This transcript was made by speech-recognition software, so names and some words may be misheard. The recording is the original: watch on YouTube.
Jain, Tess, Nabi, Zain, Gilman, Cholzen, Faroja, Paula, Kalo, Cholm, Bobby, Ross, Ivor, Julia, Anita, Andy, Dean, Kavisha. There you go. Yes, darling, please. Right. Thank you. Oh, god. Yes, got it. Oops. I'll give you to me after. Lovely. Open. Open. Sweet. The eyes widened just when I go around the room. Must be recognising something. Good to see you all. Good to see you, sir. And you all know what it's all about, of course. all know what it's all about, of course. What they call non-duality and Vader, or the one essence. And, they say that is all there is. But we've got a few here looking into it.
There's a hell of a lot out there that are believing in this idea of their person, this individual. Miss out on what the ones that have understood it and grasped it down through the ages have pointed out. It's only one essence. Only the one thing. One thing that has the capacity and ability to pattern, shape and form express and play or act or whatever you like to call it, as everything. Only the one. Non-dual, undivided. Absolutely one essence. And all the pattern, shapes and forms, which you and I and everything in this room and the room itself are, are only pattern, shapes and forms appearing and expressing as seeming separate, but are still only that one essence.
When you look into it, you'll see it's so, just a little bit of simple investigation. Why do we need to do that? Because each and every one of us, when we were born, came into being and learnt words, took on the idea that we are separate, individual persons. individual persons. And from that idea of separation comes division. With division separation, isolation, loneliness, sadness, happiness. All the conceptual imagery we have through the words we picked up, are believed in. And added to this pattern, or shape and form through which is expressing. Which we call body minds, or persons, or individual, or me. But it couldn't be anything other than the one.
Everybody in this room is breathing right now. Each one got a separate portion of air you're taking in? Or is it the one air? We're all sitting in space. Each one got their own space? I hear a lot of people say, I want to stay in my own space. A bit hard. We don't look at these things. And we all believe we are separate. Male, female, male, female. Different races, different things, different concepts. Where does the vision come about from? Doesn't it come about from words, thoughts, ideas, images we've got? How many words were you born with? Were you born with any words at all?
When you go. When you look back on it and investigate, you realise you weren't born with any words. And with the learning of words, which didn't happen until we picked up the language, around about two, two and a half, when the capacity of reasoning developed in you, and we learnt words, that we took on this sense of separation. When you were a little child, you know, you had no words. How could you say you were born? How could you say you were separate? You were living, doing things, but you had no idea there was such a thing as separation, or good or bad, until we learnt words.
It tells you in the Bible, in the beginning was the word. That's where it all begins. When we learnt words. Adam and Eve, supposed to be the first so-called two humans that came into being. It's just another story, like all the other stories. Were in paradise. Had no words. Living in the Garden of Eden, paradise. Everything was beautiful, wonderful. But they ate of the tree of knowledge. They were good and evil. You know, an apple or something else. But the tree of knowledge. What's knowledge? The learning of words, concepts, ideas. And of course, with taking on those concepts, and believing in them, what have we done?
We've separated ourselves. Look around the room. Do you see anything that's not separate? Everything in this room, we're separate from the space. We're separate from the air. The seats you're sitting in. The person next to you. All appearing to be separate. Yet, it's all the content of space. Space is no thing. No thing at all. Does it have any distance? Has it got any closeness? Can you divide it? Can you separate? Can you grasp it? And also, can you postulate, or think of, anything at all that could be outside of space? And you realize there's nothing that can be outside of space. And some of the texts and scriptures have pointed this out down through the ages.
The so-called ages. Because when you look into the ages, there's time. And when you investigate time, you see that, is that any concept any more real than the other concepts we hold? It's not, So without that concept of time, it's all as it is. Right here, right now. And you can't say it's not there. Because it's appearing. Seemingly so. Appearing as separate. Appearing as different. And we take, the way we're seeing from, And that's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. When you look into it. So without that concept of time, it's all as it is. Right here, right now. And you can't say it's not there.
Because it's appearing. Seemingly so. Appearing as separate. Appearing as different. And we take, we're seeing from, this appears to be me. We're seeing. It's not. This appears to be me. Me or I, a separate entity, something that's separate and apart from, regrating by this great concept we believe in, the old God. That's where we think we're God-given creatures, with this label God on. I immediately set that up as something superior, something higher and greater than what I am. But isn't it just another word? And it tells you in the Bible, in the beginning was the word. That's where it all begins with the word. And when you look back at that, you'll see that.
Again, look back as far as you can remember. For the first couple of years of your life, could you remember what was going on there? You can't. But you were living then, when you look, people pointed out and put out a time, you were certain, been functioning for a certain period of time. You were no longer the little embryo. You were no longer the little baby. You were a young child. Which was the same as you're no longer the little child right now. You were youth, middle age, old age, all different shapes and forms. Constantly transient. But each are still claiming it to be me or I.
The separate entity. It tells you in the scriptures, I and the Father are one. If you believe there's something greater, it's the Father or the Mother or anything else. It's still only the one. And the invader is one without a second. Implying there's no other at all. There's not two. Never was two. Never could be two. And that's all that needs to happen. Recognise that that is all there is. You are the one essence that's patting, shaping, forming, appearing, expressing as everything. Only that and always have been that. But we've taken ourselves to be this separate entity. Now we think we have to become that.
That is an enlightening experience. What's this enlightenment they talk about? We think it's a great and wonderful burst of absolute beauty and wonderment and then. But all these concepts on it. Concepts fictionalised would make all sorts of things. But what happens if you have a look and see for yourself? Instead of carrying around all this burden of concepts and ideas, recognise it is that one. And being that one, why does it have to fear? Why does it have to be anxious or unhappy or depressed? Why does it need to be anything other than what it is? And without putting the concepts on it and breaking it up with words, you've had the taste of that many times.
When it's been joyful, which means compassionate, loving, happy. But because we've taken on the words divided, division is seeming separation. One has seemingly become two. But you take any stick and break it off. So I've got a stick here. And it's two ended. Is the stick two ended? Or is it the same stick in which one end is different to the other? One coin. We've got two sides of it. The gold, bangled, bracelet and earrings are made up of gold, if they are gold. We put the libeled bangle on it, put other metals into it. Bangled and earrings in size of gold or silver or this, that, that.
Put different labels on it, but it's only gold. Anyway, it's all it's ever been. Leaving it in its oneness, in its simplicity. And there's nothing simpler than one. What do you have to seek? What do you have or need to become? Why would you want to? If you know and recognise, I am the absolute, I am that reality. The more, instead of taking on board more concepts, more ideas, more images, which I do when I learnt words and get ideas and plans and positions, I just basically sit back and relax into what I am. And what I am is the livingness, the beingness, that's just happening by itself.
Out there, when you look outside the window or even in this room, there is light. And when you investigate, you see it's the earth rolling around the sun. Now the light is the sun. And the earth rolling around in it, there's different patterns, shapes and forms and all things appearing. Is it the sun rolling around the earth? It's not. The sun is seemingly static. The earth is moving. And all these things appear in that sunlight. We look around the room, and we're seeing different patterns, shapes and forms. Take the patterns, shapes and forms to be real. But who are they or what are they appearing to?
They're appearing to this conceptual image that I've taken on the idea that it is me. A separate entity. It's picked up words along the way, which I didn't have. All these concepts and ideas, words and images, have all been collected as I grew and acquired the capacity of reasoning, learning. And what have these ancient teachers pointed to? Go back to the Taoists or the Buddhists or Hindus or the early ones thousands of years ago. They all point out that the oneness of it all. Some different stages, different stages. Some clearer than others. Some are more attuned to it than others. They're still pointing out the one.
The one. But we have stuck to the idea of separate. And think we need to become more. Because it's not too good when you're living from this dualistic point of view. It's constantly transient. You breathe in and breathe out. Air in and air out. Your heart expands and contracts. Pumping the life around your body. It's all a vibration. All a movement of energy. And the energy of the vibration implies is other than one. Divides it. And separates it. And then that division, trying to separate it, instead of realizing what they tell us, that it's simple, it's only the non-dual one without a second. We divide it trying to become something.
And that makes it worse. Because we form more concepts. More ideas. More images. If I do this or learn this or take this up or cast this out or get rid of it, I will become something different, something better. What about what I am? Now there is another thing. That belief comes up, I am. What's that I am-ness imply? A sense of presence. A sense of knowingness. A sense of beingness. A sense of beingness. Now, this pattern through which it is expressed through, this body which has all the organs, brains and sinews and life to express through, is claiming it as me. As the person.
As a separate entity. Individual and whole has now been separated, divided. Separation to. Separation to. Me and other than me. So there is me here, and I am not sure of the other. Especially when the capacity of reasoning hasn't developed. How can I claim this me to be other? When it's only the one. And in that claiming to be the other, too, we set up the dualism. And now this one here, trying to find out what it is. It's got all these mental images and mental concepts. Parents told me, Little Billy or Little Johnny, whatever your name might be. Now this is me. I am Little Johnny.
You're not Little Johnny, or she's not Little Johnny. They're something else. So I'm separate from them. And with that sense of separation, well I'm not too sure of them. They might take away my toys or my food, So, not sure of them. So you get the fear, the anxiety, the stress, the guilt. All because of this sense of separation. Or an animal or a bird out there that I haven't learnt the name of. Haven't taken away from either. And I'm not sure of that, or an insect, or anything else. And then separating and taking to believe something other. The fear, the anxiety, the stress. All the psychological suffering comes up.
Now this human race. One intelligence entity. One life. Absolute. If it was expruting like that, what would you call it? Wouldn't it be like what they pointed out, or tried to point out, years ago where it all began? Garden of Eden. Where nothing was wrong anymore. Where the living was easy. A natural functioning. But what is it like, from this point of view of separation? How many different concepts, ideas, and points of view are there in this room for a star? Let alone the world, and everything that's appearing in it. They wonder why we're in such a hell of a mess. Why wouldn't it be so, if that's the way it's looked at?
What's the way out? Well they tell you that. They shout it out all the time. Know thyself. Be self aware of yourself. Knowing. Be the absolute. Be what you are. Not what you appear to be. How do we not come to recognise? My self. What is the self? Is it what they tell me to be a personal self? Or is it what they tell me? It is absolute. Absolute. What can you aid to absolute? Nothing. Not a single thing. It wouldn't be absolute. If you try and take the smallest thing away from it, it would no longer be absolute, would it? Or as they put it in Buddhism, the great perfection.
If you took the smallest thing away from the perfect, it wouldn't be perfect anymore. They tell you that in the scriptures, if from the perfect to perfect. Perfect is taken, only the perfect remains. So take all these concepts, ideas and images away from yourself. And if you are what I'm pointing to, the absolute, what changes are they going to be? Isn't there going to be a natural ease of being, where you're not entangled in all these concepts? All these beliefs, all these anxiety and guilt, don't we want? Wouldn't it be a sense of being well? Nothing wrong? Nothing wrong? Nothing excluded or included? As they try it out again in Buddhism, the great perfection is non-conceptual awareness.
Now that's the thing to look at, isn't it? Is there anyone in this room who is not aware? And nobody will tell me, I'm not unaware. You all know that awareness is there. What awareness is there? What awareness is? What can you say awareness is? A lot of us have got different concepts about what consciousness or awareness is. But not realising, you couldn't, if you didn't have that word and there wasn't such a word, what can you say about anything if you're unaware? What were you before you were born? When you were growing in the womb and the first couple of years in life you were living, that awareness was there, but there was nothing being added to it or taken away from it.
It was just a natural, spontaneous functioning. Now, they tell us you've got to become something. Well, are you being right now? You're going to take all the concepts off and wouldn't you be that pure being? Would there be any need to become anything other than what is, than what you are? And have a look and have a think. There are times when you've had taste of it. Of course you have. I hear it often, I fell in it, I saw everything was right. But the me came back again. Anyone ever found this me? Has it anything, ever been anything other than a word? An idea?
A concept? That we put the sense of being me on it as separate? Or has it always and ever been that life? Has the me changed? It's still the same me as when I first learnt the word. But the pattern, shape and form that's been expressing it, is constantly transient, constantly changing. And the energy and belief going into these words, are taking a toll on this believed in conceptual image. They're making it emotional, feeling, thought, feeling and emotion. Thoughts coming up, feelings and emotions. And stirs it up and does all sorts of things. And most of us live, living from that point of view, are not very happy, not very, some of us get on alright without it.
We don't have to do much about it. Others have a little bit of a taste and nature's much better. We can get by. Others are completely locked into it and are self-destructive. And in that self-destruction, we try to destroy everything that comes in our way. And impeding it or trying to stop it. And involved in all this conflict. To be pretty miserable. As I know for a fact. And I know the other side of it too. Where in the settling into it, everything can become pretty nice. Pretty beautiful. Pretty loving. And it's natural. It's spontaneous. And it's timeless. It's spaceless. It's ever fresh. And ever new.
Beginningless and endless. Beginningless and endless means, if I take away the concept of time, time is beginning, middle and end. So I've taken the idea of being, becoming and recognizing the spontaneous functioning. But right now, right now I look out the window and I see the branches on the plant moving. Is the plant moving those branches? Or is the space that the air is appearing in blowing and moving it? The plant is doing nothing but grow. Facing towards the sunlight. Taking up the moisture and using the earth to feed and live. What are we doing? How much is it? Anyone who's not breathing? Anyone who's heart is not beating?
Anyone who's not hungry or thirsty at times? Anyone who's not knowing what to do when the hunger or the thirst goes up? But is there a majority of us have little taste of it, don't investigate it further, see what the other that appears to have more than us, and we want that. Or seem to be the others that are going to take it from us, and we fear them. We need to get rid of them, we need to hold our place and complete our grasp on this beingness. We grasp it for a certain amount of so-called time. But see, that's things that's trying to grasp it.
It's the same body that when you were a little child, first learning words of that, couldn't walk, couldn't do anything. Now it was still growing old, falling apart, dissipating. We're fearful, we don't want it to go. We're not realising that we didn't know it before it came about. It developed of its own, like you formed in the womb of your mother and the father, and the life that was in them formed from other life. And that life before them was in the essence of the food, and the things that were in the planet and the earth. And that life, as we know it, is always there.
You can't even put the concept of time on that. It's a spontaneous emanation, a spontaneous vibration, a movement. But it appears in all its own diversity. And each and every one of us had some enjoyment out of it. Quite a bit. Some more than others. And others have a lot of troubles and problems with it. But in the recognition of your own nature, if, as Wei Wei Wei said, why are you unhappy? And he says, because everything you say, and everything you think, and everything you do, is for yourself. And he says, there isn't one. Now, he's saying there isn't one. And all the scriptures, no matter what side of the fence they come from, they all point out to that one, as a God, as a higher power, or something greater.
there's a normal power something better and we think because we're not functioning too well and others seem to be that there is such a thing but why would they all consistently point out it's only the one essence because they've seen it they've recognised it, they know the truth and he says as Wei Wui says for yourself and there isn't one isn't what, what's the one? the self what's the self? well the self is me or I, the personal self and they don't tell you that if you look into it you read it, you've heard it and you've read it many times like I did and seen it yeah that's pretty good but I'm still this personal self but is the person the reality person an individual a separate entity person is not reality they'll tell you it comes from the ancient Latin persona the mask pointing out what they point out that we've learnt concepts and obscure our true nature our very life with the words with the picking up of words and learning words we've learnt concepts ideas and images the saga tells you nothing can trouble you except your own imagination imaging in talking about that word imagine and that's what's troubling us what we imagine they talk about the snake in the rope quite one of the ways they point it out when was the rope ever a snake when could it ever be the snake it's only a piece of wet rope that somebody in the dark night doesn't see it but in his image in his mind he's got a concept of snake he might think other things that were snakes and he sends on this piece of wet rope that rolls under his feet and he says I was taught on a snake and immediately the hair stands on there the goose bumps arise and there's this sensation being better fear in the trembling starts and there's anguish fear we try to do something about it well what's with all these thoughts we take on board somebody calls you a nice hole and you get all up in the air about it you get this terrible image of what it is I'm insulted but if you had to look at a nice hole what is it it's just a round hole isn't it how many else was it you look at I see the cats well the cats have got one well that goes with any other name too seeing it as it is what's next to it what's next to it you started something now I think I'll leave it at that you can carry it on to me arseholes why are you laughing you're supposed to be offended just goes to show whichever way you take it doesn't it go on yes so Gioti says this was hilarious and Nandi says good morning and apart from that we had a couple of meetings ago I think it was Marty who pointed out that majority of the communication and that's the NLP discovery the research majority of the communication comes from the body language tonality and the gestures not from words so you were not convincing I'm a fire you're a failure take it on board get sad yeah well weirdly enough nearly every one of us when you believe in a self-center fear of failure and idea that I'm a failure failure is the most debilitating depressive thought one could think of and it is believed the idea of I'm failure I'm not good enough I'm not lovable enough there's something wrong with me there is something missing and this is also just a description of the feeling that can't be pinpoint that feeling of separation which is translated to the thought it's just funny to watch and then yeah question anyone would like to start questioning asking sharing because there's no one from the community 20 plus people who actually have any questions I think they've been regular they've been with us and yeah they understand that the questioning the questioner is the problem the search is the problem don't have to ask questions tell us your version what you see somebody else might hear it might be a bit different than that so the words that they can grasp understand or they might understand what a 7th CD you're a tough act to follow Bob the most beautiful thing about non-duality and this is probably what every speaker ever tries to do although I don't know what that motivation is that would be narrative anyway is to make it as simple as it gets because it is super simple every word is further complicating the simplicity of it so if any one of you is moved to say you know how how you could put it in just a lot one line and how simple it is you know you are aware you're not unaware you're aware that you are go on Julia I think it's part of what I guess what what's coming up here is just this this idea that when we're little babies we don't have any thoughts coming through we're all little Buddhas you know I've had children and you ever stare into a newborn's eye you can see that that's true that that I don't know it is occurring to me today how we have a tendency to see when we see these human patternings to take them as a solid thing and not see not notice well there's no solidity to any of it yeah it's a good point um yeah nothing else to say and you said in one line you could think of one line what came up for me is we just are yeah lovely take all the concepts on me that's that's it yeah and I love what Julia pointed out the fluidity of it you know if you really look at what's static about any way the persona appears what's static about the way the body appears what's static about the thinking the feelings all is fluid I mean you could see how many concepts through the day if you still believe the concepts of yourself how much they are changing oh I'm alright oh I'm not too bad oh yeah I'm disgusting oh I hate myself you know all those all those concepts they completely they're constantly changing what's there to trust what's there to believe even the common sense would say that the narrative is unreliable especially when it relates to the self that can't be found you can rely on the narrative of a sport commentator more or less but the narrative that is commenting on the self that can't be found that's what a joke so many stories none of them real yeah so the line the lovely line the history before Bob about the asshole taking offence getting called that it just what is it that takes offence you cannot so so those things just wash through you like everything you know yeah yeah yeah let it go through to the keeper when I'm chatting with people about this because I do love babbling about this sometimes I really love your pointer of intelligence energy I mean can you think of anything that exists without energy right so you're calling us assholes I've actually called people my dog shit you are my dog shit because you're everything so yeah same thing one word is not sufficient is it the thousands not enough right that's right Bob is often especially when he wants to illustrate something when he has one-on-one meetings at home and usually the red cat I don't know he's hiding somewhere he sits on his lap and he rests and he spends as much time as Bob on that recliner with him and Bob as an illustration says look I say to that cats every day that I have bug bug and I will put some rocks into those bugs and I will take them to the river and drop them with that bug and he says do you think they take any notice they come and lie on his lap and they come when especially Pesto the red one he he if he demands attention he will walk over his keyboard he will poke the nose in the camera in his face he is he's running the show he doesn't have any inferiority complex or any idea that he's not enough for and doesn't get offended I have a million questions and I'm too scared to ask one of them because I'm sitting over here and you're sitting over there looking at me so let's just start there we're all just a bunch of assholes that's fine it's just bunch of assholes that's fine now you're curious you have to ask one question why am I scared to ask a question that's what's coming up there's a lot of confusion someone answer it if Bob wants to answer you want to say it first Bob then the belief that you're a separate entity an individual a person you've isolated yourself what will they think of me if I ask this maybe it's not right you've got no confidence in what you believe me what you say so we get upset or fearful or don't ask the question but the point is not to ask the question who is happening to who is the question have a look at that why or who is asking this question am I this body am I this mind take you back to investigate in our own self nature to see what's there what is the reality and what's the thoughts concept can you negate your beingness right now Can you tell me what being is the one that is the one that is the one but you know that it's that aliveness or life their concept we put on you can't negate it but the person can you tell me what the person is thoughts uncomfortable sensations in my body yeah the one that's failing this the one that's frightened to ask the question the conceptual idea or image you're gonna there's something or something there that's other than the reality shall we give Gilbert the voice yeah yeah I was gonna say something very similar that you know the me is a fiction the total fiction so innately we know that we all know that the me is just a mask that we wear but you know because it's not real there's a sense of fear because the whole mechanism is to try and reinforce this image of self and make it real but it's not real the person is not reality what is reality that's a real question what is reality and it's pointed out in the ancient text that the unmanifest is reality the numenon is reality but the mind is like a mirror that reflects the numenon as phenomena seemingly separate things all phenomena is an appearance it has no independent existence or volition even though it appears to have volition as people and animals and things they all appear to be separate things or entities that have volition and they're doing something but it's all consciousness consciousness is what's doing it and it's one consciousness it's not your consciousness my consciousness you know that's just the mind reflecting the one as many and the mind seemingly divides the oneness or the wholeness into all of these different things in a seeming personal sense I like this I don't like that so but is that person that's on a seesaw going up and down is it real the fulcrum point in a seesaw is not moving so to get off the seesaw you have to find the fulcrum point and if you really examine a fulcrum point it has no existence in phenomena if you had a microscope strong enough to look closely all you would see is molecules going around and around some invisible axis and the whole universe is moving upon that emptiness so the me is a fiction and it's the seeming cause of all of our psychological suffering but psychological suffering is not real but you know nobody wants to hear that because they've invested all of these stories about me and my suffering and oh my god and oh you know I had a terrible childhood and my father used to beat me up and my mother was horrible stories but you know come back investigate is the me real and what is it that knows that it's not real innately it knows it's not real so we're all actors on a stage playing roles you know and we wear a mask and you know like I think the Japanese have a form of entertainment called no or something where the actors wear masks beautiful wooden carved masks but at the end of the play they take the masks off and they go home the mask sits on the hook in the theatre you can't do anything you can't see anything you can't hear anything a mask is nothing but an image so why enslave myself my essence to this image of myself it's going to betray me one way or another over and over and over again and that's the suffering but you know find that something that doesn't change what is it that doesn't change it's not a thing in phenomena it's no thing you know it's like the sky the sky has clouds in it it appears to be blue but at night time it's not blue and the clouds are not stuck to the sky they are phenomena which is constantly changing ever changing but all the changing things are changing upon that which doesn't change so you know like there's the physical body which is appearing in space the space is not changing the body is changing the heart is beating the breathing thoughts emotions and things are all constantly changing and in our desperation we try and fix that changing thing into something solid that I can cling on to and that's the suffering let it be like Bob says leave it as it is unmodified uncorrected un-something else un-altered un-altered yeah who's going to alter it me I don't like it I want it to change but what are you going to change it into whatever you change it into it's just going to be phenomenal and phenomenal changes it's not real it's the un-manifest that's real and that's what you are you are the un-manifest there's no time for the spirit the spirit is ages it never gets old and dies some call it the soul you know as Bob would say I've got three souls you know back to the assholes again when I when I was a young fellow I had 22 aunties and uncles and and my grandmother and they're all old you know they're all in their 60s and whatever when I was 10 or something and that all most of them would say I don't feel old you know it's only when I look in the mirror I can't recognize myself so that's enough from me you wanted to say something about it yeah go after Bob Gilbert pointed out it's all images what do you do about that well listen to what Nisargadatta says nothing can trouble you except your own imagination what you are imaging in and that's all we're doing we're creating this mental or conceptual images and taking it to be real and that's the trouble but an image what do you see in the mirror an image in the mirror or a reflection go up and try and grab it how real is it so you can't say it's not there because it's appearing before your very eyes but you can't say it is there because you can't grasp anything at all grasp the thought and you can't tell you this is body mind hang on to a thought if you can I was just going to say that that image we have about ourselves is time bound and that time is a concept as well and all conflict arises between me and the other person place or thing in other words we get caught up in the narration of the fact the narration and separation that we're separate and we we've spent our lives identifying with that me that separate entity and then there's a response to that me whether it's as you said Zane I'm scared to say something or you know all our lives we've been protecting this me you know we've been trying to closet it and what we've done is we've kept it vulnerable you know to any sort of attack and the mind's nature is to work in the pairs of opposites me and the other person place or thing so what Bob's pointed out is there is no me that is the persona that is the image that we have about ourselves but old habits die hard even though we know in reality there is only one and we've known that ever since we were little you know as Julia correctly pointed out you know you look into a baby's eyes and there's you know stillness well that stillness is with us always always every single second and the narration or the image we have about ourselves is on the top if you know using words to describe but it's all an illusion you know there is no me and the other there is no time there is only one you know but at times it really feels like there is because that old habit is so strong or allegedly so strong it actually isn't but it's allegedly been pointed that it is you know and old habits die hard so you know what's been pointed not only by Bob but everyone who's seen the truth is is that there is only one it's at the core of all the great religions you know it's at the core of all great understandings okay I have someone here from online community who and it is John David and he answers that in one word unborn but I would also like to acknowledge that you know regardless of that fear you actually genuinely really want to and you love the truth and you want to get that clear so even though it was threatening you actually came out and asked the question which is wonderful but also it is really kind of nice to look at where is that fear come from because Nisargadatta told us that every problem we can ever have is the problem of the body so how is that applying or how is that related to the body and of course body mind is one thing but not two things because without that mind it can't operate in dead so it's how it relates to body mind and in the fear the origination of that fear and apparently statistically it is being said that people have more of the fear of public speaking than the fear of death I mean how can you fear death death is non-existent it's nothing to fear but the fear of dying you know like if you die in torture pain there's fear of pain not fear of death really but because it's such a common thing if you look back in the origination of that fear you know even look at the wildlife look at the community of the bonobo monkeys or whatever and you see that if someone comes out and speaks and is rejected by the whole village by the whole community that someone is not going to be able to survive that someone is basically killed this is death I mean if you speak up something and suddenly you make full of yourself and we all hate you and we all want to get rid of you and we all just have nothing but violent thoughts and exclusion that's the end of you I mean on the tribal sort of instinctual level the brain is wired the whole machinery is wired towards loving to be meaning survival so to actually have that sense of reservation before you put yourself in the fire line in danger and the rejection absolute rejection of the whole community is death so it is totally justified so having that and overcoming that is absolutely beautiful the suffering comes with the narrative when it says oh this is fear this is not fear really it's just a sensation it's just a sort of like you know like almost like Jane sometimes says she's a performer gathering of the energy to actually be able to deliver it so it doesn't even need to be called fear when it is called fear oh why what's wrong with me why am I not getting it why am I so self obsessed oh this is wrong I well I don't know how is the wildlife creature who is going to stand up to the alpha and speak in front going to feel whether the energy is going to be buzzing through the body probably yes but the narrative doesn't have to be there so you can actually enjoy and still come out and please do enjoy that sort of a tingling sort of energy and yes bring up all of those doubts because and I just wanted to say that it was just coming up really strongly that everybody that's ever talked about this stuff including you Bob and Christ and all the all the seers sages and prophets from the past they've all had the courage to speak out despite the whole community wanting to bloody stone them and crucify them and you know and that's kind of how we feel when we when we first come and we want to speak out you know we think you know oh well despite the fact they're going to crucify me I'm going to speak out anyway they don't crucify you they'll put you in a loony bed whatever whatever your experience is you touched on it when you said talked about there's awareness of it all you know as kristinamati we looked at kristinamati years ago there's an awareness of the tree and there's a response to that tree that response is thought feeling and emotion you see the tree just as it is but when you put the concepts of the tree you're not seeing the tree you're just seeing your concepts you know can there be an awareness of the tree without any response and can there be a response to the tree and that way we stay in the natural state that's right that's right beautifully said Bob and if anyone wants to know about that book it's the second penguin reader krishnamurti the chapter on awareness it's brilliant absolutely brilliant pointer I've had a few copies of it printed I just wanted to point out as well that everybody who has a body that has an awakening still has a body or still has an apparent body there's not a person owning it that's what changes is the identification so there's still to me it's like transparencies there's still the and the classic example that I always use is a modern day ramana when he had a full awakening he just went quiet stopped talking stopped eating he wasn't present for most a lot of the time he didn't speak so there's some people have awakenings and they just stop talking they go very quiet because because and there are other people who are but he came back he came back into his person so he still lived through the apparent person so there is a living occurring there is a leela a dance of manifestation it's just about the where you place your identification there's a sort of difference I think I believe in experience in my experience about the fact that nothing's rejected no experiences are rejected no manifestation is rejected there's no like or dislike it just is but there's also something much more profound than that occurring at the same time at the level of awareness you know in identification well said that's the problem we think one awakening is better than another more profound and discriminating again but what's awakening that's awareness if you're aware you're awake you're certainly not awake I'll have a couple of comments here Manju says yes I'm born and is everywhere and everything that is manifested and Vivek says me is individual individual means separation separation is dualism world dualism is fear I just have to share a little story because I can't give a point to like everyone all the intelligent people I can only talk shit so I was in the truck house this morning this story like this morning I was I go to feed the chooks and I'm in the chook house I come back in the house and Josh comes in and says I can smell chook shit I can smell chicken shit and I said I smell like chicken shit and then I started repeating as he walked out I said I am chicken shit I am chicken shit and then I just started just like I'm chicken shit and then I actually became the expression chicken shit I actually no no this energy of fear like bubbled up out of nowhere and then I started singing a chicken shit song because it was absolutely hilarious this can't exist it's absolute madness it's not existing for anyone so then I just became chicken shit all the whole drive here and it was the funniest thing ever because there's no one for anything to be stuck to and the whole point yeah it's like just fantastic so that's my little story lovely and also what came up for me was that fantastic expression false evidence appearing real with fear you know and you know I heard that acronym ages ago you know it sort of really resonates because you know firstly there's got to be a me to have fear and then when you see that the false evidence appearing real is appearing to a me well it just all sort of disintegrates you know that's how I see it that could be a little bit that could be a little bit you know I am chicken shit nothing can touch me and who were talking pop pop pop pop pop pop that was a good insight but we're taking you know taking the words chicken shit and putting more importance into them seeing it was an insight of recognition yeah I think my dad used to have this terrible expression my mother gave birth to a boy and a turd and the boy died so we're on the shit thing now yeah it's not that far from us and we've been Julia was talking about dog shit then about chicken shit anybody else bullshit bullshit bullshit lotus can't grow without lotus can't grow without yeah the compost without the shit the lotus needs it yeah absolutely any other lotus you've got a shit song possibly this could be yeah give us yeah do you want to sit here please do you want to sit here okay thank you what is it that makes us tear the page and begin again what is it that makes us weep and feel our pain invisible indivisible unspeakable aching in my heart invisible indivisible unspeakable aching in my heart wings of love carry me carry you till we meet till we part the thread we feel the thread we feel that links us so through the universe through the universe it goes past all time past all space to places forgotten deep and holy the first kiss the first kiss our souls meet this healing in a blinding flash i fall from the sky looking at your beauty why the sword why the chain why the locks the guns we could just fly this sorrow this joy this let go hello hello goodbye goodbye invisible indivisible hymph unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment unisment Unspeakable radiance we hold Invisible, indivisible Unspeakable radiance we hold Invisible, indivisible Unspeakable radiance we hold Invisible, indivisible Unspeakable radiance we hold invisible, indivisible, unspeakable, radiant, sweet home.
Thank you. That righty-eyed all around the room. Well, well done, singing. You can have Sailor Pop's choir. Silence. Silence sings. Don't talk about chicken shit. Yeah, it felt important. I don't think I even actually had a specific question before, but I was so involved in myself that I needed to just say something to break through that. But now I have a question. Good. Yeah. Fantastic. It seems like there's this real desperation to have an understanding of some sort. Mm-hmm. But at the same time, there's a great resistance to it. And when I was here last week, what was coming up was like, what, why am I here?
Like, what, who's, who's seeking this? Like, what, what am I seeking? Why am I here? And who's doing it? If we're already aware of that? Like, why are we all here? Like, why are we all here? Mm-hmm. Do you like it? That's the thing. That's the thing. Being in the company of truth is, as Kabusha so beautifully put in that song, it's holy. You know, I know that's a label, but it's something beautiful to be with people who are on the same wavelength, you know. But mainly by what you say. And, and even though, even though, even though, even though, you know, you take, you take yourself wherever you go, or you're in, you're, the reality takes you wherever you go, you don't take yourself.
you know why not be with those that are you know resonating you know so yeah nurturing nurturing that you know that yes spark if you like that it's good to be with people that help you grow it and help that awareness grow like we're we're all like in a garden you know in the company of you know and also this is experiential it's experience it's not a conceptual thing although we discuss it sometimes the conceptual things but it's actually direct experiencing and there's something it's quite remarkable to be with people who just are in the moment experiencing and you've experienced that it's just a joy why don't we want to do that you know it's experiencing not the mind when when you know the the concept of holy of course comes from from wholeness you know and that's really what it's about it's not about piety or some sort of pining for idealism that is that experiential knowing that's direct experience without concepts yes it is about the whole yeah something resonates it's an inner nature there's something in lately it draws you to it might be unknowing by the mind but something resonates you want to hear more and it takes you where you're going to be you might consider it a lot of rubbish for a start off but something grabs you it's your own innate intelligence that's recognizing or trying to recognize yourself but we block it out with all the conceptual ideas on it just let it be just go with the flow see where it takes you and when you ask question why I I got the feeling that you actually ask why am I here but see what happens suddenly everyone wants to answer the question why with a different story because that's what the why does it invites the mind to justify why you're here I tell you because life brought you here it's not that you had any choice it's not that what you think is the real motivation it's an absolute mystery how the life unfolds why we do what we do we can have tons of justifications we can blame it on the childhood or on the weather or anything else but the truth is we are not the doers we are not we did not come here to get something or to understand or to no we did not come here at all because we are not the doers it's just life expressing this way but but when you ask the question why am I even here look who's questioning look who wants to know who is there I think that was my question I thought so who is he who is coming here stay with that though yeah I had too many questions to learn that that was coming from your questions yeah so so some of you might be aware of something called the urban guru cafe many years ago I got in touch with a guy called David Godman who was the librarian chief librarian at Aaron Anshula and he's written books on Ramana whatever anyway he sent me a whole bunch of tapes of Nusa Gharata's meetings and a lot of them sound wasn't very good but some of them were and on the urban guru cafe there's yeah Nusa Gharata's meeting not Ramana no he didn't talk anyway that this question came up in the record in the recording it's on the urban guru cafe so there's a young man young man young seeker in the meeting and he says to Nusa Gharata why am I here why is it that I'm here and Nusa Gharata says how did the space come into the house into the room how did the space come into the room he says the space didn't come into the room something is building the house in the space present tense something is building the house in the space and it's very subtle it's appointing something in the mental activity is building this structure of me and house and whatever but the thing that doesn't change is the space the space like awareness so why am I here what am I doing here it's a great question how did and Papaji was another one of Ramana students if you can call him that and when he went to visit Ramana at one point Ramana said how did you get here he said I came in the rickshaw and he says where's the rickshaw now oh it's gone and before that he said I caught a taxi where's the taxi now it's gone and before that I caught the train from Madras where is the train it's gone you get it it's like we have these stories about how we got here and that's that becomes a burden because you know you've always been here really in essence there's only one consciousness or awareness there's no story of getting here yeah can anything be pointed out in space as a centre to it no or anywhere that's not here there that's why the word self centre is such a fiction because how can there be a static thing called a self centre when there's no static point in space what would it be resting on floating in nothingness so all of our stories of supporting the me are a fiction and the sooner you see that the better I have a come you can't do that you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person you are a person seen through the eye.
I have a couple of comments also here. Gudula says, for the joy of sharing this. And Heyman says, I don't expect Sailor Bob to walk through the wall or blow my mind by reading my mind or even tell me something uplifting or something that can ease the turmoil in my neck. Just tell me I love you without sarcasm in your voice. That's beautiful. Thank you, Heyman. And Vivek says, why am I here? To hear the message of freedom. And that is actually a good answer. Thank you, Vivek, too. Because see the mind, which always have those stories and those concepts, it has this very subtle concept that it doesn't get it and it may need to get it or want to get it or will get it in the future.
And it has a subtle concept also. What is it that it is going to be got that is not here presently? And that is usually because the mind think dualistically. So it is usually the absence of pain and the presence of pleasure. There is not enough pleasure right now in this moment. So the mind the thinking pattern which is naturally designed for survival, meaning seeking pleasure, it has this concept that there is a great enlightenment which is a steady supply of constant pleasure or ecstasy which is impossible because the brain also has the fuses and the serotonin shock is quite a quick death. But the concept is there that there is something to achieve and there is someone who can achieve it.
So the message of truth is really why even the logic, the mind, the thinking there is an attraction to hearing it and the message is the one who wants to achieve it, the one who wants to get enlightened will never get it because that's the imagined self that's the illusory self. So it really is no point for the mind to hear anything apart from the fact that the answer is not in the mind and the mind can never get it and it needs to rest its case. But it can't do it because its nature is to seek. So mind will continue seeking whether for more money or for more pleasure or for enlightenment that's its nature that's how the program operates.
But repeated that constantly that kind of that narrative which verifies and compares and interprets everything when it hears it repeatedly it may start losing lowering the guards and let it go deeper and sink to the point when there is a resonance on the level of the heart. In the heart when there is no thinking there is nothing wrong nothing needs to be achieved there is no desire for pleasure because those things are superficial movement of the mind but bypassing that movement of the mind there is nothing wrong already and it is the mind the functioning of the mind the operation of that dualism of that energy moving that clouds that natural state that natural ease of being and that nothing is wrong anymore and recognizing from that stillness the movement of the mind brings the perspective back brings the background to the front brings up the realization that ah I am there like Gilbert was saying prior to the thinking what is it that never changes what is it where the seeking mind appears and disappears on and off and this is really not a message for the mind but initially there is no other way to hear it than through the mind initially you hear the same thing you are already that just quit seeking it's all fine well but I don't feel fine oh okay later on yeah yeah okay I agree with you but intellectually but I don't feel it still subtle idea that there is a feeling of pleasure that is missing or is absent and it should be there and then eventually as those ideas are seen through the natural state which initially for the mind is bullshit nothing nothing there is nothing there what a big deal all talking about nothing that nothing gets completely different dimension and it becomes nothing nothing full of radiance like Kavisha was singing radiance and aliveness and beauty and freshness that which look through the mind is just void yuck nothing embraced by the heart is the true bliss of being true joy of being but initially yes the mind filters everything and rather than you know the whole seeking seeking path is seemingly forgetting the truth or clouding the truth with ideas and concepts just to go back to it by completely recognizing clouds to be irrelevant and unimportant beautiful if I don't mind it doesn't matter yes and now we we have comment from JB thank you Bob for another wonderful Sunday thank you all and have a great after meeting meal and hey man sends the heart oh and come again tomorrow if you want to do it on zoom if you're in the north american time zone or even here 930 in the morning melbourne time but whatever you are that's when it is on zoom and you can find the details on Bob's website thank you everybody's got a taste of it listen to what came out of a few of you this morning yeah thank you Bob and Kat thank you everyone thank you