The dream is not a problem. Sailor Bob and friends. 7 Jan 2024

Lays and Amir. Carolina, Raymond, Jor, Mahi, Julian, Rose, Linda, Shieland, Liz, Anjan, Will, Strabo, Vikram, Jim, Lockie, Sarodia, Jack, Igor, Charles, Jamie, Ben, Liga, Catherine, Adrian, Anita, Dean, Sestinta, Michael. Yatalia. And Nisha. Yes. And, and, oh. And we're gonna... Thank you, darling. Great to see you all. Thank you. Thank you. What we talk about is non-duality. One without a second. And, uh, it's the one life, the one essence. And you notice the difference. In this room an hour ago, there wasn't very much, didn't seem to be very much life in it. The people gathered here, and the voices, the sounds, and the words, emanated the room, became charged with that life essence.

And it's recognised and resonated with you. You see the difference, you know the difference. It opens you up and you want to talk to one another and see that. And when we isolated ourselves as a separate entity, an individual, well, there's a lot of suffering going on there, miserableness, and anxiousness, and the descriptions, and words we're using to describe ourselves. And what do they say when one or more are gathered together? Well, there I am in the midst of it. And that I am is the sense of presence. Each one of us knows I am. And when that I am seemingly expressing through the many, it can be very, very powerful.

And realise it is the one power. It's a power on its own if it's recognised or understood. But we've got the idea we are separate. We are individuals. We are these persons. And what brings us here? Well, innately, the people that come here are recognising or resonating that there's something a bit more than what they've grasped or understood out there in the world. And they open up and it brings you to where you need to be to recognise. And if that recognition or recognising, as the Buddha called it, the cognising emptiness. We think we cognise the emptiness. It's got nothing to do with the we or the I at all.

It is the emptiness itself. It's full of that cognising or knowing. And he made the statement and then it said emptiness is form. It points out that the forms can be nothing other than emptiness. So you and I are all patterns, shapes and forms. And the furniture and everything else in this room are patterns, shapes and forms. What are we all appearing in? What's this manifestation appearing in? And they call it a phenomenal manifestation. A basic space of phenomena. The space, the base of it all or the space of it all is that emptiness. The cognising emptiness. It's why they call it one without a second.

And it needs to express itself so it appears in all this diversity as the different patterns, shapes and forms. different forms. But we believe that different patterns, shapes and shapes and shapes and shapes and shapes. This is I or me. A separate entity. And the sense of separation is isolation. It is loneliness. It's moved away from the singularity into the believed in many. And each one of us while we take on that idea that we are this person. We are this individual. We are this separate entity. Well that causes all the psychological suffering. The fear and the anxiety the stress the guilt the shame remorse all these things that come up in this pattern.

Which when investigated you see the pattern is not how it appears to be. Am I this person? Am I this body? Am I this mind? And it expresses as the thought I am. But where did that thought I am come from? It's a word that we picked up when the capacity of reasoning developed in us. Where did you come from in the first place? And you realise that there is only one essence as they call it one self one Atman one God if you like to use that term. We learnt the words I am when our parents we learnt names because of our parents fussing around us spoke the words and said you little Johnny or you little Gene and we needed to say well I am little Johnny instead of investigating and recognising what the ancient things tell us that I am is the one essence that's passing shapes and forms and expresses it at everything.

They call it God if you like but there's only the one God. But we've got a different concept and different religions and different traditions we've all got our different concepts and ideas what we believe this God is. God is. Instead of realising it is the basic space of phenomena the manifestation is a phenomenal manifestation and the definition of phenomena is that which appears to be. It's all appearing to be so and all appearing to be very real. But can you postulate or think of anything that is outside of space? Are you separate from space? Try and separate yourself from the space. And what is space?

Can you find a centre to it? Do you find a comfort to it? Does it have any beginning or any ending? It can't have any beginning or any ending. Space has no patterns no shapes no forms it is no thing. And all this manifestation including you, me and every other pattern are things. all the content of space the no thing. Can some thing come from no thing? It can't. It can't. So though it's appearing as things all this manifestation is like that space like awareness. Now that awareness as I say is suffused with that knowing or life or intelligence which are called awareness which is prior to consciousness and the consciousness appears on awareness and we take all the words and names and shapes and forms and we've got this manifestation.

But is anyone unaware right now? Because that's how they explain non-duality. Sat, Chit, Ananda Nama, Rupa five factors Sat is existence Chit is consciousness or Nanda Nanda Nanda is loving to be. So with anyone who is not existing right now and you realise no, I am existing you can't negate it you can't deny it. Anyone who is unaware you realise no, you're not unaware so you have to be aware you can't tell me what awareness is but you know for certain that you are not unaware that you couldn't say do or be anything if that awareness wasn't there. And awareness of being is the bliss or knowing about beingness awareness of that beingness you call yourself a human being we call God the supreme being take away the word human take away the word supreme try and negate your beingness without the word.

So we think we've got to become something we hear about these so called realised beings saints, sages, saviours and seers because they've understood it people set them up as saints, sages, saviours and seers when they're just pointing to the truth and so they set up some of them form religions around it and get locked into the conceptual religious beliefs and miss out on the simplicity that there is only life there is only the one life there in the Nisargadatta tells her that when he says there's only life nobody nobody who lives a life and we've got this idea we are this body mind but you are the life that is fashioning shaping patterning and forming as this body expressing as this body as expressing patterning shape and forming and everything else in this manifestation which is appearing as things patterns, shapes and forms but it's still that no thingness or space like awareness awareness like space so in the recognition that I am that essence and takes away a lot of these concepts the idea that I am this body I am this mind I am this person but innately when you look at it and investigate are you the body are you the mind are you the person you say my body you say my house my car my coat and you know you are not the house you know you are not the car you know you are not the coat well maybe if you are not the body either and when you look at it you realise it's true what is this body made up of made up of elements air earth fire water aren't these elements all around you right now you are breathing air there is water in your body water in your body your body is 60% water the earth we are on the earth we are out in space all those elements are there and all those elements can be broken down into subatomic particles and those subatomic particles can be broken down into pure energy so all this body is a vibrating pattern of energy it's not the person we got the idea this is me where did you come about well where did that life that is expressing as you where did that come from go back as far as your parents your father and your mother that animating life essence in your father enable in that pattern through the food he is eating the air and prana and the breath he is taking enable in that pattern a little microcotic called a sperm to form you can't see that sperm with your naked eye you see a blub a goo but put it under a microscope you can see there is life essence you can see there is life in it it's moving around it's vibrating the same in your mother that animating life essence in your mother enable in that pattern an egg or an ovum another microscopic particle called the horn that sperm that egg attached itself to the wall of the uterus implying it was suffused with life or intelligence to do that it wasn't floating around accidentally or the lindani it's that self-thwarted the uterus and the sperm was the same it had the capacity of swimming to the oven it knew what to do and when those two came together that same life essence vibrating pattern shaping and forming brought those two together and forming the little embryo the little fetus which is what you are today what were you doing about it then what did you know about it then nothing at all but you were alive the breathing was there the heart beating was there but you had no words you hadn't learnt any words or language and that didn't come upon you until as that pattern shape and form the capacity of reasoning developed in it and grew and your parents fussing you around you started speaking and you learnt the words from them and you learnt the words I I am little Johnny or me and from then on we learnt other words and we took the word to be real the word to be the thing but is the word the real?

what's word? sound? voice? concept? concept? mind? but we got the idea I am this body I am this mind and my mind tells me this and my mind tells me that but show me this can call mind you're saying my mind just the same you said my body who? who is it that has the mind or who is it that has the body? is it the body itself? is it the thought itself? it's not but that body that thought and energy needs something to express through so it forms the pattern of the body it forms the trees the flowers the planets the stars the insects everything in this manifestation are patterns, shapes and forms which are nothing but vibrating energy appearing in that Atman or Self the One Self not a personal self the One Being the One Being that sets you to enter again being knowing and loving to be that beingness is suffused with intelligence it knows and it's not the I know this or I know that it is the knowing itself and that knowing and that knowing is loving to be knowing of us what we did if we can avoid it we want to continue this loving in us and we love to be but because of the way it taken on the sense of separation and the words we've learnt which are continually dividing and separating it it causes all the anxiety all the stress all the fear the misery is the Word tells you in the Bible in the beginning was the Word that's where it all begins when we picked up words from our parents because of the first couple of years of your life you had no words you're getting quite long quite alright without the Word you're being looked after by your parents mainly but you were living and being you couldn't say it was good or bad or anything if you're hungry you'd try if you're unhappy or something was wrong you'd try and if you're fed and looked after you'd gurgle and be happy but you had no labels or words to discriminate it with it was life itself functioning naturally and effortlessly and we turned the words we took the words we took the words when your parents told you little Johnny and somebody then asked you who you are well I managed to put that label on I'm little Johnny this is me we put that label on because we never look and investigate any further and so we carry on from there and we learn these words and the words we learn we look at the word is the word the thing well the word is not the thing take the word water drink it if you can drink the word the word fire cook with the word eat yourself with it burn yourself with it the word I or me do what you can with that what can you do with that when you're related to this conceptual image you try to do something with it you don't get too far because the thoughts keep coming up more words and concepts appear and the energy of belief goes into them instead of recognising that you are prior to the word and how would you recognise that well realise for the first couple of years of your life you had no words and yet you were living you were being and you knowing that you were living one day you learnt words and carried on took the word to be real instead of then being you had what these words told you you thought you needed to become something if I do this and do that I will become something but becoming implies a future time and there is no such thing as becoming because when you investigate time you see time itself is a mental concept also is there a past if I don't think about it we'll have a look at that for a minute if there's no past if I'm questioning can I say there's a past without a thought well I can't but then I'll think I was living the past I'll try and live yesterday yesterday yesterday might have been pretty good it might have been horrible go back and try and live it you realise you can't live it you can recall some of it but when are you recalling it you can only recall it right now you can't go back and live yesterday what about the future you got a future you know later on today I'll do this or do that or become this and become that you can anticipate and imagine the future but anticipating imagination is not living it and you won't know the future until the actual living of it goes on and it is a spontaneous functioning it comes and goes because it has no duration past and future are duration they're time when does now begin well have a look try and grasp now I've got it it's gone I've got it again it's spontaneous it's got no duration it doesn't last but past and future they come and go seemly they're not the reality when people like Christ tell you I am the way I am the truth I am the life people think he's talking about himself he's talking about that sense of presence the knowing that you are that think expresses through the mind as this thought I am what is I am well it is the life of me it's the intelligence energy it's the beingness it's the knowingness it's loving to me it is not the person the person is just another word we've learnt another concept coming from persona the mask so when we take the person we've got this conceptual image this mask of concepts I am Bob the Australian the good fella not so good I like this I don't like that all the concepts that come along with that and all those concepts are words and none of those words are the real are the thing they're all descriptions and beliefs when you look at the description you realise the description is not what we're describing the description can never be the described and we're trying to describe something now but it's not its description but if you have a look into it and see for yourself that prior to the words prior to the thoughts you can't say I am not there is a knowing there that I am and what is that I am it is a sense or the recognition that there is a a presence awareness here not a future awareness or a past awareness a presence awareness happening presently and Shakespeare tells you that he says there is nothing either good or bad but thinking makes it so and way we way tells you nothing why are you unhappy because everything you think everything you say and everything you do is for yourself and he says there isn't one and look at that isn't that so what will I do next or will I become this or what will I think of me all for this believed in self and then the story starts if I do this this will happen or something else will happen and we form a conceptual image and that image becomes the story the real, the word but where does the story take place in?

doesn't it take place in time? if you recognise time as a mental concept where does that leave you? leaves you back with that presence awareness non-conceptual ever fresh presence awareness with non-conceptual it means no mental constructs that's all a concept is is a mental construct and we've got all these concepts or the words to be the real and what do they tell us? the great mantra is I am that what's the that are you talking about? we think it's this person when we learn that I am Bob in Australia and the parents tell us we've taken that to be real that's what we think I am I am this person the thatness the thatness they are talking about is the thatness that you know already as everything because you say that's the chair I am sitting in that's the room the chair is in that's the space in the room that's the tree that's the flower that's the planets that's the stars everything is that the one essence expressing a period is everything but we take the words to be real put that's the bird that's the beast put the concept on the label on and divide it up and the one becomes the seemingly many and the one becomes the seemingly many and it becomes related to me the conceptual image and it's only me that can be fearful it's only me that can be unhappy only me that can be depressed isn't that so?

if you're angry is it the other person who's angry or is it you that's feeling angry? you that's feeling angry it's only always me the other happiness might be there you can't claim it as yours so it's only when you claim the me there you claim this fear this anxiety this stress this guilt this fear this unhappiness all our psychological problems come about that we are this separate entity now a belief is not the actual look up your dictionary look up the word belief in your dictionary and you'll see the definition of belief is an unquestioned acceptance of something in the absence of reason we haven't reasoned it out when our parents told us a little Johnny did you work it out then say I'm not little Johnny yes I am Bill whatever my name is so an unquestioned belief that I am this person a sip of coffee yeah acceptance of an alleged fact without positive knowledge or proof there goes the other one there goes the other one that I am in the next one in the next one in the next one in the next one in the next one in the next one in the next one in the next one in the next one in the next one So, when you ingress to that question, it all points back to that one reality, the non-dual, pure intelligentity, which patterns, shapes and forms and experiences as everything.

Now, you see this room full of so-called others, but it's the same life that's expressed through each and every one of us. And you are that life. Now, you might believe you are separate, or you're different from this one, or you haven't understood it, or haven't grasped it, or they're better than what I am. That's all conceptual image we take on Lord and believe. But they say, know the truth, and the truth will set you free. What are you free from? You're free from the belief that you are this individual, you are this person. And if you're not this individual, you're not the person, what are you?

I am that. I am that reality, which patterns, shapes and forms, there's myriads of different patterns, shapes and forms. But in essence, is the absolute. Now, the absolute, what can you add to absolute? Not the least thing, because it wouldn't be absolute if you could add anything to it. What can you take away from absolute? You can't take anything away from it. It wouldn't be absolute. It's going to stop me talking. No, no. It's a cough lulling. So you can't add anything to it. You can't take anything away from it. And if you realise that you are the absolute, who could ever be superior to you?

We've got this concept that I am this individual, I am this person. He's better than me, or I'm a lot better than he is. Well, what's that? Who can be ever superior to you? No one. Who can be inferior to you? No one. And what would you want from anybody else? Not a thing. Because it's absolute. It's there for you already. It's yours. But we don't realise that. And so we're looking to try and become the absolute. Not realising that becoming implies a future time. It's not being. Being is the immediacy. Becoming doesn't happen. We think it does, but it doesn't. So you are that pure being.

So trying to set up a kind to become the absolute. If we do this and do that and practise this. What do we do? We get involved in all the mental constructs. And the story we've got about ourselves keeps going on and on. Becomes worse. Brings up the fear. The anxiety. The misery. It's only me that can be unhappy or fearful. Me is the cause of all my psychological suffering. And the effects of that cause are the fear, the anger, the depression, the guilt, the shame, the jealousy, the envy. All those things are the effects of the cause. And that's what so-called karma is. Cause and effect.

If I ask the simple question, Can there be an effect if I'm not relating it to a cause? Well, ask yourself the simple question and look at it. Where can the effect lodge if it's not relating to a cause? The cause of something is false. There is nothing to relate it to. And relationship, remember, is duality. Relative to. And we've got this idea sewn into our heads of all this relativity. And especially the male fear of relationship. So the real life is that life or that love in action that you naturally bring together. But when you get the concept and idea of it, you get full of lust.

You want this one and that one and the other. And you're not satisfied with the natural sense of well-being and the love that comes up and expresses through you. And allowing it to be. Getting a taste of your true nature. That which is breathing you. Beating your heart. Growing your hair and your fingernails. Digesting your food. The natural beingness. The sense of being well. Of nothing wrong anymore. Well-being. Being right now. Not wanting or will-being. That's what has to be recognized. And a lot of you here do recognize it. You wouldn't be here if you hadn't looked into something other than some of the things we were taught in childhood and believed to be real.

Gods and devils and different things. Look at some of those stories that tell us. Story of Adam and Eve, for instance. In paradise. The Garden of Eden. What did they do? They ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. In other words, they learnt words. As soon as they learnt words, they kicked out of paradise. And isn't that what's happened with us? Until we learn the words. Everything's alright when you learn the words. If I'm not good enough or I'm fearful of my name. So that's what we grew in with. In the beginning was the Word. The Word was God. The Word was God.

That's all that God is is the Word. And all things were made by Him. By the Word. Isn't that so? There's nothing you can speak or say that you haven't got a word for. All things were made by Him. And there was nothing, no thing made that was made without the Word. And we've got words on everything. Space, trees, flowers, birds, animals. We discriminate it with the Word. Instead of seeing it's the one life. The one intelligence entity. The one being. And the being is not becoming. It's not what was. It is being. Human being. Human being. Right now. You believe you are a human.

Take that word human off. If you believe in God you'll call it the supreme being. Take that word supreme off. Try and separate your beingness without those words. Can anyone in this room jump up and say, I'm not being right now? You can't. You can't deny your existence. That's another name for it. Resistance, consciousness, bliss. Satya and air then. So what are you seeking? Realize what you're seeking you already are. And they tell you that in the scriptures. What you're seeking you already are. And the search itself becomes the problem. Recognize that and see it as the truth. And see what falls into place then.

And it'll bring about the changes that are necessary. So that's basically enough from this particular pattern. So you can carry on from here. And those of you that know it, let somebody know about it. Talk and tell it. Because somebody else might hear it in different ways, the way I'm saying it. Which might ring a bell with them. And that's what's got to happen. If it's got to resonate with you. In your words, in your way. And that's how it will. Some of you might have doubts or questions. Well, don't hesitate to ask them. Because until the doubts are cleared away, that suffering is likely to be there.

So, where are you going? Hi, everyone. And then, hello everyone online who's with us. We have 20 plus people. And we have a couple of comments. A lot of good morning messages. And Laura who says, I love Bob's message. No guru. He won't have it. Which is why it's sincere truth. And yes, that's really worthy of appreciating. That he doesn't claim anyone being superior or inferior. Everyone is equally here, equally aware of presence. And that's also what very often the search is about. People are there looking for God. Or they're looking for themselves. Or they're looking for peace. And what he said, what you're looking for, you already are.

So, how are you God? Omnipresence, omnipotence, omniscience. How are you that? See where is that true. Or looking for oneself. Where and when can you ever experience not being present? So, you are the all-presence. Whether you call it my presence or omnipresence or God's presence. It doesn't matter how you call it. But it is experiential. Every moment. Every experience. There is people even joke, you know. You're running away from something. You're taking yourself with you. The presence that you are. The existence that you are. Or the peace. Looking for peace. Where see what obscures the peace. See what stands in the way of the peace.

And then you will realize that peace underlies everything. Even the obscuration. So, what you're seeking, you already are. Inevitably. It is just a matter of recognition of what is already so. Because if it wasn't, as Bob says, if there was something to gain or something to find, what would that be? Other than experience. That starts at some point in time and ends some point in time. So, it is an illusion. It's a phenomena. Every experience, no matter how pleasant. No matter how blissful. If it has, if it is limited to, oh yeah, it's not here now, but it may be here tomorrow. It's not worth it.

It's not reality. It's part of Maya. So, if we are not looking for any experience or any supreme state, but are looking to recognize what is always and forever present, right here, right now. Where is the looking to be happening? Not in the concepts, not in the mind, not in the passing states or passing concepts, but what underlies it, what is undeniable. So, thank you, Laura. And we have greetings from Queensland. And Saul says, thank you, Bob. Yes, it will bring about the changes that are unnecessary. It happens spontaneously. Recognizing life in all thy ways, how everything happens spontaneously. And that's it for the online comments.

So, anyone would like to start the conversation or ask something or highlight something or contribute to the meeting? I'll start. Yes. I just want to say that Bob, who lives in present moment, is forever youthful and ever alive. The aliveness is ever-present. Absolutely. It's so obvious when you're in his presence. That's lovely. Thank you. Now, dear, you. I don't know. Bob, in the spiel, you spoke a lot about, you often speak about the emptiness. And you describe it in many ways. And how does someone recognize the emptiness? So, if you can recognize the emptiness in all things, you recognize the emptiness in this idea of a me.

So, how does... Or, if you recognize the emptiness in the me, there is no me, then you can see the emptiness in all things. Because they're all the same. They're not separate. All the things and the me are one. How do people recognize... come to recognize this, Bob? What's the very first thing you see? Space. It's obvious to every... Like, no one can not see the space. That's... That's the first thing that you see. Yeah. But... You're not used to... recognizing or saying anything. You can... That's one of the conceptual images that are appearing in space. You don't notice... The most obvious thing... is space.

That's why they call it, the basic space, a phenomenon. It's like the movie screen. Everything. The movie appears on the screen. You can be... All sorts of things happening on the screen. Is the screen corrupted or contaminated by anything that appears on? No. So, it's not... Is the space ever contaminated or corrupted by any of the earthquakes or tsunamis or anything, the wars and everything that's appearing on? It's not. Space is no thing. It appears as everything though. Patterns, shapes and forms. Like shadows. So, who is seeing... What is seeing this no thing? It's pure seeing. What's your next thought going to be? The thought comes up, I think.

And you've formed a subject as soon as you say, I think. But... Can there be a thinker without thinking? No thinkers. Thinking or vibration happens, which we call thinking. Or we call it seeing. Seeing comes up, we call it seeing. We call it hearing. I see, I hear. As soon as we put the eye on, we form the subject. No eye. It's pure functioning. Seeing, hearing, tasting. It appears to be so. Nobody's there. See those windows there? When the sun shines through, then the eyes of the country of the mist of only four today. They... That and the white... It's not there. It appears to be there.

It seems to be there. It's not there. They're a tour. It's all I saw in the same time. It's to go. It's a rain dollar, this guy. It's one point of the rain dollar. It appears to be there. It's not there. It's a million. It's a whole lot of things. It seems to be there. It appears to be there. The paint. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more.

It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. It's a little more. So, The train was in the middle of the night. There were hills and mountains, and there were two. And that train was going to wake up and it was all down. It all disappeared. What you know, the way it happened this train. That train was going to wake up and get the luck, and then I was going to wake up and get the luck.

In other words, it was going to have his milk. He said, wake up this train, continue. We were back up the night before, so he didn't say, to his ideas, he said, get rid of the meat. This is the waking dream, don't they? The guy that tells him, the dream will turn the poor world. He says, stop waiting for a day. The dream won't look at, sir. He said, love one's health, not the other. He said, love all the world, and the rest will be done. He said, you know, he's done in 50 years. He said, I have it for myself. This is quite incredible, isn't it?

Each sound is actually empty as well. If you break it down, you talk about the sub-atomic party. This infused energy or knowing what's going on, intelligence, is actually empty. Yes, very much. It's like nothing is recognizing itself as the nothingness, appearing as everything. It's just like incredible. And the first line in your book is like, keep seeing that... There is nothing that sees. There's no, yeah. Yeah, there's nothing that sees. Or the thought I see can't see. It's like incredible. These pointers are so good, Bob. Like, all of them. Like, every single one of them. Like, and, yeah, they can produce like a really profound change.

But I don't understand, I have no idea of the change that goes on or what's actually really going on. Like, no one really knows anything at all. There's no kind of knowing on that level of intellection. Anyway, I've said enough. Thank you. That's beautiful. Yeah. Yeah, it's all, it's all, um... I don't even know why I'm getting all upset here. I'm not. I wonder if, maybe I am. Thank you. Yeah, you're really one of the best dreams I've ever had. Or didn't have. I don't know. Have ing. Thanks, Bob. Beautiful spiel as always. I think what I was noticing on this, not a path or whatever, but the emotions are actually even deeper.

Like, um, I can feel more deeper sadness and tears and I can feel more deeper bliss and happiness. Like, I'm actually feeling more in this process and it can just come on randomly. Like, that's the mechanics, that's the human operating system and it's, it's been cleared a lot more to, to do that and feel that and no judgement around any of that. Like, sometimes I'll just break out in tears for no reason or there'll be an immense gratitude and love that all shine through in different, or you know, it could be anger or whatever. I know that's all labels, but this stuff is just going to come out deeper.

Um, and just one other thing I was going to say, um, like, I like to see this as a revealing, this whole thing as a revealing. So it's about, um, clearing or getting, removing all the stuff that blocks the love and the light that I am. And this is one modality that can help clear a lot of that illusionary stuff to reveal more of what is already there. And, um, life or God can sometimes put different people in my path that do another piece of work and, and clears more old stories or whatever. Like, the other day, a deep story, um, from childhood around, there's something wrong with me.

You know, I'm not enough. There's something wrong with me taken on by the child at a pretty young age. But I've come into this world already complete and clear and full. But at some point that story is attached. And so that needed to be investigated and looked at and, and revealed and, and let go of. And the hurt came up and then there's more light comes out. So, I don't know if I'm saying it in the way I really want to say it, but that's what it feels like. So if whatever comes, life can put stuff in your path that is going to continue to help that process grow if you're open to it.

Yeah, that's all it is. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. It's for a little. So, I can do a little. it's for a little. A little. A little. in a little. I can do a little.ivo.

I can do a little. Thank you. Can I speak up? Okay. All right. I feel like I'm in a class. All right. Thank you, Bob. That was so beautiful. It was my first time here today and that was very, very enlightening. My question is like the more I think about it, so our true self that we are. So I feel like you told today about how we are just a construct of words. It feels like that I've built a character in my head that I think I am and that has like so intertwined itself with the true self that it's just added layers upon layers.

So is the path like, is our sadhana to get rid of those layers? Am I right in understanding it that way? Just these layers that I've built upon and covered the true self with it. Tells it, tells in the end of the evening, the more I do, you talk and think about it, the further away you wander from the truth. So stop talking and thinking and there's nothing you'll not be able to know. Pull all that out and try it out, test it. See if it's true. We're not creating stories. See what happens. Yes. No, yeah, that makes sense. But I know like when it's something bad, I mean, it's not a very good feeling.

It's easier to get rid of. But when it's something so intense, like, you know, loving somebody or appreciating, I guess, when you see a like starry sky, it's a little harder, I guess. I get it's the more beautiful things that it's like, you know, not, it's a little harder to like not, you know, I don't know if it's the right or but attach yourself to it. It's a lot easier with bad feelings than you can say, I'm not that. But when it's something beautiful, it's like, okay, it doesn't really, yeah, that's, I hope I made sense. See how it works is something comes up and you like it.

Yeah. I say something comes up and you like it. How do you know? Well, I've had this feeling before and it's good. And we don't want the things we like to go away. Not really, no matter how much you love them, how much you want to keep them there, they're going to change. You don't want it to change, but it's going to change. So what do we do? We resist it, trying to keep it there. We resist it from going. And resistance is conflict. And conflict is uneasiness or disease. The other way around, something comes up that you don't like. Oh, I shouldn't be thinking that, that's a bad.

What do we do? We resist that. Try to push it away. So whichever way you look at it, there's resistance, conflict and disease going on. Leave it as it is, unaltered, unmodified, uncorrected, it changes by itself. And at no point it means that you won't be capable of loving your partner or your children or the beauty or the starry night or... It's just a narrative that creates the reference point of me. That this is I love the rainbow, I love the cat or something. That narrative is unnecessary. When you look at the wildlife, the natural world, you know, swans or elephants, they join for life.

But it is not a story, a narrative of my partner, my possession or my attachment. No, it's just a natural, natural joining. Like the river joining with another river or with the ocean. So this, there is no sacrifice required. It doesn't mean that once the truth is recognized underneath the appearances, the appearances will lose their beauty. Absolutely not. The pain is still painful and the pleasure is still pleasant. It's just no narrative going and referencing it to the me. This is my pain, it shouldn't be there. Or this is my pleasure, I need more of it. Yeah. Is it like right to think that it just exists, the pain exists, it's not my pain, but it's just there like...

Just intuitively like it's another object, the pain is just there? It's just like you see the animals experiencing pain. No resistance. Yes. They are good teachers, animals. Yes. All right. Thank you so much. Thank you. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So, I'm just basically questioning the very basic, you know, assumptions I make, because I think that's where the identification is, is there. And so one of the basic assumptions I was actually challenged by someone that is clear and asked this question. And for example, he asked, when you feel your feet, do they feel like the sensation of feet?

Like down below, like below where you are? I said, yes. And then, like, and then I thought later that why do I feel like that? Is it like, is it because I feel myself being in the head? Which I think I do. That's why feet are down there. I don't know. How do you guys feel your feet? Is it down there? Or right here? Or right here? Or? Well, first of all, if you already have someone who is guiding you or mentoring you in particular way, it's probably healthier for you and for him to stay there. Okay. Really. I mean, there are different styles of pointing.

And if someone is taking you this way and it resonates, it may be the best for you to dig the well in one place. Because we can bring you another pointers, they all point to the same place. But they may seem contradictory and they may just confuse you further. Okay. So if you go that way, stay with that guy, follow him and dig deeper. And then after some time, if you see that it completely doesn't work and you can't actually see where he's taking you, well, okay, maybe that was just an obstruction. Because the experience, yes, you can tell that you can, anyone can say, you know, that light is further away than that light.

And that's natural. Or yes, my feet are further away to my nose, for example. But it is a subjective narrative that judges the sensations. Okay. So you can see the sensation is always happening here. And the narrative brings up the distancing it from that here. Because here is unlocated. That's right. And the distance is a simic location. But I suggest you stay with that guy because he may have a point somewhere. Okay. Thank you. And so just another question is, so I mean about distance, is it like, do you actually do you guys maybe I should I mean, this is something not I mean, I just heard it from other people on YouTube.

That they don't actually perceive distance as we do, like, you know, you guys that are clear, like basically, is it like you see 3D or? You want to imagine what we are seeing. You see, that doesn't work, does it? No, it doesn't work. Whatever people are describing, description is never described. Okay. This is pointless place I'm going, right? I'm going to be pointless. Imagine what did they mean by saying this, that or the other. Okay. But if you look at the pointer that Bob made initially, what you are seeking, you already are. So if you are looking for the change or shift in perception, you're looking for the experience.

Okay. Not for the truth. So if they see differently, that's their problem. They may have some sort of a, you know, separation issues. I see more or better or different than you do. Therefore, I will always be a guru. You will always be follower. Okay. We don't go there. This is not the style. You know, we are pointing out that you are already what you are looking for. Not that you will become when you learn to see 3D or 4D or 2D or whatever the concepts people may have about how different they are to you. But if you resonate with them, take it all the way until you see that that may be the direction you don't want to go.

And then when you clear about that, then you don't have to bring them here. And you can really fully listen to Bob. That's right. Because I constantly, I'm... Okay, this is very helpful. Because when I try to understand what they say, I'll go to my head. So I basically have to just investigate what is here rather than what they say. Right? Absolutely. That's what you're suggesting. Thank you so much. Absolutely. Especially when they bring up differentiation and separation. Okay. So another thing that came up... Sorry, I'm asking too many. No, no, absolutely. Like another thing that I don't know if that... That actually came up for myself.

Like I was actually going into emotions like, okay, when I'm sad, how does that sadness feel? When I'm stressed, how that stressful feels in my body? And then... Then I... Then I somehow, I don't know how it happened, but somehow something, I just got distance from it. Like basically, somehow it happened that I just was looking at it more from distance. So, okay, that's sadness going on and this is me looking at it. I can't describe it. Something like that. Mm-hmm. And then I thought, well, it's just nothing really. This is just a sensation that I'm calling it sadness. Yes. And... I mean... And then I thought, how come that...

If that's it, if it's just a sensation and a thought that labels it. Mm-hmm. So how come all of us... I mean, is sadness actually felt the same way by someone else? Again. You know? You're doing it again. Who cares? Yeah, I know, but how come we all call it sadness? I mean... Yes. How does it feel? How does it feel? We have certain social conditioning. We all have the facial recognition pattern. And we all have particular way of projecting our feelings outside. So when I was, you know, when I see someone screaming on the top of their lungs, I would project anger. And you probably would too.

What that person feels, well, who cares? They probably feel rushing blocks and, you know, breathing from the top of their lungs and maybe clenching teeth. And, you know, those are sensations that they're experiencing. And we were conditioned to label a particular set of sensations in a particular way. That's called socialization. Mm-hmm. But what the other person feels, how they, you know, the people who are actually misjudging the labels, they can sometimes misplace it. You can see and you can actually mistake the anger for frustration or the frustration for the disappointment or things like this. But what does it really matter? So the question is, yes, the comparison.

Is everyone feeling the same sadness? Is everyone seeing 3D or 2D or whatever? See where you are, you again separate yourself from the crowd and trying to join it from the position of separation. That's impossible. You can't get there. Am I the same? Am I okay? Am I just experiencing as the others do? And if I don't, how am I going to modify myself to fit in? You don't have to. You are the same life. Expressing through that pattern. Certain expression will be universal and certain will be completely unique. And that's perfect. Yeah, but where I was going with that was like, you know, when you say, Bob says, you are that knowing, which I'm not quite sure what he's pointing to.

But I thought, could that be that if we all experiencing a certain sensation and really, honestly, I've never really looked at my sensation of sadness before. How it actually feels. But all my love, I call it sadness and someone else also does the same thing. Yeah. And then I thought, well, somehow we all by nature know it's called sadness because how else we could know we're not in each other's head. So is that the knowing that Bob says? Like knowing of the sensations, knowing of, you know, you know where I'm going? Yes, I know what you're saying. And I do actually applaud you for realizing that the sadness is a label that you put on a set of sensations.

That's the good thing. That's a beautiful direction to go. Yeah. But there is even more primal knowing than the knowing of something, you know, like you have the seeing, the capacity for seeing and then seeing the lump, seeing a person seeing this thing that you see the thing of something is somehow the utilization of the capacity for seeing. And then knowing of something is utilization of the capacity for knowing. Like, you know that you exist, but can you say that I exist is an object of knowing? No, it's not an object. It's the pure knowing. It's the undeniable knowing. Within that you can also know about the weather, know about some news or whatever.

But the, the primal knowing, the, the basic screen for the knowing of, you know, like Bob says sometimes you have the awareness, which is potentially, potentiality for the consciousness, and you have the consciousness, which is actuality of the awareness. And that consciousness is a consciousness of. Right. But the awareness is even more primary to the consciousness of. But you can't objectify it. But you can't deny it. Okay. So there is no need to worry about it with the thinking, with dualistic thought, which will say, oh, is it this or is that? But yeah, keep investigating. Okay. And see, hit the wall with that. That's the point.

That's where the mind lets go and gives, gives away, gives up. When it repeatedly hits the wall, it can't objectify itself. The very thinking capacity, what we call mind, cannot be aware of the thinking capacity. It can see the thought of, but not the capacity itself. Okay. The source, the capacity. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I just want to say that again, there's no outcomes. There's no outcomes. Nothing can happen here. We line up our objective analysis and we say, okay, at the end of that, there'll be something that transpires.

If you really get it, nothing will ever transpire. Nothing ever happens. No. It's only the instantaneous realization now that you are a kind of organizational level higher than what you think. In other words, all my concepts are nothing. They're all empty. Don't you see that? Yeah. Yeah. Everything that I think comes to nothing. Because it's based on nothing, isn't it? Relative to what? Nothing. But that's okay. Yeah. That's all right. That's good. If we sit there for a minute and the impossibility of that, never being able to resolve one concept against another, you know, we can't ever do that. Can we? So, in this moment, we throw up our hands and say, this is impossible.

I don't know what to do. I don't know who I am. I don't know what I'm doing. Here I am. You know? And something else will kick in then. Something non-conceptual. Non-conceptual realization. I don't know if that makes any sense, but that'll do. I'll just have a little word about that too, Mitra. Please. Yeah. I think there's no denying, there's no rejection of an apparent experiencing or experience. You know? There is an apparent Mitra, and an apparent Bob, and an apparent all of us. The thing is, that operates at a certain level. And I think most of us humans get stuck thinking that that's reality.

When, in fact, there is something that knows that there's a continuous thing going on. There's something in the background, a kind of quality or an experience, I wouldn't say quality, a direct experiencing, which never changes. It doesn't get sad, it doesn't get happy, it doesn't, it's not worried by rain, it's not. But those things appear to be occurring, but there is this other thing within all of us, because we are us. It is the ground that there is a knowing of that which is never actually affected by that. Beautiful. So there's no rejection of it. Or acceptance. Or acceptance. Or acceptance. That's right. But there's no buffer to it.

That's right. Adrian introduced the topic of identification. One of the Christian mystics referred to his body as poor body donkey or something like that. My poor body donkey. Yesterday I took the donkey for a walk. And my predominant goal was 5,000 steps. And every bloody step there was this donkey, heavy, you know, weighed down, one foot plotting after the other. It was sort of like the old age is just saying, well, this is what it is, this is what it's like. And there's the identification was stronger than like stepping back into the awareness. But it was nonetheless, poor body donkey. From beginning to end. With a couple of sit downs on park seats on the way.

And then, yeah, there's the clarity, there's the freedom. And then you say, well, I've got to keep going and get up and pa-dum, pa-dum, step by step. Off it goes again. So I'm, I used to think I wasn't identified with the body until I went to the dentist. But now the, the body is pretty, a pretty strong identification. And I've got to line up to it and say, yeah, that's, it's there. How do I deal with that? Any ideas? No. I was just going to comment. I was talking about like, I think before you, something about the, I just like the metaphor of the movie and the screen.

You know, what you are is the screen that the movie appears on. And so the movie can be a horror movie or a comedy or a romance or a drama. And, and the screen isn't affected. It doesn't care. You know? And so what's happened sometimes is we identify as, we forget that we're the screen for a moment, but, but that's appearing on the screen also. So that's still not the screen. This is just the screen. And it's, um, it's very simple, I think. It makes it simpler too. It's so easy. Oh yeah. It's a movie. And wouldn't it be boring if it didn't have a little problem in the plot sometimes, you know?

It makes it fun. It makes it interesting anyway. Ten minutes to go. But at the same time, it doesn't matter. Ten minutes. Ten minutes to go. No, no, you continue. We still have ten minutes. I can, I... I just like to hear, Rob, would you like to comment on the thing that Rob has... How's Bob deal with his donkey? I'll get a car. It just can't happen to you and us. I already have a carrot. That's the pedometer app. I just wanted to add to your screen story that we're also the directors the actors and the audience he says experience is for the entity individual individual loves concepts and wants unnecessary experiences sadness and happiness are experiences to the individual can ever present truth be separate or individual it is ever present being thank you thank you Ross I think it's a really powerful and beautiful question that you've offered I'm not quite as old as you but I'm not too far behind and you know this last year I've had a lot of physical pain in the body and thankfully it's turned a corner but in terms of working with it if you like which I know it's all story but it seemed like the most painful story and and the way to identify was this constant narrative that it shouldn't be happening that this should not be happening here you know because of all the other you know the healthy eating and the walking and the da da da da da um and there were moments in that last year where the pain was exactly the same no relief from the pain but there were times when there was no problem and that was when there was no idea that it shouldn't be um and that is directly from you know having been introduced to Bob a very very very long time ago but it's such a beautiful question because their preferences still arise like the preference was yeah I didn't want it I wanted to be doing my yoga and you know all the things um and the body was expressing you know that this was not possible at the moment um yeah and I reckon Bob yeah the carrot's great but sometime it would be great to hear you talk a little bit more maybe about you know we don't often get to see beautiful shining 95 year olds and we all know there's been some times where the body's you know I'm sure it hasn't been your preference what's going on with the body um but it seems like there's not a lot of suffering that gets attached to it there no it's all transit it's all constantly changing but as result as Banki says everything is perfectly resolved in the unborn mind and nature resolves itself and that that attitudes I've noticed because yes especially over the last few months certain capacities body has lost like he used to walk fair distances now this is unavailable and of course it comes with well a pity that's but it it also comes with a yes aha this is how it is now yeah and in the pains the pains are come and go some pains can be medicated some hands and it again comes of course the preference is always for the body to thrive and to and to stay alive and and pleasure over pain but it also comes with aha that is how it is now so it is almost as if an attitude of a of a student rather than the than the owner of the life oh life is having it this this is what life is experiences experiencing aha so the life is telling telling the body what it is now now it is pain all right okay now it is pleasure aha all right rather than yes the usual narrative no this shouldn't be happening to me and this is wrong this is that is completely discarded and disbelieved so we could even sometimes it's not really funny to experience pain and to see the loved one in pain also but we can laugh at the freedom associated with the attitude towards it because it's we still remember how it was before when there was a lot of uh heavy psychological suffering coming from not accepting of what life is experiencing but being that life being on the same page with life if that's how life is is you know life's creating wrinkles or life creating toothache aha okay that's what it has i thought adrian you um spoke beautifully to this earlier about you know it seems like like there were times when there was this intense disappointment about how long this particular scenario went on but if there was a meeting of that disappointment as just fully like oh here's disappointment hello you know then it's it's what you were saying before when you really really looked at the sadness then it just becomes sensation and we can put a label on it if if a label comes up or maybe not um but the problem inherent in it is gone because it is just the disappointment but i loved what adrian was saying earlier about yeah those feelings of sadness joy loneliness happiness you know it's all still um seems anyway around here it all still comes and goes um but that extra you know the second arrow of shouldn't be should be different that seems to be um yeah what maybe um one of the many things that that bob has has pointed to yeah it just is it's not should be yeah just as all sorts of things have happened there you know you think you get the understanding it'll all be clear yeah but amazing what turned around and where before you want to top myself you know it was a natural curiosity well how's this one going to work itself out you know yeah yeah we were up on the farm we had the drought the flood the drought the flood had the ross river to leave it on top of it used to drive down to the mailbox thing and i wonder who's suing us now and they you know it didn't because i could hardly walk around then but that turned around amazingly you know got us down here back down here then we got a bit of money to get it we had the health food shop invested with a dodgy solicitor and lost the lot but that turned around too after a while because the law institute had a solicitor's guarantee fund and anyone who solicited they had to pay into that fund because they didn't want to get the solicitors a bad name so we got the capital back after a couple of years when they were there and what happened after that oh different different challenges everything life throws everything yeah it hasn't been just you know everything yeah yeah people betraying you like the closest ones and horrible things yeah and pleasant things wonderful things yeah all of it that darkness and night pleasure and pain but it works itself out i just finish up with saying some obvious things like when i'm in india there's a um in tiru there's a man who has no legs and he's on a wooden platform with but this man is on wheels and and through the rain everything is really himself around he has the most magnificent face it's always uh not always i have seen him in very difficult times in the rain and stuff but still he's he seems to always just be present still you know he's uh anyone who looks at him he's always very responsive he's very you know uh all us humans can have really uh you know apparently terrible things going on but the awareness can is always present and that really doesn't change never ever present never ever fresh every new year and he was an expression of that to some degree and i have a comment i have a comment from jb the i that was referred to at age five age seven at all ages in life is the same i or impersonal one i exist i am that is now and always been now it has never been blemished affected or hurt and it is not affected by emotions or thoughts it has never been personal can't describe it only am it it was here before words and concepts and still here unchanged and bradley says life is a full contact sport yeah just to finish up a little story i had a friend once whose wife died he's extremely upset i saw him for about a few hours he just killed up in a ball and he screamed and thrashed and did everything that was required of him emotionally just poured out everything came out and then he got up and said okay i'm right there and it went on he couldn't hang on to it no he was right in used it all up and the next thing happened thanks everyone thanks bobby thanks