This transcript was made by speech-recognition software, so names and some words may be misheard. The recording is the original: watch on YouTube.
That's it. Oh my goodness, it wants me to rotate the phone. Why? Is it, it's up, it's okay now isn't it? No, it says it's gonna be doing it sideways. Goodness. Does Dean's one do that? No, no, I think it doesn't. Maybe he's... Is there a setting on your general settings? It's showing, yeah. Oh, it's showing, correct. Okay, anyway, we'll just have to start. Oh boy. Yes, so we have Julia. Yeah. And Brendan. Linda. Saroja. Lee. And Lockie. Josh. Ross. Anita. Jacinta. And Bob. Hi. Good to see you all. It's the same old, same old, a lot of you. I've heard it many times. We go over it again and again and again.
Pointing to the true nature of everything. They call it Veda in Hinduism, non-duality. In Buddhism, they call it the great perfection or non-conceptual awareness. That's what we point to. So I can't teach you anything. I can't tell you anything. All I do is point toward and ask you to look to where I'm pointing to, to see for yourself. Because non-duality means there's only that one essence. And you and I and everything else is that. We all know that. Because that's the chair you're sitting in. That's the room. That's the trees, the flowers, everything is that which we put words or labels on and discriminate it with the word.
But the word is not the thing. Take the word water. Can you drink that? The word fire. Can you cook with it? Eat with it? The word I or me. What's it pointing to? The body-mind? Well, that's what we believe it's pointing to. But have a look at that. Are you this body? Are you this mind? If there is one essence. And innately we know that. We're not because we say my body, my mind, my house, my car. You're not the house, you're not the car. When you look into it maybe you're not the body or the mind either. And that's what they tell us also.
The false cannot stand up to investigation. And we investigate some of these things and really look into them. And that understatement know the truth. And the truth is that you're free. What are you free from? You're free from the belief that you are this individual, you are this separate entity, your person. And the person is not reality. Comes from the word persona, the mask, ancient Latin. I mean we've got a mask of concepts which are obscuring the true nature of what everything which is that. All the one essence. Absolute. If you recognise you are absolute, what can you add to absolute? Can't add anything at all to it.
What can you take away from it? You can't take anything away from it. So looking at that and recognising that, who could ever be superior to you? And who can ever be inferior to you? And what would you want from anybody else? In recognising that. In recognising that you are that. So that's the important thing. Investigate. Because I tell you this, the false cannot stand up to investigation. And you know that's true. Because there's so many things out there that you've seen and believed in when you first saw them. But in investigation, you recognise they're not so. If I say to you, go down to the ocean and get me a bucket of blue water out of the sea, what would you say to me?
You'd say don't be an idiot, because you wouldn't know the water's not blue. The blue sky goes on a day free of clouds and there seems to be a beautiful blue canopy over the space. But space is empty, it is no thing. Where's the blue in this room? This room's in space. So the sky though it appears to be blue. When you look into it, you see it's not so. A rainbow, you go outside and see a rainbow and the sky colours. Misty day. But to investigate you see there's no colours there. I've got a crystal sitting in this window over here and cats put paper on the windows.
The sun shines through them and make a colour on the floor. Beautiful pattern on the floor, pattern of colours. Go and try to grab that pattern of colour. You can't. Because it's only appearing to be so. And they call this Advaita we talk about, or non-duality, one without a second. Not two. Only that. And that is all there is. A lot of people get the idea to call it God. In fact the idea is that there's some big daddy up there in the sky. If you do this and do that you'll become something. But have a look at that. It tells you in the Bible, in the beginning was the Word.
The Word was with God. The Word was God. That's all that God is, is a Word. All things were made by him by the Word. There's nothing made that was made without the Word. Have a look at that. How many words we have? How many words were born with? You realise you weren't born with any words. And you didn't pick up words until you were two, two and a half. Somewhere around that age. So wouldn't that tell you that you must be prior to the Word? I'm sorry but I can't hear you at all. You're a metre away. You must be prior to the Word.
And the Word is not the thing. You can't drink the Word water. You can't cook with the Word fire. So we've got all these words. Realising that the Word is not the thing. Where did you begin? You believe you are this person. Well look into that, investigate it. You say I was born. But can you remember your birth? No one can remember their birth. Though people say they remember their birth. How could you remember it when you didn't have any words? And you didn't pick up words until you were a couple of years old. When the capacity of reasoning took over. You developed in that pattern.
Where did it all come from? Well go back as far as your father and your mother. That life, that pattern shaped and formed your father. And that same life or essence or intelligence forms your mother. In that pattern you call your father through the food he's eating. And the breath he's taking and all the rest. In that pattern that little microscopic particle called the sperm formed. You can't see it with your naked eye. But that sperm was suffused with intelligence, with life. It attached itself to the wall of the uterus. No it didn't. The sperm was suffused with intelligence. And the same with your mother.
That animating life has formed another microscopic particle. An egg or an ovum formed. That egg attached itself to the wall of the uterus. And the sperm swam to the ovum. And penetrated the ovum. And the intelligence in those two patterns, those two things, particles coming together. Doubled and redoubled and formed the little embryo, the little fetus is what you call yourself today. The person, the body, the mind. And you didn't learn words until your parents fussing around you. They learnt words. And told you you're Little Johnny or Little Billy or Gene, whatever your name might be. And we take on the belief that I am Little Johnny or Little Gene.
Instead of recognising that you are the absolute. You're taking on the idea that you are this body, mind, this person. Now you're not the body. You are not the mind. You are that life essence, that intelligence energy. Which is one, only the one essence. That pattern shapes and forms and expresses in all its variety. What's it all appear in? Well you look at it and you see it all appears in space. They call it the basic space of phenomena. It's the base of all this manifestation. Space. Does space have any beginning when you investigate? Can you find a beginning? Or can you imagine any beginning even?
You say it began with a big bang millions of years ago or something like that. Well what would that big bang be then? It'd have to be in something. It'd have to be in space. Space is no thing. But everything in this manifestation, you and I are things. The trees, the flowers, the planets, the stars, the earth, everything else. Are things. Is the content of space. Space is no thing. Can something come from no thing. It can't. But like the colours appearing on the walls when the sun shines through it. So these things appear in space. And we take the appearance to be real. And take ourselves as the appearance.
And we take the appearance to be real. this pattern, shape and form to be separate, an individual. That because of the thoughts that are arising, it's unhappy, it's fearful, anxious or depressed, it just takes on the belief that I am this thing and these words are pointing to what I am. I went to the absolute, you can't add anything to the absolute, so we realize you're not the body, you're not the mind, you can't take over. Sorry. Yes, so we have welcome messages from people who are with us and complaints about the sideways view. We'll edit it later. So anyone who doesn't know that you are existing right now, anyone who doesn't know that you are conscious, let's see, because the that's the basics of non-duality.
It is the simple recognition of the fact that miracle of existence is going on right now. And for the mind it may feel like this is nothing. You look and try to objectify existence and there is nothing there, nothing. But it's not a nothing. It's the no-thing but not a nothing. The radiance of life, the miracle of that incredible unexplainable mystery of existence. It could have been nothing and there is an existence, there is a consciousness, there's that capacity to experience, to express. That's not a small thing. That's a huge thing. In fact, it is the only thing really that matters. And if you look with your heart, you're amazed and you are mind blown.
But if the mind is not blown, and it looks, for something hello there's nothing there no object so this is not it i don't have it you have it and i don't have it how am i gonna get it what am i gonna do what do i need to do what practices do i need to do to get it the eye that wants to get it that very eye is the one that can never ever ever get it because it is imagined and i used to imagine to be that eye as well i used to imagine that i was the separate self entity somehow trapped there in the body and now bob is enlightened he is he lost his ego and and i still have that little thing there inside well nobody could ever find it there isn't anyone there but it felt like there is it felt so intimate that oh yeah there is me you know i suffer i have feelings i have emotions i'm afraid of rejection i'm miserable so of course there is a me that feels all those things and i'm afraid of rejection i'm afraid of rejection i'm afraid of rejection i'm afraid of things but really is there a me that does the seeing is there the me that does the thinking nobody knows the next thought that's gonna show up nobody knows the next emotion that is gonna show up so they are just showing up in the field of conscious awareness but the feeling is that no they're my emotions they're my feelings and particularly the emotions were were the were the sticky ones for me because the sense of rejection the fear of humiliation and the suffering that i was going through that really humiliating diminishing self-hatred type of a suffering it felt like of course you know there is me but really even if i look at those feelings the feelings are not there all the time and i am the presence is there all the time the feelings no matter how nasty how dark they're not there all the time they come and go so i can't be my feelings yeah but there is a me you know feelings are changing that me is not changing no the presence is not changing the concept of me is changing all the time when i was three year old i was an ugly little duckling but now i am whatever the woman those concepts are changing the idea of what the me is are constantly changing the presence doesn't all those ideas comes and go in the presence so that That Presence is already here and you are that Presence.
The idea that I'm not a Presence, I am a me that has the Presence is the misconception. The idea that I am the Self, the limited entity living somewhere in the body because I can only feel that skin. I can't feel that unless I touch it, but it's not the same. Well those ideas are a misconception. If you think of the energy of life or the essence of life the same way you think of any other energy, the energy needs a vehicle to express itself, to experience itself. And that vehicle comes into existence thanks to that energy. Just like Bob often shows how the energy, the intelligence of life created itself a vehicle of the body, of a human body.
Okay? By feeding, you know, and taking air and creating those little cells in the mother and the father and in their mothers and their fathers and all the way like turtles down to the bottom. The earth staying on the turtle and turtles all the way down to the beginning of time, so-called time. So it grew itself a vehicle. That life, that energy grew itself a vehicle of expression. But does it mean it is that vehicle? No. The vehicle is part of that energy. The energy just like again you think of any other energy, for example electricity now coming out from so many lights, so many sources of light, is the same energy expressing itself through every single globe.
Slightly differently. It would express itself yet differently through an oven or a stove. Okay? Okay. So it's like a car or an electric car or the television or computer. The expression is always different. An experience, if that energy was sentient, and we don't know if it is or it isn't, if there was any sentience through any of those devices, the experience would be different. So that energy, that electricity or other intelligence energy expresses and experience itself slightly differently to every pair of glasses, through every device. Okay? But does it mean the energy is different? Even if that energy, part of it, expression, is to create the mental image of a self that drives the whole thing.
So there is an energy expressing itself as the seeing. Is the energy looking? Is the life, literally life, looking out of my eyes? And I have no illusion anymore that there is a little person there that does the looking. And the same energy is looking through everyone's eyes. Even if, somewhere on the way, there is a concept that there is an entity looking. That concept is just a concept. And that concept is to be looked at and questioned. Because everyone is present, is aware, the miracle of existence is happening. The life is looking out of your eyes. And recognition of that is only one thought away.
If that thought is taken out of the way. The direct experience of presence is shining forth. It's right here. But then the mind comes into the picture and says, ah, no, that's not it. Because the descriptions that other people give, you know, Nisargadatta says, I've swallowed the world or I am everything. I can't say that. Well, it doesn't matter what the description is. The description is never the described. And imagining what did he mean by saying this? No, it's not that. It's the non-conceptual awareness. It is the awareness where the concepts are ignored or pushed aside. And that awareness is shining forth all the time.
It is never not here. It's just that part of that energy is sucked into the entertainment system, the narrative, the conceptualizing, comparing, judging. And it is sucked into. It's the non-conceptual. so much and so habitually engaged with that narrative that it somehow is believed to be reality. So the world, the way that nature sees the world, we are seeing the interpretation of it. Interpretation that is, again, looking through the tinted glasses of conditioning. Well, the moment that conceptualization is pushed aside, direct experience of presence is there. And it is attended to, like, directly. That is what you are. This is you. Wow! But the moment mind comes into the picture, again, comparison starts.
No, that's not it. No, that's not good enough. How does it help me? How am I going to manifest my dream house or better job? That's nothing. That can't be it. People can't fuss about it all around the world. Great enlightenment. Come on. It's nothing. For the mind, it is nothing. But that's the point. Mind is the veil. That's what stands in the way. Mind is a wonderful, wonderful tool to be used. But it's a horrible master. It's the source of all the psychological suffering. And see if we have anyone commenting. Apart from good morning messages? No. Okay. So anyone? Anyone would like to contribute?
Say something? Ask something? Add something? Highlight something? I was just thinking about the imaging in. You know, I really like that pointer. And that's something that we take an image. I met somebody. I'm poor. I'm not always great here and giving my own little spiels. But I do it to strangers on airplanes and buses. And there's this poor victim on the airplane, got a Julius spiel, and I was like, you know, the beginning of this flight is not here now. You know, you might remember it. You sat down next to me, and then, you know, but what we're doing is we're taking what seemingly was to be what is.
You're imaging. You got an image, and that's in, imaged in. Imagine. I think the simplicity of that, I just, it's very clear, you know, that that's not, these are a few of my favorite things. Yeah, so really the thinking, we're talking about things. That's another thing. We could talk about things. There's only thinking. That's a cute alarm. Yeah, it is a gift Bob got from James Braha back then in 20 years ago and still working. We had it off, but now it is a good reminder to just get up and stretch. When you're nearly 96, you need that reminder. Sometimes, a bit of a nudge.
Go on, Julia. Yeah, that's a good pointer. Go on. I'm not sure what to add to that except that it's, that word imagine is like, it says it all in a way. You know, I mean, just that one, like that's, it's all dreaming. Yeah, beautiful. Yeah. It does says it all. Yeah. I mean, anything that, everything. I mean, like again, there was something I didn't get from Bob, but somebody else pointed out that, you know, that, that you can win an Olympic sport by a thousandth of a second. That's over. Like, you know, it's all not here. Close the future, the past, there's all, even the present doesn't exist because that's starting and stopping at the same time.
So there's just dreaming. And I'm loving the dream. It's a lovely dream. Even if there is no one to love it, I, you know, it's still lovely. Yeah. Yeah. It's nothing. It's, it's, it's, it's, yeah. And that it's, it's so lovely to, I mean, to me, there is no one here to benefit. That's the benefit. That sounds ironic or, but yeah, that sometimes, you know, that they'll, they'll be an upset, they'll get pissy or upset or a hold on, but it's so quick and easy to see. Oh, right. Okay. Like, put it to an end, but, but, but there's, there's some 即싹는. There's some believing.
And what's not. There's some buying into thoughts. Thank you. Thank you. We have a comment from by take here. And, and that's beautiful, Julia. That really is. It's really a beautiful pointer. And it is really essential to see that if there is a resonance with just one phrase of Bob Spiele. Just one phrase. Just one, just one pointer. If you actually feel that ringing a bell in your heart, because that's nothing for the mind, it is all rubbish, that one pointer can take you all the way. And that one pointer, imagining, yes, it describes exactly the whole mental activity, making mental images over everything. Like Bob often says, the word water, you can't drink it.
That's a mental image. It is called symbolic language because it creates symbols over everything. And it's a fantastic, wonderful, wonderful device. But when it is believed to be the truth, when you believe the map to be a territory, you're never going to get anywhere. So Martin says, nothing speaks about nothing. Beautiful. That's exactly it. Bob sometimes starts the spiel. From, I can't tell you anything, and I can't teach you anything. How does it go further? Can't tell you anything, can't teach you anything, I can only point and ask you to look and see for yourself. Because there's no personal self. As I tell you in the scriptures, there's only the one self, the Atman self.
Mmm. And you and I and everything else are that same self. Patterning, shaping, forming, appearing, as everything and the nothing. Jesus said talking about nothing can trouble you, mmm except in your own imagination. Mmm. Break that word imagination down to image in. And we're creating conceptual images, all the time. Concepts. And they, The Buddha told us that, he called it the cognising emptiness. We think we cognise the emptiness, we don't, it's the emptiness that does the cognising. And he made the statement then that emptiness is form. And the form can be nothing other than the emptiness. So you and I and all the forms in this room, we're all that cognising emptiness appearing.
Take a movie. You look at a movie, all sorts of activities can be taking place in it. Cowboys chasing Indians and shooting one another, big comedies and all sorts of things. But what happens when the movie's over? What's been touched, has the screen been touched? Has it hasn't been contaminated or corrupted by anything at all? Has this space ever been contaminated or corrupted? All these things are appearing in it. An appearance is only, what seems to be. It's not the real. I want also you to add, you know, when Marty says nothing speaks to nothing, you sometimes also include in the introduction, I'm speaking to that I am that I am.
Yeah. I say I'm not speaking to anybody. I'm not speaking to any mind. I'm speaking to that I am that I am. That's expressed through the mind. As the thought. Just to this, nothing else. And each and every one of us knows I am. That's the basic mantra. I am that. And you already know that. Everything is that. That's the chair you're sitting in. That's the room the chair's in. That's the space. That's the tree. That's the flower. Everything is that. We put different words, different labels on. And take the words and the labels. And we take the words to be real. The word is not the thing.
We pointed out before in the beginning was a word. And you realize you are living a year or two as a little child before you had any words. So how can you say you were born? You can't remember your birth because you had no words to say. And we take the words to be real. And not the word what are you? You must be life itself. And so I got a challenge to that. He says there's only life. There is nobody who lives a life. Life lives on life. And out of life more life come. As Christ told you, I am the way. I am the truth.
I am the life. People thought he was talking about himself. He wasn't. He was talking about that sense of presence. That we call I am. Expressions of the word. It's that sense of presence which is alive. Breathing it. Breathing your heart. Growing your hair and your fingernails. Rolling the earth around the sun. Causing the seasons to come and go. The tides to come in and out. The highs and the lows. Everything is that. And that is all there is. Only that. And the recognition. The cognizing emptiness. Where it's cognized or re-cognized. The emptiness is form. And the form is nothing but the emptiness. Where does it leave you?
Present and aware. Anyone who is not aware of being present right now. And you know I am. You know who I am right now. We've got this idea I am the body. I am the mind. But you know that's not true also. Because you say my body. My mind. Just the same. My house. My car. You're not the house. You're not the car. You're not the body or the mind either. But that's how it's appearing to be. And the definition of phenomena they call it a phenomenal manifestation. The definition of phenomena is that which appears to be. And appearance is only seemingly so. It all seems to be real.
When you question it and look into it. It's not how it appears to be. You know the truth. And the truth will set you free. Beautiful. I heard you yesterday on one of the individual calls. You brought up that I am is the life of the world. The light of the world. Another scriptural saying. That's what Christ tells you. I am the light of the world. He wasn't talking about himself. He was talking about that sense of presence. Light. Where does the light or life come into that body? Doesn't it come through the umbilical cord? When you cut that cord? Where does the light shine through?
Light needs an aperture to shine through. Shine through your eyes. If you notice the corpse, the first thing that happens when it dies, your eyes glide over. The light of life disappears. And what happens? Space. It goes back. It came out of space. Space is another thing. It must disappear back into space. Either burn the body or bury it. It breaks down. And ashes to ashes, dust to dust, it breaks down into space. So you're not going to go anywhere. You never came from anywhere. So the fear of death disappears. Death had a seeming... Life had a seeming beginning. But there's no beginning and no end to the timeless.
Time is a mental concept. Is there a past if you don't think about it? And you look at it that way and say, without a thought you can't say there's a past. But then you think, I was in the past. You're creating a concept. Believe you are in this past. You can't live in the past. You can recall it. And if you can't recall it, it's gone. Lots of things you don't recall. And what you can recall right now is what you know right now about the seeming past. The same with your future. You can anticipate and imagine a future. But you can't live in the future.
If you're not anticipating or imagining it, where does it leave you? Right now? What is this now? Presence awareness. Beginningness. Endless. Spontaneous. Unaware right now. I know I'm not unaware. So there's a knowingness of awareness. There is an awareness of. And look at that. Hear that tram going by right now? There's an awareness of that. There's awareness of everything in this room. Anything that the... that appears in that awareness. That awareness of. It must be an object. So all this manifestation appearing is object. And you're an object to me. I'm an object to you. So awareness, as I point out, in Buddhism, it's a non-conceptual awareness.
Awareness without any concepts, thoughts or ideas or images. And it's like... Omnipresence. Total presence. It's a total intelligence. Total beingness. And that is all there is. And you and I and everything are that. We remember and rely on that. Recognise there's only me that can be unhappy. Only me that can be anxious. Only me that can be depressed, guilty or jealous or whatever. Me is the cause of all the psychological suffering. And they, the effects of the psychological suffering, are the effects of that cause, me. Cause and effect. Realise the cause, me, is a concept. This idea of me is just a conceptual image of it.
And then if I see that and ask myself the question, can there be an object if it's not related to me, if it's not related to the cause? The cause is seen as a fiction. What must happen to the object? It must fall away. So subject-object problems are problems of our life. As I say, it's only me that can be unhappy. How does that come up? We don't realise that all this manifestation is transient. It's constantly changing. And the definition of reality is that which never changes. And the only thing you can point out, which is in this manifestation, that doesn't change, is space. You can't find a beginning to it.
As I try to pinpoint a beginning, say the Big Bang six billion years or so ago, whenever it happened, that was the beginning. But that's just a concept also. There is no beginning to space. There is no end to space. There is no boundaries. There is no centre. There is no circumference. Every so-called thing is a concept, a pattern, shape and form that appears in the space like awareness. So the idea comes up of something that I like. The things we like, we don't want to go. Not realising everything is transient, it's all changing. No matter how much you like it, how much you love it, how much you want to keep it, it's going to change.
We don't want it to change, so what do we do? We resist it. Try to keep it there. And resistance is conflict. If you are in resisting, you're in conflict with it. And conflict makes you uneasy. And that uneasiness is dis-ease. You are not at ease anymore. So that's what's happening. Resistance, conflict, and dis-ease. Something comes up you don't like. Oh, I shouldn't be thinking this is a bad thought, I've got to get rid of it. So what do we do? We try to get rid of it and resist it. Again there's resistance. Again conflict. Dis-ease. So whichever way it goes, there's always this constant resistance.
What's wrong with right now if I don't think about it? Leave it as it is. No resistance. It must change of itself. Just like in nature. What they call the natural state. This earth we're on right now, this part of it, is facing the sun. And so it's light. Does the sun know anything about darkness or light? It doesn't. This earth will roll around and move around and face away from darkness. It'll face away from the sun. And it'll be dark. Does the earth know anything about daylight or dark? No. It's a concept we take on for how it appears. And we like one part of it, don't like the other.
So that's what happens. In the liking and disliking we form all sorts of concepts. Take the concepts of words to be real, get locked into them, and suffer from the belief. And look at the dictionary of the definition of belief. It's an unquestioned acceptance of something in the absence of reason. Acceptance of an alleged fact without positive knowledge or proof. When you put your belief to that test, they'll fall apart. What's happening right now in this presence of awareness? What's your next thought going to be? Ask yourself that. And you'll say, I don't know what your next thought's going to be. But a thought will come up.
As soon as a thought comes up, what do you do? I think. You believe you're thinking this thought. But can the thought I think, as soon as the thought I think comes up, you've formed a subject, a thinker, that's thinking this particular thought, which has become the object. But can the thought I think, the subject, can a thought I think, is that the thinking or the thinker? It's not. It's just another concept. But the actuality is the vibrating thinking. Vibrates, patterning, which is the thinking. The thought I think can't think. The thought I see can't see. The thought I hear can't hear. And the thought I feel, taste or touch, can't do any of those things.
So it's all spontaneously happening, which we put the thought on. Thinking, seeing, tasting, touching. All are vibrating to that life energy. When we don't relate to a thinker, it's just a spontaneous natural functioning. Just as it is. What is means not what will be or not what was. It's just as it is in this presence, awareness, and it's transient, constantly changing. And that is all there is. The one life, the one essence. Patterning, shaping, forming, experiencing, expressing is everything. And that's who you are. You know, it's also interesting to point out is how so many like to think there's a higher and a lower and a more and a better.
And they're failing to notice that that too is conceptual. They're trying to become, they want to become more. I need to be more enlightened. And my head needs to be more quiet. And there's a me. It's the whole thing. It's interesting that they're not noticing. The... The subtleness of that, even the higher energy. You could have a, ooh, raise your vibration. There's a me that vibrates, right? But then there's a higher vibration. And somehow they're just, look, they're so... They're vibrating at such a... Yeah. But there's no higher... That's also a thought. Hmm. Shakespeare tells us nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes us...
And the saga tells us nothing can trouble you except in your own imagination. And there may be a toaster that is actually burning the toast, and maybe the globe that is shining brighter, but the energy behind them, the electricity behind them, doesn't have any levels. You know, you may have the moment when you are completely depressed and you sleep 16 hours a day, fibromyalgia, whatever, and the next thing you're manic, and you're just, ah, jumping all around. But again, the energy doesn't have level. The expression may be different. And I had some... Lately there was... Actually, well, Bob doesn't type anymore, so he delegates all the typing, scheduling, and sometimes when we are on public transport I even have time to answer a quick email or two.
Always read it to him before I send it, of course. And he kind of likes the elaboration on the email because... And then I had a couple of conversations when people would say, but you know what, when you speak there is a passion in it, and Bob is just repeating the same thing. It's a wonderful thing, but he's repeating it from that peaceful place. Hey, you know, when you were 20 years old you could go on a party for a week without a night of sleep, and when you were 96 you've got to go to bed at 9. That's the... That's the... Yes. That's the limitation of the body.
And yet, and yet, whatever he says, this is the email that I'm actually... I haven't finished yet, but this... Whatever he says, without elaborating, getting high on it or getting too passionate and speaking too loud and too high, he is maybe saying the same thing. But take a one-liner of that the same thing and let it unpack for you. There's no need for someone else to unpack it or elaborate. That's the fake entertainment for the mind. Yes, it's easier. It might be easier. I remember I had that situation in my life when I was a seeker for, I don't know, 20, 30 years, and I met a person who said, look, you know, if you just pick one of Bob's spiel, the early one, 37 minutes, and listen to it 100 times.
She listened to it 100 times. She's never been seeker before, and it opened up for her. And I told her, well, yeah, good on you. If that's your mind, you know, I'm so variety-oriented, my mind would never ever go for listening to the mind. I would listen to the same thing twice. There's so many things, so many exciting things around to listen. Why would I listen to the same thing twice? Luckily, there was enough presence to hear myself answering that. I could hear that being said through that lips. And the question arose straight away, okay, what am I in for? An entertainment or the truth?
Because the truth is, in that one spiel, I can't hear it in every sentence if I can fully hear it. And I can't because the mind is just craving for, oh, okay, what does it mean? Oh, I agree with that. Oh, no, I don't agree. Oh, someone else says it better. Oh, my goodness, comparing. I'm just being busy over what is being said. And at that point, the decision was made, and I wasn't the decision maker. The I that I thought I was didn't exist even then. But the decision arrived that, yes, that challenge will be taken. And I went, I was working at sea, and I took that 37-minute spiel on my phone, downloaded from YouTube, and I was listening to it for like twice a day for six weeks or so.
That would be about 100 times probably. And the mind was kicking a stink when it heard it the same time, again and again, fifth time, tenth time, kicking a stink. Shit, you know, I've heard it before. Come on, come on, give me something. But the persistence, the commitment to the truth, rather than entertaining the mind, was strong enough. And then I started waking up at night and writing down the pointers when they started opening up for me. Initially, the pointer of sperm and ovum was just, yeah, whatever. Yeah, that's true. So what? And then the next level hearing it another ten times, shit, that's profound.
Oh, my God. Wow. That is actually so incredibly amazing. How could I ever say that? Oh, yes, so what? How could I ever not see what's behind that simple pointer or any other, like what Bob was saying just now? Everything is transient. The problem comes up from wanting to keep what's pleasant and avoid what's unpleasant. Yeah, of course. So what? And then suddenly, shit, that's really what's happening. That's really where all the psychological suffering comes from. And it is so out of pie. It's so out of habit. It's so out of emotion. It is so out of psychological behavior. It's so unconscious. If you can only see it, my God.
And over those short period of time listening just to that, without any elaboration, without any word being changed in the spiel, they started speaking from within in their own voice, in their own language. And I came back from that, from that trip in November. And in December, I had one and only one-on-one meeting with Bob was the last one I ever needed that mind opened up completely and initially I came in tears and said well but this you know I know all that I understand there is no self but who suffers the suffering I am so sick of it I'm sick of seeking I'm sick of all that how many times God and a frustration in it and a frustration coming from the fact that I was taken to be something else than that I was by myself and by others and seeing through suddenly there was no other pointing ever required since that time been nearly nine years I never had another question it's just who is there to even question and they say all but identity sometimes arises identity doesn't the behavior may arise the behavior the response may arise like Julia says you know you may get frustrated well our cats get frustrated too but it doesn't mean there is an identity there in the frustration in the behavior in the response the identity isn't that it can't be once you see there isn't such thing as imagined little I how can it ever arise again but Bob uses the phrase that you know I got caught up in the mind in the want for a better word what is that I that could caught up in the mind there is no I to get caught up in the mind is the attention that can get caught up and if I think I'm my attention of course you know I'm constantly scattered around everything but I am the stillness the presence in which the attention is moving so the attention get caught up but the stillness never does the presence the aliveness it is always there the empty screen is always there and that was just a sidetrack around the repetitive spiel which you are here not the first time I mean apart from you first time and welcome most of the people are not so you do actually understand the value of repetitive hearing the same pointers because they are so brilliantly distilled out of any unnecessary decorations ornaments and nonsense around it they are so clean out of any belief or cultural embellishment you just can't get it any clearer than that and we have Arial says how beautiful that Bob can rely on life to have his back by way of speaking through cat when needed thank you thank you Arial and Laura says we are the Truman show and Katherine and James the last thing the me wants the me what to do is get out of the way great Yeah, no beginning, no end, no middle.
And Ruchika says, what's the difference between awareness and consciousness? Yeah, you could say awareness is like electricity when the light is off and consciousness is the light when the electricity goes through. You see the difference? I mean, of course, everything is one. So distinguishing and separating and, you know, the next thing we're going to be categorizing consciousness and bringing up the four states and stuff like this. Can you say that again? The difference? There is no difference. Everything is one, ultimately. But you know when, let's say, you get to coma, state of coma. When you get to state of coma, there is no consciousness there.
The light is off. The body is still alive, it's breathing. But the awareness of presence is off. So consciousness is off. Awareness is not. Awareness is potentiality for consciousness. Awareness is a potential for consciousness. When you think of energy, any energy, when the energy doesn't flow, is there energy? No. The energy is the movement. But is there no energy? No, because the potentiality for movement is there. So when you think of electricity, when you flick the light off. Potentially it is there. The stillness, the space, the potential for the movement of energy is there. But the light is off. Consciousness is off. Awareness is there, but the consciousness is off.
When you flick that light, the energy moves, the life goes through the body, the eyes lit up like Bob was saying, you know, lights glaze over when the electricity is off. Yeah, like in deepest sleep we are still aware, but we're not conscious. Yeah. Kind of. That's a little bit too much to say, because you can't say you are unconscious, you know? Someone touches your big toe and you straight away, ah, that! Right, okay. Consciousness is there. It's just the mind is not recording, because there are no memories being formed. There are no sensations that could be transferred into images, unless you're dreaming, of course.
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. And thank you, Ruchika, for your question. Although, yes. Remember, everything is one essence. And Saul says, thank you for your words, Bob, and thank you for the gift of your presence. Bob's presence shines through beyond the words. That's right, yes. And it's beautifully peaceful and serene. Even though he's got a big celebration tonight. Remember, we have a big celebration of 64 years of sobriety. We're going to have a cake. We're going to have a cake. And JB says, a seeker tries to be a soul. I'm not a soul. I'm a soul. I'm a piece of cake. A seaker trying to get somewhere because apparently being here is not enough.
It is up ahead in the future, surely. Because you can't hit be just this immediacy where there is no reference to the past or projections into the imagined future, without taking a trip into the past or the future. Who is there left to suffer? Be still and understand. About four years later, after you are gone, it is not one that you can work on for forever. And that's to say, we've come so close from the beginning that we don't have time left to do anything else. Don't worry about it. and be consumed that is beautiful so that JB JB that was gorgeous and Ariel says Bob's words are like listening to your favorite song over and over yeah it is the song of your own heart is the I am that I am the nothing speaking to nothing like Martin was saying and Laura says does the imagined self ever completely shut up with its it is imagined so it doesn't even have anything to say or any the narrative may be going on but if you see that it doesn't belong to the imagined self it is just a piece of software it's just like sweating of the skin does it ever stop no digestion does it ever stop no I mean well it might hopefully not not right now yeah I'm just gonna finish reading is another couple of sentences and we get so Gioti says the pointer that resonates most strongly with me is that there is no denying that I exist that is a beautiful pointer to highlight and soul says great metaphor about electricity relating to awareness and consciousness thanks cut okay and now now the speaker comes to you T-boy um yeah you been exploring that the cause and effect um side of things in the past affecting the future and um just um that's been something that's been quite meaningful recently as well um and when you get past the cause and effect as Bob was saying it's just there um how do I put it when you're just being there's nothing true that I can't um it's just the thoughts that are the constructs that um seemingly have shaped things in cause and effect whether that's my um current situation or past situations but there has to be time involved and thought involved and um when that thought is dropped there's just being and then there's a lot more to do I thought I was going to ask you in the comments under your podcast how have you VERED i think it's a great article area you can find it I'm interested in thejaworường fuhrman by if there's anything that you would like to say and i really appreciate it Mandi will see going into the second part of the presentation if if there's any brainstorming at the time and I'll be sure to get guidance away with you in the coming questions and I think i'll talk to you later when you get back in the video then there is no cause and effect.
There is just the unfolding of the moment as it is. So as I've pulled back, it's just been really interesting in the sensation of being. And in that, so much drops away, including that cause and effect or the including time because you need time for cause and effect. Yes. And there's... It's hard to... It's impossible to put into words, but I'm just... Yeah, there's just... There's an ease to the timelessness of being and so much just drops away and you just... The unfoldment of what is, it's just that. It's just really... Simple. Mm-hmm. I still find my mind wants to get in on the act.
The emotions want to get in on the act. Yeah. However, that's okay. Mm-hmm. So, yeah, there's a real simplicity to it once I don't get involved. And I can see that the awareness of awareness has also been quite there. Mm-hmm. Which... And I can sense it more and know it rather than talk about it, I guess. But there's definitely that... Yeah. Just the awareness has been really quite pleasant. Anyway, that's it. Mm-hmm. Thank you. Anyone else? Just going back to when... Mm-hmm. ...to Bob, take one. Bob was speaking very quietly before he had his earplugs put in or taken out. Taken out. Taken out. And it was very still.
And what Bob was saying, the words weren't recognised as such. It was just very quiet. And then the presence, just became distinct from the forms and the shapes and the sounds in the room. There was a recognition of that quiet spirit, quiet presence, and everything else which is appearing is allowed to be. But when Bob started speaking with force, false, that was different. That was, as Shakespeare said, Prospero said, full of sound and fury. It was manifesting as there is an actor on the stage, as Shakespeare says in that same speech, as I foretold you, they were all spirits. So the spirit had apparently separated from the air, and then the air was gone.
And then the actor and the performer and the audience, they were all still there, but there was a separation. And there was a fine, subtle distinction in which one fully rested. It was like that for quite a while. And again, as Tibor was saying, it's a struggle to try and speak about that, because it's, you can't put it into words. It's ineffable. And it was very nice. Thanks, Bob. That was really nice. Sometimes there's, I think when you're speaking, or Kat, when you're speaking, there's such a palpable falling away that happens. And it's like the distance just seems to disappear between myself, the speaker, and anyone else.
And it's almost like the words, I want to listen to the words, but the words are just washing over almost. And I think what you said about the repetitiveness is kind of highlights almost that the pointers and the words are beautiful, but it's what's sitting underneath those words, like the words are just the outer exterior of whatever is going on in this room. And I know when I first started coming, the first time I sat down, I listened to the spiel, I was like, wow. And then I came back the next week and I was like, that's the same thing. I was like, nothing changed.
And there was a bit of resistance. And then I just kept coming back. And it's just so apparent that there's, when we're listening, we're just tuning in or letting go or whatever it is, there's this one essence that we're connecting to. And the words are secondary. It's that space or that, I don't even know what you call it, alignment or tuning in. That's where all the kind of beauty and power and whatever else, is. And the repetition and the fact that you're hearing the same words is almost what brings your awareness to the fact that the words are secondary and the energy is primary. So there's, yeah, there's just a beautiful power in that repetition and in finding yourself in the space that is here.
Yeah, so thank you. I like when Bob sometimes reminds us, and maybe you can say something onto it, Bob. You say that the I or the self has been rehearsed and kept on since the age of two and a half, repeatedly. The identification with that imagined self was repeatedly reinforced by everyone around you. Can you say something to that? Oh, that's a fact, isn't it? Yeah, it is a fact, yes. Everyone takes on the word I and don't question it. That's why they call it ignorance. Not that we're dull or stupid, but we ignore the reality, the omnipresence of reality of everything in this moment.
Conceptualize it. The great perfection they tell you in Buddhism is non-conceptual awareness. Awareness without any of these gods. And there's no one who is unaware right now. Awareness of anything you're aware of. Aware of everything. It means it's object. Everything is object. Who's the subject? It comes back to the I am. Pure subjectivity. Pure being. We call ourselves human beings. Believe in God, you'll call God a supreme being. Take away the word human, take away the word supreme, anyone in this realm can stand up and say, I'm not being. You can't. You immediately know that you are. You are the pure being. And being is not becoming.
It's not what will be. It's not time-bound. It's spontaneous, knowingness right now. And you and I and everything else is that. That's the great mantra. I am that. Don't notice it. Don't take any notice. It's like the story you all heard about the fellow that goes to the guru. Been in practice for a long time. The guru says, what are you here for? He says, I want to know the truth. The truth. The guru says, well where have you been? He says, well he says, I've been to the bloke down the road. And he told me I am that. He told me I am that, yeah.
And he says, oh alright. You didn't like it. Yeah. If you want to know the truth, you'll have to serve me for 12 years. So he says, yeah okay, I'll serve you. So he gets in and asks the house-room manager, what jobs have we got available? And he says, well the only one that's left is picking up the cow dung. So that's your job. So he did it for 12 years and he came up with, I've served you for 12 years, now teach me the truth. And the guru said, well I've got to go out that. This time he heard it. And that's the problem, we hear these things so many times and ignore them.
That's why they call it ignorance. Not that we're dull or stupid. We're missing out on the obvious. It's obvious right here and now that you are present and aware. But we don't take matters. We think we've got to become something. Or practice this and do that and become what we all really are. And that's what keeps us in problem. Realise and recognise. Recognise. As I pointed out before, the Buddha called it the cognising emptiness. He made the statement that emptiness is form. Not that we cognise emptiness, but the emptiness is cognising. And it's that emptiness which all these forms appear in. You, me and everything else are.
The expressions of that awareness. Emptiness is form and he says the forms can be nothing other than the emptiness. It is not two, it's not separate, not apart. It's the one essence, the one being, the one intelligence energy that's expressing, that's appearing as everything and you and I and everything else is already that. I don't really think to add to all this is kind. Because I'm sure it would be very wise. Look, she's speaking in silence. She's really demonstrating the point. She's demonstrating the point. And we have a couple of comments here from people who congratulate Bob on the 64th. 64th birthday. We have quite a few.
Deborah says, Have fun, both of you. Enjoy the yummy cake. And happy anniversary from JB and Laura. And Sol says, Yes, the words are secondary. Pointers only. Truth is beyond words. Beyond words, absolutely. And we have that beautiful book available on eBay. I put actually three postage. I think in Europe it's going to be one dollar or something. Of the only book that Bob has ever written himself is called Beyond Words. Beyond Words, Beyond Mind. I use some of the pointers from the book to create the cards. Because again, this is a distillation. It is not like you need to listen to thousand hours or meditate for 20,000 hours.
No, just take one. And just experience it directly. It is experienceable. It is not to elaborate, to think about, to meditate, contemplate on. None of it. It is literal. It is direct. And the pointers in that book are, ah, quite a few people said that was the best book ever written on non-duality. And it is a format of, I'll just show you. It's a tiny, tiny book. It is that small. It's a page, it's, ah, how many pages? Ah, oh, 57 pages or something. Yeah, 60 pages, but, yeah. It's like a booklet, almost. And it has everything in it. It's, ah, it's gorgeous. Anyway, it's, ah, gosh.
I have a couple of more comments here. Yeah? Happy birthday more, happy birthday more, happy birthday. And Tazi says, the me is mind made. There is a sentence, a sentience, but no entity. And Laura says, yes, it's a great book. Yes, there is a sentience, but no entity. Beautiful. Yeah. Everything is alive. I kind of like to liken the whole machine, I mean, the whole organism to a machine to see how simple algorithms run the whole thing, but there is nothing that isn't sentient. Even atoms are moving, the particles are moving. Everything is made of that intelligence, of that aliveness. So even a machine, the most mechanical machine, is actually a transformation of that energy.
Like another title of a book, Bob's, One Essence, One Energy, expressing, experiencing, and appearing as everything. And it is experiencing and expressing and appearing as you. Experiencing and expressing through you, as you. It's experiencing itself as the seeing, as the hearing, thinking. And not feeling so wonderful. Exactly. Well, we might just get you the apple crumble or something. Sorry about that. No, it's okay. It's okay. I'm just re-adjusting some of the medications. It will be better. It will bounce back. It always does. It must. And anyone? Would you like to add something? Jacinta, you have the mic. Me? Yeah. I just, I love what Bob says about what's wrong now, if you don't think about it.
But also the cause and effect, which I think you were saying. Really, it's just the mind that plays tricks on us all the time. And most of my life, I was always criticizing myself, but there was no self. And the more you see that you are, there's no you, but the cause of all your thoughts are creating something that doesn't exist. So, yeah, life is much, and it's much more freer when you do let go. Because, yeah, I love the freedom today. I have much more, I mean, thoughts will always come up. And things that, you know, freer today than what I've ever been in my life.
And that's saying something. So, thanks. That's the testimony. Beautiful. Thank you. And can I just say, there's also just so much energy used in keeping your constructs together. No wonder the world, everyone's always tired, because we're so busy keeping our constructs alive by thinking about it and everything. It's just, it's a lot. It's a lot less tiring to just let it go and let it be. So much more energy. Yeah, I know, it's just free. I mean, I know that, you know, I am, I've got a big birthday this year. And I feel much younger now than what I've ever been, even as a kid when I was under stress.
I just, it's freedom. Yep, thanks. You must not sneak out too far because we're going to celebrate you. And thank you, by the way. Dinner's away. Dinner's away. And Jacinta is doing a wonderful job with managing everything. I'll send him the invoice in the mail. There's no more. No more. Do they exist? No. Chips in the mail. Go on. Yeah, it's really that simple. I mean, you know, what Bob was saying, because that imagined self, that dreamy little entity, somewhere in the head or higher, or heart or throat or wherever you imagine that center to be, that imagined driver that has the free will and make decisions, choices, thinks, thoughts, whatever the image of that alleged entity, alleged separate entity is.
It has been placed and rehearsed for a lifetime. It has been reinforced by everyone we admire, the great celebrities we admire, great philosophers that we admire, the parents, the schoolteachers, the leaders of the country or religious leaders. There is the reinforcement of that imagined self. It's almost inevitable that the child, the newborn innocent child who is born without any center and any self-concept will be brought into it and conditioned into believing to be separate self and suffer the consequences. But if you see the whole game, if you see through the whole game from the life's perspective, there's nothing wrong. It's actually a brilliant setting. How could there be an awakening?
What from if there wasn't a dream of separation? And cats, like that beautiful little thing on Julia's lap, it does not, look at her, she does not need to awaken. She's never fallen for the dream. As far as we know, cats do not have the capacity to use the symbolic language and to imagine a symbol of themselves as separate entity. So they can't awaken. They are in natural state. Like Buddha was asked question whether the dog has Buddha nature or whether dog or Ramana Maharishi claimed that his cow has awakened. Or had the great and achieved the enlightenment as if there was something to achieve.
Can they ever achieve anything? Is there anyone to achieve anything? Is there an entity that can be liberated or achieve something or the other? Because if there isn't one, there is nothing to achieve. There's no enlightenment to be had. The natural state shine forth all the time. Maybe seemingly and only seemingly veiled by the idea that this is not, I am not that. I have to join with life. I have to liberate myself from being an entity. That I can never get liberated because it's not real. It hasn't been, it doesn't exist. It hasn't been bound. Realizing that the presence that you are is already infinite and unlimited.
Unless you put a concept. Of boundedness and limitation. But if that concept is seen for what it is. Just a concept. And moved aside. Life doesn't have to. The miracle of existence. The radiance of life doesn't have to be ignored. It can be appreciated. It can be self-aware. And that's the only awareness and the only awakening from the idea of being separate. That that can ever be. And there is no I that awakens. There is life itself. Which sees clearly without the veil of translator. Of that mind which stands in the way and interprets. That this is my presence. This is my suffering. This is my idea.
My karma. That crap goes to the rubbish. And you are one with life.