Sailor Bob and the group. ...getting no-thing... 12 Nov 2023

What kind of knowledge is it? Navi? Navi. Jürgen? Jürgen, yes. Jürgen, Clip, Marty, Natalia, Pam, T-Ball, Ross, Chloe, Michael, Marty too, Tyson, Justine, John, Shara, Melissa, Chris, Adrian, Tess, Mistra, Christine, and Paul. I'll get your ears off. Thank you, darling. Well, for those of you here, what we talk about and point to is what they call in the Hindu scriptures, Advaita or nonduality. Nonduality, to translate it, means one without a second, not two. Absolute. Perfection. So I can't teach you anything. And I can't tell you anything. All I can do is point toward and ask you to look to where we're pointing to and see for yourself.

Because that's what needs to happen. There's nothing that anybody can ever give you. Nothing that you can ever get. Because if it's nonduality, one without a second, everything is that. And that's the great mantra. I am that. You are that. This is that. Everything is that. We all know that because we say that's the chair, that's the carpet, that's the tree, that's the flower, that's the bird, that's... Everything is that which we discriminate with the word. We put the words on, the label. And then we ask you to look into the word and see that the word is not the real, it's not the thing.

Try and drink the word water. Try and swim in it or drown in it. Take the word fire, try and cook with it or burn yourself with it. Take the word I or me. And when you investigate that, you'll see that's not what you really are. You're not the person. You're not the individual or separate entity that you believe yourself to be. Because as I say, it's one without a second, not two. So everything is already that. And so what you are seeking is what you already are. And recognise that the search is the problem. Because when you're seeking something, you believe that it's something you're going to get.

But you can't get what you already are. All that needs to happen is to recognise, recognise it. They call it a cognising emptiness. And the Buddha made the statement a couple of thousand years ago. He said, emptiness is form. And the forms can be nothing other than the emptiness. So what he's talking about, you and I and everything, other pattern and manifestation, are all forms, all pattern shapes and forms, all emptiness. And in the scriptures they'll tell you that also. They'll say the basic space of awareness. We hear that term, what do we think? You know? Don't realise what they're saying there. That the base of everything is that emptiness, a cognising emptiness.

Emptiness. Emptiness is form and a form is nothing but the emptiness. So, have a look at that. Can you get out of space right now? Can anybody think that they are not in space? Everything in this room and outside the room is in space. Space is no thing. Can you find the beginning to space? You can't look into it, you can't find the beginning anywhere to it. Does it have any ending? Does it have any shape? Or any form? It appears to have some but it hasn't. So, everything is the content of space. There is nothing you can postulate or think of that could be outside of space.

What would it be in? It must be in space. Space is empty but there is a cognising, there of that emptiness, a knowing of that emptiness. So, that's what we need to look at. We've taken on this idea that we are a person, a separate entity, an individual. Where does that word person come from? Just like the words, they say you can't drink the word water, you can't burn yourself with the word fire. Now, what's this word I or me? That we take to believe it's so. Maybe we're not this person. When you look into that, you'll see the word person comes from the ancient Latin language, meaning persona, a mask.

So, we've got this conceptual image or mask, which we believe we are and are functioning from that. Mask or conceptual image. Investigate. Have a look. How are you this body? How are you this mind? Well, everybody says my body. My mind. You say my coat. My car. My house. You know you're not the coat. You know you're not the car or the house. And when you look into it, you'll see that that's so. What's this body made up of? You'll see it's made up of elements. Air, earth, fire, water, space. Just like the elements around you. Separate yourself from the air. See how long it lasts.

Take the water out of your body. Your body's 60% water you wouldn't last. Take the body temperature of the fire. The fire. And when you look into it, you'll see that that's so. What's this body made up of? You'll see it's made up of elements. Air, earth, fire, water, space. Just like the elements around you. Separate yourself from the air. Take the body temperature of the fire. You'll soon get hypothermia and die. Get off the earth. Get out of space. When you investigate, you see you're not separate from those elements. All those elements can be broken down into subatomic particles. Into pure energy. So this body really is only a vibrating pattern of energy.

And it's transient. It's constantly vibrating, constantly changing. You haven't got the same body you walked into this room with. There are thousands of cells dying in it right now. And being replaced. And each cell knows what to do. A skin cell won't replace a heart cell. A brain cell won't replace a liver cell. Each cell is the fuse of that innate intelligence. That life essence of all. That pattern shapes and forms this pattern we call the body. Well, have a look at it. Where did you begin? You'll say, I began at birth. Can anyone of you remember your birth? You all say, a lot of people say they can remember the birth.

But nobody can remember their birth. But nobody can remember their birth because you didn't have any words as your birth. So how could you remember? How could you say I was born? And you didn't learn words until you were a couple of years old. Your parents fussing around, you're speaking. And the capacity of reasoning developed in that little embryo, that little fetus, and that little baby. And you learnt words. And we've learnt words and added words ever since and taking the word to be the real. But the word's not the thing. Just labels, images. So how did you come about? You believe you were born, you believe the sanity.

Where did you begin? Well, we go back to that father and mother. Your father and your mother. You seem to be coming from that, your mother. That animating life essence in your father, enable a little, through the food he's eaten and the prana and everything else that's functioning going on, formed a little microscopic particle called a sperm to form. That sperm was suffused with intelligence. With life, it knew what to do. And the same with your mother. That animating life essence in your mother, enable in that pattern another microscopic particle called an egg or an oven to form. That egg was suffused with intelligence. It attached itself to the wall of the uterus.

And the sperm being suffused with intelligence, swam to the oven and penetrated the oven, implying there was life and intelligence in it. When those two came together, that cell doubled and redoubled and formed the little embryo, the little fetus. Which is what you are today. What were you doing about it then? Nothing. Nothing. It was all happening naturally, effortlessly and spontaneously. Just the same as it is right now. Did you think about that breath you just took? Or did you think about expanding and contracting your heart? All these things are going on. They're happening by itself. But we've taken the belief that we are this person.

And for the first couple of years of your life, you didn't have any words. We didn't learn words. We were around about two, two and a half. Some of you might have been sooner. Some of it later. It depends on the life, the intelligence in the pattern that's expressing. And when the parents fussing around you, tell you, you're little Johnny or your little Betty or Billy, whatever your name is. And what do you say? Well, I am little Johnny. Or I am little Betty. So really, that sense of presence, that I am-ness, that is what it is. The sense of presence which expresses through the mind as the thought I am.

So it's just a natural expression. We didn't know it doesn't need any words on it to be. So you are that being. And you are knowing that being. And you are loving to be. And that's what Advaita is. Sat-Shit-Ananda. Existence, Consciousness, Bliss. The other two factors. Naam and Rupa. Name and Form. Anybody who is not existing right now? You'll say, no I am existing. Anyone who is not conscious or unaware right now? And you know for certain, no I am not unaware, I am conscious. Anyone who is not happy to be? Well nobody wants to be dead right now, no matter what trip problems are going on.

You still want to live. So, recognise you are already that. And the Naama Rupa, the concepts we've got about the body, mind. Naama is the body and Rupa is the form, the mind. Naama Rupa, they tell you clearly, is Maya. It's illusion. The pattern, shapes and forms are all illusion. And we pointed out before, it's a cognising emptiness. Emptiness is the base. The basic space, the phenomena, that's what they call it. What is the base? Something which everything comes from. Well, everything is in that basic space. You can't postulate or think of anything that could be outside of space. What would it be in? So, that's what needs to be recognised.

That I am that spaceless, timeless, bodiless, mindless, pure intelligence energy. The activity of knowing. That's what intelligence energy. Intelligence is knowing. You know this, knowing that, reasoning. Energy is a vibration. The activity of knowing. It's a vibrating pattern of energy. With patterns, vibrate patterns, shapes and forms into words, concepts, ideas. And the word is not the real. And they tell you in Buddhism, the great perfection is non-conceptual awareness. It's that awareness without any concepts. And the Buddha told you a couple of thousand years ago, he says, emptiness is form. Now, all these forms, you and I are forms, the rooms, the form, the carpet, the trees, the flowers, are all forms.

Emptiness is form, and he says the form can be nothing other than the emptiness. The mission of the children, the food, thearent, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food, the food This is what I am.

So that's what we need to look at and recognize and see that this body, mind, is a conceptual image. So seeing the body is nothing but a vibrating pattern of energy and the mind is the same and that is an intelligence energy of what was born. That sense of presence needs something to express through. In its unicity it can't do anything. It is perfect and I also call it it is absolute. Now nothing can be added to be perfect. It wouldn't be perfect. Nothing can be taken away from it. Nothing can be added to absolute. Nothing can be taken away from it. It wouldn't be absolute.

If you recognize that you are the absolute, what would you know? Can anybody be superior to you if you are absolute and everything else is absolute and it's only the one? There is nothing that can be superior to you. Can anybody be inferior to you? You can't put he's better than I am or I'm better than what he is or any of that without the concept. So nothing's superior, nothing inferior and what would you want from anybody else? Now again there is wars going on. People want to take this from somebody else or want to protect it from somebody else. All these wars going on in the different countries and patterns and personally there is all these arguments, shapes and forms, jealousy, and the unhappiness, depression, guilt, shame, remorse, all the psychological suffering is going on also.

All because we are relating to disbelieved in entity. So all our problems are relationship. Relationship is relative too. And there is no duality in non-duality. There is no relationship. It's all the one essence. It has to be recognized or recognized and seen through, question it and have a look and see that you cannot possibly be separate and apart from anything. Because it's all to be traced back to the great perfection which is non-conceptual awareness. No one is unaware right now. If you were unaware, the life would be out of that body. The awareness is there first. And awareness is prior to mind. Because that awareness was there for the first couple of years of life before you learnt words or thoughts.

What is this mind? What is this mind? We say we are this mind. Show me your think or mind if you can. You realize you can't show me anything at all that you can say is mind apart from thought. So what mind is a thought or thinking? And if you look at that, what's wrong with right now if you don't think about it? You can't say it's good, bad, pleasant or painful without a thought. But it's not the end of you without a thought. You go to sleep at night, what do you do? You gladly give up the mind. You gladly go to sleep. And that's not the end of you.

So you start to, though we believe it is. We must leave out of it. But it's not. So there's no beginning and no end. But it needs patterns, shapes and forms to express through. In its absoluteness, in its unicity, you can't say anything about it. So it patterns, shapes and forms, things to express through. As it's formed this body. And we are expressing and experiencing through that. If you investigate that, you'll see there's nothing there at all. Ask yourself what's your next thought going to be? Can you tell me? You can't. You don't know what your next thought is going to be. But the thought comes up, I think.

And as soon as that thought, I think, comes up, what have you done? You've formed a concept, a thinker. You believe that I think. That the thinking was there beforehand. I think this thought. And the thought you think has become the subject. The object, I should say. The thought I think is the thinker, subject. And the thought we're thinking is the object. So it's divided into subject, object. And thinking is always doing that. As Shakespeare told you 400 years ago. He says there's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so. When you look into that and see how you're thinking, you'll see you're thinking past, future, pleasant, painful, happy, sad, loving, hating, high, low, far, near.

It's always dividing into the opposite. And instead of saying, there's two ends of the one stick, two sides of the one corn. It's not divided at all. We're divided. And in that division, that sense of separation, we cause all our problems. For it's only me that can be unhappy. Only me that can be fearful. Only me that can be anxious or depressed. Me is the cause of all my psychological suffering. And the fear, the anger, the jealousy, the envy, the hatred. All those are effects of the cause. Now cause and effect, what's that? Cause and effect is what they call karma. Cause and effect. What happens if I ask the question, can there be an effect without a cause?

Well, if I'm not related to the cause, me, where can the effect lie? It can't land anywhere. So you can be free of all this psychological suffering and all the problems it causes and recognise what you're relating to. You're relating to this conceptual image, this pattern we believe we are. And that becomes the problem. That becomes the cause. If I see that the cause is a fiction and there can't be an effect without the cause, well where are these things going to lodge? Who's to be jealous? Who's to be envious? Who's to be unhappy? Who's to be unhappy? Without relating to the me, the believed in me or conceptual image.

How does that work? Well have a look and see. Something comes up and you'll like it. And the good things we want to keep there. We don't want the good things to go. We want to keep them there. We want to keep them there. We want to keep them there. So trying to keep it then, realise it's going to go, what do we do? We resist it from going. Try to keep it there. Fixate of it. Keep it there. Resistance is conflict. If you are resisting anything you're in conflict with it. And conflict makes you fearful, anxious, depressed, unhappy, anxious. Uneasy. Another word for uneasiness is dis-ease.

So there is resistance, conflict and dis-ease going on all the time. The other way around, something comes up that I like it. That I don't like, I should say. I do nothing like that I don't like. Oh, I shouldn't be thinking this, I'm bad, I'm a sinner. I shouldn't think that, that's a good one. What do I do? I resist that. Conflict again. Trying to escape from it. So that's what's happening in all my life. Resistance, conflict and dis-ease. Now what happens if I see and recognise that? And leave everything as it is. Without resistance. And seeing, when I put that resistance on it, I separate it.

There's me resisting that. But recognise the resistance and the conflict, it's still only expressions of that one essence. It's not two. Two sides to the one coin. Two ends to the one stick. There's no one in a stick, there's no one sided coin. It's all the one essence that patterns, shapes, forms and experiences everything. Like you've got a, you've got a bangle, bracelet and earrings, made of gold. Take that bracelet, bangle and earrings, what have you got? You've got gold. Instead of putting the labels on which separate and divide them. So, we start to recognise that the base of everything is the one. And it's not, there's nothing separate about any of it.

Have a look at the, in nature, that's where you get a good idea. Or, in nature, you realise the Earth's rolling around the Sun. This part of the Earth is facing the Sun. What is it? It's light. Daylight. The other part of the Earth, the other side of the Earth, is facing away from the Sun. What's there? Darkness. Does the Earth know anything about daylight and dark? It doesn't. But you see, when it's darkness, it doesn't fight with it. It is a knowing that it'll change by itself. So, the Earth rolls around, this daylight will, it's further away from the Sun, this daylight will recede and the darkness will form.

But they're not divided. The same with the winter, summer, seasons, tides. And the sun will be divided. And the sun will be divided. And the sun will be divided. And the sun will be divided. And the sun will be divided. And the sun will be divided. And the same with the winter, summer, seasons, tides, and all the rest of it, and not divided. And the other and the other one was going to go. And the other is going to go. And the other is going to go. And the other is going to go. And the other is going to go. And the other is going to go.

And the other is going to go. And the other is going to go. And the other is going to go. And the other is going to go. Have a look at the sun. The sun shines of itself. And then that self-shining, that radiance, that heat, what does it do? It evaporates water. You go outside on a cloudy day, would you say the sun's not in the sky? Of course you wouldn't, because you've investigated and know it's not so. But it seems to be so. Outside on a cloudy day, the sun seemingly obscured. But they don't recognise that the sun's not obscured. The sun will keep radiating and might cause the wind, it'll blow the cloud away, or bring it down as rain.

When it brings it down, condenses and brings it down as rain, well, instead of that condensation and cloudiness, it's now become something more solid. Rain. And that rain will flow back into the ocean, or wherever it was sucked up from with the radiance of the sun. And saying the same thing will repeat itself over and over. So it's always the one essence that's pattern, shapes and forms, experiences everything. And you are that essence. So you might understand, when Christ says, I am the way, I am the truth, I am the life, or the light. He wasn't talking about himself. He was talking about that sense of presence, that expresses through the mind as the thought, I am.

That sense of presence. And when you reinvestigate that, you'll see it's so. You are. It's that life. And the saga will tell you there's only life. There is nobody who lives a life. Life lives on life, and out of life, more life comes. And you know that, it's that life essence, that pattern, shapes and forms, that pattern, shapes and forms, your father and your mother, which was the life. And that life that came from them, was the same life, the same life that's in everything, that patterns in all the different diversity, of pattern, shapes and forms, to express through. And that's where you get all the different shapes and forms in this manifestation.

But it's the one life that's expressing and experiencing through it all. And I and you and everything else is that. Recognize that. And the doctor told you that, when he said that cognizing emptiness, it's the emptiness that does the cognizing or knowing. I might have said this before, I don't know, I might be repeating myself. He says that emptiness is form. And all this manifestation is that emptiness, which is vibrating in a different pattern, shapes and forms. And he says the form can be nothing other than the emptiness. And whether you believe it or not, if you start from the fact that you are that absolute, you are that pure being, it'll soon, you'll soon see through it because the other saying is the false cannot stand up to investigation.

And that's true. when you look into something and investigate it thoroughly, if it's not true, you'll soon find out. When you look into the spotty mind the same way, you'll see if it's true or not. You'll recognize the false. false. And if it's false, see the false is false, what have you done? You're left with truth. And what do they say? Know the truth. And the truth will set you free. It's not the concepts or ideas or recognize, it's knowing the truth. Recognize that I am that essence, that sense of presence. knowing that. Being, knowing, and loving to be. The absolute being. You've always been that, always will be.

And that's where the freedom, peace, and joy is. We go looking for it in the mind. But they tell you, and they tell you the truth, you'll never, ever find the answer in the mind. Because it's prior to thought. And ask yourself, pause the thought and see what happens then. And you'll realize thought has stopped. You don't disappear. The breathing hasn't stopped. The heart beating, the livingness is still there. But thought has stopped. So it's prior to the thought. And you'll never find the answer to the mind. They tell you that they call it the peace that passes all understanding. Why would they call it that?

Purely and simply because you can't grasp it with the concept with the mind. You can't understand it with the word. But the understanding or knowing will be there. Without the thought, without the word, I haven't stopped breathing. My heart hasn't stopped beating. I still am that pure intelligent sanity. The one without a second. And in that, the chatter that goes on when we're in these concepts all the time, creating stories and believing the story to be true, the stories drop away. And then what is there in reality can reveal itself and it does. comes up of itself. As the sargetown says again, realise you are dreaming a dream you call the world.

Stop looking for ways out. He says, the dream's not your concern. Your concern is you love one part of the dream and not the other. He says, love all of it or none of it. Don't divide it. Love all of it or none of it. And the rest will be done for you. He's pointing out that that life essence that you are knows what is necessary and knows what to do. It's a dream you call the world. So when I stop looking for ways out and recognise that it reveals itself. There's something else I was going to say that slipped my mind and the age isn't getting on here and I can't lose sight of things for a while and it doesn't matter.

And that's the matter. See, that's two different we see spirit and matter. We think they're separate. But spirit is essence like the essence of a good perfume perfume in the body. The perfume is not the essence it's not the fluid itself it's the essence of it. Well the essence that you are is spirit and when it becomes word it becomes material just like the water becomes ice becomes solid and spirit becomes matter and we've divided them again spirit and matter and when we lock it into the matter we're in trouble and you know that too. When something comes up and you're not really concerned with it you say it doesn't matter and when you say it doesn't matter have you concerned with it?

No, of course you're not. Well the other one is something will do something and you'll say that you think they think affects you and I'll ask you can I do this and you'll say I don't mind. If you don't mind you haven't put it at the concepts. So you see it's as simple as that and as easy as that but we don't recognise it in its true nature. We take it to be as we believe to be it's separate when we learn words we learn separation. Tells in the Bible in the beginning was the word the word was with God the word was God that's all that God is is a word.

All things were made by him by the word and isn't that the correct? Everything you say everything you do is with the words and there was nothing made that was made without the word. So there you are. That's what we pointed to and that's enough from the cat you take on and I think the point is that each and every one of you know it. Some of you mightn't have heard it before might resonate with it and it shows you that you're not happy with all the so-called a lot of the religious traditions have been corrupted and contaminated by people who think you've got to worship this and worship that.

that. So I say recognise the word is not the thing and settle down hear it and it resonates with you or know something tell us about it because you might express it in some way different to what I do and it might be something that somebody will hear and utilise but that's how it gets around through what expressions in the word and there's power in the word in the energy the energy in this room was brought in by each and every one of you it's not the same energy that was here when this room was empty each and every one added to it and there's a great power in this room if it's utilised and whichever way you're taking it from you're taking it from the idea of a person you can get into the conflict that that'll create and argue and fight or you can settle back into it and let it express it to you and there'll be a sense of warmth of joyousness and a love in that allowing it to be so away you go okay I can't tell how many people we have with us watching because it's just Facebook is jumping up and down but we have a lot of good morning messages and welcome to the whole group messages from people who are with us and we have a good input from Gilbert he says apparently the investment of belief in me has to resist what is being pointed out or it falls apart is it true is it just another story of me did the me ever really happen and Yelena says the prior beliefs just fall away no energy invested in them what used to make sense doesn't exist anymore amazing the belief have a look at that word belief the definition of belief is the unquestioned acceptance of something in the absence of reason acceptance of an alleged fact without positive knowledge or proof put your belief to that test see if they'll stand up yes so now we invite everyone to comment open up Bob says tell us what you know not necessarily a belief system that you subscribe to but what you really know what you really know without question deeply in your heart because everyone knows that they are everyone knows they exist and this is something that there is no separation in that sense of existence expresses through us equally there is no one who is superior or inferior to Bob with that knowing of existence there would be other things that you may know that he doesn't know and there would be things that he knows that you don't know but this is all concepts this is all stories we really that where there is no separation exists is in the direct experience of being and resting back into that direct experience of being now natural expression comes up and then we are on the same page because everyone even a little baby even prior to language the awareness of presence awareness of existence is there and it is so largely underestimated and ignored because the mind is such an entertaining tool it gives us so much thrill and joy imagination memories all of it is thrilling but if we put the heart into the mind and the stories there is a backfire there is a suffering caused by the assumed identity that everything is referred to and related to but if the heart rests back in that being now the stories can still be totally loved and appreciated they are still entertaining but the suffering is absent because there is no me created that takes credit for what's happening and takes blame for what is according to some social conditioning wrong or painful so anyone would like to start I was quite clear that it all starts the moment we start thinking we start talking when I was a little boy I remember a certain time between when I could think and when I couldn't think a little time and I used to say what am I behind everything and I used to see a little blue spark and I used to think wow but there was a time when I used to think what am I what am I and as soon as we start to learn how to think and we start to learn how to how to speak and we learn a name for every single thing that we see that's where it starts the problem starts and the stories begin and so I guess that's why they say you know you go back to being a child it's not just a 10 year old child it's actually a younger child and that where everything you would see everything you wouldn't divide it into all the different pieces of phenomena would you you wouldn't even know the names you wouldn't even know how to do it anyway that's what I've got to say thanks Dean thank you good yeah great I've been watching the mine the last week or so and it's track record for predicting stuff is zero out of a million it's can never be right it's always a really bad fortune teller it's all conceptual there can't be any truth in the mind anyway because it's a concept in itself but I like what Bob was talking about the base and it does like there's no separation but it does feel like there's a base underlying everything and like everything can fall apart on top of that and there's something that remains like anything that's not real can fall apart but there's a base that is still there it exists if that makes sense to anyone but it's sort of like you know the and I was thinking the mind is wrong even wrong about me it's created a fictional me that is doesn't exist either so it's such an amazing powerful function that it can come up with a dreamed person and that's taken to be what I am so and my only other thing was just like it's after looking at this for a while it feels like it's actually ludicrous to think that somehow I'm this separate entity operating on my own steam separate from life like when life is running through me and operating everything and yet the mind's thinking I'm this I've got to do it my way and do it this way and that sort of thing and thinks it's running the show when like it's clear there's no separate like I can't be a separate entity from the life that's running everything like if you look around enough anyway yeah that's beautiful that's beautiful that actually really corresponds with what Gilbert was saying here the belief in investment of the belief in me has to resist what is being pointed out or it falls apart can it really the belief in me can the imagined self do anything can it imagine self think or resist can it do absolutely anything so that would make it real but it isn't it can't if the resistance comes up it is not the imagined self or ego that is doing the resistance imagined self or ego doesn't do anything it's just a phantom it's just a rainbow in the sky it doesn't do it's the resistance coming up and the software the piece of program which creates that imagined self it also has a function to take credit for what is arising so now we are watching the functioning beautifully said like Adrian said watching the arising and watching the functioning of the mind taking credit taking ownership relating creating imagining the self this is I this is me brilliant and you can be mind blown by that functioning and free from its implications because when you are viewing it in a way that you're just witnessing presence for those amazing functions to play in front of you you're just amazed by it rather than rather than bound by it and Gilbert says again then is it true it is just another story of me is it just another story of me did the me ever really happen yeah did it really happen it seems to it seems like there is a me but is it really a me or is it just a sense of presence sense of presence that has been translated by the mind as this is my presence this is me the entity the body the mind the woman when those thoughts are gone the presence remains but now it doesn't have the story attached to it and it's free especially it doesn't have the story attached to oh I'm limited there is something wrong with me I'm in a wrong place I'm not getting something I need to understand more I need to get clearer or they have something that I don't those stories go away with the sense of being limitation being limited I the presence is unlimited and that's what you are and if the resistance arises in that presence it doesn't even need the label it's just the energy moving through the witnessing space and it's not yours it's not personal I had a lovely conversation yesterday with someone who joins our zoom groups and he is really smart he asks really good questions and very precise so the question and that question I could hear the question arising in the group sometimes okay so Bob do you see everyone as yourself or do you see everyone like as one do you you can't actually experience separation so I laughed and said well you see how subtly and how quickly the mind sits in and brings about a concept okay do you see the same or do you see oneness or do you see separation to have any idea of what is going on to have an idea of separation or to have an idea of oneness or to have an idea of viewing yourself you need that idea without the idea when all the ideas rest or are moved away and the priority is given to the direct experience of being ideas are not that attractive anymore who cares okay you can of course embrace some idea and enjoy the imagination and enjoy the expression of it but what for trading unborn buddha mind for a thought for the idea it's one of Bob's favorite quotes from Banky why exchange unborn buddha mind for thought not that anyone has any choice in the matter because there isn't anyone so if the thought arises and the thought is being is getting that energy floating it with belief that is also what is happening in the space of awareness or witnessing presence I gotta get the phone come back come back anyone would like to elaborate on that or say something different thanks thanks the mind the mind is a tool I suppose or we say that often but is it worth using the mind to look at the mind like you may think that there are habitual ways of thinking that get in the way of just being or these things come up is it worth using the mind to look at those things or is that just getting caught up in concepts once again or look at those beliefs would you do that yeah do you want to come on what Cliff was saying Cliff ask questions yeah no it's just talking about you know we often say the mind is a tool to be used is it worth using the mind to examine the mind in in the way of looking at habitual concepts that that come up and get in the mind and be in the way of just just being with the beingness you know or is that just you know relying on concepts once again to look at concepts I think we would use awareness to look at the mind yes of course it's all awareness yeah that's yeah lovely question again you see how distinctions come into the picture you know is it the mind using the mind or is it the mind or is it still being in the realm of concepts yes when the question comes up we are back in the realm of concepts when the question relaxes that's what's happening if the looking's happening investigating is happening using concepts is happening that's what's happening and now is there anyone using anyone or anyone using anything no it's just what's happening this beautiful actually a demonstration how and the same I was actually explaining to man I was speaking with yesterday you know see how the question comes into the mind how the question creates the questionnaire now there is some problem to be solved there is a distinction happening it is only happening within the sphere of concepts in direct experience it's just what's happening as it is unaltered unmodified uncorrected Andy do you want to say something?

no you want to say something? say it beautifully thanks thanks thanks thanks hey everyone hi um just this idea was coming up about ownership and it's an interesting idea because it's at the root of sort of this world this world idea that we have and you know ownership ownership of this body ownership of these clothes ownership of this house ownership of the car ownership of land it's like you know there actually is no ownership of anything it's just is ising right now and so you know it's just life uh speaking with life and you know it's a pretty crazy thing isn't it but it's also beautiful amazing and chaotic and uh and so yeah it's just this funny ownership you know you look at the house we're in Bob's house but really if you really look at it you know and you don't call it Bob's house you don't call you don't claim any ownership of it it's just appearing this way just is this way and you go to you know look at the bodies around the room as well apply that same uh feeling or ideas there's no ownership of this body just is so uh who's talking you know it's just it's just happening just naturally and effortlessly um yeah beautiful uh uh speaking of ownership it's uh four years today since Sandra owned me claimed me oh happy anniversary oh happy anniversary i was gonna give you those too and the funny thing is it's just time um and just being like it's just yeah like it's just is like a dream for all years or having the kids or you know it's just it is just so fleeting and it's and in a sense of presence it's just i don't know it's just a story i guess yeah lovely story a lovely story yeah there you go beautiful that we can share those stories and good stories lovely stories call for celebration and it is always life celebrating itself and a story is somewhat an excuse you know like a birthday story it's an excuse for bringing that spirit of celebration bringing it back it's a yeah happy anniversary again we're gonna be having happy anniversary soon as well and that is a lovely lovely story that's a loveliest story in the whole dream and we have couple of comments here there is one from vivek he says self is just there no personality and if personality arises in a self or in that space like awareness well it is just another modification of the same self and bill presence is undeniably here now requiring no belief and impossible to doubt that is the that is the main thing and the only thing we really know for certain the rest is just a belief and vivek says the question in zoom shows it was asked considering existence of a personality this is building up a story every question is building up a story and we can just really love them why not if they don't hurt and gilbert says the manifestation is expressed as duality no phenomena can become the singularity the seeing is happening spontaneously knowing is happening spontaneously where am I seeing from investigate the seeing by doing the seeing the investigator has an agenda seeing is beyond the seer and the seen that's a beautiful and very important highlight you know if the investigation is happening in the way and that's a beautiful way in which Bob usually collapses the duality of see your seeing know where known thinker thought just take a standpoint of that ing I am the seeing and then you see how the seer and the seeing just arises within that field of seeing you are the seeing you are already dark you are already knowing believing Jacinta do you want to say something you know what confused me for a long time was always searching but the more you know who you are it's the knowing that's always pointing you to see that you're beyond that the absolute and for the new people here today you're the absolute that got you here not the entity yes absolutely the knowing and Marty another idea popped up you know Bob always says he can't tell us anything and there's nothing he can give you there's also nothing I can share with you there's also nothing you're going to hear from me that's going to give you anything and and it's in in that that you get nothing from us and and that's it because you know it's there's nothing that anyone can give you and that's what we're talking about wonderful wonderful and there is nothing that you ever need because you are already like Jacinta was saying you are already that you are the absolute you are a completeness expressing true and art limited form but in essence you are completeness but it's beautiful that you highlight yes there is nothing if anyone come here to get something well forget about it but but nothing is is everything because out of nothing we all came out of nothing we return to nothing so in that state of nothing all possibilities for everything arise so for me the way that I sort of get it is like yeah we we are all separate in this room but it's a matter of perspective if we zoom out we can't see ourselves as separate bodies if we go further out and see the world as you know a sphere or a disc depending on your head you just see a world you don't see it you don't see 8 billion people on it if you zoom in on a drop of water you start to see creatures and stuff swimming around the drop of water but when you zoom out you just see a drop of water so we're both one and everything at the same time that's that's what I think I think it's both but you don't want to get caught up in either one because if you get caught up in like it's it's all one all the time then you don't function very well as a human being in the practical level and if you go too far into the ego you don't function very well as a human being that way so you need to sort of work both both in and yeah beautiful it is it is in fact a great illustration of the you know how everything is a matter of perception but it's even further out we just completely neglect perception anything perceivable or conceivable is just an appearance and landing the direct experience in which even to say I'm everything or I'm nothing is already too many words and that is a beauty to actually find that place in which there is already complete relaxation in that field of not needing to know anything and not formulating or labeling any identity whatsoever there is no one here who needs to be one or the other above or neither because the identity is just the arising is a wave arising from the ocean and coming back to the ocean there is no need for the identity and in this in this sort of relaxed state of not knowing mind just the being of the of the essence identities arise as they need to I need to be a wife the identity arises the body functions I need to be the totality okay identity arises temporary identity nothing all those identities are just free to come and go but the space like awareness does not have and does not need to have any and that's the ultimate freedom when there is no urge to even find out who am I because there is no one who wants to know and what I say when you get to the no thing see the no thing of that no thing and Bill says awareness is taken to be limited it is all pervasive yeah all pervasive everything that is field like you said beautiful it's a field of potentiality everything streams out of that no thing that potential did you want to say something to him no no no oh come on come on oh sure no no see what comes open your mouth open your mouth and the father will speak through you I'm not sure I don't know what's what's the topic today okay if you yeah if you don't if you don't want to push we have we have Vivek saying anyone who comes and interested in these meetings lose everything how wonderful all the heavy weight is falling off your shoulders lose it out lose the suffering what for and then he says all collected knowledge ego entity attachment etc and get nothing pure potentiality enjoy getting nothing from those meetings thank you Vivek and Gilbert says as Bob point out you cannot work it out in the mind fantastic point yeah quit trying and he says on the seesaw we got up and down the way out of the seesaw is through the fulcrum point which has no actual substance neither up nor down Bob often talks about equilibrium and Jay says or nice not to be here take it easy Gilbert no you've got to give us more than that give us more than that perfect pointer take it easy it actually is you're right Taz yeah take it easy relax that's a fantastic pointer because life already has you life's already looking after the body life's already looking after making sure the next breath is going to be taken the cells are going to be replaced the hair are going to grow just relax and see how the life takes you where you need to be how the life will provide the next thought when you need to have one and give all credit to it take it easy and just give credit where credit's due it ought to be okay if the hair starts falling out as well absolutely absolutely look at Bob's bald head he's totally happy it goes in weird places you don't have that trouble Andy you don't have that trouble it's just brain cells dropping off now and Gilbert says thanks Dean so good to hear you say something at all and Bill says just for fun take this imagined eye out of the picture remove it delete it ignore it everything is just beautifully so everything is just as it is clouds floating by or perhaps a wild thunderstorm let it be just as it is when the imagined eye is in the picture it persistently creates separation by evaluating and labeling and seeking some sort of becoming or non-existent liberation and again and just for fun put the imagined and illusory eye back into the picture place it off to the side let that illusory eye be silent let it be still let it merge silently with the beauty of it all into the inescapable immediacy oh my god bill this is so beautiful this is gorgeous thank you i think bill you should put some music into it and narrate it with a digital background sorry and like when that happens like what he's describing like it's absolutely just amazing like it's just this isn't the message of just like oh yeah work a few things out in the mind and feel a bit happier and no no no it's quite stunningly like magnificent like it's there's nothing that you can ever like imagine like just having no fear of death or the next moment or anything whatsoever like you're untouched like it's because there's nothing to be touched like you're just there's a space like thing and this is the experience and in this experience there's me's and no me's and ideas going around and around and around but really the immediacy is like it's vibrating like electricity just vibrating patterns of just magnificence and wonder of god of whatever you want to describe and I don't know Bill's thing just sparked the whole thing and Bob is just wonderful to be here and in this room with everyone and that's all I've got to say goodbye no that's I can never say I don't really know what I'm going to say but I think there can be a lot of beautiful non-duality speak and lingo and pointers and it's all beautiful but you know at the end of the day I think this is this is about like it's nice to talk about what I am and what I am and all that sort of thing but I can't experience what I am until I see through what I'm not and see through what's false because it can't expand and blow up while that matrix of that parasite or whatever you want to call it is still trying to be taken to be what I am so it's beautiful to speak from the heart and all the oneness that it's an intellectual understanding is completely different from an experiential and knowing so I mean that's why I love Bob's stuff because he just cuts through it's just a fact finding mission and investigation it's not all esoterical all the time it's just have a look have a look at really look at this and not just float through and go maybe it'll all work out like actually an earnest investigation over time and it's going to go in and out and it's going to go up and down and it's going to go fucking everywhere but eventually the stuff will come up and if there's enough light coming through it will start to burn up all that shit and see through it it's false so that's what's my point it's just a practical investigation I feel at times so thank you that doesn't happen no that is beautifully practical and that is really important to actually really have a look and you will see that even the earnestness to look and you know that longing for the truth that will life will provide it life will facilitate it and that rigorous investigation like Bill was saying you know just experimenting removing the eye or putting it aside or seeing or hearing the narrative but really just as subtitles as a commentary and just yeah everything that is the way it is facilitated is provided and recognized and give credit to life that life can provide that earnestness for the practicality of it for the practical investigation am I my thoughts am I even the thought I am when the thought I am is absent I'm still here when the thought I'm a woman man or person or emotional being when that one is absent I'm still here so could I possibly be something that comes and go if I'm the witnessing presence for that which is coming and going could I be my emotional self my sense of insecurity my fear of rejection if sometimes it is here and sometimes it is not and I am prior to all those things arising and moving away so could I possibly be any of the passing phenomena if I am a knowing of the passing phenomena and discarding everything that I'm not I can't be the thought I can't be the image I can't be the ugly image I can't be the good image because if the image is absent the presence is still there and that's really great reminder to just seriously look and if you see even on so called intellectual level if you see that this can't be true who knows that discipline may come back when when the mind takes you for the ride again like Bob was saying sometimes hey I've seen through it again there is no I there is no self it still feels like there is one but let's look again and if it isn't the relaxation may just come back direct experience you you want to say something no I might say something on this theme again you know we we say you know the self appears in awareness and yet that's that's part of the phenomena too like thought comes and goes events come and go and they all seem to you know the right sort of thing in retrospect seems to happen as it needs to happen like well you know I've had a story as an alcoholic and yet something brought me out of alcoholism and you know I struggled with it in the mind for a long time and then you know I see that I needed all of those experiences to get me to where I am today yet so those things had some sort of validity as they came up and were seen or not seen and yet it's beyond it is beyond the mind to examine it all and to make sense of it in a way if you know what I mean yeah yeah it may feel like there is a mind watching the mind or there is an eye doing the investigation so how could mind watch itself it's just awareness it's just yeah it's just awareness it's just knowing within that sphere or space of knowing different patterns of the thinking comparing judging labeling they are being known I remember like this sense of me dressed itself up as this like spiritual policeman and was watching me watching all the different aspects of me and that's all it was it was just nothing like nothing watching nothing like watching and claiming that now I've found this out and I've discovered this it's like I'm earnest now I'm not honest now I'm a liar now I'm a this and it's just like endless endless endless until there's a realization that this that like Bob says like clearly the thought I think can't think like it's just there's no there's no there's no entity it's an energy of just stuff floating around and who's seeing it who's observing it what's observing it that's it's unknowable unfathomable and brilliant and there's a and I don't know how can some sense of a something claim anything like it's just beyond claiming that's all I don't know what yeah but that's I said the mind my mind anyone's mind that was all I had to say I was just thinking when sorry when Cliff was mentioning before that he was an alcoholic is the use of an alcohol a sort of very sort of primitive way to try and turn the mind off and maybe maybe it doesn't work very well but maybe you went through that he came out the other side and go well there's a better way to do this there's a better way to feel to get rid of these self-conscious feelings all these feelings all these feelings you might be trying to push down with alcohol and using the mind because when I if I drink alcohol my mind clearly feels different I feel different about it actually I don't really like it I'd coming out the other side brought me to questioning things that I would not have questioned otherwise I don't think so all part of that experiencing of the self in a way Carl Jung has talked about alcoholics like there was a low level seeking for God through alcohol and drugs that was coming from that place but that's what it tried to use to arrive there or something I don't know something like that I think that in a way alcohol and drugs brought me to living in the moment when I was plastered or something you didn't care about the past or the future or whatever it was just experiencing the now in a way and then as soon as the drug wears off all that nightmare comes back it's a bit more instantaneous it's a dirty now yeah we have that topic did you want to say something on the topic of alcohol it's amazing how the substances are being used and we can say to reach God or to look beyond myself to escape myself to find myself to find God to escape reality to escape past and future to find the now all those things are basically summarized into one not this you know reality as it is now no good so give me a substance because that will mediate sedate the suffering a little bit and a substance can be alcohol substance can be a behavior a shopping or overeating or watching porn or whatever or gazing at social media anything but not this just escaping the angst of life as it is whether it is the torture of the mind or whether it is a longing for the truth and I have another couple of comments here one from Bill as soon as anything anything is denied or is defined or labeled the subject and object appear all labeling without exception results in fixation and duality that's obvious see that the world is not the thing see that by defining stuff limitation arises yet we go on labeling yet there is no escaping freedom my goodness isn't it gorgeous and now the labeling as it happens and as it will now it can be believed or it can be just noticed and then as Dean was talking about the you know creating an imaginary witness who is an imaginary police person who is kind of noting everything well that could also be part of the arising the label the witnessing all of it part of the arising and then the freedom as Bill says no escaping there is no escaping freedom in that stepping back and relaxing into the natural state freedom is inevitable and Kathy says great and ram as I was listening to cut I noticed there is a strange echo coming out of the audio sometimes the words are heard before I see her lips moving oh wow sometimes they are heard afterwards sometimes they appear to come out as her lips are moving which is the present moment beautiful what's he drinking and Bradley sipping the seeking syrup is just as intoxicating seeking syrup yes relaxing the search any search arising is just to be noticed again this is another way of saying not this not this something else something better something more and inevitably the mind the body mind is wired to always look for more pleasure and less pain like Bob says you like it you want to keep it you don't like it you want to push it away but the body mind's behavior is not who you are it is just what is happening within that witnessing present the seeking may be happening it doesn't have to be personal you don't have to attend to it let it be there in the background like Bill was saying just push the eye aside ignore it instead of ignoring the sense of presence the heart of hearts yes Bob say something I thought you want to say something no no I know your lips your lips move but I can't hear what you're saying I might I might try and say something I really like the conversation around trying to use any substance to get out of the mind and I was kind of already I suppose conjuring that up as the conversation was happening and kind of reflecting on you know this life of doing anything anything possible to just not be present and not be in this body and anything and everything and so this message um and whatever it was that you know brought me here to um receive the truth of this I can see more and more like even when I sit here today I'm just available not as me as a concept but just available to just be and and really take in life in the way that at some point along the timeline I just needed to escape from so I'm very thankful beautiful and even to actually have the narrative that I needed to drink to escape life it's just a narrative this is again on the on the greater scheme of things this is life self organizing life self-medicating life creating and adhering to survival strategies in the absence of any better ones or other ones it's all life it has never been a me who chose or not chose you know like Cliff was saying I didn't choose to be an alcoholic it is the life doing what it what it does dancing itself and if it has to go through the gutter to take you where you are today like in Bob's case well you see the beauty and you appreciate the beauty of life when you zoom out and you see the bigger picture but you may even appreciate it in the moment when you step out of the story and see this is what's happening and then you watch the movie and you see the tragedy of war and you see people being abandoned and that's also what's happening and it is happening within the consciousness so it is happening within you and you can appreciate the pain experience when you actually connect empathetically with another face of you happening at this exact moment when it arises in the consciousness I suppose my talks with Bob you know when I come and see him I didn't really maybe I was so far removed from reality that I couldn't actually see the gutter that I was living and so just the talks with Bob really had me face what I needed to face and I'm very again very thankful yeah beautiful what in a way you know this talk of escaping the self or the mind the thing about looking back after I'd come here and seeing what I'd been creating you know and talking about consciousness as I creating in the mind was a really shitty version of the self that you know you're pretty happy to let go of really yep every version of a separate self is nothing comparing to the absolute to the complete freedom even the most elaborated wonderful image of self if it's limited if it's separated if it's somewhat even if it's kind of you know compare in comparison is fairly functional it's still limited it's still yeah still not it and we have here Vivek says alcohol to satsang to no satsang all is to moving away from thoughts and mind and just be and Ram replying to his comment about what was happening when he was listening I paid a 10% Sunday surcharge on my coffee this morning Bob that could be it thank you and we have couple of more minutes quiet minds things ready with the mic this is that fine perfect clear jeans everything in our society I couldn't take it anymore because the message that we're hearing today is not the main message that we hear you know out there so since we live in a consumer society and we've got to work and raise families and consume this message is almost in many ways an opposite message to the way we have to sort of kind of live and of course we're told if you you know this is just so non-mainstream this message and that's that's that's the that's the probably the issue is that some people just never hear this message and if they do they don't really have the capacity to understand the message the first time I mean until you're in enough pain like I've been in pain we've all been in pain here you're not going to do you're not going to investigate anything are you you're not going to question anything so pain is actually the biggest gift that we can give ourselves just have to get tired of the hamster wheel I've got this quote can I read it out it's got all I just saw it yesterday all truth passes through three stages first it is ridiculed second it is violently opposed and third is it is accepted as being self-evident beautiful yeah and that can happen on a personal level too when you first hear not just on a sort of a broad scale but on a personal level you might hear something and just go that's just you just haven't got the capacity to understand it I've been into this this sort of thought sort of a long time now but it's it's taken you know 30 years to mature and to you know sometimes you move away from thinking like this as well and go into those avenues of thinking like sort of how society wants you to think you know sort of head down bum up work and you know you get and you get really caught up with the non-spiritual aspects of life and you can you can really believe it's real absolutely but these seeds that you plant you know and you can water the seeds and they can they can grow they can really benefit you and make your life infinitely better until suddenly you're probably not a good citizen anymore because you're getting pleasure out of the more simple things in life rather than a purely materialistic sort of way of life anyway that's happened a little bit for me I've never been really good at that sort of part of life because I've always needed a bit of time to dream and time alone and space and all that kind of stuff so yeah it does take time to take those ideas on board unless you're just spiritually gifted like an outlier and you just sort of hear those ideas and straight away can really absorb them and let them grow anyway thanks thank you yeah yeah that's it oh I have one more comment been trying to share this message with my very religious cousin it's entertaining thank you MJ that was MJ thank you thanks everyone that's it you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you but you Se she..., you yes you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you youivo