Immensity of the universe puts things in perspective. Sailor Bob and the nonduality group. 7 Aug 22

I'm James. Adrian. Adrian. Tessie. And Dean. Good to see you all. And there are quite a few old-timers here today that have heard the spiel many, many times. But sadly they'll have to hear it again. Because there's nothing new. We go over the same old, same old. We can't teach you anything. And we can't tell you anything. Understand that right from the start. Because there's nobody that can teach you anything. And nobody that can tell you anything. Because what we talk about is what they call Advaita in Hinduism or non-duality. Non-duality means not to. One without a second. So it's only the one who is there that can teach you or tell you anything.

Nobody. So it's just a matter of resonating with what you hear, if you resonate with it. And recognise it. And put it to the test. And another way I put it, I'm not speaking to anybody. I'm not speaking to anyone. I'm not speaking to any mind. I'm not speaking to that body, mind or identity which you have believed or might still believe that you are. That person. That separate entity. The individual. If there is anything separate and apart from it, it wouldn't be one, would it? One is the absolute. What can you add to the absolute? Nothing. It wouldn't be absolute. What can you take away from the absolute?

Nothing. It wouldn't be absolute. And the same with the perfect. What can you add to the perfect? Nothing. What can you take away from the perfect? Nothing. So the Buddha has put it, the great perfection is non-conceptual awareness. It's that awareness without any concepts. And Hindus, Sat Chit Ananda, Nama Rupa. They're the five factors. Sat is existence. Chit is consciousness or awareness. Ananda is loving to be. And as I say, the Nama Rupa, the Nama is the name we've been given and believed ourselves to be. And the Rupa is the body, the form. They tell you that Nama, Rupa, name and form is Maya. It's illusory.

So this body, mind, I am. This body, mind, I dare. We've got about ourselves is illusory. And that leaves us with the existence, consciousness, bliss. Anyone who's not existing. And you recognize, no, I'm existing. Anyone who's not conscious or unaware. And you know, no, I'm not unconscious. I'm not unaware. Anyone doesn't love to be. Well, none of you want to be dead right now. So you are that Sat Chit Ananda. Already. Now what's the point of trying to become something that you already are? And that becomes the problem. And that's what we point to. Are you this body, mind? Are you this conceptual image of a better self?

Are you the body? Well, when you investigate that, and that's the main thing we point out, that the false cannot stand up to investigation. We've taken on all these. Erroneous beliefs, which we take to be real. But when they're looked into and investigated, they fall apart under the investigation. Are you the body? Well, you know already, no, you're not the body. Because you say my body. You say my coat, my car, my house. Are you the coat? You know you're not your coat. Are you the car? You're not the car. Are you the house? No, you're not the house. Well, maybe. Well, maybe you're not the body either.

This body you're claiming to be you. And when you investigate it, you'll see it's a fact. What's the body made up of? You see this body's made up of elements. Air, earth, fire, water, space. Just like the elements around you. Well, if you think you're separate, stop breathing. Take that element air out. How long are you going to last without that? Take the element water. You'd soon die of thirst if you didn't drink water. Take the body temperature of the fire. You'd soon get hypothermia and die of the cold. See if you can get off the earth and live off the earth. Or get out of space.

So when you see that, you realise you're not separate from any of those elements. And all those elements have been broken down into subatomic particles. Into pure energy. And what's energy? Energy is a vibration. An activity. A movement. So this body can be broken down into pure energy. What about this thing we call mind? Everybody's claiming it's my mind. My mind. Well, show me your mind if you've got to think you're in the mind. Anybody ever found a thing that they can call mind? They've done millions of autopsies on people. Have they ever dug a mind out of it? Of the opposite? You can find a brain.

You can find a heart. The liver, the lungs. But nobody's ever found a soul or a mind. But we believe there is such a thing. Well, have a look at mind. What's mind? Well, mind's just thought. And how many words were you born with? What's thought? Well, I don't know. Words. What's words? Sounds. What are sounds? A vibration. And what's a vibration? A movement of energy. So this thing called mind. What's a vibration? This thing called mind can be broken down into nothing but energy. The thoughts, feelings and emotions that come up. What's a thought? It breaks down into words. The sounds break into words.

Well, how many words were you born with? And you realize you weren't born with any words. That's why you can't remember your birth. You say, I was born. And you didn't have any words until you were about two, two and a half. When the capacity of reasoning developed as that little embryo, that little baby was growing. And we learnt words from your parents. And you've taken these words to be what I am, to be real. But is the word the thing? Take the word water. Try and drink the word. If you think the word is the thing. Swim in the word. Wash in the word.

Drink the word. You can't. The word fire. Can it burn your mouth? Can you heat yourself with it? You can't. So what's this word I or me? And you realize all it is, is this believed in conceptual image. What your parents told you. Your little Billy. Or your little Jane. Or your little Mary. Or whatever your name might be. And that sense of presence, the knowing that you are, translates into the thought. I am Billy or I am Mary. So that sense of I am, what is that? That capacity of reasoning development is translated into that thought. I am. And the Sargat has all told you, you've got to stay with the I am-ness.

And people think, well I've got to repeat I am. I am. I am. I am. And I'll get to it. But you don't have to do that. Because that's what the I am is. A sense of presence. A sense of being aware. Hey, all it is, is the awareness of presence. Not the awareness of something past or something in the future. that that awareness is presence, it's happening right now. It is an activity. Aware. You're not unaware right now. So you must be aware. And in that awareness, the knowingness and the seeingness and everything else happens. And on that awareness, which you can't say what awareness is, but we call it awareness.

Just a label. And that's the primary. Everything appears in that awareness. And in that awareness, consciousness appears. And in the consciousness, we get all these patterns, shapes and forms and labels. And the pure being is recognised. You call yourself a human being. If you believe in God, you'll call God the supreme being. A greater being than what I am. And that I am is a sense of presence expressed as, in the words that we've learnt. But, you take yourself to be a human being. And if you believe in this God, the higher power, or the greater being, you'll call that the supreme being. Take away the label supreme, take away the label human.

Anyone who is not being, right now, not was-ing what was, or not what will be, but in the actuality of this present moment, is anyone who is not being, or is unaware right now. If that's what you are, that pure awareness of being, you already are. So who is there, or what is there, to search? And what are you searching for? What do you think you're going to become, if being will never be becoming? Because becoming, implies a future time. But when you look into time, and investigate time, you'll see itself, time itself is a mental concept. Ask yourself, what is wrong with right now, if I don't think about it?

You're sitting there, well just, let the thought be for a moment, put it aside, and see what you can say, or think, or do, without the thought. And you realise, without the thought, you can't say it's good, bad, pleasant, painful, happy, sad, loving, hating, can't say anything at all about it. But you haven't stopped breathing, your heart hasn't stopped beating, hair and fingernails haven't stopped growing, food hasn't stopped being digested, the actual functioning, or livingness, is going on, without the necessity of thought. Thoughts come up on that. But you didn't learn any words, or have any thoughts, till you're about two years old. And that thinking is what we call mind.

This thing you're claiming is my mind, is nothing but thought. What's thought? Word. What's word? Sound. What's sound? A vibration. And what's a vibration? A movement. A movement of energy. So we're back to this again, the activity of knowing. And what's this thing you call God? Well we believe there is this greater power, but look out there in nature, you'll see the earth rolling around the sun, the seasons coming and growing, tides coming in and out, stars, planets, galaxies and that are forming, imploding, exploding, tsunamis are coming, all sorts of things are happening, and it's that same essence, or life, that's breathing you. It's beating your heart, growing your fingernails, and digesting your food.

So it's all that one essence, or one life, if you like to call it that. All the one life, the one essence. So it's one without the other. And those are these other things that are seemingly, that are seemingly, patterning, shape and forming. They are still that same essence, which is vibrating. What's the basic screen, in which everything appears? Well it's that same screen, that you are sitting in right now. You mightn't even be noticing it. But what are you sitting in? What's the closest thing to you that you can see? What's the closest thing to you that you can see? What's the closest thing to your eyeballs?

What's the first thing you see? You'll say, I see you, or I see that. Unless you've investigated this before, and a lot of you have, and know it already. The thing closest to your eyeballs is space. And the next thing from here, what I'm seeing is space, then that thing there, and then the rest of the thing. And even outside of space, it's not. What is space? Can you find a centre to it? See if you can find a centre to space. Where does it begin? You can't think of any centre, or any place, where it begins in, because space has no shape. It's got no boundaries.

No beginning. No ending. No inside. No outside. Can you find the inside of space? You can't. Can you find the outside of it? You can't find it in boundaries, to have any in or out to it. It is no thing. And you and I, the trees, the flowers, and all this manifestation, are things. Space is no thing. Can you postulate, or think of, anything that could be outside of space? What would it be in? You don't have to road scholar to see that. There's nothing I can postulate, or think of, that could be outside of space. Nothing at all. So, everything, everything, trees, the flowers, the mountains, the hills, the microbes, the germs, everything is the content of space.

There's nothing you can think of that could be outside of it. You and I are things, the trees are things, the flowers are things, and all these things are the content. Can the content, no thing, be any other than the space? No thing. Can something ever come from no thing? It can't. It's impossible. But it seemingly divides up into things. Seemingly, it appears in these pattern shapes and forms. But it's all no thing that vibrates again, that vibration, into different pattern shapes and forms. That I am-ness, that sense of presence, is no thing. So it's still the no thing, it's still the one essence that's patterning, shaping, forming, and expressing as everything and the no thing.

Shakespeare told you that 400 years ago when he said there's nothing either good or bad, thinking makes it so. No thing that's good or bad, but thinking makes it so. We have this capacity of thinking, reasoning, which is a vibration. And have a look at how that functions. That's mind. All your thinking, it vibrates in the interrelated opposites. You're either in the past, which is memory, or in the future, which is imagination and anticipation. That's how it vibrates. Past and future. What's it- Look at time, is there such a thing as past? It's gone, it's dead. Yesterday is dead. Is there such a thing as future?

You can't, there's no such thing as future. And does this spontaneously moment, this fresh and new now, does it have any duration? Does it last? No, it's just a throb. A pulsation. As it's beginning, it's already ending. It's got no duration whatsoever. So time is a mental concept. Shakespeare told you that. Nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so. We bring in time. The saga data tells you there's nothing that can trouble you, nothing at all can trouble you, except your own imagination. Have a look at that word, imagination. We break that down to imagine, or break that down to image in, and realise that's what we're doing.

We're creating all these conceptual images that appear, putting labels, shapes and forms, and we're imagining this, that or the other. All these words or concepts, vibrations we've taken on board, and we imagine they're happening, and so we take it on, I'm fearful, I'm anxious, I'm unhappy, I'm depressed, I'm guilty. All the concepts or labels we put on are all imagined, all mental images. And that's what's troubling me. Because when you look into it, it's only me that can be fearful, isn't it? If you're fearful, who's fearful? I am. I am is this me. Only me that can be unhappy. Only me that can be jealous, envy, depressed, guilty, shame.

Only me is the cause of all this psychological suffering. And the effects of the cause are me. This conceptual image. Now if me is the cause, and it's seeming this me that's effect, what happens if I ask myself a simple question? If I'm not relating to a cause, can there be an effect? Well, have a look at that and question it. If you're not relating to the cause, who, to whom, can the effect lodge? And all that cause and effect are, they tell you in the scriptures, is so-called karma. It's all this fear and imagination that goes on, oh my karma, this is going to happen, and all the concepts and ideas we've built around that, and all these so-called karmic consequences.

But if I'm not relating to this fictitional me, where can the effect, if me is the cause, if I recognise there can't be a cause, and nowhere for these effects to lodge, it becomes what we call an unfixated awareness. Where the awareness is not fixated on anything. It's free to see the comings and goings, the vibration, all these things, but we're not fixating on the one. And that's what they tell you in the scriptures. Be utterly awake with the fire and the fire's senses wide open. Where you're seeing, you're hearing, you're tasting, you're touching, you're smelling, you're feeling, you're thinking, all equally, but we're not doing that.

We get taken in the thinking or the seeing and keep it there. Instead of letting it change and move on, we hold these sorts, there are concepts, and they become seemingly solid and substantial and we beat ourselves with the word, with the sensation with the feeling. Be utterly awake with the five senses wide open and it says to be utterly open with unfixated awareness. If you're fixating on something, you're not seeing the totality. But if you're open, instead of staying on the thinking, you move into the other senses that are there and when they come up, you can be free to whatever is going on in this present moment without fixating and sticking with something which we might hang onto for hours or days or weeks and beat ourselves up with a dead image.

When it's ever fresh, ever new, constantly transient, ever changing. Like the ocean is ever changing but never changing. See it's got a calm, serene ocean. It'll start to move as the wind or the energy will blow through it. It'll cause a ripple to form or a wave to form. And it'll grow, the waves will grow. There's no two waves the same. But all those waves are water. Still the ocean. But we call it the waves or the storm or whatever. So it's ever changing with those words. But it's still only the ocean. So this life essence, this capacity of knowing, this capacity of being, this capacity of reasoning, the life that you are, the intelligence energy, that's ever changing.

But it's still only life. And the Sangha doesn't tell you that. He says there is only life. That's all there is. It's here right around you. There's life everywhere. And every pattern, shape and form in this room, in the trees, in the flowers and everything. That's all there is, is life. There is nobody who lives a life. There is no life. We've taken on the persona, the belief in the persona is a word that comes from the ancient Latin persona, the mask. A mask of concepts we put upon ourselves. I'm Bob the Australian, the good fella. They're all concepts. What happens when the life goes out of that pattern?

It becomes a corpse. That corpse, before it breaks down, still got the eyes, the ears, the heart, the lungs, all those vital organs, the brain, are still there. And it's about that life, that intelligence entity vibrating and expressing through it, what good is it? It's a corpse. Nothing animating, it continues to break down and rot, forms bacteria, germs and things like that that help it to break down. And goes back to the only place it can go back into, is space. The emptiness. And just like the cloud seemingly obscures the sun, and you realise that that sun has never left the sky, it's still shining in its fullness, but the clouds seemingly obscure it.

Well the same thing has happened with the thoughts. In that clarity of pure intelligence, the awareness that you are, thoughts come up and seemingly cloud it over and obscure it. But when you investigate the sun and the cloud, you realise the sun forms the cloud. The sun doesn't know anything about the cloud, but it's the activity of the sun, the brilliance, the height, the heat, the immensity, enables in that heat it evaporates water. And the water rises as steam. The steam condenses a little bit and forms the cloud. And the cloud obscures the sun. Now the sun is a little bit more clear, and the sun will continue to shine and it's radiance, what will it do?

It will cool it down and bring the cloud down as rain, or blow the cloud, cause the wind to blow the cloud away. And what's in the sky then? What's in the empty space then? Isn't there more clarity? The sun is there in all its brilliance, shining brightly. Well the same thing applies in this thinking. We forget all our ideas, images, and obscure the life essence that you are, the vibrating, the livingness, and we get locked into these thoughts and concepts, and forget all about the life. That life that's rolling the earth around the sun, causing the seasons to come and go, the tides to come in and out, the volcanoes to explode, implode, stars and galaxies to form, what's doing all the patterning, shaping and forming in this life, it's what's breathing you.

It's the same life. It's beating your heart. It's growing your hair and your fingernails, digesting the food, it's the actual livingness that you are. So, what must you be? You must be that life itself. Look at your computer, that's a good analogy to use. You've got a computer there. Look at the wonderful, amazing information that's been put into it to build it. Applying as a pure intelligence from the fact that it's been utilised by these patterns, shapes and forms we call these human beings, they have the capacity of reasoning developed, you can put all this information into the computer. But if you haven't turned the power on, what are you going to get out of the computer?

So you'll see now, no matter what amazing things you put in, you'll get nothing but a corpse. You're no good at all. So then, what are you? You must be like Christ said a couple of thousand years ago, he says, I am the life. He doesn't say I am the body, I am the mind. He says, I am the life. I am the life. I am the life. I am the life. I am the life. I am the life. I am the life. I am the way. I am the truth. I am the life. People thought he was talking about himself and set him up there as somebody greater.

He wasn't talking about himself, he was talking about that same I am-ness that you are. It's the sense of presence, it's not the thought. It stresses and translates to the thought. There's nobody who is unaware right now, you're aware of that presence, that sense of presence is active right now. That's the way, that's the truth, that is what you are. And that is so already. How did you come about? You'll say I was born, but you can't remember your birth. And the saga tells you that. He says there's only life. That's the reality, that's all there is, life. But there's no body who lives a lie.

And you are a body, you will believe yourself to be these bodies and mind. And you will believe that. That's a belief. And the belief's not the actual. Nobody who lives a lie. But he says life lives on life. For out of life that more life comes in that virus. And that's true. Where did you come from? You'll come from the life that was your parents. Go back to your father and your mother, that animating life energy in your father, the intelligence energy enabled in that pattern. A little microscopic particle to form through the food he's eating and the breath he's breathing and the life activity that's going on that's utilizing it, enabled a little microscopic particle called the sperm to form.

Now that sperm was suffused with intelligence. It wasn't just a mob of glue. It was suffused with intelligence. It knew what to do. And the same in your mother. That animating life essence or the intelligence energy in your mother. Enabled in that pattern an egg or an ovum to form. And that egg was suffused with intelligence. It knew what to do. It attached itself to the wall of the uterus. It wasn't floating around accidentally. It attached itself to the wall of the uterus knowing what to do. And the sperm knowing what to do swam to the ovum. When those two came together that life essence in the two began to form and grow on that pattern coming together and the genes and things that were there and the life that's coming into your mother and double formed the little fetus, the little embryo which is what you are today.

What are you doing about it then? You realize you couldn't do anything. You had no words. But you were growing without the word. Pointing out that you're prior to the mind. There was no mind then. And you didn't learn any words until you were about two, two and a half. So you were functioning all that time without this thing you call mind. The absolute intelligence spontaneously patterning and vibrating had no words or concepts to discriminate it. When your little baby was hungry it would cry. When it was happy it would gurgle. If it wanted to defecate it would defecate. If it felt hungry it would let you know.

The functioning was going on. It would make a few sounds just like the animals and birds will make sounds now. One sound might be there's food here another sound there's danger. A call. But they haven't got any words. So they can't discriminate. And so that little child couldn't discriminate until it learnt words. And I tell you in the Innocent Men when no discriminating thoughts arise the old mind ceases to be. The way we've been believed into thinking ceases to be that way. The thinking is still there. The thinking will be in a more spontaneous different way. The activity of knowing. The being. And loving to be.

So all our problems are because of the word. The word is called a cognising emptiness. I'm talking about emptiness before. Everything is that emptiness. It's form. But it's a cognising emptiness. Cognising, another term for cognising is knowing. It's that knowing that you are. It's the emptiness that's doing the cognising. And he made the statement that emptiness is form. It's that cognising or intelligence energy in that life that's forming this manifestation and everything in it. Emptiness is form and he turned it round the other way and these forms you and I and everything else the forms can be nothing other than the emptiness. And it is a phenomenal manifestation.

This whole manifestation which we all appear is phenomenal. Dictionary definition of phenomena is that which appears to be. It's not real. It's only an appearance. It's only seemingly so. Like a dream. And this architect says you're dreaming a dream you call the world. And he says stop looking for ways out. He says a dream is not your concern. Leave it as it is. It's that you love one part of the dream and not the other. Isn't that so? We're trying to change this dream. We're not happy with it. Because of the concepts and ideas that go on through the belief in separation we don't want it.

We want one part and not the other. He says love all of it or none of it. Leave it as it is. Love all of it or none of it. And the rest will be done for you. And that's the beautiful thing to recognize and realize. It is done for you. It brought you into existence. It's breathing you. It's beating your heart. Growing your hair follicles right now. It knows what to do. It takes you where you've got to go. And when you're resistant you get into all sorts of shit and trouble like I got into for years. But in the recognizing a lot of it falls away.

Because it cannot be believed in anymore. And what's the belief? Look in your dictionary definition of belief. An unquestioned acceptance of something in the absence of reason. We haven't reasoned it out. We've just taken it for granted what our parents told us. When they told me I was Bob I believed I was Bob. The good boy, the bad boy and all the other concepts. Not realizing I was the absolute. I was the presence awareness. The pure actuality. Pure being. All these words. And all these concepts drop away. Left as is. What's is-ness? Isn't is-ness part of the verb to be? Am, was, is? Not was or not will be but is.

Right in this spontaneous immediacy. That's vibrating ever changing but never changing in the moment. Got no duration because time is duration. But the spontaneous functioning. It's breathing me. Isn't it breathing you? What's your next breath going to be? It's beating my heart. Isn't it beating your heart? Or are you doing it? Look at it. See for yourselves at how we've taken this me to be so great and wondrous. I can do this. I can do that. Can you take a breath without that life? Can you think a thought and you feel a feeling without that life? What's good or bad if you're not thinking about it?

What's your next thought going to be? Most of you will say I don't know. And you don't know what your next thought's going to be. But the thought comes up. And you say I think. You've claimed it. What's claimed it? Is it the reality? Or the believed in conceptual entity? The person. It's me. I'm having this thought. It's my thought. The thought is the concept. And the I that's having the thought has become the thinker. There is thinking going on but now it's claimed by me, a thinker. And me is thinking this thought. So the thought has become the object. The thinker and thought are subject and object.

Seer and seen are subject and object. Hear and heard are subject and object. Dualism. But can there be a thinker without thinking? Have a look at that. And you realise there can't be a thinker without thinking. And can there be the thought without thinking? There can't be. So then you'll understand what Shakespeare was saying when he was telling you there's nothing either good or bad but thinking makes it so. Just the thinking. And you don't know what your next thought is going to be. So thinking is happening. And you don't have to abide in the subject and object. Just leave it as it is. And thinking is spontaneous.

It'll change. And it's constantly changing. And that's all this manifestation is. It's transient. It's all changing right now. There are thousands of cells dying in that body right now. And you don't realise or recognise it. And each cell that's replacing it knows what to do. A liver cell's not going to replace a skin cell. And a skin cell's not going to replace a heart cell or a brain cell. Each cell's suffused with intelligence and knows what to do. And we as these little human beings claim it that we have this power. We can do this and do that. Know the truth and the truth will set you free.

Relax. Let it happen. Let that life essence relax. Relax right now. Just drop everything. And see how long you'll stay without the breath. The life essence will make you take a breath. The next thought, it'll come up. As soon as you try to force it out, try to do something with it, you're in trouble. In conflict. And even though life is functioning quite naturally, the earth is rolling around the sun right now, just the same as it's breathing is. This part is facing towards the sun and it's light. But the sun doesn't know anything about light or darkness. It shines of itself. It's ever shining.

And the earth doesn't know anything about daylight or dark. It's ever the same. And without the darkness could we know anything about light. The light of intelligence. The light of knowing. The light of life. That's what Christ told you. I am the way. I am the truth. I am the life. It says in the scriptures, let your light so shine before men they may see the good works and glorify the Father, that essence that you are. It's the light of life. Where does the light come into your body? You see a corpse. The first thing you notice about a corpse, if you watch it, is the glaze goes over its eyes.

And shuts off. The light of life goes out of it. Where does that life come into your body? A light. It comes through the mother. In the umbilical cord. It comes into the child. It's that light of life. And life, light needs a aperture to shine out of. And what's the aperture it shines out of? You've got a light under cover. It'll find a crack somewhere to shine out of. Doesn't it shine out of your eyes? That's the aperture that the light of life expresses. And then you can say like, I am the light of the world. Because it's in that light that the world appears.

Without that light, what would you know about it? So, understand and recognise that you are already that. Christ, I've been going over tonight. No. Keep going. Yes. So, as I say, the old timers are here that know about it. They can tell you their take. You might see it in a different way to what I do. Where somebody might resonate with it. Others, not so new, have got a good grasp of it. Others that are here for the first time might have questions. But it's up to each and every one of you, which are already that. It's how it's passed on. If you didn't open your mouth, who or what's going to hear it?

So, it's what you know. Let it out there. So, it can be recognised or resonated. And so, someone who is lost in the darkness of that self-centre or ego, to see clearly. So, away you go. Wait for the microphone. I had an interesting drive down to Inverloch yesterday. Talking truth all the way to my drummer and my guitar player. Because they were sort of into meditation and looking at different things. So, you might get a couple of people on Zoom this week. Or, yeah, it was just amazing how it all just came out of my mouth. Just pointing to the reality that they really are.

They were very inspired by that. And, yeah, they've got a lot of great stuff. And, yeah, I think they're going to be very, very successful. And, yeah, I think they're going to be very, very successful. And, yeah, I think they're going to be very, very successful. And, yeah, I think they're going to be very, very successful. And, yeah, I think that they're going to be very, very successful. zoom meetings additionally in a week one on monday morning which is sunday afternoon for america and tuesdays and thursdays in our evenings so if anyone wants to tune in you're more than welcome and we also have couple of comments from the community and a couple of welcome messages and that was dave saying every time i hear this it sinks in a little deeper and that's really seen that kind of proves really effective to listen to the message fresh and new it sinks a bit deeper because initially when we listening with the mind the tendency is to evaluate to agree or disagree to always have some sort of adjustment or opinion of what is heard that sort of a that controller doesn't really let it in all the way but as it is heard repeatedly it passes that body and it sinks to the core to the heart and then it opens up and it is heard from completely different place and amarnath says he's quoting kramara mahashi i know self and i do not know self both are false nowhere and i or not too and tanya says that was great bob listening to the spiel there was a relaxation recognizing there is no there is not really a problem the problem is imagination an old story is seeming to be believed in for years without the thought it is gone so it can't be true the one that thought seemed to be relating to is not found what is the me is just a word thought memory concept thank you so much and keith says hi bob and karen everyone and benjamin says what is bob's definition of soul does he use another word for it yeah i don't call it s-o-u-l i don't know anybody who's ever found a soul but it's s-o-l-e what we're talking about is non-jewelry one so that one is the soul one one atman not many souls one soul one soul not many souls one soul not many souls or Brahman, whatever label I like to put on it, it's the one soul, or soul.

And everything is that soul unitary, one essence, appearing as many. Yes, so we don't have equivalent for the word soul. We just basically question the existence of the separate soul and find there isn't one. So there's no need for the replacement word. Similarly with the ego or other things. Benjamin says thank you. And now I would like to invite every one of you to just open up and share. There are people, there are old-timers here, like Jane, she knows Bob for half of her lifetime or more. And Gilbert and Tazi and James has a nice clarity to him, even though he knows Bob for quite a short while.

So, thank you. And somehow, he, Heyman, needed help. Heyman and Dean, absolutely. Thank you. So there are small body parts around the spinal cord that when we do physical exercises or work in a week or in a day, I mean, after a while, we visit the chiropractor to fix them with simple moves and techniques and pressure. So I want to thank Bob to adjust some of the blocks in the system, in my mental system. You're a mental chiropractor. Yes. That's a nice metaphor. A very nice. Thank you. Thank you. I like getting my adjustments pretty regularly, too. Julia, come on. Share about your adjustments. Okay.

There isn't much to say. You know, I, too, like to share. You'll get a few more people, let's say, like Julia Spear. Talk to a teenager, you know. Can you adjust nothing? You can't. There's nothing to adjust. But it's fun to, like, because 99.999% of the, our fellow, I don't even know the word to use, dreamers or whatever, they're not even like, you know, nobody, you know, even considers that we're no thing. Who cares? Who cares? Yeah, I don't care. I don't care. I don't care. But when I feel, when I watch people suffer, my heart. It gets you, doesn't it? Huh? It gets you.

Well, whatever. You suffer in that many cases. That's not fair. When I see others suffer, and then I share with them what I've been coming to. It's fun to watch, to also, to watch the, it's like a light goes on, or, I don't know what happens, but it's really fun to, you know, to just, to share this with people. And when I was talking to a teenager the other day, well, it was funny, because she started out telling me that she was in her head. I'm like, oh, I've been there. I can relate to that. Huh? Just kneeling. Yeah. And then I just sort of shared with her that the thoughts are, well, they're just sounds.

And when those sounds are given meaning, oh, they're very important and special. But when the meaning is seen to be just kind of also more sound, well, then that's like kind of the, I don't know, I think what I had said to her, I don't know. But yeah. It's fun. I think people have the same idea. I mean, I love the snake and the rope metaphor. Yeah. So when you, you have somebody who is a really, really afraid of snakes and you turn the light on and you see that that snake has always been a rope. How long does it take for the fear to go away?

So grateful. Nothing much for me to contribute here. Yeah. Can you accept that? I have a comment. Oh, Adrian. Not sure if it's gonna come out too well. But I'm let go of trying to say things perfect. And I want to, I have a couple more questions. Okay. I think this is a love story. Definitely. I mean, it's different. It's really, really, I feel like, I think like a way to say it. I have a comment I'm not sure if it's going to come out too well but I'm letting go of trying to say things perfectly and perfectly non-dual and they come out perfect that's right seeing all that oh I've got to sound good and non-dual and stuff like that seeing all that it's bullshit let all that go but I like the idea of the light trying to find its way through the cracks and that's what it feels like it's for me it's sort of like the more that light and you've got to use words but it's more like that light which is the truth hears the truth the more it grows and the cracks get bigger or the separateness gets burnt up and seeing through more it's like the more truth hears truth the more it sees truth and starts to see through the stuff that's not truth sort of thing in a way which is words but yeah and the other thing I liked is that life that apparently brought us into this existence um relative this is good this is bad this is pleasant this is painful but this is not to be believed this doesn't have any answer it is just dividing it's a division software while the oneness of that being that miracle of the existence is there regardless of what the software is going to chuck on top of it it doesn't matter what the mind says it doesn't matter and of course it may matter relatively and may be appreciated but we all love the stories and there's nothing wrong in in that appreciation of the ten thousand things which were quite mind blowing and that's really the only way the beauty of love can exist through the appearance through the appearance of not one more than one but are they real?

are they all transient? are they all disappearing in a moment? I mean even in a moment you move attention somewhere else gone and the attention is constantly moving so they are not they are to be appreciated but they are not the ultimate truth they are phenomena like Bob says they are just the maya the rainbow the smoke in the mirrors that's it Tanya says though makes it so complicated when it's just that you know that you are thought, yes sorry thought makes it so complicated when it's just that you know that you are that's the only thing that you really know the rest of the things you believe and belief is nonsense as Bob said one thing you know that you are the rest, whatever else you know is a belief you know that the sky is blue?

yeah, go out at night see how well you know you know that you are a body? how? who told you that? so whatever else apart from the undeniable belief the undeniable fact of existence you think you know that's only thinking that you know you do know no, I was just going to comment more on the knowing yeah, I think I think Krishnamurti was trying to point in that direction as well when he was talking about freedom from the known because when we say we know something we are bringing well, something from the imaginary past or the dreaming or whatever that's not here now now which is 100% programmed and uniquely for all of us so it's like anyway, that's what I was thinking about when you thank you I have Tanya commenting on replying to her own comment on the Spiel how great is that you are never in the mind thought game the beliefs have nothing to do with you and that was on the there was a comment on listening to the Spiel was a relaxation recognising this that it's not really a problem problem is imagination old stories seem to be believed in for years without a thought it's gone and so it can't be true the one thought seems to be relaxing relating if it's not found and that is the meaning and I think there was one more comment from Donna so wonderful that which is seemingly everything and nothing does not need to know itself yet dreams arise of an apparent journey to know itself laughing out loud hi Donna yeah, isn't it cool super cool yeah Dean, did you want to say something?

no, no, no please no, I was just oh okay usually I always talk about a story I just realised so today I was trying not to think about the story which I have or I came with and then more focusing on the energy when Bob said it and of course the thing that you're not your body and then there's the energy and then when I sort of focus on that and I close my eyes I mostly notice like energy in my forehead and it feels like I don't know tickling or I don't know how to describe it but then before I felt it in my hands as well and then I sort of noticed that my hands you're laughing and my hands are sort of were crossing but they didn't feel like they're crossing anymore and then it felt like there's no thing I'm not connected to my hands and so that's the energy is it?

like it's yeah so it's pretty cool because it feels like you're not your body in some parts so yeah that's it yeah one thing one can sort of recognise is that seeing the activity of seeing is happening spontaneously and I'm not doing it there's no person there that's doing the seeing it's just happening spontaneously and that applies to this knowing as well the activity of cognition is happening spontaneously and you know to recognise this this is the way it is it's spontaneously happening life itself is spontaneous and then we add on meaning and structure and personal stuff but the what I used to call the first instant the only instant is that spontaneous cognition seeing, knowing and it's not there's no entity there there's no concept of an entity in that original spontaneous movement and then the idea of me is born through society and contact with the body with others.

But a good question to ask is, where am I seeing from? Where am I actually seeing from? And if you recognise that the me is just a fiction, a story, a story can't see anything, a word can't see anything, an idea can't see anything. So the me can't see anything, but in the scheme of things it borrows the seeing and constructs its own personal story to survive, because life is a jungle out there. But just coming back to that spontaneous nature of phenomena, it's not me doing it. There's no me there doing it. It's a fiction. It's a fiction. You can't... You can't even do anything about it.

That's the way it expresses. And there's pointless fighting against it, but you can see it for what it is. And then there's a sense of relief, because it's almost like there's a choice. You don't have to follow the thoughts about me, because that always leads to trouble or drama or whatever. Because the me has to survive, and it will... I don't know if you remember the panic for toilet paper. What a strange thing. Everyone's buying up all this toilet paper. Some strange survival thing. People have to wipe their ass, and that's the most important thing. The last thing you would have expected everyone to do.

Yeah, I thought baked beans. Baked beans. Anyway, that's the way it is. But where am I seeing from? That's a really practical thing to ask, and you can't really answer it, but the seeing is happening. I liked a metaphor you used once about Mickey Mouse. Oh yeah, Mickey Mouse. Yeah, you can talk more about that, but it's like the... Does the fictitious... The fictitious character. When I was a child, when I was a child, let's start early, a long time ago, I was a child. Mickey Mouse was a huge cartoon thing. Every time you went to the movies, there'd be a Mickey Mouse cartoon with Goofy and all the rest.

And Mickey Mouse is a fictitional character, like me. The me is a fictitional character. But you can watch a cartoon. At no point is Mickey Mouse going to jump off the screen and come and pinch your ice cream or your popcorn. It's not going to happen. So Mickey Mouse is a character. And so is the image of self. The image of self is... There's nothing static or permanent about it that's constantly changing, and it's very fragile. Somebody only has to say something that's challenging or... Challenging or insulting to that image and all hell breaks loose if you're invested in it. So it's a good thing to realise that it...

The me is just a Mickey Mouse. Walt Disney. And Disneyland. I mean, Disneyland is this huge thing that people go to. That's on the bucket list. Go to Disneyland. What for? They even have Mickey Mouse... You know, people dressed up as Mickey Mouse walking around. It's great for kids, but grown-ups... And party. Yeah. I don't think we're going to Disneyland. I think I'm not a grown-up yet. I was just talking about, you know, knowing that you are. I've said in the past to quite a few people, you know that you are. And they go, well, everyone knows that. Yeah. Without realising the significance of saying everyone knows that.

If you're old, very old or very young, or a Muslim or a Christian or a Hindu or a man or a woman or whatever. If you're a good person or a bad person. Even, you know, the murderer or the most vile individual knows that. It's incredibly significant, you know, that everyone knows that. And they don't have to think to know it. There's no thought required to be. Everyone's being. You don't have to say I am to know you are. It's non-conceptual. A non-conceptual being which is present prior to becoming a Muslim, becoming a man, becoming a woman or anything else. I was just thinking about, you know, as we were talking about knowing.

All the drama that comes about from wanting to know. All the, all the, oh, I don't know. I want to know. I don't know. But I don't know. But I want to know. Desire. Yeah. And the desire to not desire to not desire. Nothing, nothing more I can really say about that except that. It's, it could be encouraged to allow yourself to be as clueless as you already are. And Bob says the only problem we ever have is the ignorance. You want to say a couple of words about that? Well, that's what I tell you. Ignorance. Not that we're dull or stupid. We ignore our true nature.

It just means we turn our back on what's there already and focus into the story and ignoring the light of life that you really are. The actuality. Now we get distracted with the story. Yes, Hayman. Thank you. Ignorance is a solvable problem. And that's Bob's essentially essential suggestion. It is ignorance which is my problem, which ultimately is not my problem. It's my problem. It is not that I want to have this problem. It is that I can't solve this problem because there is a process which includes everything. And well, that's what is. It is. It is what is. And yeah. That happened within that presence.

Thank you. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yes. Just a response. I was just going to say if you know that you're ignorant, are you really ignorant? You're probably right. Everything is right. I mean, everything is meant to happen exactly as it is. I just don't have control on it. I have a lot of tension and stress in the system. Not that I want to bring it here and just. I don't have control. I don't have control. I don't exist to have control. If there was a bottom that I can press and all entire humanity or entire, you know, intelligence being in all galaxies, Andromeda, you know, Milky Way, everywhere become enlightened, I would do it faster than blink of eye.

I don't have control and I don't exist and it is obsession that I'm repeating this over and over and over. That's also something that I'm aware of. I'm implying my detective, I mean, the precise detection of small things but persistent that can remain in the system and cause big things in a long time. But your presence here has got positive influence on my system. I thank you for this. Did you want to comment, Bob, on that? No? I'd like to comment just about the stress. This question that I heard the other day that I just like it. Is that what is apparently happening? I like that one.

That question, is that what is apparently happening? It's sort of an invitation to notice that it's not what's really happening. It's still a story in your head. Yeah. Right? Any stress or anxiety is about what's not happening now. Yeah, thank you. I think there's multiple ways to look at things and one way is you can dismiss things as not happening or you can just accept them fully as they are. And I think... That's the thing. And it may get you to the same place. But I think this thing that, you know, it's a story. Well, isn't that also a story? It's a story that it's a story.

And you just get in this infinite regress. And I think one way to contend with the challenges of life is to realize that we are the ones that respond to them. And when you see the truth, you get the truth. And that's exactly what it is. That we create the way we're feeling. We create our reality from that perspective. You can either accept or resist. Generally it comes down to those two things. And it may not always be able to be simplified to those two things. But I think there's this strength and power that comes from realizing that in this moment, I create how I feel.

And the answer is how, right? Is it through experience? Is it through acceptance? Is it through recognizing that it's all one? Is it through releasing resistance, surrender? And I think the concept of non-duality is also just a story. And if you go to any sage, anyone, everyone sees reality in a slightly different perspective. They'll all say slightly different things. Sometimes it's profoundly different. So who's right? I don't buy this thing that there's one universal truth. Because what is truth? When you really investigate truth, it's not so easy to see. And so I think everyone has to construct their own path. And there's a famous Bruce Lee quote that I like.

Take what is useful, disregard what is useless, and add what is specifically your own. And when you try and mold your uniqueness, and add what is unique consciousness to that of others, I think you just become a sheep. And so getting back to the original question of the soul, I see it sort of as the Hindu Atman. You know, there's an essence, there's a divine intelligence within us that's not separate from the one. But we all have a unique expression of it. And I think we should rejoice in that uniqueness. And we should allow our own wisdom to come through. I think this is vitally important.

Otherwise, ideologies form, more concepts form, and more division forms. And ultimately, I think that brings you all closer to one. So anyway, that's just some thoughts. Did you want to comment, Bob? No? I have a couple of comments from people who are with us online. And of course, what James speaks, he speaks from his own experience. If anyone resonates, you can... Because that's completely different to what we say. It may be helpful, but we don't really construct the concept of the me that can choose how to respond, or the me that has free will. It's a little bit different. This is your experience. It's not good or bad.

It's valid for you. But it's not the non-duality the way Bob speaks it. And it may be better. Someone wants to speak. Okay, I'll read it later. Hello, everyone. This is my first time. I'm here. Hey, you're welcome. Hello. Thank you. I like what's happening here. This is actually crazy. This is actually crazy that we have someone here serves as a broken record, telling the truth again, again, again, again, in different words, different sentences, through different descriptions. Of different objects, but the same thing again, again, again. And he has been doing this for several years, from what I heard. Which is crazy, but it's good.

It's good. And we have a room of people here listening to the same thing again, again, again, again. And then you go out and live your own life. And then you come back and listen again. And then you go back. And then you come back and live your own life. And it happens. Yeah. Just, it is good. But it's also crazy. But what's crazier is people out there, they don't know this. And they're living their life not knowing what's really happening. Like a machine. That is actually more crazy. Yes. Yes. And, yeah, to speak to your point. You reckon that there's no universal truth. There may or may not be.

No, nothing he's experienced, I think. Well, I think there could be. There could be, but it may not be an on or off thing, right? It may not be there is or there isn't. It could be a continuum, a spectrum. There could be truths that are mostly universal, right? And so what's your perspective on it? What he said or what Buddha has said, that is true. That is truth. That is the, not the end of the truth. That's the most fundamental way of expressing the truth. The way we live, we are also expressing the truth. But doesn't mean truth ends here, right? So what Buddha has already said, everything about how to, even how to go to the path of liberation and how we, why we suffer and the ignorance and everything.

The veil of forgetting and everything. It's all true. So I just sense this weird sense of still not complete faith that I heard from what you said. There's also, it's not even flexibility. It is, there's still things that you think you don't know. Which makes sense. It's the one thing that I know. Which makes total sense. Yes, that's why it makes sense. But faith is very important to, to live a life in this body. The Buddha had a definition of truth. The principle, the cognizing principle, there's something that's cognizing all of that change. And that's not changing. It's always cognizing. It cognizes deep sleep. It cognizes the dream state.

It cognizes the waking state. All of that. All of that transience moves upon it or within it. Or you can't really explain. But I think that's the truth that's being pointed to. Yes. That which never ever changes. And it must be formless. Yes. Yeah. But if the point, that's exactly right. Like the truth is being pointed to, right? So how can we, how can we claim that you can feel you know the truth? It's the impersonal. No. Just once I'm done. It's, it's the, it's the impersonal. I know it's a bit of an odd way of doing the conversation. But. And so there can be a knowing of truth.

But any expression of it is bound to be subject to its own limitations. And if you say Buddha knew the truth, then one could argue that Christ didn't know the truth. Or Mohammed didn't know the truth. Or you could say they all knew the truth. But expressing it in different ways. And so that's how I see things. And if you say that's a universal truth, maybe it is. Or maybe it isn't. Maybe there's unique truths that they're both expressing. Or maybe there's an element of truths in everything. But I think personally for me, this recognition that I don't know is the, is the most liberating thing.

And that welcomes a discussion from all different perspectives. And that's what I think is important. Yeah. And it actually doesn't segregate, but unites. Yes. We don't know because Buddha has things that he didn't know. He knows where things began and where things end. Because like everything started from nothingness and it's just a cycle. But why that was a phenomena, he didn't know. So yes, there are things we don't know. There will be always be things that we don't know. But there are things that we don't know. There are things that we do know. That we know is the truth. So. Like the truth of your own being.

And that's the only thing. And the truth about love and how, why we're all one. And we're expressing the one thing which is nothing. But yeah, they are, yeah. And there are unique patterns of energy. You know. But each unique pattern of energy, there's only one thing they know for sure. And that's the truth of their own being, of their existence. And you know, Bob pointed out, the rest of it is a story. And I just could not get my head around that for years and years. Because the problem was, I was in my head. I was in the story. There was me, you know, the biggest character as Gilbert said in the story.

And then everything that happened to me. And you know, and I was, you know, suffering from terminal uni. And I was, you know, suffering from terminal uni. And I was, you know, suffering from terminal uniqueness. You know. And you know, and coming here for 38 years or 34 years, it had been pointed out, as you said, over and over again. But I resonated with it. But the mind could not get its head around it. You know. And the me, the alleged me, you know, just would not let go. And I was, you know, I was in the story. I was in my mind. I was in the world.

And then started to just be locked. Let go. You know. And it was like a whirling dervish. The me and the other. The me and the other person, place or thing. The me and the other person, place or thing, over and over again. And then all of a sudden, I just dropped away. And I did nothing. I did nothing. And then all of a sudden, just dropped away. And I did nothing. I did nothing. Buddha said, with our thoughts, we make the word. And one of Bob's point is this. What's the mind? Watch the mind and see how it operates. It's a very simple sentence, very ordinary language, nothing spiritual about it, and anyone can do it.

If you watch the mind and see how it operates, it reveals everything you need to really know about your own mind, which doesn't really exist as a separate thing. But the question, where am I seeing from? We all have our philosophical points of view and everything, but where is that narrative seen from? What is actually witnessing this narrative? The narrative satisfies something in us, but it's never true. The narrative is never true, because the natural state is wordless and silent, and this is very significant. All insights. All insights don't have words. The insight is naked. It's a moment of pure seeing. And it's nothing but seeing, but we want it to be permanent.

And the one who wants to be permanent is the one that's getting in the way and dividing it up. So if you watch the mind and see how it operates, you recognize that the mind can only divide itself. It can't divide the wholeness. The wholeness is... It's wholeness, no matter what happens. But this thing we call mind can only divide itself, and it divides itself through words and meaning and personal points of view and investments in a pictorial character. And that's where all the suffering comes from. Psychological suffering is not necessary. There's no one on this planet who will argue in favor of it unless they're absolutely nuts.

Nobody wants... Psychological suffering. And it's unnecessary. But we have to watch the mind and see how it operates. Because if we're always wanting answers to come from somewhere else, we're just being caught back into the same old thing, which is Maya. And what the mind does is it wants to name and claim everything. Yeah, of course. It wants to name and claim everything because that's its nature. That's the way it operates. It's a clunky thing when you really see it. You know? It's just naming and claiming, naming and claiming. When you realize it's just a little phantom running around, it's, yeah, it takes away all that disease.

This wholeness that Bob's talking about, that is what sees the thoughts and knows the thoughts, you know? The thoughts come as words and images. Yes. And it's a transit in an emptiness. Here, somewhere. Okay? That's the simplicity of it there, right there. What is witnessing or seeing or knowing the thoughts? What is that? What is that? That's the investigation. That's what we have to find out. What is that seeing? And this seeing is happening without eyes. Yeah. The eyes can't see. Yeah. It's seeing images here, what we say inside the head, in this empty space. It's seeing those images without using eyes. It's hearing the thoughts without using ears.

That's right. So it's a cognizing nothingness that has no form and of itself has no beginning or no end. That's right. Never arises and never sets. It's the timeless knowing, being. All these words we try to put together to explain it and it goes so far. It's a cognizing singularity. Mm-hmm. Essential. It's written so perfectly in Bob's book. Keep seeing that there is no thing that sees. It's just incredible. You just see that in itself. There is no central point that sees anything. It's just a seeing. And within the seeing, there's a knowing. And it's all infused into this. It's the experience of being. And it's miraculous.

I think you said something about not celebrating or rejoicing in our experience. It's natural to rejoice. Like, how can you not rejoice when there's no one to be in the way of anything? Like, this is just a spontaneous experience of rejoicing and celebrating in the not seeing. There's no one that's actually seeing. And that's all. Yeah. I think just jumping off that and something I wanted to say before is, like, you can't try to be aware, right? It's just this recognition that you're aware is where the freedom comes from. And I think having someone that has recognized that in themselves, like Bob, there's sort of an impersonal imprint onto an individual that sort of, it can't be described.

And I think that's the, but, you know, even that can be set up for limitations, right? Because someone listening may be, well, you know, is he claiming something that I don't have? Do I need to see someone that's awake so that I can be awake? And is there really awake into sleep? Or is it just, is it all just perfect? And that's like the minute you get into words. And we all end up to the same place. So when you recognize that, why not just have fun with the words and not take them too seriously, right? Okay. So you said something, but you just said something.

The words, when we get into that, the further we go into the words, the further we steer from the truth. Yeah. Yeah, Bob wants to wrap it up. He doesn't need that one. Yeah, just you to speak. In the 40 odd years. I've been spoken this. I haven't been able to fix that broken record. Wonderful. Keep it on. Thank you. Not broken. Good point. Yes. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you, everyone.