
No, that's just too far away from the direct knowing without the thought.So it is really directly everyone knows that without the thinking, there is a knowing. When you wake up in the morning before the concept or the idea comes, oh, it's Sunday, I have to go to the meeting, oh, it's Monday, I have to go to work. Without before those, the processing of the world, the imagining, segmentation and the navigation around that complex dream even kicks in and starts. There is the pure seeing. And then the download happens. Oh, this is I. I am seeing. Oh, I'm in a hotel room. Oh, I'm in my room.
Oh, I'm in someone else's place. But the capacity for seeing does not contain any of those computation. It's just pure capacity for seeing. But because all the senses are actually governed by that computer, by a computer, very, very quickly takes the job of translating. I tell you what's going on. This is you. And you are doing this and thinking this and you are feeling this. And they think that about you and you are being right on this one and wrong on that one. But noticing how it comes online. That capacity of narrating and making everything into a story makes it light, makes it fun, makes it sweet and makes it completely benign.
And that's the freedom. Nobody's going to promise you that the narrative and the computation is going to stop. That the narrative which is telling, taking credit and doing everything that is not doing anything, but is translating everything as my doing or someone else's doing, there is no need for that function to be select switched off. There is no need for anything to be any different than what it is right now. The way life is expressing right now, including narration, is perfect just as it is. The recognition, the simple recognition that those patterns run as they should. And they are known in the space-like awareness. They are experienced in that space-like awareness, which is your essential nature.
And which you can assert to right now. And then watch how quickly that pattern invites you for the ride. It doesn't invite you, it invites the attention for the ride.Because there is no you as such. You are the totality. But the attention goes and, oh my God, what am I going to do today? Or what is going to happen if I fall sick? Or what is going to happen when I'm on my deathbed? Or if my children, something happened to them? Incredible, incredible. Every moment is an invitation for an incredibly juicy, intense ride of imagination. And seeing how that right invites, seduces. Is so light there is a lightness of it because suddenly there is a possibility of just leaving it as it is without enslaving that attention is liberated it's not enslaved from from every pull, any direction, it is free, or at least some of it is free, to just appreciate that unfolding.
And that's the freedom, is no one to be free. There is no person to be free or liberated. There never was a person, there couldn't be a person. The illusion, like Bob often points, the illusion of a blue sea. Once you see that the water is translucent, it's clear, it's not blue.will still appear blue. Once you see there is no self, that the self is translucent, is clear, is nothing there, it will still appear blue, it will still appear that there is someone who is speaking right now, there is someone who is listening right now, there is someone sitting somewhere. In the narrative, in the translation, there is still an appearance of that rich, intense, beautiful, colorful dream with all the channels open, the seeing, the hearing, the tasting.
Amazing, amazing dream. But once you know the truth, the appreciation for the dream is appreciation for the life that animates the dream. And sometimes there is appreciation for the beauty of the dream. And sometimes there is just appreciation for the life behind it. As Nisargadatta says it, when I'm nothing, this is wisdom. When I'm everything, this is love. Love for the dream and appreciation for nothing, no thing that animates it. They interchange. Sometimes it's one, sometimes it's the other. Every moment is fresh and new, and it has to be this way, otherwise there is no experiencing. That's how the experiencing goes, the vibration, and the world appears through that vibration.
Everything, nothing.Pain, pleasure, joy, happiness, joy, sadness, or happiness, misery, whatever, day, night, winter, summer. Alive body, dead body, or whatever. And there is a possibility for the appreciation of a dark side of life too, if it's not personal. There's appreciation for the winter, for a dead bird on the road, for the hunger.Because you understand that without that, the opposite is also inaccessible. There is a humbling appreciation for the difficult moments in life because there is understanding that they are not you and not yours and they are not permanent. And if the thought arises, oh, it's going to get worse. There is an appreciation for that loving care behind that thought.
And also understanding that, yes, it may or it might, but it doesn't matter. Because it is all on life and it is all temporary and transient. What's behind it is permanent.And I think I'm rambling almost too long. So I'll invite every one of you now. And of course, as you say, there's no one doing anything. This is all just happening. These meetings are just part of the story. It's all just... Nobody's doing anything. Even when you... When you believe in being a seeker that's part of it nobody nobody there to be doing that even when you have trouble moving from one couch to another it's all part of the story because it's just this Nothing can be done.
Yeah. Just relax.Can't even do that. No. Can't even do that. Yeah. No one can do anything. Yeah, sometimes, I mean, it's amazing how it just pours out of you. But here, sometimes there's just nothing to say. It's just, it is as it is. Yeah. It just is. And, yeah. If you can come to see that time is an illusion, I think that often helps, perhaps. Yes, yes. If you can... Look at your own experience and realize that you never actually experience the future. And the past, even though you may seemingly have memories, they're just fresh and new in the moment. They come up spontaneously. They're not stored in a box somewhere in the brain.
Fresh and new, every moment is spontaneous. The seeming entity is only ever seemingly living now. It's always now. Now. So where's the baggage?Where's the baggage that seemingly feels so heavy, that's such a concern, that we keep going back to old memories? It's gone. In a sense, it never happened. Because it's only ever now. And of course, there's no one here saying anything. That's just coming out. Next.Here we go. I could do a few tricks for you. Just moving the other side of the room. Give my stiff neck a... Yeah, stick to the mic. Moving to the other side of the room and falling over and...
Body doing something else and the mind saying this and all this rubbish. Thank you, Kat. It was a lovely talk. During the week, I read something about a guy who gave a talk on awareness. And he said, usually people go along in a very subtle form of sleepwalking. And it's just a nice description.And, uh... He said there was this fellow sitting there with his dog. And someone came up and said, does your dog bite? And he said, no, my dog doesn't bite. The fellow puts his hand on the dog and it bites him. And he said, you said your dog didn't bite. He said, that's not my dog.So the talk was full of humour like that, that things aren't what they appear to be and we're constantly getting them mixed up.
But, yeah, from what Kat said and Tanya has also said, it's all much ado about nothing, isn't it? Beguiling we accept the dream as being real and we create we reify things into solid objects and hard concrete matterAnd it's all done with imagination. Amazing. We've created the universe out of our imagination. Yeah. Yeah, thanks, Ross. Yeah, Kat, I really heard what you said towards the end there about appreciation of the dream.And I recognize that there is something that prefers one part of the tree but not the other. And it was good to see that this morning. I hadn't quite seen it like that. You know, I love when there's, you know, morning light coming through the trees and, you know, brings a tear to my eye.
But there is, there's a preference for one part of the dream and not the other. Absolutely. And this is the first time I can really sort of say that. It's beautiful. And actually, that appreciation is never going to die because that's the very, very algorithm of the survival, of the pleasure-seeking. And having that appreciation and really appreciating the beauty of the dream and really appreciating also the difficult part of the dream, which is necessary for the beauty to be appreciated. It deepens up. The appreciation deepens up and includes everything. Initially, there is only the pull towards beauty and pleasure and the pull away from the displeasure.
And that is on the bodily level and it will always stay. But more of the relaxing out of being identified as a body and more of a being that witnessing presence, the space-like awareness, then those difficult parts are also included in the appreciation of a dream.And that's magic. When you actually, you know, when you love yourself crying, you love that the body is really wailing because of a sad event or a loss of something or someone who was dear and beautiful. And you just love every bit of it. Oh, my God, it's so yummy. That is when you don't prefer one part of the dream to the other.
I mean, the part that is the presence that allows and equally embraces the sad and the difficult and the beautiful, that one is the one that doesn't prefer one part of the other. The body always will. And seeing that you are not the body, that that which prefers one part to the other is not your essential nature. But that which knows about it, which notices it, the part that notices that, oh yes, of course there is a preference. There is a preference for the beauty. It'll always be there. The noticing of it is neutral, is space-like. The space in which you notice the preference for beauty does not have preferences.
It's free from preferences. That's your essential nature. And absolutely delighting in the preferences being inherently there.Vanilla ice cream over chocolate ice cream. It's not me, it's not personal, but it is there and it acts itself out or it doesn't act itself out. Wow, let me see. Interesting, fascinating. And the love for beauty, I can't imagine anyone who would not be sensitive to that. It's just a part of the machine. It's just the definition of beauty would be different for you to anyone else. Don't you love your own definition of beauty? So tailor-made for that particular system. So, oh God, loving to be me in a way, even though you're not the me, but appreciation even for the conditioning of that.
Because this particular sensitivity, is uniquely yours. It's not entirely shared like the sense of presence, that uniqueness of the pattern, thatThere's something very satisfying about that too, isn't it? No one can ever experience it so intensely. Yes, it's to be appreciated. And the knowing of it is always free. The knowing of it does not have preferences. It just notices. And we have Cleve. Sorry, it's throwing me off a bit. Well, you know, I'm not quite there with the appreciation of the beauty sometimes, with the appreciation of the dark side or the pain side. You know, I see being in that space, but sometimes... What I was thinking of is slipping from the witness into the I thought again, you know, that it's me that's doing the appreciating or it's me that's seeing it.
Or I suppose getting, sometimes getting, realising that thought is take you know yes you've slipped into the world of thinking and the dream and you notice it and so and then thinking oh right out so I'm in the dream now and I can get out of the dream, but then identifying with that I there that's doing the in the dream, out of the dream, liking the dream or not liking the dream and thinking there's some continuity to that.witnessing and then the story of that's me sort of thing arises but it's it's it's not the awareness it's it's the thought up or conceptualize me that that is saying that or is being believed at that stage I suppose and then you slip out of that and as you say in the morning you wake up and And you're completely free of that.
But then the story starts, I've got to get this happening or that happening, blah, blah, blah, and realising that's just a thought too. But it's easy to slip. I was just thinking of something else that occurred to me the other day. I was thinking, oh, that's good. I've got rid of that bad habit or that bad habit's not appearing now. You think, oh, that's well done. There's no me that's done it but immediately want to seize credit for it. And it's an interesting one. And when you went into that appreciating the dark side or appreciating the painful side, I can see it quite clearly sometimes, but it's more, rather than having a love for it, it's more like having an acceptance of it, but then as I'm even saying this, who's doing it and who's saying it, you know?
Yeah. Whose experience is it? It's experience that's happening now. Yes. But there's an imagined continuity to it, like it was happening before or I saw that this morning or yesterday.But once again, all that's really just happening now. That's, yeah, just now. And that's actually really, really well put because, again, it's a narration of the experience and you can see that, again, that basic algorithm of safety and survival of the body sometimes causes the whole attention to be sucked out and scream, Father, why have you forsaken me? And there is no witnessing presence available. All of the attention goes into that scream, no. And there is a beauty in that because without that, there is no freshness and newness.
And when you notice that, It happened a moment ago, it's a memory. In that fresh and new moment of realization, that moment of forgetting is past, is gone. And you can appreciate that memory of learning or challenge in the freshness of this moment now. Because, you know, whatever you say, whatever anyone says about the moments that were painful or difficult, they are memory now. That's right. In a moment of losing the touch with that sense of presence, there is no one who loses the touch. There is never ever anyone there only in the after story oh i was so completely taken by that moment of suffering i completely lost the sense of presence and i completely got taken identified as a thought that's an after story which is false because first of all it is not happening presently second of all that narration suggests that there was an i that identified and i was never real it couldn't be It's just the attention was required for survival, for that scream, for that fight, flight or run.
Life self-organizes, it makes it perfect. The fact that, you know, there is an idea that from some point on, the realization is just a constant, it's an always constant knowing that I am. Well, it's not a wrong description, but it assumes that there is someone that knows. And that's a false assumption. The knowing doesn't have to be translated to I that is always witnessing knowing present. There's no I. You go on. That's true. But it seems like so much of the day is... Thinking, or what, thinking goes all the time, but so much of the day the things, thoughts are organisational sort of thoughts about what has to be done next week, I've got to get this prepared this week and that week.something or other, and so much attention seems to be going there, then there's a stepping back from that and seeing that that's really just stuff that's going on in the functioning.
Functioning. Yeah. But there's no one stepping back and seeing that either. Exactly, yes. It's the spontaneous movement of attention, which is always forever free to move whichever way it is conditioned to move. And it is always known, whether there is a conscious realization that it is known or not. That's right. Yeah. And we have some online contribution here. Good morning, says Tibor, and love from South Australia from Catherine and Giotti says good morning, and Deborah and Annika, and finally a sunny one in Queensland. Oh, good on you. After the storm and the rain and the typhoon, cyclone, whatever. Hank, good morning, says from Amsterdam. Giotti, wow, middle of the night for you, Hank.
The spiel was spellbinding, Kat, thank you. And Claudia says, it reminds me what Bob said, the past is finished and it is gone. Lovely top cut to life from presence-centered awareness. Hi, Claudia. And good morning, says Vivek. And Tracy says...I understand that there is no me doing anything, but often wonder then why me who came to non-duality. I had been a seeker. For over 40 years because something in me knew and me is always quote-unquote knew there was more to seeming reality than what was appearing but I could have just as easily been one of the millions of people who doesn't care at all about this stuff I know that must be ego but why does this knowledge come to some and not others Yeah, that's a great question.
The idea that there is an ego that has been blessed to come across this knowledge or has been experiencing grace or something is the perspective from the human, which is not real, which is a dream perspective. If you, again, relax completely all the perspectives and look at the flow of life itself, Bob sometimes called it intelligence, intelligence energy or energy itself, life essence energy. If you look at that energy having a capacity to formulate patterns, shapes and forms and experience and express itself through different means and different channels as a tree, as a whale, as a bird.as a sky, as a planet, as a cell, galaxy, a red blood cell, whatever, you look at that life with its prolific quality to just
dance, the idea why it would be a musician in one body and a cook in another body and a seeker in another body kind of collapses.
And there is no why this has happened to me and not to the others, because as life, you are every vehicle. So there isn't really a need to even verify, oh, why this person is born poor and this one is wealthy and this one got sick and this one got married three times and this one never find a partner. You know, those from life itself, you have it all. You are all. You are all of it. So why this message or this knowledge comes to one and not to the other? From the dream perspective, you can write the books about it. But from the life perspective, which is ultimate perspective, which is your essential nature, it doesn't really make much sense anymore.
It's just how it appears. And you may experience joy in, again, like Tass was saying, you know, seeing or and looking at itself life looking at itself through that unique pattern that can never be repeated that can never be the same the feelings that that you are feeling are unrepeatable like a droplets of rain that droplets of water or snowflakes every single one is one and unique one at the time and rather than looking atothers reading other people's Bibles like Hindu would say just yeah immerse yourself in that curious discovery of what is this moment presenting through this one and Gilbert says dividing it up into parts is the illusion yeah yeah you can see how how labeling creating dreams dreaming is what an exquisite illusion is an expression of life is the way life expresses itself adding a story you can see how many stories come up from one situation oh maybe he thought this or maybe he meant that or maybe this happened or that happened it's just incredible And the freedom is from believing any of it.
It's from seeing it, seeing that dividing pattern, that dividing algorithm to be an illusion. Thank you, Gilbert. And Tibor says, it is good to get the clarity that it is the body that has the preferences, not that which notices it. Yes, amazing, isn't it? And you are not the body. And ultimately, as life, you are every single body, but not exclusively the body. So the preferences of the body are not your preferences. You as the consciousness.express the preference for this moment to be as it is, including the body's aversions. Anika says this quote, the great way is easy for those who have no preferences. Helps in what moment it helps in that moment when one identifies with that urge or preference yeah and that one which identifies with preference is again it's just the attention moving into it and just life essence attention or intelligence that is just highlighting you know it's like the Like you have the dimmer.
We used to have the dimmer here. It's been removed. Dear Zoran, thank you. The dimmer that actually is like almost a flow of attention. When the attention is free, the light is dimmed and the expression is just one of many. And the awareness of the expression is kind of more broad and wide. And when the dimmer goes all the way up, you know, the expression, the experience gets amplified and channeled into just one channel of experience, it feels like one identifies with that urge or preference. One. It's not the wrong description. It's the one life.identify with that flow with that amplification that one life us and attention that channel that light or that heat or that sadness or but it is still even if it's not consciously it is the cognizing emptiness the registering of it is free And Tracy says, thank you, Kat, for this wonderful explanation.
Yes, it's all in life. Thank you, Tracy. And AB says, the best wishes from England. It is the middle of the night here, but these meetings are amazing and always worth staying up for. And thank you for staying up and contributing because it is so much easier to hold up meetings when we do have some people to contribute to them rather than those who just show up on YouTube and watch it and we don't have much of a food for exchange. When the thought comes up, why? Why me? Yes. Who are you? Who are you? This is always an opportunity to take a look, see if you can find you, the seeming mini-me, the seeming entity.
Where are you? Where do you begin? Where do you end? Does this, do you have?Can you see a circumference, a boundary, a single point? Can you identify it? Can you locate it, a single point where this mini Tanya is sitting, operating, pulling the levers, pressing the buttons? There's nothing to be found. No thing to be found, yet all of this is seemingly happening. Yet, you know, the eye that looks, the seeming eye that looks, can't find itself. But then, from where is the eye that's looking? Knowing that this is occurring. Because there is a knowing fundamental to all of that, that there is is-ness, there is knowing that sits behind it all and that sense has Never changed.
It's the only thing that you truly, really, absolutely know without a doubt is that you are. I am. You exist.And it's always that fundamental, subtle, behind the scenes of everything happening sense is always there. You can't get away from it. It never changes. As you said before, you know, the body can change, it can shrink, it can get taller, it can grow, it can get fatter, it can get older, and yet that sense never changes. Everything else changes. The dream is constantly changing, constantly changing. Anything that has a beginning and an end is not the truth of who you we are. Because it's shared, obviously.
Life is all there is.And that sense. How could it be any different, that sense of knowingness, how could it be any different for the seeming entities? It is shared, it is the same. This is why Kat talks about, forget about worshipping the messenger. Or the hierarchies or looking to someone, seeming someone else with the answers or to, you know, help you get where you're going. Because we've said this before, there's only one guru, one teacher, and that is who and what you are in truth. And this is all this stuff that seems to be changing is the dream. How could anything possibly be right or wrong in a dream?It doesn't make any sense, does it?
To even ask the question. When you realize it's a dream. You wouldn't have, when you go and see a movie and you see the movie characters doing all sorts of things and the bad guys doing this and the good guys doing this, you don't walk away and for ages ruminate over the, you know, the awfulness of the bad character and the greatness of the good because you know it's just a movie. Entertaining, sure. But it doesn't affect the viewer in any way other than in their imagination.That's it for me. That's beautifully put. That's just so beautifully delivered. I love it. And yes, the dream only has its impact in the moment.
It doesn't have to be carried on for ages because every moment is fresh and new. And just... Really dropping the prior moment and letting the new and fresh and new moment amaze you and indulge you and remembering that this is also fleeting it's nothing binding and just holding on to a story is overlooking the freshness and what a waste of that incredible indulgent juicy life experience That's what makes you laugh. You want to do it? No? Oh, Heyman, did you want to say something? I see you have a mic. Do you like to say something? Thanks for this opportunity. So, as opposed to the great...
Way is not difficult for those who don't have preferences. It is difficult for those who have preferences. Pain and pleasure are directions that someone can prefer to go towards one. As opposed to the other.Therefore, I'm sitting and just being with what is coming into the experience and experiencing the experiences. What I notice is this is a method that works. I know I said there is something to do and I'm doing it, but there is also something that you can rely on known as free will. There is such thing as free will. And there isn't, because as the host of the meeting suggested for you, there is a sense of self which is precisely bodily consciousness, which has got only one way of operating.
The way of operation of that bodily consciousness is only one thing and one thing alone, destruction of physical and mental life. So when sense of bodily consciousness feels I'm willing to be It is working at that moment because there is only one version of being.What I understood is this method, less method, which is sitting and being, makes my outer life and inner life closer to one another. I would call it closing of lover and beloved until they become one, which is non-duality here and now in this immediacy. Beautiful. Thank you. Thank you, Heyman. Thank you. Yeah, closing the gap. And Bradley says here, the only obstacle for enlightenment is the belief that I am not enlightened.
Here there is the old Zen saying that There was a student asking a master about what is the difference between the enlightened one and unenlightened one. And the master answered to student that the only difference between the enlightened one and the unenlightened one is the belief that unenlightened one has. That there is a difference because there isn't one there isn't one if you let's say put our beautiful bob as a messenger on the high stage you know the guru like tanya was saying you know that there isonly one life. There is no guru out there sitting on the high throne who knows and I don't know and he is superior and I'm inferior.
And I believed that 10 years ago. I remember being in that position of idolizing. He has something that I don't have. And the truth is, he didn't have something that I imagined I did. I imagined that I had separate self and he knew he didn't. So this is all upside down and completely opposite to what it seems. Wait, wait, wait for the mic. The converse applies. There's no one who doesn't have what I have. Yes. The other thing I like is the movie. It's like a movie, but you can step, you know, if you are getting scared in the movie or whatever, you can step out of the movie anytime.
That's like Alfred Hitchcock used to say to the actors, it's only a movie. And that's a great point, you know, there is a freedom from stepping to step out. Yes, it was. During the week was observed this strength of aversion and it was a tightness in the body, contraction in the body.same time it was known that you could just drop this but in practice no it was really binding And yet there's a chink of light, and that chink of light, is really informing one that that this will pass and thatWhen the... When the great ones say nirvana and samsara are one, that's it. It's no big deal.
It's just stepping out of that self-deception. No big deal. Yes. And yet we get... Wound up and tangled up and distressed and angry.Isn't it amazing? Yeah. And there's this freedom there all the time. Come on, wake up. Speak closer. It's a great joke. Great joke. Great joke. Okay, I have a couple of comments here. Tanya says, amazing how there is nothing here, but it seems like this nothing is looking from the perspective of the body. Yeah, well, looking is always happening from some or the other perspective. But seeing is a capacity. And Giotti says, thanks, Tania, to you. And this sense of continuity often gets confused with the experience of the body and mind, but it is never changing.
Sense of continuity yes that's true you can see what is changing and what is not changing that is really the distinguishing that is really where there is a difference in no difference you know the experiencing what Tanya was saying the beginning and an end of every fleeting changing experience happens on thatimmovable background like Nisar Gadada would say, immovable background of stillness in which all the movement occurs. And so New Zealand Tania says, so why does it seem to take so much looking at what actually is not belief, thought pattern? Well, why does it seem to take so much looking? Yeah. Why not? I mean, this is the point.
See, animals don't have to do any looking and they can't appreciate what they have for granted. The illusion of losing the sense of oneness and looking for it and the whole play, a whole game of hide and seek, I'm not it, I am it, I want to be it, I want, you know, this, the idea of me trying to get small me being bigger me or inclusion, that whole play, that whole joke. Is the way for the life to reveal itself to itself. When the bubble of the illusion of separation pops and you see that it was impossible right from the first place, but it had to be investigated and looked at because it seemed so real.
Like Heyman was saying, you know, the illusion of free will, it seems so real. It's so, so real. That you can't even say it is not.It is neither. So Tanya also says it is interesting that whenever there is looking and noticing that without thought there is no problem or belief in thought and there is peace, silence, freedom for no one. There you go. Yes, and Claudia says, the mind wants to manipulate the truth with the preferential attitude, but truth cannot be manipulated. So the love and reverence for the truth can help us see clearly what we are locating oneself and tianorstis, clear seeing.And Claudia also says freedom to be that truth.
Yes, you can see that the controlling part, the manipulating part of that navigation property, of that algorithm that governs and makes sense of the world and that aid or tool or assistance that Chuck G. Pitino had, which finds the most smooth way of functioning. It is just a part of functioning. There is no need to attach or detach or anything, just to recognize. And we have a B says, I am currently reading Bob and Kat's book, Bags of Pointers to Non-Duality for the first time. And it is the most clearest book on non-duality I've ever read. And I've read hundreds. Oh, thank you. I actually heard someone saying that.
And the idea came really, really out of the blue and just expressed itself. So I can't even say that I wrote it because it just... It just show up in this pattern of uncalling the words. I love the 3D screen analogy that is used, the still aware screen and the ever-changing movie that is playing on it. And there is a couple of hearts on it. Yes, thank you.And Cliff has the talking stick. It is a good book too, Kat. I've got that on my coffee table and often flick into it. But something you said sort of really gelled with me was the difference between looking and seeing.
Looking is from the body through the eyes, whereas seeing is through the awareness. Seeing is the awareness and there's quite a difference when you're looking from the body and using the body mind as a reference point rather than just naturally seeing everything with awareness because awareness stretches out everywhere. It's not located in the body alone. It's everywhere and we're seeing and knowing with awareness is different to the body mind knowing, I think, in a way. Yeah. Yeah, and that's, you know, it's easy to fall into that illusion of only looking with the eyes and thinking that that's it. I sometimes use the metaphor of like seeing the way the camera is seeing.
It's just, it doesn't have even, you know, that focusing property when you touch on it and it focuses on particular objects, that focusing. The camera is looking indiscriminately and it's just showing up the whole gaze of seeing. That is the true seeing.It doesn't have that personal element which moves the attention from object to object. It's just a metaphor. It's an interesting one. I don't know, it's like locating consciousness in here in a way too, you know, thinking that this is where consciousness is, where consciousness is universal, it's everywhere and you are that rather than that. Yeah, I often think about that too, the camera and the way cameras record stuff in time too, which is different to how the ICs things and mind works.
And I have, oh yeah, Ross. The optics of it all are very interesting because when the rays hit the back of the retina, what's up is down and what's down is up. So it's inverted like that. And then the brain... Supposedly changes it. But also,
We see one view. We have two eyes, but we see one view. And if you extend your arm to where that view finishes, you see it doesn't have a boundary, but it does disappear. Yes. My hand disappears there. Good trick, isn't it? Yeah. I do that trick all the time. I'll pass it over to Cliff, he's headless. There's just something that you were saying about where things disappear in vision.Bob once said to me, look backwards with your eyes, you know, look behind you with your eyes.
Well, you can't do that with your eyes, but it's a, if you look backwards, there's nothing there. It's like you're looking through a window. But when you look, if you imagine looking backwards, you can think, well, there is nothing. Back there, you know, it's blank, it's nothing, but only this is what seems to be appearing in the field of vision. And so that what appears has come from nothing. Yes, it's all nothing being interpreted in a certain way. Nothing more to say.Yes, so we don't have any new comments, but I would just like to say this. Thank you for reminding AB about my book, because if anyone wants to buy that book, wait a couple of days.
I will just withdraw the manuscript and add the part, update the part, because I didn't really have time for it. The bonus material is a biography of Bob that was on there. And the biography has the, you know, it has concluded, it has changed. Because the way I put it in the book, he was available for speaking with people. And that's off the menu right now. So wait a couple of days. I promise I update the manuscript today. So you can purchase updated version day after tomorrow. Because usually Amazon takes a day to... To fix it. Bob is no longer with us for just a few weeks, less than two months, but he is with us forever.
And he is the true nature, the life that he is, can never die. That's the nature of it. And Hank says, I am gradually dozing off to sleep, but what a wonderful sharing. And thank you, Hank. And we are almost done. I would really, really like to invite you, the only one who didn't share, please. Just give us a little bit of time. What will I talk about? I know what I can do. I can go like...here and I could lie down upside down And like, wait till the scene turns around. Okay. Speak to the mic. It's all about the optical nerve, isn't it? What should I talk about?
There's just this, you know, like I said, this whole show has been going on today. It's a meeting about pointing and looking and describing and explaining and showing and everything's just appearing in that. And what is that? That is this. And this is the awareness or the... Knowing that this is, and there's no one seeing this, is just like the book. Bob says, points it so clearly, keep seeing that there is no thing that sees. And in that no thing that's seeing, everything appears. So that, that, that, is an idea that there's a me who's seeking, that it appears that there's a me who's contracting, that it appears to be a me that's merging this side to that side, appears to be a me who's watching conceptual thoughts and moving away from it and going into it.
It's all the same.appearance. It's all within the same appearance is a ray like a whole pattern and all the whole pattern is completely empty and yet appearing absolutely full of all of these things and it's always now, every idea of past or present or future is always now. Any idea of I need to be or I need to become is now. And they're ideas all in the appearance, appearing as little energy packets, like just floating around and they appear. For no one, they just appear. And so the whole show here is describing that, explaining that, and then there's an idea that there's a me listening, getting a glimpse, getting an understanding.
They're all energy packets of information. The idea that there's a system of... Mechanics and their understanding and this conditioning that's all here right now that they're all ideas bubbling up presenting as that there is this presenting as a machine there or it is this presenting as a seeker or it is this presenting as as I need to go, I need to get, I need to understand, I need to discover. And it's a funny game, and yet there's no game. It's a show. And sometimes it just seems like...Like there's nothing appearing as an absolute circus. And the circus is the greatest show in town. And there's every kind of act appearing in that circus and every kind of...
You know, artists performing. And the whole show is, who is it appearing for? Who is it appearing for? Or is there someone that it is even appearing? too, it doesn't even make any sense because all those are ideas within this. And so there is nowhere to go really at all. So when people say there is nowhere to go, it's not like a concept for you to don't go anywhere and stay still and meditate. There really is. It's an idea, it's a concept that there is a you that has to go, and that's appearing in this again. And the idea of a sense of a body is appearing in this.
The idea that there's a teaching and there's a teacher and there's a lesson is appearing in this. And there are ideas, concepts, or energy expressing. And so what is really needed to be done? Can there actually be something that needs to be done? The idea that something needs to be done is bang.Like there's absolutely, where could you go? What could you do? How could you recognize it and get it and understand it and then lose it? It's impossible because they are all the same idea. Circulate, that's why it's a circus. That's all for now. Thank you. That was a good steal. That was so yummy.
That was really fantastic. I love it. It's so good. But, you know, it's an absolute illusion that we've been conditioned seemingly to have the belief that there is actually something going on back here behind the eyes somewhere. But when you actually look and you realize it's just like. There's just what's happening. That's it. Yep. That's it. Just this and nothing else. Just this and nothing else. Remarkable. And then what do you do with it? Like Bob says, leave it unaltered and modified and corrected because that's what space does. There's no one watching. There's no you that is leaving anything. There's no you that is witnessing anything.
There's no you, the you that appears as something separate.is part of the appearance, is completely included in the circus. So space just is, leaves it unaltered, unmodified, uncorrected. It doesn't do anything. It doesn't even exist. You can't say that space is an object. And if it is, then of course it's included in the circus, in the display. But it neither exists nor it doesn't. It just is, it neither exists nor it doesn't. It's just a poof. I like the idea of the appearance of circus. It's cute. And we have, thank you all from Claudia and thank you everyone. Julia says, come back to the Zoom meetings.
There are some on your time zone on Bob's website. Yes, for anyone who would like to participate a little bit more closely and intimately than just texting on the site, we also have three Zoom meetings that are on the website. And this is all free of charge. You can tune in at any point and tune out if you don't like it. So check it out. And thank you everyone. Thank you for hanging out with us. Did you want to... Final words? Yes, please. Go on, click.I'm experiencing a lot of bodily consciousness. I'm accountable and responsible to resolve it by sitting in being. Now, from non-dualistic viewpoint, you may disagree with me that no, you're not a doer.
This is just happening by itself. I'm disagree with you as well. I'm doing it. I don't care. And this is... No alternative zone. There is only one reality and it is my accountability and responsibility to align with it. So everything will take care of itself by itself as itself. And there is only one self. Thank you so much for everything and opportunity. Thank you. Thank you, everyone.