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anybody there? Good morning, same old same old. Again we point to the one essence that's appearing, patterning, shaping, forming and expressing as everything and a lot of people call that God. But the trouble is, I read and hear that God is one God and they take on the idea it's a personal God. And all things are the creation of this God so they don't realize that they themselves are that one essence also. So one essence, patterning, shaping, forming and expressing as everything. As, and it points out, there are no separate entities at all, there's no persons, nothing separate or apart than that. And that's the Mahavikya or the great mantra, I am that.
And innately don't you realize that because when you say that's the chair, that's the flower, that's the tree, that's me, that's you, that everything is that which we're discriminated with the word, with the thought, with the idea. And the thought, the idea is all images. All these patterns, shapes and forms are images vibrating into the patterns, shapes and forms. But it's the one essence and you are that essence. So we say start from the fact that you are already that and realize that any search that's going on it's going to take you away from that because you think you're going to become something or realize something or see something.
But the seeing, hearing and realizing is going on right in this moment. This moment is just another label that we put on the so-called time. It's all happening in this immediacy. Right here, right now, it's all there is. You know, we've taken ourselves to believe we are this individual, this person, this separate entity, and that, look at the word indivisible, means it's undivided. If it's indivisible, who are you going to divide it up between or with what? You say, I am the individual. Yes you are, but not the personal individual. You are the totality. It's all undivided. It's all indivisible. We see what's going on around us, and from the words we've learnt and the ideas and descriptions we've got, it can seem very horrible, very terrible.
But our narrow viewpoint from the idea of this persona, this person, is that we are the individual. We are the shape. We are the form. We are the form. We are the form. We are the individual. As the absolute is not included in the absolute, if it's absolute, every appearance, every pattern, every shape, every form is that, appearing as difference. And they call it a phenomenal manifestation. That's all a manifestation. And the dictionary definition of phenomena, that word phenomena, is that which appears, to be. Pointing out again that the patterns, shapes and forms haven't changed their true nature. They're only appearing to be separate and apart and something less than the totality.
That's all they tell you in the Buddha's text. They call it the great perfection, just to say that word perfection is just the same as the absolute, means the totality. They give it to you in one sentence there, the great perfection is non-conceptual awareness. Put it all on this awareness. Awareness is existence before the consciousness comes onto it. When the consciousness is on it even, there's still that awareness. It's all appearing on or in or as that awareness. No separation whatsoever. But in the dividing of it, we've taken ourselves from being the absolute to poor, miserable, unhappy or depressed human beings. And we often say that when things are going wrong.
Well, after all, I'm only human, making out. Of course, if I'm only human, so-called things are going to happen. Because you're taking yourself away from the complete and the wholeness, the wholeness, the holiness, if you like it. When everybody's got an idea of some big mystical thing, you know, this enlightenment this realization, you know, becoming one with god, that is some mystical. But not. This is very, very, very ordinary awareness, or knowing, or seeing. Nothing simpler than that. of it and realizing there's no static point to any of it, this persona, where does it begin? You can't say it begins, you can't say it ends.
It's not static, it's transient, it's constantly an ever-changing, ever-fresh, ever-present awareness. When investigated along these lines, you'll see that nothing else never can be anything else. And you've always and ever been that. We've learned words from our parents and schools and everybody around us and separated ourselves with the word. What's a word? A mental construct. A mental construct. What's a mental construct? A vibration. Vibrating and stirring, moving the stillness, seemingly moving the stillness. And it vibrates. Vibrates. Vibrates. Vibrates. Into patterns, shapes and forms. It's sound! Vibration is sound. It's movement. It's an activity. I use the term intelligence energy rather than use the term god, because god's alright if you understand it.
But when you take it to be something greater than you or a higher or something that we can't control. come near or ever get to know we try to become one with it and the very trying takes us away because what's the trying mean that means the so-called persona the so-called person thinks it has some self nature some self power some independence power of its own they get the idea of free will my free will at the ancient call is here from the Hebrews hear our Israel the Lord thy God is one God there is nothing other and if there is no thing or nothing other that includes it means it's you and everything else is that God the Muslim slay there is no God but but God that's all there is Allah is his name Allah's the label you put on him and put it up now there's something separate in the part there's still no one God Christians Christians and others say it's omnipresence omnipotence omniscience total presence total power total intelligence you are that totality because aren't aren't you aware or knowing right now aren't you existing right now aren't you conscious right now and aren't you happy to be right now so you are that livingness livingness livingness that power already but look at the limitations and boundary we put on it what are the limitations boundaries were full of words in the beginning was the word that's when it all began when you had to Adam and Eve were in the Garden of Eden they were in paradise and some of them come along and some our own they picked up words I ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil and other words they put the note words the words knowing that the words and not just good and evil with the words but the word that's when the mind came in because pointing out that the way the mind divides is always in duality good bad pleasant painful happy sad as Shakespeare tells you nothing either good or bad but thinking makes it so but they see your mind functions good bad pleasant paper happy Saturday look we've learned words the words being a vibration they must vibrate and if you've got two poles they're vibrating through the boundaries they're vibrating in in that limited range good and bad pleasant painful happy sad and then we take the boundary put on the words to be real but have a look and recognize there's no word that is real every word every pattern shape and form is a vibration and it seemingly in the seeming vibration it ends in the word the label we put on it this is good and that's as far as it goes and this vibrates back the other way this is bad and that's as far again so we locked ourselves in a cage of concept of what the boundaries of yourselves were in this limited gauge they've added the cage let the thoughts be free as I say let them express and if they're not free expand them expand them until they take instead of just leave taking a certain range in and leaving in expand that range and take everything in everything in and leave it there's no boundaries to engage any of it so you're free become free of the belief you're encased in this conceptual image I'm the soccer that it tells you nothing can trouble you accepting your own imagination what's your imagination with the cage of concepts you build around it and that's the only trouble is and if he says that nothing can trouble you accepting that your own imagination what would you do to get out of that imagination it dropped the boundaries when you and let it expand let the thoughts expand let it contract till it's contracts into the night thing that's a little expand until it takes in everything and becomes another thing again so you are already that and I am that that sound om is the primary sound I am when they translate it I am but you're not satisfied we're not satisfied with I am we've got to put something onto it I am Bob the Australian the good fella all the not so good the world's against me wrong good I'm having everybody's attacking me but all these concepts and all words without the concept what am I now in the socket other I said when he said me when he was looking at this he said I stayed with that I am this and in the three years recognizing in every opportunity I could know I am this he says Now, what's the freedom?
Freedom from that? When he was talking about the I am-ness, people say, well, I'll do what Nisargadatta did. I'll start saying I am, I am, I am. I'll start with the I am-ness. Use it as a mantra. You do that thing and we do it for a million years and it won't do you any good. But what's that I am represent? That represents a sense of presence, a knowing that you are. That I am that's vibrating through the universe or the manifestation has no beginning or no end. That's a subtle sound, subtle vibration. And it continues to vibrate. And you know that you go out into the hills or the mountains somewhere and you speak a word and you hear it go out.
It hits the rock. It hooks or something and vibrates. It echoes back to you. An echo will bounce around there for a long time. It's getting subtler and subtler as it goes on. When you've got a gong or a bell or something like that and you ring it, that sound vibrates and becomes subtler and subtler. We think it ceases, but it's probably going on. Yeah, that's the ointment you put on, isn't it? Subtler and subtler and goes on forever. And some of the... Subtler. Subtler. Subtler. Subtler. There's lots of text out there, different religions, different traditions that point toward us. And we localize ourselves in one and forget the others.
And then we start arguing about it. Well, my idea is better than yours. Just like you've got a couple of football teams. My football team's better than your football team. And we start fighting and arguing and bearing it forward. All these different religions. Subtler. fight and argue with themselves not realizing that each and every one of them they can recognize the same essence if they look at it closely. So we're stressing the fact that it is one essence appearing and expressing as everything and that one essence is the word which is sound which is vibration which is a matter per vibration is energy the activity of knowing energy a vibration is an activity and it vibrates intelligently because look out there and see the way nature is forming galaxies are forming planets stars volcanoes seasons moon stars all the rest of it you can see the way nature is forming galaxies are forming planets stars volcanoes seasons moon stars all the rest of it trees flowers everything forming doesn't that imply these human forms doesn't that imply these forms patterns shapes and forms are those the pattern shapes and forms are suffused with an innate intelligence innately knowing it knows everything knows that it is no just purely knowing that it is without using the word it is or using the words knowing because they're just concepts also trying to describe it and we use words to try and recognize it but the knowing is there and that's such in and end of being knowing and loving to be or existence consciousness bliss or awareness of being is bliss or have an affectionate awareness of being there are all different ways of describing the one thing but it's all that so the words vibrate into pattern shapes and forms play around for a while and disappear into the world and then they're gone.
disappear and what we had where did the words come about realize when you look at it that the word is not the thing take the word water can you drink it you can't drink the word but it describes to you what word there is what the water is word fire can you cook with a word can you eat yourself with a word so all these words you see they've got this meaning in take this word I or me. I or me. What does that represent does it represent the person the individual or does it represent that sense of being that knowing of being or that per sense of presence because knowing that I am the I am this is right in this immediacy the sense of being alive of being aware you don't not a moment or a second away or anything it's immediate it's spontaneous spontaneous activity of that intelligence energy and the way it's expressing through the body and if it didn't have a pattern to express through where could it express the shape and form of the body with all the organs the nerves the sinews and the brain and all of them enable that intelligence to form bring these words into form shape and form and the shape and form of the body.
and the shape and form of the body. and form the pattern fire their illusion they only to be to me appear to be so and that's all this manifestation phenomenal manifestation and what's the definition of phenomena phenomena the dictionary definition is that which appears to me so it's all appearance but we've never been told to look at it. when we were first born. We're told to acquire, amass, accumulate, add to this I-ness, this me-ness, to make it whole, to make it complete, to make it real because we've taken on the idea it's separate. So if we acquire, amass, accumulate, better education, more wealth, good relationship, a good job, all the rest of it, we acquire all these things, it'll make us complete or whole, not realising we're all complete already.
We've always been the whole, nothing separate, always been complete. Nothing can be added to it, nothing can be taken away from the absolute. So we're starting from behind the eight ball and we think we've got an entity, a human being, a person. So we've got to fix up first before we can find ourselves or understand ourselves or know ourselves. But realise that body, mind, you call it, is the pattern which is expressing and uses as that. Instead of letting it use you, letting you use or not recognise the essence, there's no you as such, instead of recognising the essence of what it is. What is means it's unaltered, unmodified, uncorrected.
Everything appears as is right now. Unaltered, unmodified, uncorrected. But what happens if you recognise that all the appearance can be broken down back to that innate intelligence energy, innate essence, the one reality or the beingness or the awareness, whatever labels you like to put on it, being the one. You must only and ever be the one. Subtitles by the Amara.org community Subtitles by the Amara.org community too. Where's the count going to go from then? You realize it's only the one that's patterning, shaping and forming as the tree, as the flower, as the sky, as the space, as the volcanoes, as the planets, as everything else, as the so-called god, as the holiness, as the sinfulness, as everything.
And you already are that, is what we said before, put the label on it. It's that. You know that innately because that's the chair, that's the carpet, that's the flower, that's the tree. It's all that which we put the labels, all the words on. If you didn't have any labels, what would you put on it? Look around the room right now without putting the label on anything in the room. And you realize you're seeing what everything is without labeling it, and you know what it is. And you'd be able to describe it if asked what it is, or you'll say that's the picture on the wall, or that's the wall.
But without saying that you know what it is. You needn't call it the picture on the wall, but you know it's not the wall itself. And then you might understand when they say seeing no thing, yet it is seen. You're seeing all these things without the label and you realize that they are no thing. They are just the pure seeing, which can be, which as soon as you put the divider to them, they become things. So everything in this manifestation is things. You are a thing. You call a human being, I am a thing. You call a body, mind, entity or a person or a human being.
Now can some thing come from no thing? If no thing is empty and nothing at all, then it's not a thing. No pattern, no pattern. Can something come from it? It can't. So you realize, leave everything as it is as no thing, seeing it as no thing, you're knowing what it is. Like this cat here, there's a cat in the room here. It hasn't got labels for everything, but it knows what it is. It's taste, it's smell, sense of smell. It's seeing, it's reeling, it's moving. It's not a thing. It's not discriminating any of it with the words. Yet it knows what everything is. There's a knowing.
It knows what food is, it knows what it's not. It knows where to go to get out of the house. That's the innate intelligence. That you are that. You are that energy. You are that awareness. Awareness of being. Being is not becoming. See where we get taken up with the words? In the self. My self. We think as this persona, this mask, this conceptual image, we call it my self. See what we've done? We've engaged ourselves into the me and the my, the conceptual image. We put ourselves in this boundary, this limited factor. Me and my. You know. But there's no being. There's no being.
There's no being. There's no being. There's no being. There's no being. There's no personal self. And they tell you that in all the scriptures. There is one self. That God, if you like to call it that again, is the Atman or the Cell. And again, the Lord thy God is one God, there's not two. So there's only one self. There's not my self. That we take it to be my self and we've got to realise it, make ourselves whole and complete. And let me start from that idea that you have. there is a me or a myself, it won't happen and it can't happen. We put the boundaries and stopping it from happening.
But if you open and cognise it a little bit, it'll take you where you've got to go. In spite of yourself, in spite of how strong these beliefs might seemingly be, it turned me around and took me the other way completely, to the realisation that there wasn't everything there. And it took me to the so-called patterns that could help me. The Sāgha-Nāda, Mukta-Nanda and others, and a lot of the texts and biblical statements and things like that. Though I'm not a Buddhist, I'm not a Hebrew, a Jew or a Muslim or a Christian or any of these sects at all or religions at all. But I see the truth in each and every one of them.
And I can take parts or concepts and bits from each one that resonate with me and utilise it. I don't have to say that's no good. At one stage I did that and believed all that crap. But it took me beyond that even, till I have no, what do you call it, no static point and I can say this is what I am. But I can't deny the centre of the truth. It's the presence. The knowing. And it comes as a thought I am. The knowing that I am. But I know that thought is just a description. And I know the description is not the described.
What I'm describing now and trying to describe is not its description. But it might give you a hint. It might give you a glimpse of something a bit further to look at. Where you might be stuck in some concept or something. It might not either. It doesn't really matter. If you don't get it here, you don't get it there. Subtitles by the Amara.org community You might get it somewhere else if you're astute enough. It takes you beyond the words. And beyond the word is beyond the mind. And that's what they tell you. They tell you it's beyond the mind. It is prior to mind. Saying beyond the mind means it's prior to mind.
It is there before the mind appears. And the mind must appear in it or on it or whatever you like to call it. Subtitles by the Amara.org community And we've got this handicap, my mind, my body, my self. Who is this me or my? That's alluding to the persona, the mask, the conceptual energy. And if you realize what they're saying, it's one self, patterning, shaping, forming, expressing, and everything. Where would you start? Subtitles by the Amara.org community I start if there's only one self. I start from that fact and see that, recognize it. See if it's so or not. Because we've got all these beliefs about this and that.
We've picked up on the language. And the belief's never the actual when you question it. There's so many things you believed in. You recognize the falseness of it and moved on. Move on from that belief that you are the persona. Move on from that thing that you are the person. You are this body, mind. Go to the point where you are prior to the thought. Let it go. Let the thought go. Free it. Let it be free. Let it move on. And it will move on. Every thought you've ever had is changing. You might get to seemingly what appear to be the same thoughts come back and back again.
But each time they come back and they had disappeared from it, it's fresh and new. See, everything is fresh and new. Nothing static about it. A few questions? That's a comment from Rohan. Love it, Bob. If me is looked at and seen to be insubstantial, then mine disappears with it. Exactly. Rather than beating oneself up for being greedy or possessive, see that the possessor is only appears to be there and pull it out with the rest. Exactly. Out by the root. Out by the root. Yeah. Beautiful. Yeah, beautiful. And there was another question I've seen and a lot of love messages, welcome messages you will see through them after the meeting.
But there was another question from Tanya. I don't know if I can get back to it. But it was a question about someone who goes to the gym and try to build his muscles or her muscles. Does that mean they are identified with the body? That was the question. If wanting to be fit and healthy and muscly, whatever, does it mean that the narrative will be about identification or no? Well, what do you do if you're in a car? Do you put rubbishy fuel in it? No. You put good fuel. You wash it and look after it. Same with this pattern, which is intelligence as you're expressing it.
Mm-hmm. You know very well if that body-mind wasn't there, who could say what? As far as you are concerned, they believed in you. That pattern, it seems, is the unique expression of that intelligence energy. It expresses through all the different pattern shapes as well, uniquely. So if you look after this body first, because that body is physical, mental, and spiritual. They divide up into three things. Mm-hmm. Just like thought, feeling, and emotion. One and the same thing, steam, water, and ice. And we think we've got the body now physical. To keep it physical, you need exercise. It needs movement as well as food, water, and all the other things, you know, to replace the cells and keep it going.
So the body is very useful. And while every year you're living in it, wherever the life essence is in it, you're going to know that. And you open a open to what's going on, you'll do what's necessary to respond to, it comes up and does. But if you try to fix the me, you're not going to get anywhere, because you've got nothing there solid or substantial to start with. The me is already a fiction, it doesn't exist. There you go. When the sense of presence comes on you, the capacity of reasoning develops when you learn words. And that capacity is a very useful capacity, and that's what I mean by words can be very useful.
But they're also self-destructive. When we add on the persona or the mask on, and that's the limiting factor, the boundaries. Take the boundaries off and that body, you'll be utilizing that body, it'll resonate with things, it'll, you know, make, and it'll come up through it to move on to the next thing, and what you resonate with. Yes, so I'll just, I'll do it because that's the thing. I think that's the thing that I learned from you, and I really appreciate, is the fact that someone goes to the gym, it doesn't signify really anything, because I know from Bob's biography, he's been going to the gym in his 70s, getting up at four in the morning and going to the gym, because he wanted the body fitted strong.
But the question, is there identification there or not, is the question of narrative. It is, if you go to the gym because you find yourself going to the gym, just like an orangutan finds itself swinging from branch to branch in the forest because it is linked to its survival, to be fit and strong, and there is no narrative that I want to do it because I want to be attractive because this is me and my body and I am this body, then there is no, there is no reason to think that whatever the body is moved to do has anything to do with the identification which only happens in the narrative.
So you find yourself going to the gym, doing yoga, Pilates, whatever, that's what you find yourself to do. If the narrative accompanies it, that I am this body and that's why I am doing it, then look at the narrative. The body's action is of secondary importance, but the narrative that can keep you in the story of you are doing it because you are it, that is where the suffering comes, because when the body is fit and healthy and young and vibrant, of course that goes with pleasure. That identification might give you something. But the thing is, when you get to death, the only reading that you have to do is this.
Every single day, that's all. So at the end of the day, you some sort of a reward, but it's not going to stay the same. We know everything is transient, so it is going to change. Even the after-party hangover, that's a change already. But with ageing, the change is even more profound. So to break up the identification that happens in narrative and let body look after itself, let body be naturally drawn to stay fit and stay healthy, that's probably the healthier way of looking at it. Jumping into the conclusion that someone who is doing a dancing course is vain or someone who is going to the gym is identified, it may happen in certain cases.
And as we know the profile of society, it probably happens in most of the cases that narrative will still make a story that I am the body, but it doesn't have to be this way. And Bob was 20 years clean of the idea of being anything at all and still going to the gym religiously. And until today, we do exist in some regards. Yeah, you can have the wrong interview. I think you have to understand what is going on. There's a long time we have to live with life. Life I see. Our lives have to be changed, but you've got to stick with it. Yeah, I see.
And I understand you have to try to live with it, and I think that's a good thing. But you can't take the idea that there's nothing wrong with an exercise because otherwise you wouldn't be walking by now. But, again, the life energy won't allow you to keep building up the body, it starts to break it down after a while. Yeah. And you can't limit it. Look at all the great bodybuilders, champion bodybuilders. Some of them, look at as they're ageing today, you see, where's all the muscles now? You you know it can't help the aging process it breaks it breaks it down that's the natural pattern of life but while you're there it'll keep it going a lot longer than what you what you would if you were using it put it putting rubbish in your job yeah yeah yeah there is a comment from brett morning bob and cut bob as you were talking the thought everything everywhere at all time whispers i am a rose nice comment and now you have another one from amanath why we are becoming even why we are becoming even if we don't want how we are fooled by mind this is a quote from pranams gurudev and jane says going to the gym is like taking the car for a tune up or service and now catherine says hi my lovelies james seltzer his daughter joely and me all with you now namaste and another one from armand bob may i know are you without thoughts thanks bob never had any thought ever thoughts appearing through this body though and that's the way it is and the mind's still going i haven't got dementia possibly as yet but but there can be long periods when there are no thoughts here they're dropping off and their other thoughts periods and there are lots of thoughts but thoughts come and thoughts go thought can be very necessary yeah and without thought it can be very peaceful matter.
Nothing either good or bad but thinking makes us that. It's the thinking. Thinking happens. When I think and so many form a subject and I think this and think they form an object through thinking, that's when it becomes problematical. There's nothing wrong with thinking. And I've heard some of our friends who are coming to the meetings were really getting excited about one of non-duality speakers speaking fluently, expressing thoughts all the time and still claiming that he has no thoughts and building up a lot of confusion in people and a lot of false hopes that are ridiculous because they are not necessary. What he meant and he didn't, he failed to express it properly is self-referential thoughts.
That's a difference. I mean of course he can define the thought or anyone can define the thought the way they please. Subtitles by the Amara.org community But what is really signifying the clarity of the identification, lack of the identification is that the self-referential thoughts either stop appearing completely or if they appear they hold no power so they don't really have that power to identify with the story. So even if there would be a thought arising, I'm called, it doesn't mean that there is an entity grabbing into the body and believing that there is me, I, the body, I am. It is the thought that creates the action of taking a coat or dressing up.
But very often that action is created or is induced by the body without that thought. So the thoughts are coming, like people can still do equations, they can plan, they can answer questions. But the self-referential thoughts, this is what should be really clarified. The thought, the self-obsession, going about the day and thinking, oh what are they thinking, what are they thinking, what are they thinking, what are they thinking, what are they thinking, what are they thinking, what are they thinking, what are they thinking, what are they thinking, about me, oh I should have told them this, I should have answered that. That sort of self-obsession nonsense, that stuff drops away and that makes a big difference.
Because other thoughts, you do want to have that computer fully tuned and ready to use because it's handy. Yes, they say the great way is not difficult for those who have no preferences when love and hate are both absent, everything becomes clear and undisguised. Like the smallest distinction, however, and heaven and earth are set infinitely apart. Another place that says hold no opinions for or against anything. It doesn't mean to say opinions won't arise, but don't hang onto them, don't cling to any thoughts. And in the finish it says words, the way is beyond language. Remember that. For in it there's no yesterday, no tomorrow and no today.
Pointing out again that all these thoughts are concepts, not just only yesterday, tomorrow, today. All the other thoughts, they're only conceptual images. They can be used, but when they use you or trouble you, it's a problem. And when seeing through the thoughts, that's the no mind, or the Buddha mind, or the... Unborn. Unborn mind, yeah, without a thought. But thoughts, the knowing is there, pure knowing, which you can't even say you're knowing then. Yeah. Just is. Or just is-ing, if you like. Tanya says, thank you Bob and Kat so much. I go to the gym for enjoyment. Now, especially as I see I am not in.
I am is not located in the body. I am is not located in the body. I am is not located in the body. I am is not located in the body. I am is not located in the body. I am is not located in the body. I am is not located in the body. And then Mona says, what does Bob think on life experience and suffering on the path that happens for us? Naturally, it vibrates in the powers of others. There's quite a bit of suffering here at times. But it comes and it goes. Is that suffering, I mean mental suffering, or is it just pain?
Oh, pain and, yeah, stirring up of... The mind affects the body, just the same as the body affects the mind. Thoughts, feelings, emotions, it will come up. They're not fixated on, just like out in nature. It's light, it's dark, it's winter, it's summer. Still the change is coming about. But is the reality or the essence touched or contaminated by any of it? Yeah. Yeah. I think it might meant the idea because she says the path that happens for us. I know there is a saying in spirituality that things don't happen to us, but for us. So we are not the victims of whatever is happening, but they are happening somehow for us to grow, to get to know ourselves, to experience ourselves.
Now a better term would be as us. Yes. Not for us. It applies as a separate entity there. Yeah. Happening as us. Yeah. Yeah. If you expand your identity to be everything that affects you as much as the body that it is affected, then it is just a dance. And with this I4, I think, oh, I'm going to get some benefit out of this. It's favoring me. Yeah. That's what often happens. And it happens effectively in many reframing techniques and even psychology when someone feels that something happened that was harmful and it has negative stories. Someone has negative story about being a victim and having a bad, how you say it?
I'm a good block having a bad. Trot. Yes. So they can reframe the story and say, oh, look, this was good. This made you stronger. It made you wiser. This is all operating within the realm of stories when there is an entity in the story. An entity has the positive story or negative story. It has the hero journey story. They're all absolutely beautiful. But they're not the same. They're not the same. They're not the same. They're not the same. They're not the same. They're not the same. They're not the same. They're not the same. They're not the same. But they are even better if you recognize that they are just a story, they are narrative.
Because life that runs that story or all those stories, you can even write few different stories on the same topic with the same hero or heroine and see them for what they are. They're just stories. None of it is absolute truth because you are the truth. The life that is animating that story. That is what is what is truth behind it and it can't be known because it is a mystery. It is what is an essence of everything. So it can't be every attempt to bring it down to the pen and paper and put it on the flat screen or even on the TV screen as a movie.
It's limiting it. It's somehow confining it. And it can be still mind-blowing, it can be inspiring, motivating, it can be beautiful, but it still somehow makes the multidimensional mystery of life flat, two-dimensional or three-dimensional. There's nothing wrong with using positive stories and interpreting whatever happens as, oh, this is for me, this is good because. But if you know that this is just a story, the freedom is in it. Because you smile, you experience all the gratitude and everything that goes with it, but you're still free from the double bind, from the... from the pairs of opposites, from the good and bad story. History. Hm? History.
History, yeah. History. That's right. Rohan says, You, quote-unquote, can't help going to gym even if you wanted to. Ha-ha. All the play of the life essence. Yeah, that's exactly right. Yep. Thinking about thinker, right, Amaranth says. Amarnath, sorry. And Tanya says, Yes, Rohan, I have noticed that. Amarnath says, Like the digestion, heart beating, involuntarily thinking happens. Yeah. Right? Yeah. Thinking, seeing, tasting, touching is really, it's all a functioning of that intelligence energy. Mm-hmm. Now, Megan says, The way is perfect like vast space where nothing is lacking and nothing in excess. Yeah. And she says, It is due to our choosing to accept or reject that we do not see the true nature of things.
Yeah. Live neither in entanglements of outer things nor in inner feelings of emptiness. That's since in Mink, I recognize. Yeah. Yeah. Take no static position point. Yes. Charlie says, Good to see you, dear Bob and Kat. Much love. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for all we've seen. And Bob will really read one by one all the messages. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All the messages of love are very beautiful. So I will read them one by one. All the messages of welcome and love. And they're beautiful. But we're just gonna talk of some questions, so I'll skip them. Forgive me, please. Some paths are quite easy and some people have more challenges.
Does it mean I have more to be to be cleaned when I go through more challenges? That is Mona. Thank You. Yes, stories are way to experience ourselves. So what do you want to comment on this story? on that that some people have more challenges and does it mean i have to i have more to be cleaned i mean you know this is probably the idea of purification of the mind and yeah that was just what comes up that's what comes up i remember one quote from the book that our friend put together this is like thousand years old zen teachings called nine pieces of zen one of the quotes in the book says to purify the mind is to pollute it because how can you ever purified the empty thing purification cleaning this is all fascinating journey of an individual it has nothing whatsoever to do with the consciousness looking through your eyes right now listening through the ears right now now it is already seeing hearing tasting touching smelling but somehow somewhat the filter of interpretation and relating it to the entity happens but that consciousness is already bright and clear when that filter drops away it is clear and obvious it already is so is the clearing of the filter necessary purifying of the filter necessary that's the question of who would be doing it doing it.
Because if there is no entity already that is just emptiness operating through different software in the brain, the personality is the software. So who would be doing the cleansing, cleaning, purifying, rewriting the stories, too positive or too different, or even wiping off the stories? It is always kind of, it brings up the, this is the way the mind tempts you back into the story. I will do everything I can. I will sit and purify and chant and do whatever it takes. I've been through it too. And who are you comparing it against anyway? No comparison. If you're comparing it against someone, how do you know it's more than somebody else's?
That's a good point. Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah, it may seem like, you know, some people are born in India and live in places which we've both seen that generations after generations sleep after sleep. And they've been living under the blue present and find their food in the rubbish. Or places in Africa I've seen incredible places when I was working there where people lived in the buildings that fall apart, children play there. It does seem like somebody has it harder than the other. Or there are people with terminal diseases, people whose both parents died, people who struggled through many, many different challenges. Does it mean there are more enlightened people because they suffered more?
Or does it mean that they are closer because they're more pure? It doesn't mean anything at all. Because this is again the perspective of individual. As individual me comparing to this one I'm better off and comparing to that one I'm worse. But as individual I have the tendency to constantly go to the mind and elaborate and compare. But when I go back to the emptiness or to the life, now I am that essence. I am living through the child in Africa on the broken building left by British colonizers in Ghana where everything falls apart. They only love the language and abuse the system. And as emptiness I'm all of it.
As the life essence I'm all of it. So I'm not one that has better life or worse life. I'm every single one having bad, good, pleasant, painful, all the options included. So finding yourself, looking from the perspective of life, there's no need for comparison because the variety is infinite. Whatever is thinkable is already experienceable. So there's no need to place yourself anywhere. Another one? See, that's not being photographed on there. Yeah, it is a little bit. Yeah, not far. Yeah. Amarnath says we are prior to the story. Yeah. And Brett says that barrier between me, you, they, us, slowly I unpick them. So, so. Unpick them.
Yeah. And Rachel says love having you both. Thank you, Rachel and Jim. And could you speak about love? This is John David. Could you speak about love? Could I, what? Speak about love. Well. Yeah. Well, what is love? Yeah. Love's just a name, another name for life really, isn't it? Mm. We love to be. It's what we call a sensation or an emotion, isn't it? Mm. It's loving to be. We all love to be. And you are that life. And there is only life. There's nobody who lives on life. And life lives on life. And that's the love of being. Just open up to it.
Yeah. And Nisargadatta has a beautiful way to express the idea, what Bob just said, that love is life. Or he says love is everything. Love is what underlies every action and every motivation. It may be selfish, like Bob often says, have you seen a millionaire who had enough? So that's self-love, is selfish, is misguided. It comes from the standpoint that I am that self. So I want to kill and rape and get anything snatched from the others, destroy their lives, take the quality of their lives away because this is for me or my right or what I believe is honest and ethical. And there is also, but motivation is still love, even though it's completely twisted.
Other way Nisargadatta says it, searching for wisdom is love for the truth. Yeah. And searching for security is love for the safety, you know, it's wanting the self-preservation. And he says love can be small and misguided or it can expand and embrace the whole universe. But the love remains. Larry, a question. Bob, was I considering the sense of presence of being myself and how that is the same sense I remember from grade school? This seems simple and obvious, yet in sleep that sense is not there. Of course the body dies. Is that sense of presence or the experience happening now not also an appearance to what I am?
This seems like a dualist way of looking at it. Thanks. What's that again? What's that again? Was I considering the sense of presence of being myself and how that is the same sense I remember from grade school? This seems simple and obvious, yet in sleep that sense is not there. Of course the body dies. Ah yeah, sleep gone. Yes. Of course the body dies. Is that sense of presence or the experience happening not not also an appearance to what I am. Sense of presence is the appearance to what I am. Innately, that sense of presence when you're a little child, that's how, you know, it's still the same sense of presence that is with you right now.
Because you can go back to remember when you experienced as you had when you were a little child and you know that you, yeah, and the knowing that you are is there right now. It's the same knowing that you are. Remember. That's all it is. When you say the body dies, it doesn't die in sleep. You just don't remember. Because when you wake up, you'll say, I have a memory. I had a good deep sleep. How would you know whether your sleep was or interrupted or what it was? But just the mind goes, the mind rests. But when you're in deep sleep, you're still breathing.
Your heart's still beating. Ear and fingernails are still growing. Food's being digested. All these functions are still going on. Yes, I think he meant the sense of presence, being like consciousness, being awake. Are you aware? Are you unaware? Is that one also appearance on the? There's always awareness there. But you're aware of your unawareness. Because you say, I don't remember. You were not aware. But you know that all the way through it, just the same, all the way through from when you were a little child till now, though you're not constantly remembering it all the time, you know it's the same sense of presence. Mm-hmm.
As Walt Whitman says, far down, I see the first huge nothing. I know I was even there. He knows he was there. That is still the same knowing. And he says, I'm not contained between my hat and my boots. Yeah. Yeah, I would say that if there is anything which is called presence that can be conceptualized and grasped as a thing. Yeah. That is definitely appearing and disappearing. Because what is the screen, the basic screen or the emptiness, it doesn't appear or disappear. So what you're saying is totally right. I mean, the way you explain sense of presence, this is something that even when there is a sleep, the awareness is still there.
Because there is awareness of non-awareness, of forgetfulness. But perhaps there is a possibility that his definition of presence is slightly different. And then. It would be that it is something that appears when you wake up in the morning and disappears when you fall asleep. If there is anything that could possibly be conceptualized or defined as something that comes and goes, that's definitely an appearance. But again, ultimately, the presence is pre-sensory. What we call presence doesn't have the taste or touch or texture or anything. So it can't be conceptualized. It can't be grasped. And it can't be even considered as something that comes and goes. Again, the question of definition, then, yeah, unfortunately most of these questions have to be answered.
You can believe it comes from within. Because you know what you mean by the word when you utter it. It's to say it seemingly comes and goes, but can you find a static point anywhere? Can you go back to childhood? Can you say? There's a static point. You can pinpoint. You can say this is where it began. You can't. So you see, that's coming and going or appearing only. But it's always and ever been so without the concepts going on. Pure, total awareness. Absolute. Paul and Amelia saying hi and sending love. Paul Hedeman and Amelia. Ah, good. Yeah. Beautiful. The universe was neither born nor maintained nor dissolved.
This is the plain truth. The basic screen of pure being awareness stillness devoid of all the moving shadow pictures of name and form of the universe is soul eternal existence. Raybhugita. Raybhugita, yeah. Beautiful. Yeah. Amarna. But pure mind is self. Told in the mind. Amarna. Peer-mind. Peer-mind. Pure mind is self. Told in scriptures as sattvic mind, impurity is impressions or samskaras. Pure mind is. Pure mind. Pure mind? Pure mind. Yes? It's self told in scriptures as sattvic mind. Plastic. Sattvic. Sattvic. Ah, yeah. Yeah. Impurity is impressions or samskaras. Yeah. Just impressions. Patterns, shapes, forms. And now, we ourselves as love, as universal love, there is no second one to be loved or lover.
Yeah, one. So, that gets rid of this beloved, doesn't it? Yeah. Tanya says, rape, murder and violence is that. Intelligence energy also. Everything is that intelligence energy. Absolutely everything that appears. Yeah. What would you rape or murder somebody if you're getting some self-gratification out of it? Yeah. It's all for that's believed in self. Get rid of that personal self and see what would you want of another person's. Why would you want to harass an individual? Yeah. Why would you want to hurt anyone or snatch anything from anyone if you already have the sense of completeness? Why would you want to be violent towards anyone if there is nothing missing?
Amarnath, all body minds are instantly created by observer. Actually doesn't exist but appears to be existing like in dream. Yeah. Realize this when you wake up, this is a waking dream. The only way you can tell the difference between that and a sleeping dream. Is when you wake up in the morning, this one seemingly continues from where it left off the night before. The sleeping dream only lasts a short while. When you wake up it soon disappears. Waiting for questions. There's another beautiful message from John David. Love ya Bob, love ya Kat, love to my extended family in the meeting today. Thank you. Nothing comes to mind to say at the moment.
But the same thing. I'm saying we'll be there if there is a. Some good stuff coming through. From the different ones. Oh I remember something. Kavita was saying that was what Tanya was also hinting on the Zoom meeting. Mike asked us about the violence. Whether working on violence or trying to stop the violence that happens in one's own body. I'm not quite sure. I hope she was with us to remind the question. Because that was the end of the meeting. We were over time and we kind of hinted on it. You remember? No. Violence. Yes. Generally the idea of violence. Well something's been stirred up.
Some thought, feeling or emotion has registered and believed in. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. And then the sensation of anger or you know that anger can develop into violence. Yeah I remember he was I think it was around the idea of leaving things as they are. If someone has a very, very strong pattern of violent reactions, what does it mean to leave it as they are? Leave it as it is and what? Go on the street and murder someone? No. So we were actually hinting that leave it as it is. leave it as it is if there is a violence coming up and there is already a worry about that violence coming up that worry about wanting to do something about the violence that also should be left as it is and not suppressed by enemies so if there is a and there is an instinct to go and get the therapy you get sedatives or go or whatever the psychiatrist looking at it or anger management course or whatever the the hint is whatever the world is expressing and bringing up into the table it's going to be left as it is and see where the movement comes from it you come it comes up to this somebody says does something or something happens to them and this and the point might come up or through to act on it you know there was the emotion comes up as well but leave it and it's It's hard to do when it comes up spontaneously, but out of the old habit we've always reacted to it, it's a natural response.
But leaving it as it is and letting it die down, you know, and after a while it won't even bother coming up. But you've got to keep seeing through it and catching it. So it means that alertness or attention or awareness, whatever, you know, in the end of the day awareness, just see everything as it is. And you break the old habit. Yeah. And also the old easy recipe that you taught me as well, take the label off and see the bubbling life without calling it anything, without calling it volcano or violence or anger. Yeah. Or whatever. And just be present with it. Yeah. Look at it, it's fresh in you.
It's like, there you see it for the first time. Like, oh, this is interesting. Oh, yes. We've got a couple of answers now. Sense of incompleteness does not exist at all. The best thing I can say that is I have no questions. Thank you to you both. Much love. Yeah, we did. That was Michael. Ah, yeah. And Jesse says that we are beautiful. Thank you. And Larry says, Bob, so is presence literally pre-sense prior to sensing yet necessary for sensing? And is that what is being pointed to, the presence as pre-sense? Pre-sense, yeah. Immediately. John is asking, Kat, are you planning on writing about your understanding and publishing a book?
Your pointers have also been very clear and many others could benefit. I have no idea. We started writing things together about three years ago, but then the life kind of sidetracked it. Maybe it will get complete. Maybe not. Right now we are, we have to necessarily, not by our choice, focus on a different thing. But who knows? Yeah. Rohan says, thank you. I saw documentary the other day. I saw a documentary on chimps being brutal, killing other species of monkeys and even other chimps to expand territory. We see the same behavior in animals also as we see seemingly, as we seemingly exhibit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Very good point. It's just the magnitude of the, of the experience. It's like being territorial with the animals. Look how territorial humans are. We are pushing out all the other species over the edge of the flat earth if it was flat. Yeah. It's a, you're right. I've seen the documentary in which I have even seen a adult monkey raping a baby monkey. Horrifying. It happens. And I don't know whether they develop a basics of the, of the selfing network in the brain or, or is it just part of a nature ritual? But it's extremely rare. Extremely rare. To, to be able to film things like this, it was one of a million of the films or more of those monkeys within humans.
As far as, as my own research says, when I spoke with men, because I spent most of my life working on the ships with men, asking them questions, the, the thoughts like this, even incentive thoughts or they, they present. They are so important. They are so present within that selfing structure. The acting out of them is through the socializing or sense of guilt or shame that has been introduced by religions is kept down. But we are watching documentary right now about yesterday. We watched a little bit about the inquisition. My gosh, we cannot compare human species and the cruelty to which the human species are.
I don't want to. I don't want to. I don't want to. Yeah. To, to the animal kingdom. There is no way. We are in we are really insane. I mean, if you, if you look at the history and this is happening today, if you watch the news, uh, and it is, yeah, it is the self-gratification. Perhaps if there was no self-gratification, certain level of violence, cruelty would still be associated with the. Yeah. Perhaps even defending. Yeah. Yeah. defending the territory, or defending the family, or defending a physical body. But the magnitude is just unthinkably incomparable. But yeah, I'm glad you see it, because I always love to relate to the truth of nature.
That yes, it is happening out there as well. It does seem cruel, but there is no narrative of self-gratification happening there. When the Codruset kills the brain of the ant and lives through it, there is no meanness towards the ant. There is no meanness even when Lion kills the cubs, the young babies, because he wants the lioness to be available for him. There is no meanness in it. There is no narrative saying of hatred or anything like that, as far as we know by observing nature, because that's just observation. Again, I'm not saying that it's a bad thing. Yeah. All things take place. But the universe just keeps rolling along without it doing it.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, Tanya says, irritation with your daughter can still appear, even if you are clear that there is no separate self. Irritation. You can experience irritation or reaction. Absolutely. I mean, your body is conditioned to have bottoms. You may experience irritation with the premenstrual syndrome. Or with heavy raining, weather, when you, you know. Mm-hmm. And these, like, they may feel irritable at all times. Yeah, that's right. Dogs experience, we would label it irritation. We don't have to label it anything. But when they pass each other too close, or when there is a big crowd or big traffic, and there is too much of the energy mixing, that can cause reaction.
The reaction is totally, yeah, part of the appearance. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You don't want to be a zombie, incapable of having emotional reactions. It's just that the narrative that comes with it, you see through it and you laugh. Yeah. There's always response, natural responses, just the natural activities of the body. Yeah. Reacting, you go into the mind and say, I don't want it to be this way. I can't change it. Mm-hmm. Or, I want more of it, whatever. That's right. Yes, and then Kavita, she is with us. And she does remind, she was asking about resistance. Resistance. Yeah. Resistance. Resistance. Yeah. Resistance. Resistance.
it was the question because I remember Mike was asking about violence and Kavita was asking about resistance but I think resistance we actually did answer or didn't we yeah well I say it all the time resistance is conflict yes when you're opposing something or resisting you're in conflict with it and conflict makes you uneasy that's right and uneasiness can be dis-ease not at ease and it's winner yeah yeah everything can be can be brought down to the distance and I think you are ah yes I see I think you're right Kavita this is what Michael was pointing out when he asked he says that the violence is a form of resistance yeah yeah it's kind of clicked in now yeah everything could boil down to resistance because resistance is such a brilliant feedback mechanism in the body because you can actually feel it you can actually feel it you can feel it you can feel it and you can actually feel it you can feel it you can actually feel it and you can actually feel it you can feel that something's wrong.
Like the way Nisargadatta explains the natural state is the state where nothing is wrong anymore. But when you feel that something is wrong, there is a resistance. Whether the resistance is therefore investigated and labeled or attached to a story or assigned to an explanation of whatever, the violence or the anger or the sadness or the depression or whatever it is, it's still the same resistance and it comes up from arguing with reality, from sense of separation and sense of the idea that this is no good. Yeah, that's it. Yeah, we got it. Oh, Michael says, Sandra says, the love between you both is so palpable and beautiful to see.
Yeah, thank you. It is absolutely magical. To be recognized and let's read. Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm . It is good. And Tanya says, yes, Kat, I would be, it would be great if you wrote a book. I love the way you express non-duality pointers. Thank you. You're motivating me now. Who knows? Maybe that's just how life is redirecting attention away from defending you from your family into something more constructive. John David, does anyone know if there is a group that fans of Bob and Kat meet and talk outside of the meetings on Facebook? Ah, you mean without us? Because you know you can join us on Zoom and you know Bob always love when you give him a call on skype and Sally says, oh yes, I think that's a great idea.
I would love to have the opportunity to talk to others in the group. I think, there used to be a meeting where Tony from New Zealand, you know, and tried to say that a partner ah, is very honest, you know with White House. Mm-hmm . , that's good to hear. Okay, we are still 911. Yeah, and I see, oh, I'm, I'm, you know, exist? Like you're still with me. Oh, yeah, I'm just struggling. Right, because we're living in 하나 right now while you're actually all kind of overwhelmed with the other people and we just couldn't Robin he dropped off we didn't see him on the meetings for a long time but they were still catching up and speaking non-duality that wasn't really about us anymore because but but they were hanging out going to convent the call was with them I think yeah if anyone knows Tony she may be happy to rearrange it but it wasn't online it was physical meeting they were catching up going for lunch or coffee or something and when coronavirus started and restrictions landed on everyone this got to a halt and I don't know if they resurrected or not and I think they've included some people who actually did not want to speak about Bob so I'm not sure but yes Sally you could you could chat with Tony she's very yeah socially organizing things and you know just mean there so is consciousness evolving from ignorance to knowing is consciousness evolving from ignorance to knowing or is it a forgetting that is being remembered again consciousness is existence utterly aware that it exists so it's not just a awareness is clear and empty which always is consciousness comes on there's a knowing then of that existence and it can take then it goes into all the different shapes patterns forms and experiences what we call consciousness yeah but it's still only the awareness yeah the consciousness evolving that is gosh that is such a beautiful idea and it's a beautiful idea that Ken Wilber is going higher and higher onto the spiral Dynamics there is also even Eckhart Tolle is having a dream about consciousness evolving and getting more enlightened and uh see those are gorgeous stories gorgeous dreams but you want to watch out if you want to become a believer because religions offer similar things believing in future in which all your problems will disappear or believing in processes and that lead you to become someone or something, those are not non-duality.
Those are fascinating entertainment for the mind and the intellect. And they are a great description of, because there is evolution on the biological level of the species, which, you know, we call it evolution, but are they really getting better? Some organism getting their survival sorted out better by losing some of the functions, like stopping seeing or hearing some on the bottom of the sea. Anyway, there is a change. We're calling it evolution or involution, whatever is the change. But is it really about the consciousness evolving? Consciousness is already evolved and awake. So saying that it's more about remembering again, I would say, is a more appropriate way of describing it.
Although, again, it depends what anyone resonates with, because words are deceiving either way. And Amarnath, you both are beautiful and lovely. What is... What is your present feelings, thinkings, as father and daughter, as one or just two being, or non-dual one awareness? So also this Facebook objects on home and this event. Hmm, I'm not really sure. I'm not sure. Maybe Amarnath, he has a daughter, and he is talking about the oneness of being, non-dual awareness. Mm-hmm. Facebook objects of home and this event. Oneness of him and his daughter and this Facebook group and, you know, just general oneness. Mm-hmm. What about it? Yeah, so... Oh, yeah, we got the message because Sally was asking.
We got the message from Tony that her chat box doesn't work today. But you may find her through Facebook. So Amarant is saying that we are beautiful and lovely and what is our present thinking? Ask father and daughter. Okay, no, we're not father and daughter. Bob never had children, I never had children either. So we are not blog related at all. But what is our feeling on two beings or non-dual awareness and this Facebook objects and home and this event? Yeah, I think you expressed it already, one essence appearing, patterning, shaping as everything, as this body and that body and there are a couple of cuts, their bodies and the bodies of other forms of the trees and the sofa and the carpet and events, the bodies of the thoughts, the very subtle sort of a fluid bodies of the thoughts and ideas.
And feelings, they're all, they're all, yes, they're all one essence bubbling into the diversity of forms of life. They're just springing in and out of existence. The life of a thought is naturally shorter than the life of the sofa or the chair. But yeah, they still fresh and new moment to moment because they only keep the form when we assert it by, by acknowledging it by projecting it out and looking at it. And that's the way it is. And I think that's the way it is. And I think that's the way it is. And I think that's the way it is. And I think that's the way it is.
But it is still one life. Tanya, no, I definitely don't want to be a zombie. This is Tanya says she doesn't want to be a zombie. I think we are a little bit behind when we were answering about the irritation for the daughter and having all sorts of emotional reaction is good to have them. They they lively, they they beautiful, but different different frequencies bubbling through the body through the system. And then a central nervous system needs variety. Apparently, the biggest torture is to keep people in a single cell and deprive them from sleep. That's the deprivation from the variety. So you want that aliveness to bubble through whatever it is, if you call it irritation, love that irritation.
And Catherine says, Kat, you are a light from the infinite in a female form, James. Hmm, beautiful. That's all he needs. And again, no, he is just life appearing and expressing through this form. And of course, there is a lot of people around who have completely opposite view, especially those who want to take advantage of Bob, they believe on the darkness because he's still around and I can't wait. So it is all duality all down. Thank you. And Ben says, well said Kat, You made the point about the Bodhisattva story once as well. Yeah, yeah, Bodhisattva story. That's the story of one who relinquishes their own enlightenment or awakening to help all the sentient beings.
But this is just one way of looking at the Bodhisattva, because ultimately, I've read, I think, in also Chris's book, The Nine Pieces of Zen, and the Bodhisattva had a completely different definition. It was the definition of someone who doesn't identify as anything. And naturally, if you don't have the Self, you do anything for the other, because that's the only calling. So that's why our relationship is so beautiful and effortless. I have no Self. I do anything, anything and everything for this beautiful man and Deito. It works both ways. So having a reflection of each other without personal agenda is such a natural, effortless joining, friendship, love, all of it.
And yeah, being a mother and father of every sentient being. So we're not blood related, but we may be, and I may be his mother at some point. He may be my father. I may be his daughter, his wife, his girlfriend, his cook, his maid. He is my everything. And I'm his everything. And that's our baby coming into the picture. He's got a hand. Pista. Probably. Whatever, I think it's... Yeah, he just sat on the table. And see if we have... Amarnath, consciousness is knowing without knower. It is beyond knowing and not knowing. Two, beyond language, words, lovely discussions. Very well said, Amarnath. Yeah. That's exactly what it is.
John David Weekly replying to Tanya. I can relate to this question as I lost my cool at work this week, not long after the event teaching brought me back with what's wrong with right now if you don't think about it. Also, I have found that irritation and anger arise naturally and sink back into the mind. I think that's the most important thing. I think that's the most important thing. Yeah. Make me humble. Yeah. I kind of want to, I'm very vulnerable and I like to say, you know, just like a lot of people, I feel like I'm a little bit shy whenever you listen to me, you know, I feel like I kind of want to be humble.
Yeah. I find it even quite exciting when you lose the cool. I find it exciting watching our cats that are sweet and lovely, they really love and respect each other. Sometimes they're just a little bored and they pat each other in the head, and then they run behind. One could say lose their cool. But yeah, for a moment, it's like he's coming. And it's five minutes later. What's wrong with right now? Nothing. Tanya says, great, John. That pointer came up here also. Yes, that's the way. Jasminder, is renunciation necessary in the non-dual journey? Yes. Anything to be renounced is the belief in the separate entity.
That's it. Yeah. It's not even, it doesn't even need to be renounced. It needs to be recognized. Recognized is not even there. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. There's absolutely no need to contrive the way life essence wants to express through that particular pattern. There's no, this is not a path of controlling, changing, altering, modifying, fixing, purifying. There's no, it is being one with life or one with nature. It means totally just opening up to that life and that nature to flow through. And in the recognition of oneness of that life, the fact that this life exchanges signals and food and air with the body constantly, there's no separation anywhere.
The body is part of nature. The thinking is part of nature. It always responds to the nature. There is no separation. Nothing needs to be fixed. And again, a life. A life may want to, through particular body, experience and express itself in that one body as ascetic, sitting or lying on the bed of nails. I mean, life is infinite and unlimited, but that's definitely not part of the non-duality. It's just what it is. It's not non-dual journey. It's non-dual journey doesn't really go anywhere. It is not a journey. It is a recognition that wherever you wanted to go, you're already here. It is coming back to this moment right now as fully it and nothing beyond or behind.
Nowhere to go. It's a journey without destination or without time and duration. Well, you're too caught up with us. Yeah. So there is one more. Renunciation. Again. Renunciation necessary in the non-dual journey. When recognition of non-duality occurs, is there an expectation of what one's life will look like? If it's seen non-duality, it's seen who's to renounce what. That's right. And if there is expectation, you recognize that expectation as just another cloud of thought, image, and ignore it. Just ignore it. Don't bother. Just ignore it. Don't bother with it. Expectation. Yeah. There are stories that, oh, yeah, you know, when you get enlightened, everyone, every bird will sing and the rose petals will flow from the sky and that's, yeah, they're gorgeous.
But there's stories. No expectations whatsoever. Life in natural state is carrying woods, oh no, chopping the wood, carrying a water. It's just a normal life in which there is no story of anything. It's just a normal life. There's no anything happening to entity that lives inside the body or inside the brain. It's just normal being, effortless normal being, just like everything else in nature. The tree, the galaxy, the bacteria. And now Sally says thank you. And Jane says thank you. And we. We say thank you. We say thank you. Thank you, everyone. Yeah. We had a friend for lunch. We got to get ready. Love you all.
Love you all. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. And thank you so much for your time today and some good stuff coming through, right? Good stuff. Everybody. Big stuff going. Everybody, when they're willing to talk, and can pass on to somebody else, what resonates with you, it's yours. Thank you.