USA Sunday evening zoom meeting with Bob. 28/29 Nov 2021

There you go. Done. Thank you. Can you speak on? Yeah, you don't need it. You have your headphones. Yeah. Good to see you all. Another day. And it rolls around the sun. Today it's daylight. Yeah. Where you're at is probably dark. Just naturally and spontaneously happening. So, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. All things take place in that. Nothing you can postulate or think of can be being outside that space, and that space is utterly aware, totally awake, and everything appears on it, including you, me, and everything else.

We are in essence that space like a land. Non-connection. conceptual, ever fresh. And what's differentiating? Words, thoughts, ideas, images. And how many of these words we are born with. Life essence that's forming that pattern, shape and form is initially when it first appeared had no words. And then it's learnt words which are the life essence itself vibrating, patterning and shaping and forming into all this manifestation and everything in it. Nothing but that space like awareness. So it's all things. You're a thing, I'm a thing, the room's a thing you're in, the trees are things, the flowers, all things appearing in that space like silence and stillness.

Which is no thing. It's just a thing. Can something come from nothing? It can't. So the so-called we, you, me and everything else is still that no thing. It's appearing as all these different things. And how we discriminate and how it's discriminated is why these words we've learnt. We recognise it's all one essence, patterning, shaping, forming, appearing as all these things, everything. We divide it up. It's divided by each seeming pattern. It has the capacity to fuse with that intelligence energy of knowing and discriminating. That's the amazing wonderment of it all. It's life, expressing, patterning, shaping and forming. It's that pure beingness, loving, being, to be.

That's the activity. The vibration. It's the natural love, the sense of wellbeing, being well. Nothing wrong anymore. The sport of Shiva, if you like to call it that. The play of consciousness. And it's the amazing ways and wonderful ways it's playing, playing and expressing, implying, it must be suffused with the innate. And it must not be the same. It must be the same, the same, the same, the same, the same. The same, the same, the same, the same, the same, the same. The same, the same, the same, the same, the same, the same. intelligence. It's not just peering willy-nilly all over the place. It's expressing in an intelligent way, knowing what is necessary.

Vibrates as everything and in that vibration there is a discrimination. The words, we put different labels and words. I'm saying we, but there's no we. It's all that one essence. It's expressing as this amazing intelligence, universe, the cosmos. And for these patterns to be able to discriminate and recognise it, if that intelligence wasn't there, then it wouldn't be able to do anything. If it was just a form of discrimination, suffusing through each seeming pattern and expressing it as the different shapes and forms, what would it be? It'd be just that absolute essence. It'd go into waste, wouldn't it? If it didn't vibrate into different patterns and express in different patterns, shapes and forms.

Look at the amazing things through that discrimination. Amazing things that could happen. And they can only happen in their opposites. The so-called vibration vibrates into words, thoughts, feelings, ideas, images. And there can't be one without the same appearance of the other. There'd be no manifestation. If it didn't vibrate into the opposites, then we didn't put the labels or the words on the other. But we've taken them to be separate. We're seemingly separating the inseparable, the indivisible, dividing it. And that's how we get this amazing expression and patterning. It's appeared, learnt, taken the words to be separate. But the thing is, in that division, the sense of the word is not the same as the sense of separation.

We've made the seemingly division, the seemingly opposites and the way the opposites manifest. There could be no differentiation if they didn't divide into opposites. Even though it's only a seeming division, it's still the one essence. But with the labels and words and the meaning in the labels and words, we see all this separation. It's a very interesting expression. It's a very interesting expression. It's a very interesting expression. Just like some of the two sensations or words we picked up seemingly divide, vibrates them good, bad, pleasant, painful, happy, slurred, loving, hating, me, you, I, that, all those. Any way we can describe it, know anything about it.

And the belief goes in to this pattern. That I am this person. I am the separate entity of this individual believed in the individual. Yeah. and I takes on, takes delivery of these thoughts and feelings, energy of belief going into it. And we put the meaning into the words and separate the inseparable, seemingly so. And it seems so real that we believe it is so. We take ourselves as persons, separate entities, individuals, human beings, all the word. And in the beginning it was the word. That's where it all suddenly started. And the analogy in the Bible, Adam and Eve were in a garden of even, paradise, living in paradise.

There was nothing wrong. Everything was beautiful. But they hated the tree of knowledge of good and evil. In other words, they learnt words. Kicked out of paradise. Because when they learnt the words, all the opposite divisions come up. I am this person. I am the separate entity. I am fearful. I am unhappy. I am depressed. Instead of saying with I am the absolute. I am that godliness, if you like to use that term. I am that which patterns, shapes and forms, all this manifestation, seemingly creates it. But there is no creator of such. There is no creation. And there are no creatures. That's which we have been created.

No where appear to be. It still has never changed its natural state. It is the one essence. The godliness, if you like to use that term. The only. Only is another name of the word. Only is the one. Only is the one. Only is the one. Only is the one. Only is the one. Only is the one. Only is the one." Everything is that and there is no problem with that at all. With the learning of words putting the division up. See the misery, the unhappiness. The depression, the guilt, shame, remorse. Jealousy, envy. All of these patterns that are formed as well as the seemingly good patterns that are forming.

All vibration, all or somewhat of a movement. Somewhat meaning it's not a full movement. It's a throb, a pulsation. They call it spander in some of the scriptures. Beginningless and endless. Constantly transient. Constantly changing. Ever changing like the ocean. Like the ocean. But never changing like the ocean. Like the ocean but the ocean is contained in it also. So is everything else. So no thing that you and I are has ever happened. Though it appears to be so. And that's what they call phenomenal manifestation. And the definition of phenomenal is that which appears to be all of these so-called things are appearances. They're not the actual.

They're not the real. They're all dreamlike. And we've divided that even into the sleeping dream and the waking dream. But it's still only the one essence appearing in all the variety and differentiation. Instead of locking into it in the belief that it's real, investigate and see if it is the actual. That's where the freedom comes from. The freedom. Because we've got this belief which then we lock into it. And it's causing all the problems. Krishnamurti wrote a book, Freedom from the known. Drop the known and be the knowing. And then you're not bound in that belief. You're not bound in that believing in the known and taking it to be real.

In the knowing, you're back into the changing. The ever changing. The constant vibration. The constantly moving. And you're back. I'm not using the term back. There's no back or something. But you're back in the sensation of the actual. Not the imagined future. But the past. The dead past. That's the knowing. Knowing is like the seeing. The hearing. The tasting. The touching. The smelling. The ING gives us something that is happening right in this presence. It's not was. It's not will be. It just is. And everything is that. Which we know. That is the chair. That is the room. That is the room. That is the tree.

That is the sky. Everything is manifest. We put these labels. And taking the thatness. Which implies everything is that. To put discriminating it. Separating it. And that division is the cause. Of all the psychological suffering. All the fear. The anguish. The depression. The guilt. The sobering was. It's caused by that belief. In the separation. The definition of belief. And it's not the actual. It's taken to be actual. But it's not the actual. The definition of belief is an unquestioned acceptance. Accepting something without questioning. An unquestioned acceptance of something. Whatever these things are. Without knowledge or proof. We haven't investigated them. We've accepted them without question.

Taken them to be real. Acceptance of an alleged fact. Taken them to be facts when they're not. We're religion. You're to be fact. Acceptance of an alleged fact. Without positive. Knowledge or proof. Knowledge or proof. And when you investigate. Some of these beliefs we've taken on. You'll see they're not real. Like you look. Go down to the ocean. See the water. The ocean. So what a beautiful. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. You'll see. Added to that it was a beautiful blue sea. Pull a bucket of water out of it.

There was no blue in the cement. There never was. You turn away from it. You still see it as blue. But the differences now. You've investigated it. You pulled the bucket of water out and it's not blue. You know the truth about it. So you can still admire it. And say it's a beautiful blue sea. But you're not bound by it. You know when we were kids we believed in Santa Claus. It's carried on from what our parents told us. our parents told us. It didn't take us long to wake up from that but we still do it to this day because we got pleasure out of it when we were little children.

So to give our children the same pleasure, we put on this belief, put on this idea that they're a centre for it and it's real. There's many different things out there when you investigate. They won't stand up to investigate. We believe that the earth was flat. People stood on the shore years ago and were told where the sea and the sky met. Don't go out there, you'll fall off the edge of the earth and people believe that. Who would believe it today? No one but it still appears to be the same when you look at the soil. Where there's a horizon, where the sea and the sky met, it seems like it's the end of the end of the earth but have a look at it, watch it.

When the sun goes down over the horizon there's not a big splash and a cloud of steam rises up. It hasn't fallen into the water at all but it appears to many things which you investigate and they use that many inputs pointed out in the scriptures. There's a snake in a rope. A fellow sends out of his cabin one dark and rainy and wet night. It's cold and he steps out and treads on a piece of rope and he thinks immediately he hasn't seen what it is but immediately the sense of fear goes through him because he believes he's tromped on a snake because it rolled under his feet and he's done it.

Goose pimples come up and the fear and the tremor in his hair stands on end. The sudden fear goes through him but somebody comes out and shines a torch and look it's only a piece of wet rope and there's immediately sense of relief but what was cool stirred up physically the emotion doesn't die down straight away and the goose bumps are still there and they're shaking a little. It'll take a little bit longer but he's seen through it. He's not carrying it around and what it's caused is the emotions the sensations in the body. It's gone beyond the thought, fear and the emotion. Thought is happening when we learn words.

The capacity of reading development. Learn words is about two and a half and we've taken on those words and put belief into the words by the same token. As we think the snake is in the rope before we investigate we think those words are real. Our parents told us, little Johnny and little Billy don't go there don't do this this is this no it's not this do that and we weren't born with any of these words. These words didn't come upon us until after we've been around for a couple of years but the energy of belief has gone into them and we carry that belief until something takes you to look a little bit further into this.

Investigate it and that's why you're looking into this stuff because something in that intelligence energy you asked us this is not good enough there's too much fear and anxiety and stress going on. The world's in a terrible place and I've believed most of us have taken on the belief in the higher power or a thing we call God and we think it's a power greater than ourselves it's the power that functions this universe and they're right in that respect it is the power that's that fashion shows and forms this universe but we think we're separate from it and we've got to believe in this power and recognize this power and understand this power and this will look after us and that's right also.

But you ought to realize that there is only that power you are not the separate entity you believe yourself you are already that because if it's non-dual as one of the scriptures will tell us one without a second not two what else can there be apart from that that's what we miss out on we should believe in the so-called God and God's going to save me and do this who's the me that is going to say is there anything separate from the one without a second the absolute the totality so even though it's expressing in different pattern shapes and forms in all the variety not only us as humans but the trees the flowers the continents the satellites the stars the moon the seasons and all this it's all the one this is everything is that and that's what we are we are things things are seemingly pattern shapes and forms that are appearing in the no thing but the very fact that it is no thing you must realize the real recognition comes up can something come from no thing that can't so it's a conceptual limit.

The concept of the no thing is that it is no thing. even if you look at the image we've taken on and believed to be Ruth and we suffer accordingly from them with the sense of separation comes isolation insecurity vulnerability if you think feel you're separate and especially when you're little children you don't know what all this other stuff is going on around you is but it might hurt me like they're damaged for me so I'm fearful about it I've got to do something about it. So natural conflict goes on, trying to get rid of the fears, the anxieties, the stressors, the guilt through the words we've learned and believed in.

And sadly, our parents, our schools have reinforced it, purely and simply because they've never understood it themselves. And there again, you look around and see all these scriptures and traditions that are going on and read some of them and recognise something in them, a resonation that there's truth in this. So I've got to give myself up to this. I'm never going to bother to investigate. I try to become it instead of investigating and seeing it. Am I separate in the first place? Was I ever separate? Will I or can I ever be separate? And some of those traditions have understood that. I'll tell you, it's non-conceptual.

It's ever fresh. It's one without a second. It's non-dual. It's absolute. It's the great perfection. Now it's there, but we don't take notice. I think we need to become. I think we need to become. I think we need to become. Or change. But what does becoming imply? Implies there's something I think that I'm not, that I'm going to get or become, that will make me whole and complete. Because I'm told in these traditions that you're separate, you're a sinner, you're an evil person, you shouldn't do this. You need to become whole or complete. And that's an impossible task. If you're never separate, how are you going to become something that you already are?

I could say the crude term, but I better not. But you know what I mean. Like pushing against the tide. If you believe you think there's a separate entity, and you've taken it to be true, and you've believed in it for so long now all of your life, now somebody comes along and tells you you're not that, and something within you innately knows that and starts to resonate with you. Well, in that investigation, you'll certainly resonate more until you realise that I've already been that. I was never separate in the first place. Because they call it non-duality. What's duality mean? It's mean there's more than one.

Me. And other than me. That's dualism. They say it's non-conceptual. Non-conceptual means no concept. Ever fresh. It's not time bound. It's just immediacy. Presence awareness. It's this awareness. I'm not unaware. I'm existing. I am presently in it. Just this and nothing else. Just this. Presence awareness that's with you right now, that is you right now. And nothing else. As all these things are still appearing around you and about you. And I don't know. But they're no thing. It's the same as that body of mind you call yourself is a thing. And something cannot come from the no thing. All are clearly on that basic screen.

The silence. The emptiness. The stillness. It has no boundaries. Has no centre to it. Has no circumference. So how can you say it's a thing? And we all, every so-called thing is appearing in that no thing. And some thing cannot come from no thing. So it's already that. And we've got this believed in thing that is on the search. It's got the taste. It's got the taste. It's got the sense and smell. There's a little bit more to it than this. And I'm going to become realised and know. Because they tell me in the scriptures, know the truth. And the truth will set you free.

It doesn't say believe in it or think about it. But know it. And aren't you knowing right now? Well be that knowing. Recognise that knowingness. It's a functioning. Put labels on it and discriminate. Functioning intelligence. Intelligence is knowing. And energy is an activity. And activity is a movement. So that knowing. Each and every one of you that are there right now are knowing. Being. Knowing. Loving to be. Which is another way they put that at an end. You're being right now. Not was or will be. But being. And you're knowing that. Not did know or will know. But knowing. The I-N-G-O. There was something happening right now.

And that knowing is a sense of wellbeing. An idea. A sense of security. Of wholeness. Of completeness. Of happiness. As you're loving to be. But because of this conceptualising. In belief they've come up. It obscures. Like a cloud obscures the sun. And you seem to lose sight of it. You're not it. You need to become it. But you are being right now. Without thinking about it. Know that you are being right now. Know that in the immediate. You're being right now without having to think about it. And you're knowing that. But you have to say, I know. The knowingness is happening. And you're loving to be.

You don't want to be dead right now, even though it might be pretty miserable, of all the concepts we're taking it from. That's why we try to keep going, because we love to be. But not acknowledging that. And that's one of the scriptures saying, acknowledge him. The him, the thing you call him, is that life essence or godliness, which is not a thing, but it's other than the totality. Acknowledge him in all thy ways, that he will direct thy path. And that's so. Isn't it that same being, knowing and loving to be, that's breathing you right now? Did you think about that breath you took?

Isn't it expanding and contracting your heart? Did you think about that? Isn't it blinking your eyes? Doing all the other things that are going on. Digesting your food. Causing the blood to run round the body. And the thing you call brain. The life essence in that brain to causing it to function. It's saying what to do. What not to do. Causing the thinking to happen. But then again, we take the thought to be my thought. I am thinking. And we put the conceptual I or me. It's obscuring the totality. And we miss out on the natural, spontaneously, effortless living that you are. Now we need these words and things to functioning.

So the word is not the enemy. It's the tool. When you understand and recognise. It can discriminate. And seemingly divide. But no, it's only seemingly so. Even though it appears to be. Like the earth rolls round the sun. This part that's facing the sun where I am. It's light, it's daylight. And the sun is shining brilliantly at the moment. but a cloud can come up and send me obscura but as it rolls around the earth it's changing and when it faces away from the sun there's darkness now does the earth really know anything about darkness what is darkness isn't it the absence of light the light has been obscured and disappeared and what's light when this comes around the other way the absence the light is the absence of darkness so is the darkness real and is the light real but it's constantly changing it seems to be again we've taken the appearance of the seamen to be real there's a thought you had a moment ago you believed in it not the word this is a thought what is thought real what is thought isn't it sound when it's silent it's just a vibration vibrates what's the vibration it's sound sound is noise sound vibration it's word so a word is just a vibrating movement of energy the same as if you've got a piano or a guitar you press a note on it or you're playing that guitar string what's it do it vibrates it makes a sound and from that you know utilizing this body you can make a tune out of it a melody a song or sound just the same as the vibration here forms words words become sound a vibration which was called thought thought becomes a feeling a sensation when that sensation vibrates into word or sound and then that sound or word will go into the book in the body as an emotion it'll cause that feeling to be there the emotion sadness the happiness and all of it and that seems to be real the label without the word have a look what's there what can you say without the word what was the thought say what's wrong if i don't think about it you can have taste of that you had a taste of it and that buried when there's been no thought coming on what can you say about it then can you say it's good bad pleasant or playful and not while the thought is gone when the thought comes up he'll say there was nothing wrong without the thought it was good there was a feeling of peace of contentment a sense of well-being an affectionate awareness of being nothing wrong anymore if nothing wrong that must be right and so you've described the discrimination of right and wrong has disappeared it's just as it is because you can't say it's right or wrong but there's that sense of well-being presence there and it tells you again when no discriminating thoughts arise the old mind ceases to be the old conceptual way of thinking sections to be and what is presently presently being recognized will come up the way they put it as thought free presence awareness let the thoughts be free don't fixate on them and rather conceptualize it there i again that i mentioned before about the book that christianity wrote with the title freedom from the known and that's what happens when you're free what's your freedom from the known what's known but the knowing will be fresh in you and you don't get down get bound in it and leave it as it is it's going to move along because there's no thought fixing your dad where are yesterday's thoughts are they there now some might be some might be carrying around and fixated on them but if they're not fixated on where do they go they disappear back into the emptiness again and whether they're there again and we're relating to the old labels on we go back into the old sensation of the old fear oh this is unhappy this is anger this is fearful i don't like it or he said this and i don't want anything and i shouldn't be believing this all old concepts are bringing out we regurgitate them as kipley said a dog will return to his vomit and that's so the dog goes and brings up one of those we'll go back and ease it again sooner or later and then we bring these thoughts up we're going back into the old thing you don't have to do it recognize what's going on and you don't have to carry on with it every thought is fresh and new we're not putting the concepts the images on it and seeing it's nothing but a vibration a movement of energy and it's all happening to the believed in me and the believed in me the ego is a concept also there is no such thing as an ego as they say he goes when i go that's true see that ego is a fiction it's a conceptual image it's a dead image that is based on past events experiences conditioning on yesterday or thoughts from a minute ago with the fears or the anger or the unhappiness all dead what's wrong with right now if everything is fresh and new it might be a similar thought going on but if i see it is that just a new fresh and new vibration the movement of energy and don't fixate on it unfixated awareness i'm not trying to keep it there and it's free to do what it's doing anyway it's not attached there it'll move on as left as it is everything is just it is right now.

When you don't fixate on it, it's constantly changing. But we got into the habit of attaching to thoughts, feelings and emotions. And today the continuity of that keeps us in this conceptual image, this egoic image. Ego is the I thought and the I thought is the believed in conceptual image that we are. See, it's just a thought like everything else. It has no substance or independent nature, just another vibration of energy. We take it to be me or mine, instead of recognise there's no I or me that does anything. It's the life essence itself. It's the absolute. That's what seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, smelling, thinking, feeling, all this manifesto is happening.

We divided that when we heard words like that. We've broken the absolute down into a believed in egoic person. Person, persona, meaning the mask, a mask of conceptual image. So the person is the absolute. It's not reality. Reality is only the one reality, the absolute. Non-conceptual, ever fresh, presence awareness. Presence is happening right now. And that presence is not the media, you see. Before any of the senses have even started, it's pre-sense. But it's not unaware. But you can't tell me what awareness is. But you know, right now, that you're not unaware. You haven't disappeared. You are still appearing. You are still being. And the basic knowing is there.

And the loving to be is there. What am I trying to add to it, to fix it up? Can anything be added to the absolute? It wouldn't be the absolute if there was. And recognise that feel that, that you are the absolute right now. You are not separate. Both seem to be so and seemingly so. Question it... Are you the body? Are you the body? You know that because you're saying, Joe! You're the body! ogue my body. Are you this mind? You know that you're not the body or the mind. I am this mind. Am I unaware? You know that. You're not dead. So the knowing is there.

So the being is there, the knowing is there, and the loving to be is there. Absolutely there right now. So why would I continue to seek if that is what I am? The only reason I'd continue to seek would be the belief that some of us say, oh I'm not there yet. I've got to become something. But being is not becoming and never will become. Being is being. Becoming implies a future time. It's not going to happen. I saw a couple of people that took a look at the word being, asked them what the meaning of being is. What is the meaning of being? What is the meaning of just being or in a way, which is the more real thing?

And yet, as they say, you will never get the answer in the mind. And that's- we've taken on this mind, and it's very useful and we think it can do everything, but it's not doing that. Life isn't as oppressing. It's doing it all. So you can't negate that beingness right now. label human take away the label supreme what are you left with to take those words off try and re-goat the negate the beings without the word and right here and now without even thinking about it you can't say i am not if you can't say i am not you must be right here and there you are already that thing is don't forget it if you haven't recognized that investigate again have another look and see for yourself nobody is ever going to give it to you you might believe that it's a way nobody can ever give it to you how can they because you're already that that which is trying to give you is an appearance also as the believed in appearance the thinking can do this and do that however the appearance cannot do anything it's only seemingly and their life essence is functioning is that absolute which you already are you are that being so that's about it and you've all had taste of it if you've got any questions bring them out but it's an open season you can all get in and say what you think you know about normal reference might the way you might say it somebody might recognize where they might be recognized in here so it can be useful carry on get into it it's all yours this is a this is a welcome to fresh and new judy and jeff hi it's rich it's a welcome to fresh and new judy and jeff it's their first time here hi i've read i've read two i've read two of your books and also a book by gilbert yeah got the taste yeah i got a good taste of it i think good keep the tasting going i just wanted to say thank you bob i love you i hope it all goes well wednesday i have to go because i've got another appointment love to everybody and thanks for those wonderful pointers thank you thank you hi hi thank you jones love you yeah you take care you take care love you it's okay if i say something before i forget and so as jane was just bringing it bob's gonna um not be able to join us next week because of his surgery um that said there's quite a few people in this room who can continue the dialogue and i think bob would like that i could be wrong it happens once a year but um anyway if if you would like to wait until bob is back um i will send um my email address out into the chat and then if you write it down i will shoot you an email when he is back okay that's it good thank you julia thank you morning bob morning yeah a strange thing i noticed today as you say uh just uh thoughts are coming even this knowing is also is there the patterns are going but we have never involved in the pattern we have never involved in the pattern and patterns cannot touch us yeah thank you thank you bob this is kavita can you hear me Bob?

Yes, go ahead, I didn't say what the schedule was. Yeah, there's going to be a lag of what I speak because of my broadband here. Bob, can you talk something about witnessing? You know, witnessing is something that's being mentioned and also about relationships. So if you can talk about witnessing and relationships. You know, I kind of understand that when you're dreaming, there's lots and lots and lots and lots of people and you have relationships and when you wake up in the morning, they're all gone. But as far as the witnessing goes, you know, you're witnessing a dream. But in this case, in the waking dream.

There is still a witnessing going on. And can you just talk some more about that, please? Well, I'm not into the witnessing. I can't tell you much about it. Who's the witness? I mean, it has to be something that's separate and stands apart from. So if there's a believed in witness, that's still standing in the light of the absolute. It's all happening. It's happening. It's happening. All appearing, disappearing. There's no one who can claim to be the witness. It's a spontaneous thing happening. Some of you might have a different idea of it. Can I share, Bob? With your permission. Yeah. Witnessing means there is no ING there.

It is stillness already there. Normally, what we think witnessing is doing. So it's beyond doing and non-doing. It's stillness. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not. It's not.

It's not. It's not. Similarly with the relationship. Similarly with the relationship. So we are making relationship with our thoughts, not with others. So thinker is having relationship with the thoughts. So that is what going on. That is what the society, that is what the world. The relationship between the thinker and thoughts. But it cannot be any relation between these. So all these things are free. But as Bob says, we are fixing. So don't fix it. Then we will come to know that we cannot have relationship with anyone. Unless until the me. The pseudo me, a false me. As Bob says, I. So if that is not there, everything is you or me.

There is no difference at all. Thank you, Bob. Thank you. Very good. So Bob, when you are saying that there is no witnessing. But there is the I thought. Like when there is just plain seeing. Going on. And I say, I see that. Then that is the I thought saying that I see that. And that is like two ends of a stick. In the sense of the seer and what is seeing. Are one and the same. And there is only seeing going on. But if there is noticing that it is an I thought. Or if there is noticing that there is. That. You are kind of separated into a seer and a seeing.

That is what I was trying to. Say as witnessing. In a sense of noticing. Yeah. The thought I see can't see. The thing is we believe. That the thought I see as a seeing. Just like the thinking, thinking is happening. You don't know what your next thought is going to be. The thing is happening. And the thought comes up. I think you form a subject. Now is there such a thing as a subject, a separate entity? And I see the chair and the table, that's become the object. So subject-object is duality. Seeing is subject and the seeing is subject-object. Duality. But the two ends of the one stick.

There can't be a seer without seeing and there can't be the seen without seeing. So the seeing, the hearing, the thinking, the tasting, the touching, the smelling is the actuality. That's the spontaneous vibration going on. So as we put the eye on it, we've brought that believed in entity. It's very subtle. Instead of knowing that it's pure seeing, pure thinking, pure to- we've brought the eye to it and suddenly we believe it's me. The conceptual image. Seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, experiencing, expressing. It's just the seeing which divides itself into seer and seeing. The thinking which divides itself into thinker and thought seemingly. It's never been divided.

There's two ends of the same stick. Being, knowing, loving to be. Not I be, or I know, or I love to be. That's where we discover that it's just pure. It's purity. Dr. Amarnath, can you go into a little bit more about- it's a relationship with a thought. So if I have a relationship with my mother or my father, then that's just a thought that's there per se. That's the one. So you put the word belief- relationship on it. You make it relative. There is a natural- it's not related, even though it appears to be so. It's a natural knowing that everything is that one.

Relativity or relationship, whichever form it appears, is duality. There is no, absolutely no, relationship in non-duality. It's one. It's never been divided. That's what the whole stated teaching is about. Non-duality. One without a second. Not two anywhere. Never was, never killed. So even the idea of a witness is making it relative to something else. There is the one-essence, a mapping, shaping, forming, experience here basil loaf as everything. There is the one essence, happening, shaping, forming, experiencing, especially, as everything. There's never been, never will be anything other than that. That is all there is. Thank you, Bob. Just want to have a fun and joke. I read from Buddha.

Buddha says, your past will be withered off as you do sadhana. If there is no past, as Kavita is just now telling, you're saying my mother, you're saying my relationship. We have not investigated this me. This me is coming from the past, our memory and our beliefs. So just investigate that continuously. Once we investigate that me does not exist, we are creating it again and again and again. Just first know the relationship between you and me, you and I. Similarly, Jeff was saying, you are reading the book, just read the reader, see the seer, then you will click there. And it happens with all grace of God.

Nothing we are doing. So it is His grace. So similarly, just we are getting up from the deep sleep. There is no I in the first few seconds. Similarly, you continue same stage. Don't bring. We are daily bringing, just like the whole tree going back into the seed. So the seed is not there. That seed is me or I thought. If you take out that seed or the mirror, there will be no reflection at all. Similarly, you are reading the book. Similarly, you will feel the same relationship with everyone. Everyone is yourself or mine. The whole world. Thank you, Bob. Once again, all my reverence to him.

Thank you. I wish you were my doctor. Just had to say that. Yeah. Outside you are saying, but inside it is not there. Yeah. Similarly, the concept of birth. If you take out that single concept. Everything will be vanished. It's a notion. We are not going to be born or we are born or somebody's born or who is going to die. Just a concept. That's all. Just like in our dream. Everything happens, but nobody dies and nobody born. So this is an important concept. If you take out that single concept, all other will just wither off. No past is coming. Just we are creating the past.

As Bob says. The time is coming. The time, space and person we are creating. That is what the mind. Don't create it. Even if it is coming, just don't attach it to it. Fix it. Very easy. I'm reminded of something. I think I've heard Bob say that from a quote from Alcoholics Anonymous. One drink is too many. A thousand is not enough. It's probably the same with thinking. It's addictive, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. It's a. It's a. It's a. It's a. It's a. It's a. It's one thought after another thought after another thought. And it's so habitual. Like you get up in the morning and it's just like before you even notice the space or before you even notice that anything at all, you know, it's just boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

You know, you just go, go, go, go, go. And. It's. It's. Yeah. Like you said, Dr. Aminath. that relationship with the me and the relationship with an I to actually inquire into it and pretty much sit down with it and see how it sprouted in the first place and everything everything is attached to the I and everything is attached to the me and if the me and the I are seen as being untrue then everything falls apart so but thank you for your pointers and Bob thank you so much as always thank you thank you thank you yeah just see there is a terminology called in Sanskrit called drishti srishti vada drishti means you start thinking the world is created now you're saying me and my mother your thought makes it actually she's not your mother and you are not that me so you as Bob says if you don't think where is the world tell me Kavita if you don't think me then there will be where is the world the whole world is just thoughts yeah yeah I see that just ponder over this just ponder over this it will click now don't postpone it usually we are postponing and we are telling the theories or whatever we have learnt in the past don't tell it cannot be expressed actually the moment we express to come out so just do it it will happen now itself don't postpone it so now and here is the crux but mind wants there are past it will go and just it postpones simple fun game thank you and bob's video is there on mind uh kindly see around 10 minutes video of bob's it's available on youtube just see that again and again even on time it is there short videos of bob cart has made very nice videos on mind we need to see that video again and again and again and again it will click a lot and we are grateful to bob and uh cat further small clippings i look into that because i haven't noticed them yet i was looking at all the meetings and things like that i haven't looked at the short videos so thank you for letting me know that thank you something else that is has been helpful here is uh cat i don't know if you all know this but cat wrote a book called bags full of sailor bob adamson bags full of pointers and um it's lovely and fun beautifully done and uh there's a there are several references in the book that are very interesting and i'm going to read one of them and then there's another one about the actually occurring in the moment the thoughts aren't uh the thoughts aren't they're no longer the focus um it's just uh the playing around with i mean it's a spontaneous happening when it occurs But just the non-fixated awareness, particularly in relationship to the senses, if one is just noticing in the moment, the sounds, the sights, the smells, the way the air feels, the thoughts aren't there anymore, which is just very fun.

Thank you, Maureen. I feel the real Bob is within us and everywhere. What we are seeing is Bob itself. So that is my real experience. So though it is a book, it is very small, Kat is putting the pointers into that. But what we are seeing this whole world, our thoughts itself is Bob. So we need to come to our own self. He is sitting within us, not outside. Bob is not in the book. He is inside us. He is not in the book. He is inside us. He is inside us as me, so just prior to me is the Bob. Thank you, Bob, once again.

Thank you. Mr. Nath, will you elaborate, when you say Bob, when you say Bob, will you elaborate on what that actually is to you? Yeah. Because it obviously isn't separate from you, but because you're using Bob's name, it sounds like there's, yeah, I'm just curious, what does that mean? Yeah. So, yeah. So, yeah. So, yeah. So, yeah. So, yeah. Yes, exactly. According to you or the world, the Bob means a world. For me, it's not a world or it's not a person. At present, we are thinking when we start the journey, we think of ourselves as a person and everyone as a person. So, me as a person, we are thinking we are starting journey from there.

When we create me, we need pointers. And pointers are just signboards. It is not the destiny. So, it is just like this, you need to fly from the airport, till airport, we can go through taxi or something, but we cannot take taxi inside the flight. So, similarly, so till we encounter this non self or this non self, we need to have the eye thought, whatever we are seeing. These pointers are needed, but the ultimate pointer is he's inside you. He cannot leave you just like going into the jaws of lion. So, slowly slowly withers off whatever we have learned, the ignorance. So, it is just like this bottle gourd is there on the paper that we cannot cook like that whatever is coming, we are telling from the past.

But past is not the present. So, we are taking from the past, but just decode it what Bob has learned from the nisargadatta which is nameless and formless. So, we need to just tear off this desha kala vastu, that is the time, space and person. Slowly slowly it happens. It took me around two to three years. Sincerely, I am working for last two years. I am doing this for the last two years. So, 27 years but the real self-inquiry i need to complete every second even during our deep sleep and dream it happens by itself we cannot tell how it happened or what is the process it is different for everyone but slowly slowly the name bob goes off the formula is bob uh or who is just ever presents it's not in the words or imagination or what we call as a just image so that imageless thing it will come by itself just it unfolds it is just like this you are riding a bicycle you are learning suddenly it clicks just like that you are you have started swimming learning swimming so suddenly you know the swimming you are learning a car suddenly the clicking happens and you will start driving the car it's just like that once again i'm thanks to bob many pointers helped me day and night i used to work we should work on our mind i not on others usually we want to work on the pointers no we have to work on the i or me always always that is a main important pointer thank you bob thank you that's uh it's all that before you put any labels on and we know that because we say that's the chair that's bob that's amina that's this that's that it's all that one essence which we discriminate putting the word on it and the word is not the real thank you bob thank you the complete stoppage of chattering happens no more thoughts no more patterns i used to sit start from 10 seconds now increase to one to two hours without thoughts or even if they are coming just noticing it just happening dr aminath when you're saying inquire into the me or the i can you elaborate when you said that for three years you were just constantly inquiring into so were you just pretty much like you know negating everything that you have learned you know in the sense of all the things that we believe like bob said in this talk that the beliefs are are believed without you know actually finding out whether the the truth or not so the me and the i thought per se is it something that you know uh with bob's permission just within one minute i will complete with simplified so initially we are thinking the body as me or the mind as me this is called dehatma buddhi or jivatma buddhi and initially we know me is my relations and possessions when we start the journey so the me is i am the body and my thoughts and my relations and possessions but once you start doing real self-inquiry you will come to know whatever i am able to see this whole world is me you are attached to everything everything everything attached to nothing nothing is attached to everything so both has to cancel so then we'll come to know these five senses are nothing but these five principles air sky water and all those things they are working you are the main uh energy behind these five principles seeing touching tasting and all so slowly slowly it happened like that i don't know what is the process but the thing is that initially the body was me then second thoughts were me then i went just prior to that then the intellect then the main ego and that slowly slowly that relationship goes off for example we'll tell you uh we had a our mates uh uh daughter got uh uh mature means period started so i had a thousand rupees kg just sweets so i thought she's my daughter so my wife was saying don't give so everything is me the whole world what we are able to see that happens by itself we are already that but we are uh limiting ourselves that limitation part is gone and second mistake done by our mind is i am weak i am sinner i am so and so it tells again and again that's not correct so we are already that we are already that now also is saying so everyone is already that so slowly slowly that the just like if you take the sandwich the middle part of this maya so that relationship are fixing is goes off so between the matter and the cell and then even what we think non-self is also self so we'll come to know that that's everything is grace i don't know anything one word i can say i don't know anything there is no no or nothing but still i am everything that's the grace of bob thank you bob thank you aminath is your is your experience that uh the way that it worked for you was the way it needs it it will work for everyone because that's what i'm that's what's i'm hearing here and that that isn't uh experience experience actually that that uh doesn't line up really the experiencer is false see experiencer is different for everyone but experience is same for everyone we want with experiencer doing with doer doer is different for everyone similarly world is now you are seeing bub and i am saying both that both are different if hundred people are seeing bob hundred versions of bobs are there but real bob is only one like that if you are going with experience But experience without experiencer, it is same for everyone.

Actually, there are no everyone. It is same. And so in relationship to that question of do you imagine that the way it happened for you is the way that it will happen for everyone? Like when you're speaking this way to me or to us, do you imagine that there's kind of just one way? What is the need? It is different. It will happen by itself. Why you want to fix it again? It is different for everyone. Yes. Things like saying the pointers don't matter, that just isn't accurate. I am not interested in me and this past, you are asking. That is a reason we are telling.

I know what I am telling is not me. See, I can tell about what I am not. I can't tell you. cannot tell what me. So that cannot be put into words. You are thinking that you want in words and thoughts. Bob tells again and again. Words and thoughts hide you, hide me. And you want all the answers in thoughts and words, how it can be. You are prior to that. Just be there. Yeah, I don't, it's funny. I just keep feeling corrected over and over again. And it just seems funny to me. But. Yeah, that's what the mind. Just don't imagine and don't think.

You are already that simple pointer, Bob's pointer. No need to imagine. The moment we start imagining, me starts firing like anything. It's a chain of thoughts. From one thought, second thought should not come. That is a mechanism of mind. So just by self-inquiry or anything you do, just from one thought, second thought should not come. Means it's already like that. So we are making thousands of thoughts from one me. That me itself is false. What I wish to express, because you so freely are expressing what you feel like is being missed here. What I wish to express to you is that having, approaching it from the standpoint of continuously correcting doesn't necessarily evoke connection.

It's already corrected. That's what I wanted to share. Yeah. It's already corrected. We stop just whatever we have learned. Just stop that. It is unlearning. You are saying that you have to learn. That's wrong. It's already corrected. There is no need of any correction at all. What needs to be corrected is this false me is absent. We are creating that. Just don't create it. Hey, I've. Yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry. I don't know if we have much time left, but Bob, I've been listening to you for a little over a month. Been tuning in and you've made such a big difference. These pointers are just peeling away a lot of old junk.

And I appreciate it so, so much. And I wish you the best with your operation. And please come back and speak lots more to us because it's just been fantastic. And I look forward to getting down there and seeing you one day. So thank you so much. Thank you, Jo. Let this keep resonating and recognizing and let it grow within you, which it naturally does. Yeah. Thank you, Bob. Julia, somebody has their hand up, but I can't read the name. Yeah. I have commented to him privately. I can't read the name either. But you take your time. Thank you, Bob. But if he wants to unmute, he can.

I think he might have been just playing with the little things that you can do in the thing. I'm not sure. I can ask him to unmute right there. I'll do that. But he also put in a heart. I can't even see who that is. So yeah, they might have just been playing with the Zoom features, maybe. I don't know. They're welcome to jump in. I've already sent them a message saying you can just unmute yourself. Anybody who wants to jump in, please do. The water is hot or warm, actually. It's very nice. Yeah, it's written in Hindi as Radhe. Name is Radhe. In Hindi, it is there.

Once again, we pray for Bob's surgery. There will be fast recovery and all our best wishes are there. In fact, his blessings are there forever. So who's praying to who? Nobody prays to no one. Nobody prays to no one. Exactly. There is no creation and there is no creator, but for the sake of nothing. We thank Julia for bringing Bob to us. Oh, I'm so grateful that he's here with us. And I'm just grateful he's willing to do this here. I'm just so grateful. I'm so grateful. Thank you. Thank you, Bob. I really appreciate it. Thank you. Obviously, we're on Mondays, because he's already doing three of these a week.

But at the same time, Bob, I think this is really I hope you come and join us again shortly after your surgery as soon as you can, because I think it's probably really healthy for you to just keep doing this, it's, even if there is no you, it's probably healthy for the mind, the body that you're not the same. Exactly. Nothing is happening in the self. Exactly. Exactly. Well, I was thinking Armanath though, you know, you were saying something about doing the inquiry while I'm dreaming. I can't stop my snoring, you know. Everything is right, whatever you do. Right, who's dreaming? No need to do anything.

There is no doer. However you do, you cannot. Just a notion. I think that one of the things that in wishing Bob all the best and everything, I think it's just love expressed. It's just the deepest love being expressed. And it's not like a love for somebody or love for any, you know, it's just the deepest love that's just being expressed in whatever form or whatever way it is. I just feel the gratitude and the love. I have no words for it, but in the sense of, you know, like Bob says, well-being, it's something that's, you know, just, I don't know. I don't know how to express it.

I'm sorry. Good on you, Kavya. That's good. Yeah, it's, we can call non-emotional expressing. There is an emotional expression and then there is a non-emotional expression. So beyond emotion. The Bob is beyond me or I. Thank you, Bob. Once again. Well, thank everybody. Thank you, Bob. Love you. Love you all. Love you, Bob. To your life, Bob. Miss you. Thank you. Everybody remember. Thank you all. Send me an email. We'll be here next week. To anybody who wants to join us next week. We'll be here same time. Anybody here want to come next week? Even if Bob's not? Yeah, I will be coming. Yeah, I will come.

Good. I'll see you next week. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. I'll be. I'll come. Okay good. I'll be there. Even come. Awesome. Then we'll see. Well, thanks, Bob. Thanks, everyone. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Love you. Bye. Love you, Bob. Love you. Love you, Bob. Love you all. Love you. Thank you. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.