Sailor Bob, zoom meeting on 60 added years

Hi everybody. Thank you very much Megan. You're welcome. I've been flashing the medal everywhere. I saw it. That's a good place to start. And so for those of you that don't know, this is my 60th sober birthday today. I went to my first AA meeting. It wasn't my first one, it was the second one after a bust. The first meeting that led to this sobriety today. And that's what it started with. I was definitely on the spiritual surge because I didn't believe in anything at that stage. I wouldn't have a bar of anything, any such thing as a higher God or a greater power. And I was only not believing in it.

I had a closed mind against it. Nothing would penetrate that. But going to the fellowship, going back, I'd been there. The position had been there. I'd been a deadbeat, a no hoper, unemployed, unemployable. I stopped drinking there. I was at the stage where I believed I couldn't possibly live without it. My mind was telling me bullshit then because I'd lived for 60 years without it. It wasn't telling me the truth. But I'd heard of the fellowship 10 years before I got there for the first time. I shipped back from Japan. As a chronic alcoholic with anxiety and neurosis. I shipped me back from Japan, the occupation forces, to a hospital in Sydney.

Came down to the ship and I padded a sail. Big difference today. And this time when I went back to the meeting, I looked at the 12 steps. They've got 12 steps in the AA. They're used in a lot of different fellowships today. And they're very potent. Very simple. But very potent if you look into them. Well, I wouldn't have a bar of them before. This time when I went back, I was handed a book by some, I forget who it was that handed it to me now. No, not that one. It was called Some Riding Beyond. Written by a Catholic priest who was an alcoholic.

And then fell in love with it. Talking about the 12 steps. And in the introduction, you had a little, little statement. He says, we alcoholics are given a second chance at life. I was like, wow. Bang. He says, I've been here. I've been drunk. I was drunk and now I have it. I came out and I managed to stop drinking. I got dry for a while. And when I got dried, I got cleaned up. I got cleaned up. I was able to get a job again. People looked at me. And I got a few, I got a few pickies in the bin as we called it, a bit of money.

And I said, I don't need that fellowship again. I can live without it. And like they said, I picked up a drink again. Finished up in the gutter again. And I got back. And everybody that's given this book, we alcoholics are given a second chance at life. And underneath that, the question. How well do you use that second chance? And it came to me there and then. There's only one way I can use it. If I've been given a second chance, how well do I use that second chance? It came to me there's only one way I can use it. Find out. Find out what it is that's given me that second chance.

And that was the cheek in the aisle when it cracked because it came to me then. Well, maybe, maybe there is such a thing as a God, a higher power. And that's what they talked about in the fellowship. A power greater than God. And I said, I'm going to do it myself. God as we understood him. They called it God. And that started me on the search and being a Westerner. I looked into Christianity. Delved into all the different sects. Went through a lot of rituals and things that go on there. On stage, you get inducted, inducted in baths and speaking in tongues and all this sort of thing.

It took me further than that. And years later, a little while later, it took me to the Eastern traditions. And the Eastern traditions took me to a couple of different gurus there. And each one I got something out of. But it took me further than that. It took me to India. It took me to the Sargadatta. He pointed out what I've been trying to point out for years also. And I wasn't the body. I wasn't the mind. I wasn't this person. I was the absolute. I was the great reality. I was the great perfection. It took a bit of seeing through. But the old habit patterns were pretty strong.

I needed to look into it very closely. It wasn't just repeating things and chanting things, which I did. I was meditating and doing all that. I was looking into the core of it all. What was the base on which it all appeared or expressed on? And the Hindu scriptures pointed that out clearly. And they call it Advaita. Advaita translated means non-duality. And they translate non-duality by saying it's one without a second. Not two. And there was only one Atman. There was only one self. And the way they express it was Sat Chit Nanda Nama Rupa. They were the five factors of Hinduism. Sat is existence.

Chit is consciousness. The Nanda is loving to be or the lesser being. And the other two factors are Nama Rupa. That's the way, which is the name my parents have given me. And the form was the body through which it's expressed through. And they pointed out clearly that the name and form were Maya. They were illusion. They weren't the reality at all. But I believed they were. I was living from that belief. And suffering accordingly because of that belief. And as I say, all the painful repetition and chanting and things that I did with the other gurus opened me up to be able to see this.

Not immediately. But 15 years later. When I went to a fellow called Nisargadatta in India. And he told me the same thing I'd heard many times. That the shackles had been loosened enough in the mind for me to see or hear what he was saying. And that was the turnaround. And that turnaround has been constantly with me ever since. And instead of calling it the higher power or the power greater than myself. Or the God power. What they tell you again in Hinduism is omnipresence. Omnipotence. Omniscience. Omnipresence means total presence. So it's here right now. It's just total there. You and I and everything are in right at this moment.

It's omnipotence. Not higher power or lower power or thought power. Omnipotence. Total power. And total omnipresence. Omniscience. Total intelligence. So it's the one intelligence. The one power. And the one time of existence that's expressing, shaping, forming. As everything. And pointed out also that the great mantra is I am that. Already that. That is all there is. And we've all heard that. And I'd heard it a million times before. And I think, oh yeah, that's a good one. Not really what they're saying. And what they're pointing to is everything is that already. And you are that already. See, existence, consciousness, bliss, attention, and anger. Anyone in the room right now is not existing?

No. You'll say, I'm existing. I'm being. Anyone who's not conscious or unaware? No. I'm conscious or not unaware. So I must be aware. Anyone who's not happy to be? Yeah, I'd rather be alive than dead right in this moment. So I'm happy to be. So what's the problem? Look into the other two factors. The name and form. The name, we've got to put ourselves on, Bob, on this person. And the way it's translating is through the thoughts and the concepts of ideas. The thought. Through the utilising the body to express you. They tell me that's Maya. What do I do? Am I this name? Am I this form?

Need to have a look. And a little bit of investigation. You realise when they say that the false cannot stand up to investigation. That's a fact. When you look into it, you see if it's looking at something false, it'll fall apart under the investigation. And it did. Fell apart under the investigation. And that's good. And realise it wasn't this body. And are you the body? Now look at it yourself. And you realise innately you know you're not the body. Because don't you say my body? And doesn't that imply if it's my body, the body must belong to somebody or something. It's not talking about itself.

It's my body. It's somebody else's body or something else's body. And my mind. I'm not the mind. I'm not the body mind. Just the same as my house. My car. My coat. When you know it's my house, my car. You know you're not the house. You're not the car. You're not the coat. So when you say the body, maybe you're not the body either. Investigate it and see. And when you investigate it, ask yourself, what's this body made up of? And you realise when you investigate a little bit that this body's made of elements. It's just air, water, earth, fire, space. The elements. Well, if you're the body, you'd be with these elements, aren't you?

But are you the elements? Can you separate yourself from the elements? When you realise you can't separate yourself from the elements, try to stop breathing. See how long you last without that element there. You can't. Take the water out of your body. Your body's 70 or 80% water. Stop drinking water. See how long. The fire, the body temperature, the element is fire. Take the body temperature out. You'll soon get hypothermia and die. Get off the earth if you can. Get out of space. You realise you're not separate from space. There's nothing that you can postulate or think of that can be outside of space. What would it be in?

So you can't get away from space. You see, you're not separate from those elements at all. But what about this thing called mind? Am I the mind? And again, you say my house, my coat, my car. My mind. Whose mind is it? Is it the thought, my mind? Is that what a mind is, the thought? When you realise that mind consists of thought, of thinking, of a feeling, all those things, but you are not the mind. Because the mind is just a thought that's going on in your mind. a thought, a sound. What's thought? Sound, a vibration, it's words, vibrations into words, sound. And what's vibration?

Vibration's a movement of energy, just like the body's a vibrating pattern of energy. It can be broken down to subatomic particles into pure energy, you are vibrating with energy. So the mind, thought, can be broken down into sound. So we can't be this person. And where does the word person come from? Doesn't it come from persona, the mask? I think it was Latin, said persona, the mask. Pointing out we've got a conceptual image, it's just a mask, which is obscuring, like any mask obscures a part of your face and you've got it over your face. You know, the mask is obscuring my true nature, locked in the belief that I am this thought, this thought of everything.

I'm me, Bob, the Australian, the good fellow, I'm not so good. I'm unhappy, I'm fearful, I'm anxious, I'm depressed. What are all those things? They're all mental concepts, they're all words. There are a lot of words going on, but what I need to do there, well, just ask myself, is the word the thing? Investigate that, investigate it. You see the word's not the thing. Take the word water, can you drink the word? You can't. Can you swim in the water? You can't. Can you drown in the water? Can you wash yourself in the water? You can't. Can you cook with the word fire? Can you heat yourself?

You can't. What's this word I or me? No one believes it's this persona, this mask, this image. Have a look at that and see if I have an image. And then one of the things, and I started to point it out, he says, nothing can trouble you except your own image. Except your own imagination. Now we've got all these imagination, imagining this, imagining that, the fear, the anxiety, the stress, the future, the past, imagining all these conceptual things that could or might or have happened and will recur and happen again. They're all mental images, all concepts, concepts made up of vibrations, sound, and nothing can trouble you.

Except for your own imagination. So write that word imagination down to image in. Imagine. And when you look at that, you realise that's all I'm doing. I'm constantly imaging, imagining, taking mental images about all these things that are going on. Oh, this is no good, or this is sad, or this is unhappy, or I do this and that, and all the like, and I put on this, this one's anger, this one's fear. All conceptual images. Now look in the mirror. Investigate and see. What do you see in the mirror? When you look in the mirror, you'll see a mirror is absolutely, totally full of reflections.

Even if you see a lot of empty space in the mirror, it's all a reflection in the mirror, even that space. And everything else. So you'll see a pattern of your face in there, and a body in the mirror. So don't go up and try and grab it. See how real and solid it is. You can't grab it because all you'll do is grab the mirror. So you can't say it's not there. It's there before your very eyes. So you can't say it's not there. But you can't say it is there because there's nothing there that you can grab. It's only a reflection that's seemingly a pattern, shape, and form in the mirror.

And when this is all that we are, a pattern, shape, and form in this cognising, emptiness, a space like awareness, that's seemingly solid and substantial. But it's not. There's nothing but a vibrating pattern of energy. A thing. And all this manifestation is nothing but things. Things which we put a label on, until we learn words we can't put the label on. Things which appear, you see a tree, a flower, and it appears like sun. And it appears like a flower. And it appears like a flower. And it appears like a flower. And it appears like a flower. And it appears like a thing. So to give it a differentiation or a discriminator or something you put the label tree or flower.

Put the label on those around you. That's Bob, that's Bill, that's me, that's you. Everything is really no thing appearing as some thing. And if we didn't have the label on it, or the word, it would still be no thing. Now have a look at the word. Investigate How many words were you born with if you think you've got all these words? And you realise you haven't got any words. You haven't got any words. Every word you've ever spoken or ever likely to speak has been learnt. It's been learnt from your parents, then from your school, then from the people around you, and you start learning them themselves when you take them to capacity reading.

Every word you've ever spoken or ever likely to speak has been picked up along the way. If I ask you when you were born, you can't remember. Of course you can't remember your words. You can't say you were born because you can't remember it. You didn't learn any words until you were about two, two and a half, when the capacity of reading developed. Before that you didn't know any words. You didn't know any words. So you realise the word is not the real, but yet we make the words. We make the words. We make the words. They're not seemingly real by putting the energy of belief into them.

Now look at that word belief. Look up your dictionary definition of what belief is. I'm telling you that belief is the unquestioned acceptance of something in the absence of reason. We've accepted something we've never questioned. Take it to be real. Acceptance of an alleged fact, an alleged fact mind you, without positive knowledge or proof. Again pointing out we have an alleged fact. We've investigated it. If you investigate it you'll see it's not a fact at all. So we've got this idea we are this person. And we call this person, persona, this masked entity, my self. Not the pure self. There's only one self, Italian scriptures, the Atman or the one self.

And it's self-awareness, it's self-knowing, it's self-shining, it's self-expressing. It doesn't need a pattern, shape or form or anything around it. One self is expressing naturally and effectively as everything. When we talk about ourselves to be a personal self, see what we're never down to. This narrowed down conceptual image, me, Bob, now thinks of seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, smelling and functioning as well. And it's fearful, it's unhappy, it's anxious, it's depressed, it's having a rough trot that people don't like there. And things have got to be different, you know. And because of that, he's having a bad trot, I hate them, I don't love them anymore.

Not seeing, it's all the one essence appearing, shaping, informing, expressing as everything. There's no need to hate at all. Because it's both, it's all the one essence that vibrates in a pair of eyes. Take any thought. And again, Shakespeare told us this one. He says there's nothing either good or bad. But thinking makes us so. Finding out that thinking is all our problem is. Think this is good or that's bad. And suffer accordingly because of what we believe into the thought. So we're putting that thing I pointed out, it's not the fact, the belief is not the fact. We put the belief into the word and think it's real.

So no wonder we get lost. And relating to something we believe is real. And it's not real at all. It's a fiction. This body mind is not real. The words are not the real, they're not the thing. They're all appearing as vibrating patterns of that energy. They don't need to put any labels or words, they're just labels. And the poet said it out in the Bible. But it says in the beginning was the word. And the word was with God. That's all the so-called God is. The higher power. It's the one essence, patterning, shaping, informing, expressing as everything. Which we put the label on God.

As God. And that's where they got it wrong again because they say God made man in his image and likeness. So therefore they think man in his shape and form is what God is. God's in the shape of man. But it's not that at all. God is a natural pure intelligence energy that fashions shapes and forms and patterns as everything. And the image and form, likeness, that we call man, is just a pattern, shape and form or expression of that. And it's a fuse with that intelligence energy. Knowing. The innate intelligence energy which I use instead of the term God. I don't use the term God because we can get confused with that term.

Each and every one of us come from some different traditions. Some of you might be atheists. Some of you might be agnostics. Some of you might be Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Jews. Or whatever other religions they are. And you say I'm a Jew or I'm a Christian or I'm a Buddhist. Or I'm an atheist. So you see. And even those that believe in all these traditions. Each one has got a different belief in what they believe that God is. It's generally in the shape and form of some man or some saint, sage, sabre or seer down through the ages. Or in some of the religious.

They've got monkey gods and other sorts of gods. Animal gods and this stuff. Gods and cats and things like that. But they're all a word. They're all a word we put out. And the word's never the thing. So you see how we get lost in this. Lost in the word. Lost in the concepts. Lost in the belief. And it goes on for years and years. Until we start believing in it ourselves. And that energy of belief goes into it and makes it seemingly real. And when you look at that and see you don't remember your birth. How could you remember your birth when you didn't have any words?

How could you translate it or discriminate it? Or even conceptualise it without the word? And when did you learn words? Well go back to when you were born. First we'll have a look at that. When were you born? You don't remember your birth. Well go back as far as your father and your mother. That animating life essence. That pattern of energy you call your father. Enable in that pattern a little microscopic particle called a spermatophore. You can't see it with your naked eye. That intelligence in your father. The livingness that's keeping you alive through the prana. The airy breathing. And the food. The nourishment you're getting.

That's keeping the life going. Enable in that form. The pattern a little microscopic particle. That sperm. Now that sperm was suffused with intelligence energy. It knew what to do. And the same thing in your mother. That animating life essence in your mother. Enable in that pattern an egg or an ovum to form. And that ovum was suffused with intelligence energy. It knew what to do. It attached itself to the wall of the uterus. Not just swimming around accidentally. It attached itself to the wall of the uterus. It knew what to do. That sperm knew what to do. Again, pointing out it's a fusion of the innate intelligence.

A knowing. It swam to the ovum. It has the capacity of swimming. Just pointing out it's not a dead image or a blob of goo. It's nothing. It's a fusion of intelligence. And the same with the ovum. It swam to the ovum. It penetrated the ovum. And the life essence was in that ovum. Doubled that cell. Redoubled it again. All the little embryo. The little fetus. Which is what you are today. You might have gotten to that. Or lost sight of it. That's what you started off as. And it's growing you and living you right now. So it's changed. And that's what this manifestation is.

Constant change. Constantly transiging. I tell you that in Scripture. It's constantly transiging. There's nothing static in it whatsoever. No static point anywhere. That body you walked in the room with, whatever it was, 20 minutes ago... or half an hour nearly. It's not the same body that walked in the room. There were hundreds of thousands of cells dying right at this moment. That's the wondrous, amazing functioning that's going on. They're dying right now and being replaced. Now this cell is a fresh and new cell. It's a fusion of that intelligent energy through the food and that cream. It knows what to do. That's why I don't use the term gone.

I use the term intelligent energy. That's not it either. That's just another label we put on. We have to put labels on to express the knowledge. That's why we use the word. But most of us are allowing the word to use us. We never had to use words. We've taken the word to be real and the word is using us. A word is a vibration of energy. It's sound, word, heart itself, sounds of vibration, and vibration is a movement of energy. Now when I call it intelligence energy, I don't mean your intellects as intelligence, because there are different degrees of intellect around. I'm saying look out there in nature, take your life from nature, nature's going to you all the time.

And you'll realise out there there are galaxies forming, planets exploding and imploding, stars going out, Earth rolling around the sun, seasons coming and going, viruses coming, plagues are going, tides are rising, tides are falling, things are being born, things are dying. It's constantly changing, constantly changing. And doesn't that imply what's doing it? There's no old guy in the sky pulling strings and rolling the Earth around the planet. I'm saying it's a movement of the sun, that's functioning through every pattern, shape and form. It's the life essence in every form, shape and form. So you are that. That's when the I am, that takes on a different meaning.

When you understand what it's referring to. Not referring to some vague concept or mantra in your mind. It's referring to what you actually are. I am that intelligence energy. I am the activity of knowing. Intelligence is an activity, it's not a dead static thing. constantly vibrating and transient changing and any activity is a movement of energy so that's where we get the term intelligence energy the activity of knowing and is anybody on that room right now that's not knowing no you say I am knowing what you're knowing you might put concepts on and discriminate it but the fact that you are knowing you can't negate even say oh I don't know how could you say that if the knowing wasn't there you see you're not away from it you never were never will be there's been lost sort of it now you're here looking at this stuff which is good because there's millions of people that won't look at it they don't get the chance to look at it you'll get the chance and open up to it a bit it'll take you like it's taken me where you've got to go you'll hear something that will ring a bell take you further and further and some of you are one on the way right now I see the changes going on you something you've got to know it so we'll see you soon was happening.

But a lot of us, 99.9% of the world are coming from that separate entity, the belief in the person, the separate entity. And somebody sees through it, and people have had insights through it all along. And insights, oh, and I'd say, oh, I saw through the me, or I had a clear insight the other day, but it came back. How could something that's a fiction ever come back that never existed? It hasn't come back at all. All that's happened is you've fallen back into the old habit, the old habit of belief. What do you need to do? Again, how did you get out of it in the first place?

When you questioned it and saw it was fiction, question it again and see whether this belief is true or false. We have so many beliefs. Is the sea blue? Go down to the ocean, we all say, give me a bucket of blue water. You'll see, you'll see, don't be ridiculous. You know the water's not blue. It never was blue, it never could be blue. But it appears to be blue. When you look away from it, we look away from it, recognize it, and the crowd around you and everybody else to be here to be separate, we've fallen back into the old trap again. Space, it's all appearing in space.

Space is what they call sky. Sky is seemingly blue. But space is in that room where you are. Is it blue? It's not blue. It never was, never was, it appears to be so. I've got a crystal sitting up in the window here today. When the sun comes around in the west air, it shines through that crystal. And on the wall there appears colors. Not one or two, but many of them. Three or four colors in each one. Now you can't say they're not there. They're vibrating and moving around on the wall with the movement of the crystal. You can't try and grab a hold of the wall.

You can't. Why? Because like the image in the mirror, you can't say it's there. It can't grab anything from the wall. But you can't say it's not there because it appears to be there. So we get caught back in this old trap again. So when they suck you back in, investigate again. Or come and ask me a question and I'll point you out again. Keep asking until you see the truth. And then you'll see clearly that you are not it. And then when you get the confidence in that, nobody will be able to knock you off that perch because it's what you actually are. It is your reality.

And what can take your reality away? Nothing whatsoever. So instead of them sucking you back in like they have done, you'll suck them out of it. Because they'll recognize something in you. There'll be a change in your face. There'll be a change in your manner. There'll be a change in the way you act. And you won't probably notice it. It mightn't be noticeable, but the light intelligence knows what's necessary. And they'll see you and ask you what you've got. I like what you say and I want what you've got. I'll come and listen to you. That'll be the big turnaround. And that can happen to each and every one of you because you are already that.

And that's what we do. But we've got the idea, oh no, I'm not good enough. I am this person. I've got to become that. Now when you look at that word become, becoming is not being. But aren't you being right now? Are you becoming right now? Not unless you've got some concepts in your mind. It's got some concepts you're trying to discriminate and change it with the word. But whether you change it with the word or not, it's still the same beingness. And then we'll look at that word. You call this thing you call God. You call God a supreme being. There's a discriminating label.

Supreme. And you call yourself a human being. Another discriminating label. Take away the word human. Take away the word supreme. Try and separate the beingnesses with you right now. Can you say I'm not being? You can't. You can say no, I am being right at this moment. So there you are. You are already that. What do you have to do? You have to do is just relax into it. If you lose sight of it, go back and investigate and have another look. I saw this before. I lost sight of it. Where is it? Well, have another look. And again, when you start investigating the false, you think it's going to be real this time?

If you've seen it as false last time, you must recognise it as false again. And once it's been seen as false, and it was false, it will always be false. The false can never be the truth. And the scripture saying is know the truth and the truth will set you free. What are you free from? You're free from all these erroneous beliefs. Erroneous. They take you on the wrong way. Our parents taught us words. They told me little Johnny, I don't know really, through a tantrum or something, told me this is anger, well this is fear. Now you believe that comes up, that sensation comes up.

Well you say this is anger again, this is fear. And you say, well, this is anger. And you say, well, this is fear. And you say, well, this is anger. And you say, well, this is fear. So you're putting the old label on something that's dead. Because that fear you had when your little child is dead and gone. The same sensation might arise, and you put the same label on it. But if you see it fresh in you, you might really look into it as a fresh and new sensation. You might not see it in its old way. You see it as fresh in you, you see it totally different.

A little bit of an investigation is all that needs to happen. When you get a map of it, it'll go on Tony's lens. So that'll do me for the night I think. If you've got another question, tell me all about it. What you're doing with it. And some of you in the last few sessions have been having some very good insights into it, recognitions of it. So away you go. You've heard well. Want to say something, Jad? No, I just want to congratulate you again on the 60th sobriety birthday, even though there is no you who did it. Yeah, it's a miracle because it actually, this is an amazing, amazing, miraculous story.

Because when we think of someone, I was actually walking in Tasmania on Three Caves Walk. I was telling you about about three years ago, there was few people who were familiar with Eckhart Tolle's teachings. And the guy who I had a chat with, he says, look, Eckhart Tolle doesn't have an ego. And I have an ego and you have an ego. We're not like him. He's superior. He's different. I said, well, stop it. You know, what he's pointing at is to recognize the silence or the gap between the thoughts is that there is the nothingness underlying the ego. My husband does the same thing. We are actually doing it three times a week.

And he says, no, this cannot be the same because Eckhart Tolle is famous. And I am not like him. I say, look, Bob was a drunk. He's been lying down on the streets in his puke and in his peace. He was, how did he say it? Unemployed, unemployable. Nobody would want to have anything to do with him. He's the type of a guy that you sometimes see homeless and you want to look the other way because it stinks. And look at the transformation. How beautiful transformation has happened by the light of the sun. And the light of the sun is the light of events that he could not foresee or arrange for himself.

Life took him where it took him. It's like Jesus speaking to prostitutes and merchants didn't have any distinction, didn't feel like one person is superior to the other. And one can realize or wake up or, you know, Ramana Maharshi, Anissa Gaddafi, they're all super humans. No, Bob wasn't a super human singing in the front. How do you say it? In the front of Prince Wales? I sang before the Prince of Wales. I sang in front of the hotels. Yeah, singing in front of the hotels just to get someone to give him some coins or to buy him a drink. Singing drunk. Not the Prince of Wales but the hotel called Prince of Wales.

So it is as simple, it is as natural, it can happen to anyone. It could have happened to him life-guided human way. It can happen to anyone. So we are having a special day. I'm trying to make it as special as possible. Having wonderful cakes and, you know, a nice drink. And just, yeah. And we got the... Happy birthday, Bob. Happy birthday. Thank you. And we got the 67... 60. 60th thing from Megan. Yeah, thank you, Megan. And we got a beautiful gift from Judith. Thank you, Judith. We got the... Yeah. And it just shows how natural it is and how there is no preconditions.

No matter what your mental condition is, no matter how persistent, obsessive thoughts, depressions, no matter what is the situation now, recognition of that silence underlying that mental condition or physical condition is always there. It's always available. And even seeing that condition as an object in consciousness is already seeing from that. Opposite from that emptiness, from the non-identification with it. Yeah, I just had this memory flash up there of you at Richmond, that meeting in Richmond with my dad and a guy from... Another guy from America. You spoke that night. Cathy was there as well. And what you were talking about before was... Yeah. You know, all of a sudden, they'll want what you have.

Mm. And I heard you speak that night and I wanted what you had. So I still want what you've got. Because it's the same as what you wanted. Freedom from the known. Freedom from the known. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Mm. Yeah. Wonderful. Yeah. Wonderful journey. Beautiful. What a complete transformation. I sometimes dig out some past memories that are fading very quickly from Bob. Like what happened 60 years ago? 60 years and two days, he got fired from the boat, from the ship. What was it? Il Peña? Mm-hmm. Il Peña. The ship? No, Aranda. Aranda. Oh, yeah. Okay. I got all the ships. And I'm so happy.

I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. And he was going home. He was sick and tired of being sick and tired of having those hangovers and fights. And when he got fired, it was because the captain got him up early in the morning after a big buzz when he fell drunk into the pail of sugar. And he was covered up with dirt and the sugar. And he only got a few hours of sleep. he was called up well he was actually he was you they couldn't find you to leave the port so he was late he delayed a ship and to delay a ship to delay an operation the thousands if not ten thousands of dollars for an every hour of staying in the port and they were waiting for the guy and instead of crawling down and apologizing he actually was sick of it and he not only had a goal with the captain for waking him up drunk before his but he actually attempted to attack him physically so that was the bottom that was the rock bottom you know sailors used to have a brilliant and beautiful salary the members of the Siemens Union every day was beautifully paid I know that from experience yeah and see what happened see the transformation see the serenity today there is there is no mental anguish anymore even if there is a attack on his freedom or if there is you know the phone calls with life threats the moment of reaction takes a second or 20 seconds or half a minute and then serenity goes back and the joy of being goes back the ease of being goes back so this of course it is years of recognizing and it happens just so quickly it wasn't like this 60 years or 45 years ago because that was 45 years ago it didn't happen straight away so if it doesn't happen to to happen to you it doesn't happen to you it doesn't happen to you it doesn't happen to you stride away but it happens at all that's that that's what is to be highlighted the moment when it happens when recognition happens when the shift happens when the mental anguish and the and the story is recognized for what it is it's just the story and and and that acknowledging that moment of freedom is bringing more of it because it's another mind training is training your self to do something, to be a better self.

out of following the train of thoughts. It's training yourself in waking up from. And, of course, it's not you training yourself. It's the happening. But the inspiration can make it momentary and constant. You wanted to say something, Judith? Oh, hello. Oh, hello. Can you hear me? Sorry, I wasn't sure if I had. Hello. Hello. Sorry, I've got my picture up there because I only just got out of the bath. And I've got my PJ on. Come on. We're going to see. And happy 60th, Bob. Thank you. Beautiful. Yeah, I just love to listen. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, so please ask questions because that will start Bob off again.

Well, tell us your version. Yes, tell us how you're going. Yeah. Any insight? Any recognition? Any recognition? Any moment of breaking free? If you share it, you not only reinforce it in yourself, but you can also inspire others. So can I just ask a question, Bob? How many, before you met Nisargadatta, how many other ways of, you know, like you were attracted to? I mean, I think you were attracted to different religions and stuff like that before you went to Muktananda and before you went to Nisargadatta. So can you just talk a little bit about that? No, it's just the usual thing that most people go on.

Read the different books around. I looked into Christianity at first. And that led me to the Easterly stuff. Yeah? And Maharishi came out in 1962. I got initiated into him. Hmm. Then I happened on Joel Goldsmith, or really Christian Murdi then we couldn't understand him. And years, long go to Nisargadatta. Christian Murdi was in Bombay. And I went to Nisargadatta and said, go and see him. what he was saying, I could understand him like an open book. He opened up and I couldn't understand him. Then there was Joel Goldsmith and Mukta Danda, spent many years with Mukta Danda. Finally got to Nisargadatta. So you actually saw Krishnamurti too?

After? Pardon? Yes, you saw Krishnamurti too? Yeah. I heard him talk in Bombay. It means that Nisargadatta really appreciated him. He told me to go and see him. Yeah, that's nice. When I'd read him years before, I'd just strip this book away. I couldn't understand a word of it. So simple, after. I understand him so well. Yeah. Bob? Yeah. Hi, happy birthday. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. When you were with Nisargadatta, like when I watch videos, he's screaming. Were you ever sort of fearful when you first went to see Nisargadatta? Like, were you fearful that he'd kick you out or that you wouldn't get it or something?

Well, no. He was so approachable. But you couldn't help but love the man. Mukta Danda, you couldn't get near. He had a guard around him all the time. You know, you had to write in written notes to get to see him or written questions to ask him or something like that. And all the books, man, it was very good. But all the rubbish and everything around him, the hype, would stop me from approaching him, you know. But Nisargadatta, he was just a very ordinary guy and very approachable. You couldn't help but love the man. People said he was an angry man, but he wasn't an angry man.

He'd get animated. He'd go, rah, rah, rah, rah, rah. Get you out of my mouth. Get me out of my mouth. And have a hell out of me, you know. All questions, you know. Knocked every question, every answer out. He'd find some falsehood and knock it out. Left me with nothing. What a beautiful nothing. Yeah. Very simple and very lovable. But were you pissed off with him sometimes when he was doing it? Were you? Were you disappointed? Or did you want to fight back? No. No. No. I wouldn't let him go. I was just having a good day. Yeah. But you would ask him questions or you would share insights.

And if you shared the insight, he would say, ah, yeah, well, he would show you the opposite and take it away from you. Did you feel grateful or did you feel... Naturally. Just say it turns out that it turns out. Yeah. And you don't really encourage people to share the insights. Yeah. And you don't discard those insights for them like Nisargadatta did. It's just, I guess, a different pattern. Yeah. Well, different people have different things too, you know. Yeah. Probably wouldn't do it all. Probably there's a little bit of arrogance there and they needed to step on. But they did. Yeah. When Kat was sharing, I was thinking about that thing you say that not everyone can do it.

Yeah. And I think it's a little bit of a myth. Yeah. I think you say that no one's ever gone beyond no thing. So if someone's saying, oh, this teacher is really good or something like that, that sort of busts that myth. Yeah. And no one is superior and no one is inferior. That natural state is natural. It applies equally to the tree, to the star, to the animal, to human. It's all one. It's not dual. I don't do it for dualism to be the ends of it with something other. There's one. There's nothing other than one. Everything is that one. The one can't become two.

Hi Bob. This is the first time I've been to your meeting. There's just a bit of feedback. So I'm really grateful to be here, thank you. And congratulations on the 60 years, it's phenomenal. I'm coming up to one year, I do the NA Fellowship and I've been working through the 12 steps. Coming up to my one year. And that's been my introduction, it's through the 12 steps to non-duality. And I guess I have probably a question that a lot of people have, first coming to non-duality. And I guess it's how do you pursue non-duality? How do you pursue it? And I know you can't pursue it.

I know self can't get out of self. And that's the challenge I guess. That's always going to be there, is how do you pursue it? Yes, I'd be interested in your response to Agina. How do you pursue it? What? Yeah. Go on. Have a look. Are you the body? Are you the mind? Are you the thought? What's your next thought going to be? You can't say. The thinking is happening. And then you say, I think. So as soon as you say, I think, you put it on that belief in entity that you are, the body, mind. That becomes the thinker. And the thinker is thinking in that thought.

What if I thought like this? Now can there be a thinker, the thought I think, without thinking? And can there be a thought? What I'm thinking is thought without thinking. So thinking is spontaneous. Just the same as seeing. You're seeing right now. And the thought I see, you believe it's the person's. I see. I see the chair. I see the table. But can there be a seer without seeing? What is it actually? You realise you're seeing right now. You're thinking right now. You're hearing right now. You're tasting right now. You're touching and smelling right now. The ING is something that's happening in the sub-media space.

When you put the eye on it, you've got the egoic conceptual image. Because it can't be that image without seeing. It can't be a me that's seeing. Well, it can't be the seen without the seeing. Can there? Question that out. Can there be the hearer without hearing? Can there be the taster without tasting? So the ING on it. Seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, smelling. All those functions going on. But we divide them into subject, object. I see, I hear, I think, I feel. And that's conceptual image. The how I is a fiction. The thought I see can't see. Can the thought see? Close your eyes. Look around the room and see what you can see with a thought.

Remember, with your eyes closed, you can't see. You can't see anything in the room. So the thought I see is not seeing. The seeing is happening when your eyes are open and clear. And you're seeing without the thought. You can't in point of hearing without blocking the easier. So the functioning is spontaneous. You're breathing without the thought, I breathe. Your heart's breathing without the thought of breathing the heart. Full spontaneous function. When we take it on board that I'm doing it, take it to this conceptual image. This mask, this persona is doing it. It's a fiction. The thought I see can't hear, can't breathe, can't do it.

Anything at all. And could there be a thought, a feeling or emotion there if that life essence wasn't in the body? No, you'd be a corpse, wouldn't you? And a corpse got eyes, ears, nose, mouth, heart, lungs, all the organs, the kidneys. They're all there. Unless it's been dead for a while. They're all there. Without that life essence of using it, can it see? Can it hear? Can it taste? Can it touch? No, a corpse can't do any of those. Where does that leave you? A corpse, if I can't do it, there's no life essence in the body. It must be the life essence that's doing it all.

And if I'm recognizing that, then I must be the life essence. And that is actually what you are. You're not the body, you're not the life, you're not the life itself. And that's what Christ told you. Thy am I, and I am the truth, I am I. People thought he was talking about himself, he wasn't. He was talking about that I am. Now what's the I am? The I am is the sense of presence. Somebody asks you who you are, you'll say, I am John. But that sense of presence is there prior to the thought. You are the sense of presence. You're not the body or the life.

The body and I are the instruments in which that life essence is expressing. Life wasn't in that body, as I say, you couldn't have a thought, you couldn't have a feeling, you couldn't take a breath, you couldn't do anything. Just like your computer is a good analogy. Look at all the wonderful information you've got in the computer. Touch those keys as much as you like and run that mouse over it. What are you going to get out of it if the power's not turned on? Not a thing. So you must realise it's the power that's enabling all these things to express through that machine that you're in.

Now you must realise it's the life expressing through that body, which is enabling the seeing, the hearing, the tasting, the touching, the smelling, the reasoning, the thinking, the having. So what must you be? You must be like Christ said, you are the life, life itself. And life is continuing, living on life. No room for death in it. Out of life, more life continues to come. Life's told you that also. He says, take no thought for your life. What you shall eat, what you shall drink, what you shall air. Look at the lilies in the field. Even Solonite is always gory. There's not a ray of light on the thing.

Or the birds in the air. He says they don't sow crops, reap, sow them in barns. He says they know, your father knoweth you have need of these things. And your father good pleasure. He calls it the father. And the father's not some big daddy or something. It's that life essence that's enabling all these different patterns to function. Get in tune with that and acknowledge him in all thy ways and he will direct thy path. It does. Little innate intelligence comes up and goes this way or that way, do this, do that. Recognise it. And let it guide you. Let it live. Express through you as you.

Ring a bell. Good. That means it's resonated. And if you resonate with that, that means you've recognised. And the recognising, that's when you've had a taste of your true nature. Know it. And you realise innately you already know these. And that's what we'd have called a cognising emptiness. And we think we are cognising the emptiness. It's not that. It's the emptiness that's doing the cognising. And he made the statement then that emptiness is form. Putting out that this form, formless emptiness, is forming. And he said the emptiness is form and the form can be nothing other than the emptiness. Even though the pattern, shapes and forms are appearing, there's still only the emptiness.

There's only emptiness. Unless everything appears, buggs around, disappears. It's never lost its true nature. There's only life. There's only life. How you doing, Tash? Hey, Bob. How are things? Things are good. Happy birthday to you. Thank you. And I can tell they're good. You've got a grin on your face like a fox eating guts. I'm vegetarian. Bob, I just... Bob, I just... Bob, I just... All right, baby. Like a grin on your face like a goat in a cabbage garden. That's better. Bob, I just want to thank you for just what you bring and what you point to. The last few days I've noticed more and more a curiosity.

But in engaging with the gap that Kat spoke of earlier, like a gap, rather than stuffing it, feel like I've always wanted to stuff it with something, you know, but there seems to be just, I'm not, I don't want to just, I'm seeing through the cage of concepts, I suppose, and not buying into it. I'm just pulling back from any of the identification and I'm just more curious into the sensations and the present awareness of things. And I feel really nice and quiet and there seems to be a trust, a trust that I haven't experienced before. I don't have to do anything. There's nothing to do.

And yet there's just a, I don't know. Seems to be. It seems different. Something seems very different. Good. Good. So all will be revealed. Reveal itself. All happens naturally. Just like in nature. Rowan? Hi, Bob. Happy 60 years. Thank you. Yeah. Just, yeah, I guess echoing what Taz said, being similar, just, yeah, little insights keep coming up and yeah, just kind of similar. I'm seeing now that the whole thing is being taken care of in a way. Like, yeah, it's just, and kind of this, like, knowing that it's kind of brought us this far and it's not going to like, well, yeah, even if there is, the idea of purpose is not something that's really, it's a concept, right?

And I'm seeing through that as well. But in terms of like the insights, it's not like I'm doing anything for them to come up. They're coming up. So yeah, just happy to rest with that. It is. Just as soon as you can't do anything to think of, thinking, however, so the insights will come around to you. Get the so-called false thinker out of the way and that allows them to come up with. When we're walking off with the concept that I'm going to do this or I'm going to change this or I'm going to think this, we're stopping the true nature, the true intelligence, from expressing naturally.

And that's what I'm saying. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's like you said, one of our earliest meetings was maybe seven years ago now. You said it's like burning the bale of cotton, you light one corner of it and it just kind of works its way through. Yeah. There's no one doing that. It's just, it happens on its own. It has and doesn't. And it's pressed so tightly together, that cotton, because you can't put it out. It'll keep smouldering,problems . And how's Jane doing? Jane's good, yeah, she's good.

That's what they call me anyway, Bob, I beg to differ. They call me Jane, but who am I really? That beautiful presence awareness, that pure intelligence energy, eh? Yeah. I was just thinking about what that man who is only one year around, sorry, what was your name, John, is it? Yeah. I was just thinking about your question and you see, I come from a 12 step background as well. And I got into the AA fellowship in 1984 and I met Bob there and then Bob turned me on to AI. And I was a part of the Eastern philosophy to Nisargadatta and Krishnamurti and all that.

And so like you, I was sort of juggling the 12 step program with a non-concept of God, if you like, because this is about one without a second. This is about God not having a name or in fact, none of us having a name really in reality. But I was just thinking about that. And I was just thinking about that. And I was just thinking about that. You know, I was trying to figure all that out in my head in early recovery and it was a little confusing. But I think it's all there in the big book. The more I read the big book, well, actually the big book of AA, I'm sure it's probably in the NA book too, but Bob would attest to this.

It's deflation at depth, total depth. In other words, every time you have a look at a pattern... Yeah. pattern, which and more will be revealed, more will come up all the time. It always ends up back when you do the treatment that's in the big book, it always ends up at selfishness, self-centeredness. And then taking that further, Bob says, well, there is no self. So, basically, but what the big book's also saying is that it's God's will, not my will. So, basically, it's just a different semantics, but it's saying the exact same thing. Any life run on self-will can never be a success. So, every time you see that come up, Bob used to say to me, he used to say to me, anytime you're in the past, you're wrong.

Anytime you're in the future, you're wrong. Because what you're doing is you're imagining this image you have about yourself in the future. In the past, it's usually because you're full of resentment. In the future, you're anticipating and imagining or obsessing about something and you're anxious. But neither of those patterns can live right here, right now. So, but the great thing is more gets revealed all the time. You have a look, you know, you have a look, but just ask yourself, who is it that's looking? You know, so. I mean, what's been interesting is, and I think I've seen you at some Paul Hedeman meetings as well.

So, Paul speaks really well about the 12 steps and also non-duality separately. But so, I guess that's been my, it's been through Paul Hedeman that I've kind of come to here. Yeah. And for me, because I was so broken before I actually went into NA, but I'm doing the 12 steps the AA way. Go figure. Right. Much easier. Much easier. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Much easier. But I mean, I feel, you know, because I was so broken before I got into NA, I'm really, the idea of non-self, you know, I can really understand holding onto much externals. So, you know, non-duality, it makes so much sense to me now, but that doesn't necessarily lead, I mean, it's going to lead to awareness, you know.

It might be another, you know, when I hear someone say seven years or 15 years, I kind of go I don't know if I've got 15 years. No, no. You don't know? You don't have to have 15 years, because like I said, like Bob said to me, he pointed to me and he said, you know, anytime anything comes up, you know, it's all related to a self. And who is this self? You know, who is this self that's resentful or full of self-pity or, you know, you're not going to get it? You know, I'm going to get it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's not something that's full of anger or full of remorse or full of sadness.

It's the image we have about ourselves. It's that parasitic movement, as Paul Hedeman calls it, that took over, took over, you know, and said that they were running the show or it was running the show. And it never was. It never will be. And so the minute you see that, bang, you're in conscious contact. So you bet, you know, you bet, like, you've seen another pattern, another pattern's been seen. And like Bob said, more gets revealed all the time. And I've taken a few people through the program who have been into non-duality. And, you know, they sort of relieved before they're even halfway through, because they see, you know, it all leads back to self and there is no self.

So bang, conscious contact. So it's just more gets revealed all the time. There is actually no time. So don't get caught up in the 13, 15 years. That's just another concept. There's only now, there only ever has been now. I hope that helps. Sorry, Bob, I took over a bit there. Sorry about that. Egan, want to say something? Yeah, sorry. Yeah, I've just been working really hard, Bob. I woke up today and went, oh, another fucking day. And so I've got a bit of an attitude problem there, Bob. I mean, it didn't last. I still did all the crap today, but it really didn't help to wake up and go, oh, another fucking day.

And it reminds me of when you say it takes a lot of work to be bored. It was something like that. Like you've got to create a construct of yes to fucking day to have another fucking day today, you know? It's just not helpful. Yeah. It was just another thought. Just another day as a thought, if you want to think of that. What is it? Repeating the old thought, so drop it too. And you say just another, treat that just as like just another day, just another thought. Yeah, that's certainly been coming up for me. One thing that's been really lovely is I've had no resentment for weeks now.

And just, you know, how you say don't go there, or that's just a thought, or that's just a concept. And in our book, it talks about the deep futility of resentment. You know, it took me a while to realize how much energy it takes to create a resentment. You know, I've got a story of me, story of the other, a wrong story about what the other did to me. Because they're just doing it over there. They're just patterning out. Yeah. They're not thinking of me. You know what I mean? It's a lot of work. And then to like reinvent that story every day. People say, oh, that resentment came back.

But I actually have to sort of create it each day. I have to give birth to it in order to have a resentment. Zoe. Hi, Bob. Hi. Yeah, happy birthday. It's nice to hear your story. Just another story. Yeah, I kind of go, it's like this non-duality. It's with me always now. Like it's kind of woven into my life. It's always present. Good. It's got you. Yeah. Sometimes. Yeah. Sometimes. But then I, you know, yeah, I can have periods of time. Yeah, lately I've just been really interested in that, the words that have come into my head are just being and the singing. Your being singing.

Yeah, that's just kind of, but then I can get lost in my resentments and stories. Yeah. And yeah. Yeah. I kind of get lost and then it feels like, yeah. Oh, if the eye gets lost, leave it lost. Yeah. It comes back. Yeah, resentments can be a favourite one and yeah, so. Do you know what I love, Bob? You always used to say to me, what was it? What was it? What was it? What was it? What was it? What was it? What was it? Try and sit there and do nothing. So these days I sit there and I do nothing and when I do nothing the whole day, then I can just blame it on you.

Good one. You don't have to take it on board then, do you? Exactly. And another thing is see if I can. But something always gets done. That's the amazing thing. Something will always happen. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. Yeah, she'll certainly take another breath. Exactly. Listen, there's not a heartbeat there. Yeah. And also, I remember the story. It is kind of relevant what you are saying, Judy, and what Megan was saying because this is such a beautiful aspect. I remember Cliff on one of the meetings, many of you know Cliff, he came up with a little insight that he had throughout the week.

He said, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. And he said throughout the week that he was doing scrambled eggs for breakfast and get them to dry. And then a couple of hours ago, he spilled a little bit of a tea. And then a couple of hours ago, he hit the edge of the sofa or something. He said, oh, shit, I'm having a bad day. But he caught himself on it.

He actually heard himself formulating that judgment about the day. And then he says, oh, wait a minute. What type of a bad day is that? He looked throughout the day, and he realized how his attention peeked out those little details and completely leave out the beautiful sunny day, the fact that he went up in the morning, had a swim in the sea and a little warm sauna. He got the loving phone calls from his kids, and he done a lot of good things. It's just a few little details that kind of made him say, oh, I'm having a rough day or a bad day. But realizing how that definition.

This is what you, Megan, was saying, that somehow we create the mental image in which we summarize, oh, yes, shitty day or whatever. And this takes effort. This takes a lot of imagination and a lot of belief to sustain that image and to keep it real because the act of belief makes it real. This is, of course, it's not a doing in a way that there is an ego that does it because ego is a fiction and doesn't do anything. But it is a mechanical habit. That is really expensive energy wise. It is not an ergonomic behavior. It takes an energy to hold that world, that map of reality solid.

Once it is realized, it actually the energy moves out of it and it just goes down like a balloon, just like the deflating of an ego through the 12 steps. The 12 step makes you kind of humble. It's like takes the air out of it. The arrogance. The ego. The ego. The ego. The ego. The ego. Or the arrogance of the mind that thinks, oh, I know it's a bad day or it's a rough day because I know because I'm so wise. And then suddenly exposure of this one makes it completely lose its validity, its importance, its relevance. And it is laughable. It's just the concept seen flat out without any life in it, without any belief in it.

It's so laughable and not. What do you think? When those concepts are abandoned, when they're waking up from that story happens. This is those are the moments of that because who wakes up. It's not the ego that wakes up. Ego is a story itself. Story. Doesn't wake up from the story when the moment of recognition happens. It is always the pure cognizing or recognizing emptiness. There is no separate me yet. It's the pure. I am or a pure being or that what Sally was saying that being that's being singing or silent singing that silence singing recognizes itself wakes itself up from that construct of a bad day or of a pity for me or whatever the construct is that those are the moment of liberation the moment of awakening moment of natural state when the attention is not trapped in anything is just relaxing it's not going anywhere and then of course then it starts moving again but any movement of attention can also be recognized it can just be recognized as a movement of attention and what is what is it recognized from from its opposite so from the stillness movement is always always recognized from the stillness so the stillness is the recognizing agency it was so cold because there is no agency because there is an absence of movement it's not a dead nothing it's quite alive nothing that calls almost for the quote that Bob likes of Shakespeare nothing's either good or bad thinking makes it so nothing has any quality other than the ones that mind gives it and believes it so I I am neither.

I'm neither good nor bad, neither young nor old, neither ugly nor smart or pretty. Nothing. All of those qualities are assumed. Nothing has no qualities. Oh, so I've studied quite low beginning and low end. So any judgement can be recognised as just another habit pattern. We think the word nothing means vacuum or avoid. There's no thing. No thing breaks it down. You've got no shape, no form, no pattern at all. Just a vibrating pattern of energy. And you don't have to try and force everything out and shut it all away to be nothing. No thing. When you realise that every manifestation, every pattern, shape and form are things, which we just grow and over by putting labels on.

A bed, a flower, a tree, a sky, you and me, you never know. All things. Can some thing come from nothing? Yeah, we have a couple of comments here. We have Happy Birthday. And I was wondering whether in your experience concepts stop being generated or lose their power or both. That's from Tim. From Tim. Ah. So can you comment on that? Whether the concepts stop being generated or lose their power or both? Well, when you know a concept is a concept, you know you're going to keep generating. Why would you? And you know, what power has the word got? Does the word have any power?

It's only the energy of belief that goes in it. It's the energy of belief that simply gives the power. Everybody will have a concept about you. You will have a concept about everybody. And you will have a concept about yourself. And they'll have a concept about themselves. Which concept would be right? When you understand that all concept is a mental construct, a thought. So it's only a mental construct. It's not even anything confounding, is it? Who can ever be superior to you? Who can ever be inferior to you? And what would you want of the other person? The other concept is nothing you want. And nobody can say you need to take something off.

They've got more than you on us. The concept about yourself that you've not got enough of. No concept. There's just that natural equilibrium there. Wonderful. And I also add to this one because I spoke with many, many people. And sometimes there are periods of time when that opening happens. When there is not a lot of mental images or not a lot of the commentary. And then the commentary does come back or it doesn't come back. But it doesn't really matter because it's not that important. It's not that believable. And even if there is a strong believable thought or threat or whatever idea, the image, because this is all imagination.

Even if it is very, very strong and it generates some sort of response in the body, it doesn't last long. So they lose their stink. I mean, imagination still works. Like the language works. You can formulate concepts, ideas. And judgments come up as well. When you see someone on the street, judgment might come up. Or when memory comes. But they are not believable. And you don't really take them to be a truth anymore. Like before, the idea of having a bad day would be taken on board and carried around. And everything would be interpreted and translated as such, as a proof that it is a bad day.

Whereas now, Cliff caught that idea and laughed at it. Because he could see the potential of that concept to take him for the ride. But the potential hasn't been fulfilled. The concept has been recognized. Whether it comes up. There are periods when they come up. There are periods when they don't come up. But either one, no one is, not one concept is preferred over the other. I remember I had this with my experience about four and a half years ago. I had this very, very long, long, quiet period. And then something happens. And I moved in and I lived with Bob. I started living with Bob.

Something happens and I started noticing, oh, there is a narrative going on again. The narrative wasn't really big. It was more or less commenting on the traffic. But I was surprised. Because for a long time there was no narrative. And I said, Bob, is it all right? I mean, I don't know. I kind of feel that I have kind of a little bit, I'm puzzled whether I have a preference for the narrative not to be there or what. And Bob looked at me. Okay. Who cares? The freedom is when you don't care either way. Whether there is a narrative or there is no narrative. Whether there are concepts or there are no concepts or images.

And I realized, oh, shit, that's another subtle way where the mind creeps into the picture and want to seduce you to desire something that is not. Desire the quiet or non-concept. If there is a concept, that's exactly the will of the absolute. There is a concept. If there is a desire for no concept, that desire can be recognized as another subtle way that, that makes you feel like you're not there. Another subtle way that, that mind shows up and dances its dance. And then you laugh. And I laughed. And right now, whether there are concepts or there are no concepts, it makes no difference. There is no one who wants anything that is not.

There is no one who wants it otherwise. And that's the freedom. And that's what, yeah, that's what Bob has shown me because I did ask him, do you have commentary sometimes? And he says, no. Yeah, well, sometimes I do. Sometimes I wish for some commentary and there's nothing coming up. And I have to kickstart it. And he laughs. There's nothing wrong. Commentary is not a thing. And sometimes there is not. It's definitely much, much, much less and more or less the self-referential commentary is gone. Like I used to obsess about myself, about the relationship I had or what people were thinking about me or how was I going to do here.

But now the self-referential commentary is gone. Like there is no concern about the so-called me, the body, the mind, the stories, the relationship. All that is around that sort of pattern. It just doesn't really get any attention. It doesn't even come up to get the attention. But other commentary may or may not. Other concepts may or may not. I actually have a little bit of a soft spot for that. I have a little bit of a soft spot for psychology. I love to look into the motivation lying behind the pattern of behavior. It's not a personal thing, but it shows through the personality. And it's exciting.

It's still mechanical. It's not believing that there is a person generating motivation or doing behavior. No. It's part of the dance. It's just like watching the flower blooming or watching the tree grow. It's the same way you see the pattern. You see the pattern of thinking repeating itself and strengthening itself. A pattern of behavior. They're all the same. They're all the same energy, just different form of expression. I think there is one more comment here. It is from John. He had to leave early, but he's thanking so much for the meeting and for being so kind. Congratulations on your 60 years. Yeah, a lot of people expect the meetings to be one hour because most of the 12-step meetings are an hour.

So we are one hour and a half. So better ask questions so we can learn after that. No time to have it. Okay. Is that enough? Love you all. Love you, Bob. Thank you. Take care. Thanks, Kat. Thank you, everyone. Thank you. Thank you. Bye, Bob. Bye, Kat. Bye, everyone. Bye, Bob. Bye, Kat. See you soon. Love you. Bye-bye. Thank you, Bob. Thank you, Kat. Thank you, Megan. Thank you. Thank you. Love you. Love you.