Sailor Bob - nonduality - no separate spiel. 27.10.2019

Well, you're all old hands at the game. You all know what it's all about. I can run through it all again and again and again. But if anybody would like to say something or got some questions or something to start it off with, we'd go from there. Yeah, Michelle had a question. You want to ask your question? And we're going to just start over on karma. Well, we're talking about karma. Yeah. I don't understand that. A lot of the mysticism of the word is a bit, it's all overlaid because karma comes from the probably Sanskrit but maybe Pali word karma, which just means action. It's just part of the, comes from the root of the word action.

So just a little bit. It just means to act. And then over that action, you have good and bad action and cause and effect and everything else. But if you go back to just simple action, you can see one action will have a certain effect and another action will have another effect, apparently. Yeah, apparently. Yeah. And that's the whole illusion of the appearance of things. So if you do something in five years' time, something bad might happen to you. There's that idea of karma. Yeah, there's an idea. Or next lifetime. Isn't that the label that we put on it? It is. It's just what it is?

Yeah. I would say this is probably the best explanation for the idea of karma as a cause and effect from the guru I had in India, in Tej Gyan. He says, if there is an action, what follows the action is a certain neuro pathways in the brain are being formed. So the habit follows. The habit is the consequence of action. So if I go and steal something, the first time I may have, you know, doesn't feel, doesn't sit right. But if I do it again, it's kind of getting easier. And then it may become a habit. And now the effect of the action is a habit.

And that habit will run my life. And in this way, it kind of takes off the idea of, oh, why God has done it to me? Why would that happen to me? Or how did I deserve it? Or what I have done wrong? And why do I have to pay? What am I paying for? All that I, all that self-obsession that happened to me is taken out of it. And that's what the consequence is. If the habit pattern or idea came to my head to go and steal or do something or gossip about someone, and the result follows with the habit pattern, I'm innocent. I didn't choose that thought.

That thought was a result of the whole universe conspiring, my parents, my society, my school. And then, and consequence is still there. So it's not that, yeah, on one hand, I'm completely innocent of that, of that pattern. And on the other hand, I'm fully responsible because the consequence is here. My own action, my own behavior is being altered. But the idea, you know, that naive idea that, oh yeah, I had a car accident because maybe I didn't pray in the evening. That's a childish thinking that is, I think it is like, what was it? There is this beautiful idea of spectrum of consciousness that Ken Wilber popularized.

It's not his idea, but that, you know, What was that? The spiral dynamics that Tony loves so much. Oh yes, yes, I like it. Yes, that, you know, it's like a mythical thinking. You were a child and you think you can just kind of, you know, make a deal with the universe. Like, okay, okay, I'll pray tonight and tomorrow I won't be asked at school or class or the exam will be canceled. You know, that's sort of the thinking. That's, in my opinion, that way of naivety is connected to the cosmos. And that's, in fact, in a way, in a way we interpret what's happening to us.

So is there no real way to transcend those habits of the brain to change them consciously? And if they do change, we're not really in control of that anyway? Yeah. Starting from the wrong direction. Right. Always. So we're not calling it in now, but we've all done it. And we all continue to. If it's action, the whole manifestation is action and reaction and response. But we take it on as karma as a personal doer and the person's going to get done to, whatever you like, you know. Where's karma if there's no person to react to it or have a response? If it's cause and effect, you know.

Can there be effect without a cause? And if you think it's a cause, a personal cause, who's the cause? Me, so-called me. But we think me caused all our accidents and all our problems and all our sicknesses. That's what it all appears on. But when you investigate the me, how separate is the me from any of it? Or any of life? How is it separate from anything, from anything else? It's all the one essence. It's just doing whatever it's doing. Like movements or actions come on the ocean, it's still in karma. Movements come on it, what happens? Come ripples, waves or tsunamis or whatever. And who's taking the blame for it?

Show me any separate thing or person or thing in this manifestation that can take the blame for anything. Yeah. Yeah. Or you drink and you get drunk. Yeah. There's no one there to be affected. Yeah. It's just what happens, yes. There has to be two to be a cause. Yeah. So there's no cause. Because there's not two. Yeah. Good way to put it, yes. I mean, I think without a cause, how's it going to happen? See, I still don't understand it. Because that example, you may learn from that experience. Like that eating something. That eating something upsets your stomach and you might get pain from it.

So you may recognize that connection. So then you alter your behavior so that you don't have that experience again. Yeah. Isn't that a sense of directing the outcome? Yeah. That's exactly right. Yeah. Who's the you that's having it? That's what needs to be investigated. That's where all our problems come about. And the believer is separate entities, individual. I believe we are this person. Can you find a static point in that body anywhere where you can say, this is where I begin? And can you separate it from the elements? Air, earth, water, fire, space, off the earth? You can't. Yeah. I mean, I can understand that position.

But it really does feel like there's an awareness. There's an awareness that is entangled with this particular body mind in some way. Like if somebody else eats something that upsets their stomach, I haven't got a direct awareness of that. So there is some sort of awareness that is entangled with this particular body mind. Yeah. All the cells in your body. They're all suffused in intelligence and intelligence. And each one knows what to do. So even in your body, your liver cells are going to be troubled by a skin cell or a skin cell. You see, the same thing. The idea of separation, which is the cause of all our problems, there is nothing separate in it whatsoever.

Now, it appears to be so. It'll still appear to be so. But appearance is not a sexuality. It's reality. That body is just a body. Yeah. It's just a vibration. This is just a vibrating pattern of energy. It's changing. It's constantly changing. It's not the same body as this morning or a few minutes ago. It's hundreds of thousands of cells are dying in it right now. There's three trillion cells or something in it. And they're constantly changing. So take that body as a whole and everything that's going on in it is like a... Society. Yeah. It's like the people in the world. And they have different patterns, different bacteria, different viruses, different things.

But it's all functioning as a one body, isn't it? Yes. And they're all... So when you break it down further, it's just the one essence that's doing it all. And it's the idea of separation that divides it up, seemingly divides it. And it can't help but appear to be otherwise. There couldn't be day without night, silence without sea. There couldn't be day without night, silence without sound. Winter without summer or movement without stillness. Without that seeming division and pairs of opposites, what would it be? So if you were over eight and twelve, how would you deal with that? Well, I'd have to wait and see what happens when it happens.

Yeah. Whatever the response is there is what comes up. I think I meant that. But I... You can't remember something from the... Yes. ...and one thing about the past. There's no... Yeah, there is no... I mean, we're all different. OK? Everyone different. The past can be very useful. But the mind is not the enemy because it can be useful. But as far as it vibrates dualistically, it is self-destructive. When we take it... We're related to me. It's my mind or my self. When they tell you there's only one self, there's only one Atman, everything is that one self experiencing, isn't it? We're related to myself.

Well, the conceptual idea is that... conceptual idea of me or mine is going to have the feeling or the conscious or whatever it is the consequences will be playing up in the body, in the mind, whatever it is. What happens to it all in the end? Sometimes when that happens to me, the feelings. You see the feelings that happen to you and you can't find anything static or any independent there. So then you can go into a mind stuff about it, because of this or because of that or this or that and keep it going, concepts in the mind, if you just said well, what can I do?

Leave it as it is, see what comes up next and it will be certainly change of some sort. And then I seem to learn to... Yeah, you seem to and you seem to be able to direct and change your behaviour next time. So it's like the... That's why I get so confused because there seems to be an illusion of free will. Or I could comment on that. It seems to be a mixture of free will and not free will. Like sometimes there appears to be free will. So if you have an experience and you decide to do something different next time, that appears to the mind like...

Who for? Yeah. Who for? Obviously me, isn't it? It's happening to me. But there again, go back and investigate the me again. What's the me? A conceptual idea you have about yourself. I'm Bob, the Australian, the good fellow. An energy of life goes into that, let's say. I still get really stuck on that because I can see that there is an awareness. Like I'm always aware. And there's these thoughts that are coming up, sometimes that feel directed. Like I can have a thought about a certain musical piece or whatever. That seems directed and then sometimes it seems random. Like I can't control the thoughts. But there seems to be an awareness that, as I said before, is entangled with this particular body-mind and not other people's body-minds.

That I, because of that, because I have this awareness is entangled with this, that I'm labelling me. It might not be a permanent entanglement, but for now it is what I call me. There's always an awareness there. Didn't you say that? And things come up and seemingly obscure it or get it out of the road. But if that awareness wasn't there, could any of these other things come up? And you say you don't see it. Every other seeming pattern is a pattern in awareness also. And there are unique patterns and expressions. Well why, if I'm just awareness, if I'm that, if I'm everything, how come I can't have an experience of something besides this body-mind?

How come I can't have a sense of that? How come I can't have an experience of your body-mind if I am that? If you are that, whatever happens is an appearance in that. It's all my illusion. A phenomenal manifestation. Definition of phenomenon is that which appears to be. It's only appearing to be. So like the water appears to be in a mirage, appears to be in a mirage. Yeah. A rainbow seems to be full of colour but there's no colour up there. It's only a reflection of the sun. All these things appear to be so. You appear to be that body-mind, that person. But are you the body?

Are you the mind when you investigate these things? And as I said before, is there a static point anywhere in your body where you can say this awareness starts or it finishes or ends it? And what is awareness? You can only recognise it from the fact that you know you're not unaware. Because you're seeing, you're hearing, you're doing all those things now. So if you're not unaware, you must be awareness. But you can't say what awareness. You can't say what consciousness is. But you know it. There's a knowing there, pure knowing. Without putting in a label the shape and form. That's all the labels we put on everything.

But the label's not the thing. The word's not the thing. Have a look at that. How many words were you born with? And you don't remember any words. You don't even remember your birth. And you didn't know anything until the word started. So that's where all the problems come about. Where the thinking came about. All problems are problems of the so-called mind. And show me your mind. Is there anything substantial there or solid you can say this isn't mine? You say my mind effortlessly and naturally all the time. Oh my mind talks. But what is your mind? Have you ever had a look? Is there anything there that you can say this is mine?

And when you investigate looking into it, there's nothing. They're apart from thought. What we have thoughts we call that mind. The thinking. And what's thought? When your real thought's only a vibration, a mental construct that has no substance whatsoever. A concept. Mental construct. And that's all this manifestation. Mental construct. Appearing in something we call mind. But we can't give you such thinking. It's encapsulated. The only way it gets encapsulated is in between two thoughts. Good, bad, pleasant, playful. Me and other than me. As Walt Whitman says, I'm not contained between my hat and my boots. They're the two ends. Everything seemingly has two ends. No one is sticking.

All the ones stick. It's still all one and the same thing. Everything is that. Everything. So-called thing. Peers solid and substantial. We reinforce it day in and day out. And so it seemingly we're locked into it. But the other way around, when you're recognizing it day in day out and seeing it, it falls into it. And it has no importance to you after that. Things will still come up and it'll still appear the same way. But it's no big deal anymore. You can let it go. Don't be bothered with it. And see what unfolds next. Could cause thought, feeling and emotional. Come up though. It'll all come up.

Just the same as, in nature, steam, water and ice. It's the same thing. Three aspects of the one. Steam is very, very subtle. You don't see it when it's first come out until it condenses a little bit and becomes steam. Then that steam cools. It'll become the liquid. Water. And then the water cools long enough. It'll become ice. Solid. So when you say thought, feeling and emotion are one and the same thing. And we call it spirit and matter. Spirit is the very subtle essence. And matter is seemingly when it condenses or solidifies. I know that you're still going to be asking things from the wrong angle here.

Yes, we're asking questions. But yeah. Because I still don't get it. And I suppose the mind is never going to get it really anyway. I still don't understand that if everything is seamless, whole, connected, why, why I have to have this experience, a localized experience. Like why can't I just, if I'm just awareness or consciousness, and everything is consciousness, why can't my consciousness just jump into the cat or something like that and I experience things from the cat? Why is it fixed? Your consciousness is in the cat. But how come it's not my own? What is my experience? Because you're still naming and claiming. You're still identifying with a separate me.

So that separate me, which is an image you have about yourself, can only live in your memory. And it's either projected into the future or it's a memory from the past. And so you're identifying with that. But in reality, everything is one. And I know it's a hard thing to grasp. But the habit is the clunky mind goes, like Bob was saying, all problems are problems of relationship to me and the other. And the mind can only work that way. And what you said before was quite right. I guess I'll never grasp it with the mind. Though I guess you're quite right. Because the mind's parameters are only duality.

They're two. So it's pleasure, pain, happy, sad, me, you. Yeah. So, so, so... Oh, sorry. The other thing is, have a look. We can go back as far as you can remember. What were you doing for the first two years of your life before you learnt words? I can't remember. I don't know. Just experiencing things very, very directly. Yes. You can't remember because you had no words. It was just a spontaneous functioning. So why did all this happen to you? Because you learnt these words. And that's all we've all done. That's what it tells you in the Bible, plainly and clearly. In the beginning, it was the word.

There was no problem before we learnt the words. That's when you seemingly began. You can't say you began because you can't remember your birth. And we've learnt words without question from our parents, schools, society. And continue to learn until up to times like this, you start to look into all this and see. So naturally, we take on the conditioning. One way or another. Because you're going to go to school. You're going to learn more words. And you're going to mix with people telling you you're a separate entity. You're a person. You're this person. You're this, that, and the other. And you're not good enough. And you're fearful.

We're doing it constantly, day in, day out. And then we're doing it so much that we start saying the same thing ourselves. This is me. I'm Bob. I'm so and so and so and so. And reinforcing it constantly. So it came. Start looking at this stuff. It turns it all on its end. Out of the road. Because what are you going to relate to if you haven't got a reference point? What were you before words? You don't know. But you were. Still were. So it doesn't mean to say you are prior to thought from that point. So when that prior thought that was just a natural, spontaneous alertness or knowingness or awareness, whatever you like to call it.

Wasn't happening to us. Wasn't happening to a me until you learnt words. And you learnt words like I and me. That's the beginning of it. And you can't do much with the words I or me. So make them so many much better. Put a little bit. I'm Bob. The Australian. I'm a good fellow. I'm not so good. All the concepts I've got about myself added onto that. And they're all dead images. All based on past events. What's the image about yourself right now? I'm Bob. I'm a few moments from now. And I feel the same way. The world has changed a lot compared to when I'd first started.

It's different. It's different. It's a different world. It's a different idea. And I can't just say you're me without relating it. You just are, aren't you? Not a thing going on either. I just don't even have to say I am. But that awareness is there. Which we call awareness. Put a label on. Which we can't say what it is. And you go to sleep at night and you think the awareness is gone. But you wake up in the morning and you say I slept well. How do you know? You realise I wasn't there as the person. But I must have been there. You aren't. In the morning you say, I slept well.

How do you know? You realize I wasn't there as the person, but I must have been there because I woke up. And I can say I had a good sleep. You can say something that you didn't even know was going on at the time in the mind because the mind was in abeyance, but the awareness and what appears on it is still there. Sometimes I wake up and I can't go back to sleep. Wake up again. Or when you're saying you haven't had a good sleep. What's the name when you can say that? Oh, because my body feels tired and unrefreshed. My body feels tired and unrefreshed.

Well, you can recall what was going on there. And that seems like an instant. Well, you can recall what was going on during the night when you tossed and turned, you know, and vaguely there. That's the system. I must recognize that you are still existing. Still alive. I don't know about that. Hm? I don't know about that. Well, you don't know about that because you say I had a bad sleep or a good sleep. Well, it's because I didn't. Yeah, well, how could you check your body if you weren't that life-assisting? So do you really think that when you slept at night, there was no breathing or heartbeat or rejuvenation of the body?

Your brain was dead or something? I woke up and started to breathe. Yeah. Very funny. Can you see how conceptual is that? It is. Yeah, you can't really say anything maybe because you're recording your memory wasn't working. If the memory was still recording stuff, which means the symbolic language was in operation, you would probably say something. Like I was dreaming about being in hell or heaven or somewhere. You know, the dreams. That shows that there was an activity. Yes. But when there is no language involved, when there's no way, there's no way to say it. There's no way to say it. There's no way to say it.

There's no way to say it. There's no way to say it. There's no way to say it. And there are no symbols, images happening. What would be recorded? You can't record nothing. So there's nothing to say. But it doesn't mean that you were dead. It just means there is nothing to say. There's nothing that have been recorded. As if you put the tape, record it, and record it silence. Is it nothing there or is it silence? It's just see how conceptual it is. Really what we focus on here is right now. It's this moment. Whether you slept right now or you existed last week or 10 years.

years or 10,000 years is just a story. Also the purpose, somebody was asking here, what's the purpose? What's the why the awareness? Why I can't take another locations? Those are also all conceptual stories, that this is happening because of something or for something that it is for the reason it is. All those stories are invented by the mind. This is all because of the potential of creativity of the mind. And just for the record, it is possible what you were saying that, you know, I want to experience myself as a cat or as a tree or something else is very possible if the field space like awareness or aliveness creates that strong desire in particular body, that desire can be followed, special training may be acquired, and the life can be completely surrendering into achieving those powers.

I had a glimpse of those powers because the retreat that I've done in India with Sarshi . And I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India, I was in India. So a chocolate was coming out of turmeric is the gefunden that the fire breath. the same way word to word when he was talking about the finger that the you know the index finger and the and the thumb touching each other you know when you identify with one this is the field feeler and this is the felt you can reverse it very easily just conceptually and you can also experience a glimpse of the being in other but i tell you from from experience why isn't it a default mode imagine if by default you could experience absolutely every being around i tell you i was going i was telling it on one of the meeting going down the escalator after i've done the shopping and suddenly that mode just activated itself and i could see people passing it was me passing and then another person passing it was also me passing and after a moment there was about 20 of them because it's a big shopping mall and it was so overwhelming i would have to say okay enough otherwise i'll just fell off at the end of the escalator it's just gonna make me dysfunctional yeah so the the pure functioning requires from the awareness to create that network in the brain that creates a sense of location that see the cat it doesn't identify as a person but bob was telling me that the cat has whiskies here and if he is going through a tight hole his whiskies are telling he his shape so if the head with the whiskies can fall through the rest of the body can also fall through this is how the cat's brain is learning about its size and shape so it can be functional so we do have the sense of location we look from this angle through the eyes through the ears we have the rough feeling of the shape for the sake of functioning because otherwise how would the awareness see the world if it didn't have the eyes the eyes need location and to have location that location needs to be protected defended so the whole position of the cat just excels when you're there and now when you're systems that brain survival strategies that brain developed for then it was again life developing it life developing the brain and the brain developing those strategies so there's a practical function it doesn't mean that it can't be learned or experienced or even glimpsed otherwise is it impossible to completely transcend that locality that individuation because we need to survive well it is it is possible to have glimpses yes but not to transcend it fully well you will transcend it fully on the moment when you die yes the sense of being and the awareness of being is not the sense of being is not the sense of being is not the sense of being is not unique it's just like every wave is different has different height different shape different speed of moving in the ocean you have many waves they all uniquely different every snowflake is different but the being awareness of being because it doesn't have inequalities it can't be different it can't be warmer or cooler or vibrating faster or slower because it has no qualities so it is a basic screen it is completely blank that's why thejet engine is very different it is full of wealth like lightings in the And you can have a lot of fun in lucid dreaming.

That creates a sense of duality though. Well, if you're saying that there's surface stuff, the surface activity, and underneath there's wholeness, that's duality. All I mean is when you're operating from a sense of presence and you know you're not the me, the stuff that goes on the mind, to use language appears to be surface stuff, just like I appear to be and they appear to be. To me it's objective. So it's just having to use language to communicate. And also surface and the depth. If you think of the ocean, they're still all water. They're still all one. On the surface there is an appearance, there is some sort of a storm or activity going on.

We've all found that. There's foam, water ripples. Foam and ripples, yeah. But it's still water. We were talking before about the entanglement of I in mind. But sorry, the entanglement of I in awareness. Yes. It's good to remember that awareness cannot be entangled in anything. That's right. So the problem is the I. Yes, that's right. Not the awareness. That's right. The awareness is... is not sublimated or dominated by anything. That's right. That appears to happen. Mm. And that's the label we put on it. That's why we get confused. We think there's such a thing as awareness. Yeah. And we start looking for it. As I say, can you put any shape or any form or anything on it?

Yeah. But the only way you know it is are you unaware right now? Yeah. And you know I'm not unaware. So you must be. Oh, wow. And you must be aware of that wakefulness or awareness, whatever time of day, whatever. It's not something you can grasp, hang on a minute. But it is the basic screen in which everything appears, plays around and disappears. Mm. It's never corrupted or contaminated by anything at all. It's like the mirror is always the mirror and the images in it are always the images in it. Yeah. Yeah. But if there's... Not the mirror. Mm, no. But if everything is whole...

Mm. Mm. Mm. just like energy manifesting constantly and and people do and people and there is a how can having a sense of I be wrong then like if everything's whole and everything as it is and most people most humans do identify with a with a localized sense of I sense of me if everything's whole and everything's perfect how can that that that not be a manifestation but when you investigate it what has ever happened in your dream when you wake up from the dream when does it ever happen how did I can you pinpoint it I was in such and such a place where the dream suddenly took place all this manifestation is the same it's all appearing to be sad seeming the definition of phenomena is that which appears to be another word for appearing it's only seemingly seems quite seeming to be appearing it's only seemingly seems quite real I can't imagine anything else really that image in that's what we do we image in then you continue that'll continue to happen and the spider but we think the person is doing it the person's never done anything all problems are problems of you know and so when you really see that whatever comes up just dissipates because you can see so clearly that all problems are problems of relationships do you understand that so well well uh a perception of some sort of duality to to relationship relationship well we won yeah yeah so so how I see it is is if I if I'm identifying as Jane and something comes along that I don't like well you know I'll resist it you know and um you know if if I'm just cruising along the actions are taking place there's no doer everything that happens just sort of flows along you know but the reason we're here is is because somewhere we got sick of that you know so something's dragged us here to listen to Bob to hear about non duality you know the suffering caused by that all problems are problems of relationships so and there's no answers in the mind none yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah Go on.

Yeah I don't me go on to be good talking I rubic on I can't say they're really, can't say they're not where. But they appear to be so. Now, is that mirror, the essence in which they appear in the background, is that contaminated or corrupted or touched or hurt in any way? And do any of those reflections in the mirror go to say, well, I am the mirror, or I am aware of the mirror? No, that's the same as this awareness, which apparently we try and put a label on. It's just the same as that. And that reflecting surface in the mirror reflects everything. Have a look and see if there's any space in that mirror that's not a reflection.

Now, it appears that we see the space in the background, we see all the space in the mirror. There appears to be space in the mirror, but there's nothing that is not reflected. It's totally full of reflections. So is this manifestation, the same. Totally full of patterns, shapes and forms. None of that. None of them can be contaminated or corrupted. They only appear to be there. Or another word for it, or another way of describing it is surface stuff. Surface stuff. But the problem is we're in our body. It's interesting in language, all the same, you can't do much about I, but when you take the word individual, if you look at the actual meaning of individual, it means that which cannot be divided.

Fantastic. In means not. Individual, that which cannot be divided. That's great. Sometimes the word can say what it appears to be not, but it's still a label. That's right, and that's what pointers are. And it's still covering reality. Exactly. And then someone comes and says, look how many individuals. Yes. Not divided. That's great, I love that. I'll keep that one. You can have it. Thanks Bob. When you say in the beginning, is that we're saying like from the first word, that's when all this religion started? For you. Yeah. And for the man, it's time, it's time. For the conceptual image. For the conceptual image, yeah.

The word. And all thoughts come from learnt words? Yes. Yeah. I can see that's what I say in the beginning of the word, it tells you that. The other one is that Adam and Eve were in the Garden of Eden, in paradise. Everything was right, but they ate the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Good and evil was not just good and evil, but they learnt words. Before they had any language, they were going along quite all right. So, when they learnt words, they were in deep shit. And good and evil, and they ate from good and evil, is the pairs of opposites. Yeah.

Yes. That's what that story's about. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. The birth of dualism. Yeah. Dualism. That's right. You got it. You got it, babe. But all those words, the ability to communicate, and to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, use you, yeah, your point table and divide reality up into dualistic concepts, comes from the fact that we have a complex brain. That comes from our brains. Isn't that right? Yeah. Our brains ability to do that. What a useful instrument. Mm hm. As long as it doesn't use, play. And when. Notise, well, well in the room, how, how, developed even that you're still living and coming together then.

That life essence is going through that body and forming the brain and utilizing it on the body. The brain can't do anything at all without the life. Yes, yes. So it's the life essence. What do you, what's your name for it? I call it Intelligent Energy. But is that the same as what some people would call consciousness or some people would call awareness or? All sorts of things. And they give it a thousand names of Vishnu. Thousands of different names. All the names are like that. Words. So Intelligent Energy. That's a label too. Yes. Yeah. Well, if you're going to talk about it you have to make it worse.

Yes, yes. Yeah. That's right. Which then does bring it into a dualistic form. That's when the dualism comes in. Yeah. The vibration of the activity of knowing. Any activity is a movement. And knowing is another label of what I call for intelligence. Not the intellect which is working out knowledge. Not the intellect which is working out the mind. But the innate intelligence is breathing you right now, beating your heart, growing your hair and your fingernails, enabling those words to come express through you because there's no thinker thinking and thoughts arise. Seeing is happening. That's energy. It's all energy. Intelligent is the activity of knowing. I'd rather use the term God because the term God implies, you know, you can come from some tradition.

I started talking about God. If you're Hindu, you'll start talking about Krishna, Vishnu or whoever else you're worshiping amongst all that. Or a Buddhist, you'll say, no, it's just this presence awareness. Or somebody else will say Allah or all different lives we put on the term God. So if you're relating to that label or whatever it is, you move to, you will miss out on what we're pointing to anyway. So you really can't get there through thinking because as long as you, as long as you're thinking about God, you're not going to get there. You have to try to get there to really experience it or whatever you want to say.

The activity of knowing. Where are you going to get to without knowing? The activity of knowing is going on right now. Where further have you got to go? And who wants to get there? You're already there. You want a memory of yourself? And get where? And get where? Yes. So you're already there. Yes. I'm already that. Start from that fact. Start from that fact. Start from that fact whether you believe it or not. I'm already that. And that's what they tell you in the great mantra. I am that. And everything is that. That's the chair. That's the carpet. That's the tree. That's the mirror. That's the clouds.

That's you. That's me. Which we put labels or words on. Without the labels or different words yet, which differentiate it, what are you then? It's all that one essence. one essence, no separation, no division, no beginning, no end, none of the concepts and that's all thinking is, a mental construct. A vibration that seemingly vibrates into sound which is word. Please pointers show you who you're not. I must leave you with what you already are. When you come back to the place you never let anyone come back. And also, initially you asked that question, you know, you actually mentioned that sometimes it feels like there is a choice or there is a decision to be made and sometimes it feels like yes, yeah, the life does it.

Like for example, I'm asking Bobo, would you like the Italian or Indian today or whatever and it feels like he's gonna now answer or make a decision and it feels like it is his choice. He usually says whatever I like. Now that bumps it on me. But again now, where is the thought or decision coming from? Like right now, okay, I'm thinking Indian or Italian, I don't know. There is no thought, there is nothing happening, nothing popping up. So there may be some sort of a searching going on, okay, just picture this one, picture this one, whatever. Some sort of computing happening. But am I doing it?

No. It was triggered from his question. So it was kind of environmentally. It was triggered. So now I'm responding, the body is responding to the environment. And then suddenly one decision arrives or doesn't. Again, did I do it? I don't know. If I did do it, I have no idea how I did it because it just kind of, it's just kind of shown up. So and then if I did it again, who is that I who did it and how it has been done? So when you see at this point when there is any doubt, it feels like okay, okay, let's say I don't have free will, most of this is sympathetic or parasympathetic nervous system that does everything on autopilot automatically.

I have no idea how to do it. And now there are situations in which it feels so profoundly like yes, this was my choice. If I have chosen otherwise, there would be completely different future happening. That's an imagination. But it feels like I've done it. But now if you look deeper into it, okay, if I've done it, how did I do it? And now you look closer, contemplate, look, look, look, look, zoom in. Shit, I have no idea. I have no idea. It's just it was nothing and then it was something. Decision. Decisions are made but there's no decision maker. Choices are made but there's no choice maker.

Thinking happens but there's no thinker. So the mixture, you used the word of mixture of it feels like there is free will sometimes, it shows up and there is no free will the other times. Just look at the situation. There's a moment when it feels like there is. There seems to be a process like you might be given two choices, Indian or Italian and what I do is I usually check in with my body, what does my body, what taste from memory, what taste do I feel like right now, the smells, that kind of stuff from basically checking in with memory and what do I want currently.

And that seems like a process. It seems like a process and then you come to a decision on it. But you're saying it's all past conditioning. It's all very deterministic. Well see, who do you relate it to? Me. You relate it to that I again. I think the personal doer. But again, have a look. Is there a personal doer there doing anything? And you said that you choose from memory. Or the memory is in the pairs of opposites. But then you claim it with a me which is also memory. See? Yes, so functioning happens. Because the other question you asked was, okay, but there is learning happening.

Like if I do something stupid then I learned and I don't do it again. Or if I eat something, I don't eat it. Tony was saying eat something bad and then I feel that I got the bad stomach so I won't be eating it again. It feels like I consciously learn and consciously draw conclusions. But if you look at the cats, I give cats something that is bad, I guarantee you they won't take it again. They have such a good smell. They also make connections. They also learn. Learning is part of functioning. What is not part of functioning is taking credit. Cat doesn't take credit.

I did it. I went to the memory to compare things. I don't know how to go to the memory. Look, if I ask you what were you, let's say, ten years ago or whatever, now that environmental question coming out from environment, which is me, prompts you to go to the memory. If I didn't ask that question, the memory is not being reviewed. Sometimes that question comes internally. But it also shows up. And it prompts you to go to memory. You would not go to the memory if there was no necessity, if there was no need. If there was no necessity, if there was no trigger that would make you look there.

And that trigger is usually, we can say, oh, but this is I. I have decided. Now again, how did you do that? There was a great statement years ago. Do you choose to think? And they do appear. Why don't you have all those thousands of negative thoughts that you wouldn't deliberately? And like Bob says, if you had a choice, you would never have a single negative thought ever again. Yes. Because you want the best. And that's true. So, can you please tell us about the facts? Yeah. Can you tell us about your learning from experience? He said he drank something that he should not drink.

Prove that it's not me who can transport to next generations. So, for example, some experiments on mouses showed that mouses have a bad experience. And their children, without doing that even once, they don't do that. That's true. And it can transfer to five generations. According to scientific experience. experience that's right yeah amazing that's the intelligence energy doing that yes yeah well there's no there's no there's to be is that a sort of uh suggestion of uh karma yeah you can call it whatever you want and there was that uh that just reminded me about um a biblical sign that the sins of the father passed on to the children seven generations yeah and and it is if you look at the at the way we are conditioned if you look at the way the brain is constructed and it's so many impulses that it needs to process to function in the world that is getting more and more complex all the time so most of the activities are happening on the autopilot and most of activities including what we perceive is assumed we have to do assumptions the brain lives on assumptions and all those assumptions are not assumed the brain lives on assumptions are the memory is used for it like okay i see the plant out there and now i'm looking somewhere else but the assumption of it is still here so it appears in the in the field of vision even though i'm not looking so i can't see it so that's how the brain works with everything that's how we have conceptual image about other people that's why we have our concepts about religions a lot of different concepts and beliefs that let that actually keep the world together that's why we believe that certain food or certain diet or certain behavior or certain whatever is good or bad we would not be able to function it's just the the the computer would just not be able to process things if they were continuously fresh and new without the assumptions that's why the conditioning that's why the patterns are habits you ask about the breaking habits also because the you know the association with the me and identification and projection of the everyone else being separate entity it is also a habit pattern if those habits or any other habits can be broken yes they can they again require the whole universe conspiring because you know they they have to be a response to that because the i and the environment are one so if i want to break any habit pattern i have to get the motivation inspiration and all that stuff that has to work together with seeming conscious decision because it will feel like now i'm determined to whatever do quit smoking or whatever i you're saying i so who wants to quit the smoking yeah yeah that's that's how it appears to be so i say i can't choose to quit smoking but the whole universe can conspire in a way that suddenly every book i open will show me a picture of a contaminated lungs and then i put the radio on exactly what happened to me that's how it happens exactly what happened i wanted to give up smoke just as an example i wanted to give up smoking i've been thinking about giving up smoking i really didn't want to do it anymore blah blah blah i cut down to three cigarettes a day i opened the paper and it was two thousand chemicals in every filtered cigarette it was a quick campaign i opened that paper that day and oh the last cigarette i had made me and then i went to a meeting one night one night and my spouse said what's wrong with you you look a bit green and i said oh i just really want to quit smoking she said well stop it right now yeah and i did never had another cigarette she said give me your cigarettes so i gave her my cigarettes and you've never smoked again yeah and we still say i quit it i did it but but i understand so how is that not a choice how's that not free will who really did it did she did she print that paper did she deliver it to her house did another person give me a suggestion did she smoke my cigarettes did you know but you still apparently made the choice to stop there was an attraction choices are made choices no no no choice maker did you get tempted again yeah a lot of messages come full insights well i was just sort of validating what i was saying well i was just sort of validating what i was saying validating what i was saying what kat said you know she said everything conspires the universe conspires to you know there's no choice it's the same life going through everything what's that 100 monkey one hundred monkey effects i haven't heard that yeah they they taught some monkeys to use the tool you want to yeah and they found it on an island there's no way out where monkeys have never been there they started started doing the same thing so they pick it up and the same is the same life is going through each and every one of us and we know it's just evolving you know we evolve along with it about about back to the smoking and the inspiration i have a friend very dear friend back in poland who is a and he thanks to him not just the first time living in these kind of and she never really was inspired to quit smoking she had a lot of stories that she would tell herself why is it not so bad you know in her own house not everyone who smokes has the lung cancer not everyone who smokes that's the only thing that is really her that's really you know and then suddenly i spoke with her a week ago and she says you know what i think i'm moving to a new place and putting it down i have no idea how it happens inspiration came not well it is a response even the 요 motivation from your ownulation moment that's for sure motivation that comes from within is still a response to the environment because you can't separate yourself from it so sometimes the drive to do something or to change something or to learn something comes from within as a thought but am I that thought or am I the one who actually created that thought no so I it's a conventional word it's a language it's just a word that I'm using to communicate this this equipment this body mind transmitter receiver sort of a device that's I call it I but did I really that let's say I'm decided to learn a language new language or whatever did I really decide it or the idea or inspiration or motivation sprung in that body and the body followed whatever shown up in it how could I choose that so I don't know how to do that it's like really we don't know how the brain generates thoughts how the brain generates images and we know electrical activity we know we know neurotransmitters stuff going on but really how it came how it comes as an end result as a strong motivation backed by feeling that creates action that's a mystery when you said inspiration what are you doing you breathe and you inspire don't you what do you think that air comes from and what time when we're all the thoughts come from inspire come in with a breath and translated but put so much on the brain all the brain does is translate image can't do a damn thing if that life essence is not in it there's a life essence which everything is and the body is formed to take what it can out of it and utilize so does everything else in this manifesto takes and utilizes and forms patterns hopes and all those things but they're still never anything other than that essence itself what we call this essence that's just a lame if the life's out of that body all those organs are there that we put so much home what good are they to you without that life counter not a bit of good so what are you a life or the body which is fat and shaped and formed and they explore the other expressions of it I'd take my chance on the life but the habit of naming and claiming is so strong which thank you very much for the wisdom so so as the intelligence energy just expressing itself that that that is kind of directing things but but with no with no purpose of goal in mind it's just yeah just just moving energy flowing yeah and that but there's no there's no individual that that is risk can be responsible for that that's exactly right yeah so so it would you take this answer sorry when that's not just that we would you take this chance yeah well that's what that's what my mind is trying to work out yeah where's my name with my next position going to be what do I believe in yeah yeah you are the life so so you are the life of yeah you yeah yeah yes yesterday to say it's my mind I can't do it got a things like there is it seems like there's yeah so so so when i when i react in the moment and I say something angry or and not let and not sort of control it or anything like that that that's just the energy moving that's not yeah it's not you being naughty no so so it's basically just you know just calls you just to relax and chill out and just go with the flow enjoy enjoy the ride see what's happening see what shows up enjoy the ride it's and the magnificent expression and so when you notice that naming and claiming you know you just go there it is that idea the conditioning that's just coming from conditioning that implies time and conceptual stuff as well isn't it so that's all yeah when you say that so that's just all stories the story for the mind yes yeah that's samsara that's what we've got all the life suffering you know begins in suffering ends in suffering yeah all the time yeah so it's all duality and duality is i yeah i is the duality but the very good point out there and because look if we if we say you know on the beginning was the word when you were little when you were a child you learned the world the words that implies that you were born that implies that you were a child that you were growing up that implies the time too so it implies that through all the experiences past conditioning experiences school society patterns where are they now they don't exist they just a story in their head but sometimes it's kind of describing the duality in the parameters that are familiar for the mind for the language which means putting it in space time perspective calms the mind now as same as science you know giving it a little bit of an explanation look this is happening this way or look at the animals they also take choices decisions whatever that's what happens they're also learning this all brings up the evolution of the brain you know it's called a parallel brain and you justrain it to think of it as a kind of human science you know of course we're time which means it's not really a pure non duality it's an explanation for the mind so the mind shuts up and goes park itself outside and experience yeah that's really just just a helpful pointers which okay I get it mind very often has to say ah now I get it now that will get off the way but it's a beautiful yeah great that you actually see it it is all story the time is story the childhood is story the moment prior to this is a story the the working of the brain is a story learning action I remember there was one meeting also when Terry got really excited about the idea that there is no transience because even transience everything being transient requires time for tanks to come and go to begin and end it all requires time so even the transience well it's not exactly there's no transience there is a transience on the on the experiential level because we do feel that everything can interpret to the mind so there is a perceived transience but in the absolute he's totally right there isn't there is just nothing there is just without the interpretation without the calculation labeling things out of the existence there is a no thing there is just a no thing by the way Terry's not with us and that is because he is focusing his energy now on building his own pointing he is already having and that's also you know I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that but I'm going to do it I'm going to do it but I'm going to do it also for people who watch us he is he has also for people who watch us he is he has the website www.terence.com.au so please check the website because for another two weeks he's offering the free webinar so anyone can tune in and join the free webinar later on there may be an entrance fee so he's growing he's uh he's focusing on his own to stand on his own two legs as Bob says he doesn't need to be in the next nest anymore he's ready to fly so wish him all the best and join in for free webinar and later on join on join in for the little entrance fee because that will that actually brings more value to what you hear Terence Stevens.com.au you may learn about the transients and everything else is the eye on his myself is awareness is emptiness because I take away everything experience so since I was growing up through my parents and my friends in my family I started learning things yeah and memory and stuff is put into my head if I take all the stories away don't feel that will be myself this awareness this emptiness that's right so the duality that you talk about is this awareness and all this stuff that I learned yeah trying to figure out yeah because if that's the case if I'm right with that um um the same way putting place for you guys to just say before running like that way um if I take all these memories away and I'm putting a book in a little box somewhere I will be just completely empty I'm waiting for something to happen and I use this words in the box to help me to react to that well interesting way to look at it yeah very nice yeah you wouldn't be conditioned but a lot of this condition patterns are habits that are unconscious so it's not really just consciously parking of the memories because the pattern is the says that this life essence needs the pattern to express through without the pattern you see you need the instrument to have the music without the instrument there is no music so that he learns from the stage on the fire but my brother he never sold me he never did it and I'm doing brother and he went to did it as well I know they keep do it yeah I'm your lamp on mistakes yeah what he said about the animals he's a concern about it because all of us we need to go and do it be able to learn from them I cannot learn I cannot say online my stuff because you learned somewhere else yeah so I had to go and experience on myself to be able to to develop myself so we're trying to say I need to have experience in my life be able to grow to hear of a point of different country and have different cultures and ideas and how people react and I believe I'm please correct me if I'm wrong because I think I'm right there right is those experiences in the past helping me to develop the men I'm today yeah yeah you are the totality A absolute it was only the one I was looking you are that health supp거를 intuitive so I'm intuition will tell you it not together whatever they like to recognize that oxymore a natural risk response that comes up.

As you say, you learn from other people as well. But base it mainly on your own intuition. Where intuition comes from? Where is intuition? Have a look at it. It's going on spontaneously out there around you. The earth's rolling around the sun. Seasons coming and going. Tides coming in and out. The wind's blowing. Everything is that spontaneous, natural functioning that we call this manifestation or appearance. But it's all appearance only anyway. But that intuitive thought implies there is an innate intelligence within you, a knowingness which is acting in you right now. You know that you are right now. Are you existing right now? Are you conscious right now?

Are you happy to be right now? Well that's what they tell you in Hinduism. Sat Chit Ananda. Existence, consciousness, bliss. Nama Rupa. The Nama Rupa is the name and form. The name is the label you've got on yourself and the form is the body you're expressing to. But it says the name and form, they're Maya, they're illusion. But it's existence, the being, another way of putting it is being, consciousness, knowing and loving to be. And that's the way it is. And that's the way it is. And that's the way it is. And that's the natural state. We learn all sorts of concepts and labels we put on it that seemingly obscure it.

But leave it in its natural state, you are that awareness, pure knowingness. And in that the proper thoughts or functioning, or whatever happens will happen. But when we exclusively take on the idea we are this separate entity, we are this persona, and the word persona comes from the word being. And that's the way it is. And that's the way it looks. And that's the way it has to be. It comes from mask. We've got a mask of concepts obscuring ourselves. Well, you are, take that mask off and see it's, you are the reality. You are the actuality. Because even while all this is going on, if that existence is still going on in you, that knowingness is still there.

And a wanting to be, that's what the outcome, you always want to be, a good outcome. That's the loving to be. It's the base of which it all appears in. I have a question. I'm thinking about the future. The future, that you want to have a future. Should we be thinking about the future, preparing ourselves, studying, working hard, pursuing success? Well you can't do that from your conditioning. But future, that's another thing you need to look at. Look at the concept of time. Ask yourself, is there a past if I don't think about it? To stop a thought, what can you say? In your memory.

In my memory, yes, that's right. But without that past, when we have this present. The same thing, is there a future if I don't think about it? You can't say there's a past or future without thinking it. But you'll say, I was in the past. Or say, I was in the present. Or say, well go and try and live yesterday. Yesterday is the past. Go back and live yesterday. You can't. But you can recall it. You might remember it when you go in there and recall it. The only reality you're giving it, is when you're recalling it right in this moment. Because, you know, what you thought a minute ago now, you can't even tell me unless you recall it.

The same with the future. You can anticipate and imagine the future. What you're going to do when you leave here or next week. Or make this plan or that plan. You can't live a moment in the future. So instead of trying to stay in the now, say you can't ever get out of it. When does now begin? Well to try and, I've just got to say it's beginning right now. But even as you're saying that, it's ending and beginning again. So it has no duration. Time is duration. To get from here to the end of Ramtah, what you'd call time or duration. There's actually no time.

It's all spontaneously emanating in this moment. Spontaneously. And what's doing it? That same life essence that's rolling the earth around the sun. Causing the seasons to come and go. That's breathing you. Beating your heart. Growing your hair and your fingernails. What are you doing about any of that? You're saying to yourself, I'm going to take the next breath. Worrying about it. Or going to beat my heart. You're not. It's going on spontaneously. And what's your next thought going to be? You don't even know that. Thoughts will come up. Because then how we separate them and take delivery. It's all happening to me. And I've got to do this.

And I've got to do that to keep it going. And that's when we first learn the words. When we learn the word I. We add onto it my self. You know. It becomes the personal self. But there's only one self. That's the Atman. It's the one self. It's self aware. Self knowing. Self seeing. Self fixating. Doing everything. It's that one self. Patterning. Shaping. Expressing. Expressing. Exterminating. And there's no personal self whatsoever. And that's where all our problems come about from. Relating it to the personal. The separate entity. The individual. When there's no such thing as we pointed out before. The individual. There's nothing divided at all.

It's all that individual essence. And you can only and ever be that. Already. You don't have to get it or become it. Or try and find it. You are. You have already that. Does that answer your question? It does because of the what should I continue pursuing things then? So what should I continue? Come to study to get my degree? Or my master? Or what should I continue working so hard to achieve success then? When future is not happening. I could have just said I don't have to worry about my knowledge growing up. Or taking a breath. Try not doing it. Yeah. So what? Try not doing it.

Can't stay in bed all the time. Yeah. Try not doing it. It's a natural functioning. It's a natural functioning. Even without the stoic. Yeah, I'm not worried about it. The thing is, I'm not worried about it. The thing is more like, so watch your other entry. Who wants to know? You realize you've never gone on an adventure. Oh, that's a good one. Yeah, Bob is saying something. Done. Yeah, Bob is saying something. He's never done it. I said, you realize you've never done anything. What did you do about when the father and your mother and the sperm and the ovum came together and you were nothing but that little sperm and ovum when they came out?

What were you doing about it then? And you say, why? Why am I come together here? They did say it then when you didn't even have a brain. But it's formed a brain, it's formed that little fetus, a little embryo, and it's formed you and Livvy and expressing as you right now. It's the same intelligence and it's the same essence. There's no, the essence hasn't changed, but the pattern, shape and form has changed, which has formed around it. So you have never done anything, never can and never will. Recognize that and watch it happen by itself. What's the Earth to do about rolling around the sun?

Can it say, I move over here today or there? It's not, it doesn't know where it is. And you also mentioned a baby on the beginning, that the baby has this plain, clean slate and it doesn't have concepts, it doesn't even see properly before that one is learned. So baby doesn't do anything at all. It is being cleaved, it is being, you know, it is rolling, then it's learning how to walk, then it's learning words, but it's not doing it. It doesn't construct the self. It's not saying, I am here. I am here and not there till the age of two, two and a half, when it has enough concepts and symbols.

But that very baby is in that natural state and coming back to the natural state is coming back to the state of being curious child that is looking around, oh, I wonder what the body is going to be moved to do now. Oh, it's going to go and earn money or study. This one is part of the functioning. Like the squirrel, they don't, you know, the animals, they don't believe in the past and future. And she will still, or he will still pick up little nuts and hide it for the winter and forget where they're hidden. And then the trees will sprout from it. That's how nature functions.

So now you can say, OK, I don't need to work so hard to get that extra pennies so I can go for the extra vacation and can show it on Instagram or something. You don't have any story about what is happening anymore. Now you are just looking how the grass is growing, how my body is moving and cooking or going to work with no story. So you don't do it because you have to. You don't do it because there is a reason for it or there is no reason for it. Don't create the story. What would be the reason or why are you doing it?

You just see how the life is leaving you. See how the life is getting you up in the morning on Monday and going to work. Oh, OK. When you say, why should I do it? Why should you go to the toilet? Say, why should I? I'm not going to go. I don't want to be around after that. I'm going to have to love you and leave you. Yes, we'll have to. My phone died so I've got to go and get a new phone. I've got no phone. Don't ask me if I dropped it in a bowl of soup. You are not the doer. You're innocent.

The whole universe conspired if the soup wasn't there. Anyway, thank you. Thank you. Thanks.